Aaron Hernandez Found to Have Severe C.T.E.

[brotherbock 349]

Interesting, although according to one of the 2016 articles it said the new testing method study was preliminary. Looks encouraging.

 

For sure, it's all still in the research phase. But the findings do look promising. Particularly for a condition that wasn't even known about a decade ago.

[seafoam1 1,878]

 

Yeah but I can't sign a waiver form stating that I'm aware of the risk of driving without a seatbelt so that I can do just that. At a certain point the rules that apply to the common man, have to apply to millionaire athletes.

In a way you do for seatbelts. You prove that you can pass a driving test which includes the use of a seatbelt. And it's a law. The company that is the NFL should officially state the risks of playing even though all players know the risks.

 

Look at the situation with hitting high or low on the field. I have heard more than a dozen players say they would rather get hit in the head than in the knees. And noone have I heard from that stated the contrary. Except for that one rookie that retired a couple years back because he didn't want head injuries. And he was healthy and young at the time and not rich.

[brotherbock 349]

The company that is the NFL should officially state the risks of playing even though all players know the risks.

 

 

But this is the problem--the NFL has been doing the exact opposite of admitting to the harm their sport causes their players. They've in fact been covering it up. So if they were to put a waiver in place now, their past (possibly criminal but at least culpable) behavior alone would likely make them not immune from future prosecution. Again, they are in a very similar place to where cigarette companies are. And those guys still get sued all the time, even though cig packs have warnings all over them, and their own corporate websites have entire sections devoted to explaining why you shouldn't use their products. Still open to lawsuits.

 

The only corporations that have proven immune to lawsuits over damages caused by use of their product (and playing football is the 'product' of the NFL) are gun manufacturers. And the NFL doesn't have anything approaching the political power of the NRA at its back.

 

I just don't think waivers will do all that much.

[seafoam1 1,878]

[quote name="brotherbock" post="6032116" timestamp="1506105343"

 

I just don't think waivers will do all that much.

 

Your points are well taken. They would need a stellar medical legal team to defend that the league didn't know the risks, just like the players didn't know. So either take this on now, or do it never. This is still a very questionable area of study. And that being said, it may be the right time for them to approach this.

 

I mean, can players sue for not being able to walk without pain in their later years of life because of injuries and surgeries they had while playing? Look at Mike Ditka these days. But some of them carry their injuries as a badge of honor. I think it's Booger McFarland that refuses to get one of his fingers straightened out for this reason. It's friggin sideways.

[brotherbock 349]

Your points are well taken. They would need a stellar medical legal team to defend that the league didn't know the risks, just like the players didn't know. So either take this on now, or do it never. This is still a very questionable area of study. And that being said, it may be the right time for them to approach this.

 

I mean, can players sue for not being able to walk without pain in their later years of life because of injuries and surgeries they had while playing? Look at Mike Ditka these days. But some of them carry their injuries as a badge of honor. I think it's Booger McFarland that refuses to get one of his fingers straightened out for this reason. It's friggin sideways.

 

I do think player attitudes are serving to cloud the issue, for sure. All these guys who say "hit me in the head rather than the knees" are all still know-nothing 20-somethings (I say that knowing that I was also a know-nothing 20-something ) Ask the guys who's minds are deteriorating in their 50s whether they'd prefer to have their mental faculties back at the expense of being able to walk, and I think you'd get a different answer. When we're younger, we value the physical part of life more. When we're older, the mental.

 

For the NFL, you're right that the sooner they take it on, the better. That's always the case. Things would have been far better for the cig companies if they'd come clean sooner. If the NFL came out now and said "Okay, you're right...these hits are causing serious serious damage to almost everyone (one article noted that out of over 100+ NFL player's brains examined so far, one did not have signs of CTE), and we've known for some time that brain damage is a serious problem, and we have covered that up", they'd be able to start damage control sooner. I think they're hoping to try somehow to prevent it from happening in the future, and then sweep under the rug all the crap they pulled in the past.

 

 

EDIT: Just to provide one example, the NFL pulled funding from a research study when they learned that the study was focused on the link between concussions and brain disease. They basically tried to stop the research from happening by pulling away the promised funding for the research. Now why would they do that...?

[jgcrawfish 232]

EDIT: Just to provide one example, the NFL pulled funding from a research study when they learned that the study was focused on the link between concussions and brain disease. They basically tried to stop the research from happening by pulling away the promised funding for the research. Now why would they do that...?

it's these things that will come back to haunt them. when guys are shooting themselves in the chest to mount the evidence against the sport, the fall is coming.

 

when my sons were in 5th grade the first one got his concussion. was pretty bad. Balance issues, vision issues, moodiness, sensitivity to light. We made him lay off football for 18 months. 2nd week of 7th grade practice he got another one. then again in 8th grade. other one got one 7th grade for the 1st time, then another in 8th grade. I told them that a sport where you are nothing more than a # to the coaches isn't worth their long term health. The whole "next man" up is a loose translation for "you're replaceable". I like watching the sport, but I don't want anybody I care about playing it.

 

And I've said it before, all the advances in helmets and cushioning isn't going to do much. if you want to stop it, put them in leather helmet and take away the weapon.

[brotherbock 349]

 

if you want to stop it, put them in leather helmet and take away the weapon.

 

Except that you'll first have a whole bunch of outright dead players before they learn to adapt. Hand Vontaze Burfict a leather helmet and see what happens. Hand any of them a leather helmet and see what happens.

 

That's the problem. There's no turning back with current players to less protective gear. James Harrison almost quit football because he claimed he couldn't unlearn how to hit a QB in the head. You might be able to start elementary school kids playing in leather helmets, and then just keep that new batch wearing them until they are pros. But at some point, they'll have to either wear hard hats, or the guys they mix with in the pros will have to go backwards. And they'll flat out kill themselves, because they don't know how to play in them.

 

That's a non-starter of a theory.

[seafoam1 1,878]

I've been saying for a while that the reintroduction of leather helmets would be the only thing that will stop these guys from banging heads. There were a couple linemen that wore that extra layer shell over the current helmets but the other players were too macho to try it cause it looked weird.

 

You can't educate people who don't want to be educated.

It's like telling someone to not drink too much if they really like drinking a lot. There are gazillions of things in life that people know are bad for them and they do it anyway. That is why history so often repeats itself in ugly ways.

 

There are still people who can barely afford their own rent and food who have multiple children who grow up in poverty.

 

People will continue to literally bang their heads into hard objects even after knowing what they are told that it's bad for their future.

[brotherbock 349]

I've been saying for a while that the reintroduction of leather helmets would be the only thing that will stop these guys from banging heads. There were a couple linemen that wore that extra layer shell over the current helmets but the other players were too macho to try it cause it looked weird.

 

You can't educate people who don't want to be educated.

It's like telling someone to not drink to much if they really like drinking a lot. There are gazillions of things in life that people know are bad for them and they do it anyway. That is why history so often repeats itself in ugly ways.

 

There are still people who can barely afford their own rent and food who have multiple children who grow up in poverty.

 

People will continue to literally bang their heads into hard objects even after knowing what they are told that it's bad for their future.

 

Well, the poverty issue isn't something that can't be dealt with by education. It's just extremely difficult. In fact, there's good evidence that it can be corrected--poorer immigrants moving to wealthier countries see a drop in birth rates before their own incomes begin to go up. Just being surrounded by a culture of 'fewer children' starts the process. But being educated about birth control (i.e. not being taught that it's a sin) and having birth control and women's health services available is also huge.

 

So I'd say the same thing about football players--the way they play is changing. We're seeing more people pulled from games for head injuries not because there are more head injuries happening, but because they are no longer letting these guys play with the injuries. That's the big difference. Reported incidents of something definitely go up when more people start reporting something that was underreported in the past

[seafoam1 1,878]

 

Well, the poverty issue isn't something that can't be dealt with by education. It's just extremely difficult. In fact, there's good evidence that it can be corrected--poorer immigrants moving to wealthier countries see a drop in birth rates before their own incomes begin to go up. Just being surrounded by a culture of 'fewer children' starts the process. But being educated about birth control (i.e. not being taught that it's a sin) and having birth control and women's health services available is also huge.

 

So I'd say the same thing about football players--the way they play is changing. We're seeing more people pulled from games for head injuries not because there are more head injuries happening, but because they are no longer letting these guys play with the injuries. That's the big difference. Reported incidents of something definitely go up when more people start reporting something that was underreported in the past

I know what your saying has merit, and for example I'm not saying that things like prescription health warnings don't need to be made.

 

But, for a lot of things in life, especially after the facts come out, I just think that people should apply basic reason to their personal well being and not be forced to have an authoritative entity control their actions. When I got a smacked head in high school football practice one time and was a was very woozie for a while, even though it was not reported or looked after at that time, I knew first hand what that could mean to my health. When I got myself in some significant debt in my 20's from not taking my finances seriously, I all of a sudden learned the difference between wants and needs and cleaned it up in a couple years time on my own. Also, I just never thought it an option for myself to have kids when I was working 2 jobs and living on pasta, rice, and beans. It just didn't make sense to me because I knew better than anyone my income, my bills, and my leftovers or savings (or lack there of at the time). It's a simple formula even as a kid. Can't buy something with no money.

 

We all learn some things in life the hard way, but especially now with all this head stuff in the NFL that has been talked about in sport circles for a few years, people will still do it. Except for John Urschel, who took it upon himself to look into it and make his own decision to quit as an NFL rookie. Actually also Chris Borland quit in his prime.

 

Anyway, it's an interesting discussion.

[WR Guru 31]

For anyone now to say that they don't understand it's a major health hazard to smash your head into the heads of other 250 lb men is laughable. Maybe players from decades passed have a beef, but not the current guys. My 6-year-old who plays soccer is not even aloud to head a ball inflated with air, for chrissakes.

 

Lots of people engage knowingly in risky occupations and hobbies. That's a decision that people have the right to make.

[seafoam1 1,878]

For anyone now to say that they don't understand it's a major health hazard to smash your head into the heads of other 250 lb men is laughable. Maybe players from decades passed have a beef, but not the current guys. My 6-year-old who plays soccer is not even aloud to head a ball inflated with air, for chrissakes.

 

Lots of people engage knowingly in risky occupations and hobbies. That's a decision that people have the right to make.

Quick search of 10 most dangerous jobs for men in American per a government study:

 

There were 4,836 fatal work injuries in 2015, not counting active members of the U.S. armed forces. Ten industries in particular saw the highest rate of deaths per 100,000 full-time workers. Most of these jobs are done by men.

 

• Farmers, ranchers and agricultural managers. ...
• Truck drivers. ...
• Structural iron and steel workers. ...
• Refuse and recyclable material collectors. ...
• Roofers. ...
• Aircraft pilots and flight engineers. ...
• Fishers and fishing workers. ...
• Logging workers.

[Skinny_Bastard 154]

The issue is Helmet.

Play with no helmet like rugby and you won't have guys leading with their heads.

[seafoam1 1,878]

The issue is Helmet.

Play with no helmet like rugby and you won't have guys leading with their heads.

I agree. Give them the leather. But somehow I don't believe that will ever happen. Would ratings drop if they did? I would think that shoulder pads would need to be scaled down as well if no real head protection. Think of these guys lowering their shoulders into your head when you try to hit the waist area.

[brotherbock 349]

Again, the no helmet or leather helmet thing is not actually a good idea. It will never work. You would either have to just flat out replace all the current players, or deal with plenty of players dying or getting paralyzed when you make the change. It's a theory that sounds good until you actually think about implementing it. Bad.

[jocstrap 8]

Muhammad Ali didnt kill anybody or act crazy out of the ring. His brain was all focked up from the amount of hits to his head. Hernandez was a bad bad apple seed long before he was taking hits to the helmet. Don't blame the nfl or football on this one.

 

Take the helmets off probably isn't going to happen:-)

 

15 years from now - all nfl players will be wearing the same robotic equipment/shield/protection where they fly into each other full force with minimal injuries. I saw that in a movie once!

[bjsteel 34]

The guy played only 3-years in the NFL, he accumulated this massive CTE diagnosis in this time? So playing H.S. and college football didn't contribute? Or getting his head beat-in while in jail?

[jocstrap 8]

How many fist fights was Hernandez in as a juvenial? Did he ever take multiple blows to the head in in a gangster fight? That might have contributed as well.

[stonewall 647]

Could be that the CTE prevented him from killing even earlier...

 

Nobody knows squat.

[ChinaCat 21]

The guy was a gang banger since he was 14 or 15. He would have died a lot sooner had it not been for football. As usual Liberals will try and blame the game when this guy was a piece of garbage since birth.

 

There are problmes with head injuries in the sport but this case isn't one of them.

 

Maybe OJ can sue the Bills too.

 

 

Give me a break.

[yanko 11]

Except that you'll first have a whole bunch of outright dead players before they learn to adapt. Hand Vontaze Burfict a leather helmet and see what happens. Hand any of them a leather helmet and see what happens.

 

That's the problem. There's no turning back with current players to less protective gear. James Harrison almost quit football because he claimed he couldn't unlearn how to hit a QB in the head. You might be able to start elementary school kids playing in leather helmets, and then just keep that new batch wearing them until they are pros. But at some point, they'll have to either wear hard hats, or the guys they mix with in the pros will have to go backwards. And they'll flat out kill themselves, because they don't know how to play in them.

 

That's a non-starter of a theory.

How about electrify the helmets? If it starts to go horizontal give them a buzz. If they don't straighten up fast give them a stronger buzz.

[jocstrap 8]

How about electrify the helmets? If it starts to go horizontal give them a buzz. If they don't straighten up fast give them a stronger buzz.

That's awesome - they'll be like rats in a lab! I'd like a remote at home so when my ff players are sucking...I'm upping that voltage baby! It's all about the points!

[Gepetto 979]

I hope the judge rules him and his family dooshbags for trying to game the court system.

 

 

Hey Joc! Good to see you around, hope you and your family are good, and your fantasy football teams too!

[seafoam1 1,878]

The guy was a gang banger since he was 14 or 15. He would have died a lot sooner had it not been for football. As usual Liberals will try and blame the game when this guy was a piece of garbage since birth.

 

There are problmes with head injuries in the sport but this case isn't one of them.

 

Maybe OJ can sue the Bills too.

 

 

Give me a break.

Seriously. CTE made him kill someone execution style for disrespecting him or whatever. If he didn't have CTE, Hernandez would have taken him out for ice cream to discuss how they could better communicate with one another and have a more tender lifestyle together by sharing their innermost feelings.

[LunaTick 29]

apologies for not reading all the posts

 

What are the odds or likelihood his damage occured before the NFL.

 

This all stated, Of course the NFL will be sued. Greatest pool of money available.

Next then would be his University, and then his High School.

 

I don't see the point here.

It was his criminal behaviors that cost him and his estate all his money

[thePRO 78]

You can't diagnose a concussion while someone is alive? Can't see signs of one with an MRI or whatever? It's all just observation? I don't think so.

What part of cracking open a person's skull do you not understand? A concussion is very different from CTE.

 

"A definitive diagnosis of CTE can only be made after death, when an autopsy can reveal whether the known brain changes of CTE are present."

[brotherbock 349]

Muhammad Ali didnt kill anybody or act crazy out of the ring. His brain was all focked up from the amount of hits to his head. Hernandez was a bad bad apple seed long before he was taking hits to the helmet. Don't blame the nfl or football on this one.

 

Take the helmets off probably isn't going to happen:-)

 

15 years from now - all nfl players will be wearing the same robotic equipment/shield/protection where they fly into each other full force with minimal injuries. I saw that in a movie once!

I'd the claim that brain damage will affect everyone the same way? So if Ali's brain damage affected him one way, that's the only way brain damage could possibly affect a person?

 

The plural form of anecdote is not 'data'.

[brotherbock 349]

What part of cracking open a person's skull do you not understand? A concussion is very different from CTE.

 

"A definitive diagnosis of CTE can only be made after death, when an autopsy can reveal whether the known brain changes of CTE are present."

Except for the research that is quickly changing that quote from true to false.

[IGotWorms 3,302]

What part of cracking open a person's skull do you not understand? A concussion is very different from CTE.

 

"A definitive diagnosis of CTE can only be made after death, when an autopsy can reveal whether the known brain changes of CTE are present."

I tried telling the poor bastard but he's a little thick

[brotherbock 349]

How about electrify the helmets? If it starts to go horizontal give them a buzz. If they don't straighten up fast give them a stronger buzz.

 

This is a fantastic idea Like those anti-bark collars for dogs.

 

The teams could use these too. Coordinate with the TV networks to use that superimposed line of scrimmage like an invisible fence. Every time a lineman jumps early, zzzzzzt! Let the coach program his own team's collars for additional purposes. Got a QB who holds the ball too long? Kenny Britt sleep-walking his way through a game? Your guy about to smack-talk his way into an unsportsmanlike penalty? Zzzzzzt!

[jgcrawfish 232]

people aren't understanding the true scope of CTE. Damage to the areas of the brain it affects has a direct reflection in impulse control, judgement, critical thought processing...think Alzheimers. These guys are in the 20's and 30's and can't remember their kids names. Chris Henry of the Bengals was a doosh, but no "reasonable" person jumps into a moving truck and tries to attack the person driving then flies out and dies. Justin Strzelczyk of the Steelers never had any brushes with the law before he spiraled out of control and ended up dying after crashing into a fuel tanker truck. Junior Seau went from on top of the world to battling depression to shooting himself in the chest. No, the NFL isn't completely responsible for this. But for years they told players that football was safe and there was NO link between it, concussions and long term brain function. That was a lie. Hernandez attorney is being brilliant about it, it's his daughter suing the NFL, and the NCAA and Florida are soon to follow. 10's of billions of $ in suits for other players are to follow.

[IGotWorms 3,302]

Hernandez was always a punk though. That's the whole reason he slid in the NFL draft.

 

CTE ain't got sh1t to do with this one, imo

[brotherbock 349]

people aren't understanding the true scope of CTE. Damage to the areas of the brain it affects has a direct reflection in impulse control, judgement, critical thought processing...think Alzheimers. These guys are in the 20's and 30's and can't remember their kids names. Chris Henry of the Bengals was a doosh, but no "reasonable" person jumps into a moving truck and tries to attack the person driving then flies out and dies. Justin Strzelczyk of the Steelers never had any brushes with the law before he spiraled out of control and ended up dying after crashing into a fuel tanker truck. Junior Seau went from on top of the world to battling depression to shooting himself in the chest. No, the NFL isn't completely responsible for this. But for years they told players that football was safe and there was NO link between it, concussions and long term brain function. That was a lie. Hernandez attorney is being brilliant about it, it's his daughter suing the NFL, and the NCAA and Florida are soon to follow. 10's of billions of $ in suits for other players are to follow.

 

Very well stated. People need to go read about someone like Phineas Gage to see what a little brain damage can do to a guy.

 

Hernandez was always a punk though. That's the whole reason he slid in the NFL draft.

 

CTE ain't got sh1t to do with this one, imo

 

That he was a punk before isn't mutually exclusive with the idea that CTE aggravated his behavior. And his violence and ending up in prison is only half the story. I'm sure his daughter would like a live imprisoned father instead of one who killed himself. And does his 'being a punk' explain away his suicide? Seau committed suicide too, and he wasn't a 'punk'. Maybe the common denominator for that part of the story is the brain damage.

 

Edit: Dementia patients are often highly aggressive (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28857270). And dementia damages the frontal and temporal lobes of the brain, the same lobes that get damaged by CTE.

 

I mean, --here's a cross section of a normal brain on top, and the brain of Greg Ploetz (stage IV CTE) on the bottom. How well are you going to make judgments with that much of your brain simply gone?

 

http://assets.nydailynews.com/polopoly_fs/1.3355347.1501014573!/img/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/article_750/figure-1-annotated-gross-pathology-greg-ploetz.jpg

[brotherbock 349]

Here's some great data relevant to this discussion. A study of 202 'American football' player brains, from all levels. High school, college, semi-pro, CFL, and NFL. (To be clear, these were players who died while playing at or after having played at only that level and below. So the 'high school' level represents someone who didn't play above high school football.)

 

21% of high school players had CTE.

91% of college players

64% of semi-pro players

88% of CFL players

99% of NFL players.

 

(From http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/new-study-finds-nfl-player-suffers-cte-article-1.3355228)

 

The standout figure is the college figure--aside from that, it's a clear increase with playing time. This is a somewhat small sample size (although still significant, particularly at the NFL level, 111 of the brains were NFL level), so I'd expect to see the college level ending up somewhere below CFL overall, given that you get into the CFL having played in college.

 

But the really clear figure is that NFL figure. 11 NFL player brains, 110 had CTE. Now, there was likely some selection bias here, as I'm betting that families donating their player's brain were more likely to do so if that person had showed signs of mental problems in life. So there may very well be a higher number of guys out there without CTE in the end. But 99% is incredibly significant. And a huge jump from the other levels of play.

 

As everyone loves to say, the speed and power of the game is so much higher at the NFL level, right? That's why 'fast' college guys aren't always fast anymore, 'strong' guys aren't strong at that level, etc. So is it so hard to extrapolate that the hits, and therefore the damage caused, are also so much more significant at that level?

 

Take a look at Greg Ploetz's brain, man.

[Gepetto 979]

 

Very well stated. People need to go read about someone like Phineas Gage to see what a little brain damage can do to a guy.

 

 

That he was a punk before isn't mutually exclusive with the idea that CTE aggravated his behavior. And his violence and ending up in prison is only half the story. I'm sure his daughter would like a live imprisoned father instead of one who killed himself. And does his 'being a punk' explain away his suicide? Seau committed suicide too, and he wasn't a 'punk'. Maybe the common denominator for that part of the story is the brain damage.

 

Edit: Dementia patients are often highly aggressive (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28857270). And dementia damages the frontal and temporal lobes of the brain, the same lobes that get damaged by CTE.

 

I mean, ######--here's a cross section of a normal brain on top, and the brain of Greg Ploetz (stage IV CTE) on the bottom. How well are you going to make judgments with that much of your brain simply gone?

 

http://assets.nydailynews.com/polopoly_fs/1.3355347.1501014573!/img/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/article_750/figure-1-annotated-gross-pathology-greg-ploetz.jpg

 

Yes, but many people commit suicide that never played football and never had a concussion so you can't say if football and/or concussions contributed to this suicide.

[IMMensaMind 459]

Again, the no helmet or leather helmet thing is not actually a good idea. It will never work. You would either have to just flat out replace all the current players, or deal with plenty of players dying or getting paralyzed when you make the change. It's a theory that sounds good until you actually think about implementing it. Bad.

Why is it bad? Do you think these guys wouldn't instantly retrain themselves to hit and tackle properly again?

 

It's not like today's athletes tackle someone in the produce section while picking out broccoli.

 

I think Skinny Bastard has it right. I believe that the reason this problem has escalated is due to the heightened perception of security these increasingly technologically advanced helmets have afforded. Take that away, and you'll have a nearly immediate cessation in spear fishing in the NFL, which is the primary source of head injury. These guys need to play with soft helmets; not hard shells.

 

And Hernandez had CTE alright: Compulsive Thug Endemic. I don't give a crap that head trauma scrambled his brains; he was already a focked up individual.

[seafoam1 1,878]

Here's some great data relevant to this discussion. A study of 202 'American football' player brains, from all levels. High school, college, semi-pro, CFL, and NFL. (To be clear, these were players who died while playing at or after having played at only that level and below. So the 'high school' level represents someone who didn't play above high school football.)

 

21% of high school players had CTE.

91% of college players

64% of semi-pro players

88% of CFL players

99% of NFL players.

 

(From http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/new-study-finds-nfl-player-suffers-cte-article-1.3355228)

 

The standout figure is the college figure--aside from that, it's a clear increase with playing time. This is a somewhat small sample size (although still significant, particularly at the NFL level, 111 of the brains were NFL level), so I'd expect to see the college level ending up somewhere below CFL overall, given that you get into the CFL having played in college.

 

But the really clear figure is that NFL figure. 11 NFL player brains, 110 had CTE. Now, there was likely some selection bias here, as I'm betting that families donating their player's brain were more likely to do so if that person had showed signs of mental problems in life. So there may very well be a higher number of guys out there without CTE in the end. But 99% is incredibly significant. And a huge jump from the other levels of play.

 

As everyone loves to say, the speed and power of the game is so much higher at the NFL level, right? That's why 'fast' college guys aren't always fast anymore, 'strong' guys aren't strong at that level, etc. So is it so hard to extrapolate that the hits, and therefore the damage caused, are also so much more significant at that level?

 

Take a look at Greg Ploetz's brain, man.

So if you are going to argue that this is extremely common and will continue, then that is the best argument to implement leather helmets. Then give everyone the official warnings at all levels, that they will hurt themselves if they keep playing as if they are wearing plastic. Let them quit or take their chances. In the long run, it will be for the better.

[brotherbock 349]

 

Yes, but many people commit suicide that never played football and never had a concussion so you can't say if football and/or concussions contributed to this suicide.

 

I'm not saying it did contribute in this case. I am very far away from the actual data. I'm just pointing out that everyone here saying it did not play a role are talking out of their a$$es. There's every chance it did play a role.

 

It's like asking whether a drunk's being drunk 'played a role' in his being aggressive towards someone else, swerving all over the road, etc. You can say "Well, he might have been aggressive/swerved all over the road even if he'd been sober!" Sure. Of course he might have. But you're talking about a disease that degenerates the brain. And you're going to tell me that this disease is not going to have a negative effect on someone's judgment and actions?

[brotherbock 349]

Why is it bad? Do you think these guys wouldn't instantly retrain themselves to hit and tackle properly again?

 

 

No, they wouldn't.

 

Do you actually think that these guys could "instantly" retrain reflexes they have been training since the 4th grade, so that in a split-second on the field, playing at full speed, they'd be able to change behavior they have been learning for the majority of their lives?

 

Making a tackle isn't an instance of constructing a logical argument and formulating a careful plan based on cost-benefit analysis. It's reacting much more than it is acting. Again, a lifetime of training. And you think they can just 'undo' that? Before a ton of them get seriously hurt? That's ridiculous.

[brotherbock 349]

So if you are going to argue that this is extremely common and will continue, then that is the best argument to implement leather helmets. Then give everyone the official warnings at all levels, that they will hurt themselves if they keep playing as if they are wearing plastic. Let them quit or take their chances. In the long run, it will be for the better.

 

And what I'm saying is that, unless all of the NFL players currently playing just quit, you would have a bloodbath on your hands before anyone adjusted.

 

I mean, seriously consider this. Say you made the switch to leather helmets this coming Tuesday. What's Thursday going to look like? Or Sunday? Say you decide to make the switch in the off-season. What's the first full-contact practice going to look like?

Sure, after you have hospitals full of paralyzed players and teams down to 15 or so healthy guys, maybe you'll have something going there

 

It's like saying that we could reduce handgun accidents by removing safeties from guns, thus forcing everyone to treat them more carefully. Perhaps people could learn...but while they are learning, thousands and thousands would be getting shot.

 

 

This leather helmet thing has been a popular notion for a long time. I remember my dad saying the same thing when we were watching a game when I was back in college. It's not a new idea. And if you could wave a magic wand and instantly change everyone's behavior, it might even work. Plenty of ideas are great if only magic was possible But it's an idea that could never be actually implemented without horrible results.