The real truth about Columbine

[GettnHuge 1]

[TD Ryan2 314]

Rachel Joy Scott...

She became a Christian, lost a lot of her friends

She was just a teenage girl moved by Christ

 

yeah, I'm Irish Catholic too but this is almost as wackO as the psychos who shot up the school.

you show me a teenage girls who's been "moved by Christ" and I'll show you someone who ain't right... in the head... ya' know?

 

and as usual, I'm with KSB in this thread.

My "memory" or "version" of what happened at Columbine doesn't include much about targeting Christians.

 

No kidding they were psychologically disturbed.

No kidding they were angry kids.

No kidding adolescents are in a volatile time of their lives.

I'm just not sure why there has to be all this analysis over it.

They were angry, whacked out kids who were further influenced buy the violence that is commonplace in American culture, from video games, to Hollywood, to toys, etc, etc, etc.

They waged war on everyone and glorified in in their heads... they were each their own John Connor agains all the Terminators.

 

Really, it's hard for me to even differentiate between the Columbine kids and the Virginia Tech kid. Pretty much the same motive, setup, and (sadly) results.

[tikigods 76]

yeah, I'm Irish Catholic too but this is almost as wackO as the psychos who shot up the school.

you show me a teenage girls who's been "moved by Christ" and I'll show you someone who ain't right... in the head... ya' know?

 

and as usual, I'm with KSB in this thread.

My "memory" or "version" of what happened at Columbine doesn't include much about targeting Christians.

 

No kidding they were psychologically disturbed.

No kidding they were angry kids.

No kidding adolescents are in a volatile time of their lives.

I'm just not sure why there has to be all this analysis over it.

They were angry, whacked out kids who were further influenced buy the violence that is commonplace in American culture, from video games, to Hollywood, to toys, etc, etc, etc.

They waged war on everyone and glorified in in their heads... they were each their own John Connor agains all the Terminators.

 

Really, it's hard for me to even differentiate between the Columbine kids and the Virginia Tech kid. Pretty much the same motive, setup, and (sadly) results.

 

The original story had them supposedly targeting jocks, various races, and Evangelicals.

 

See Rachel Scott or Cassie Bernall's stories.

[wiffleball 4,629]

The original story had them supposedly targeting jocks, various races, and Evangelicals.

 

See Rachel Scott or Cassie Bernall's stories.

 

 

...or the websites, or the best-selling book - all based upon a lie.

[tikigods 76]

...or the websites, or the best-selling book - all based upon a lie.

 

Made millions off lies.

[wiffleball 4,629]

Made millions off lies.

 

I'll take what do Evangelicals and Halliburton have in common for a thousand, Alex!

[naomi 343]

yeah, I'm Irish Catholic too but this is almost as wackO as the psychos who shot up the school.

you show me a teenage girls who's been "moved by Christ" and I'll show you someone who ain't right... in the head... ya' know?

 

and as usual, I'm with KSB in this thread.

My "memory" or "version" of what happened at Columbine doesn't include much about targeting Christians.

 

No kidding they were psychologically disturbed.

No kidding they were angry kids.

No kidding adolescents are in a volatile time of their lives.

I'm just not sure why there has to be all this analysis over it.

They were angry, whacked out kids who were further influenced buy the violence that is commonplace in American culture, from video games, to Hollywood, to toys, etc, etc, etc.

They waged war on everyone and glorified in in their heads... they were each their own John Connor agains all the Terminators.

 

Really, it's hard for me to even differentiate between the Columbine kids and the Virginia Tech kid. Pretty much the same motive, setup, and (sadly) results.

 

What I mean by that is she became a Christian during high school and had a sense of urgency about the importance of being one. She didn't seem to be in anyone's face, but she lost some of the friends she had, and she was seen reading the bible and walking around with it. Think she had it with her when she was shot on the lawn. She was the first person shot and shot multiple times. They were pretty indiscriminate and I wouldn't make the case they intentionally shot her first, she was an easy target at the beginning of the spree. But Erik and Dylan did talk about her too.

 

To understand what I mean by "moved" read her journals.

 

transcripts from the basement tapes:

Eric: "Shut the ###### up, Nick, you laugh too much! And those two girls sitting next to you, they probably want you to shut the ###### up, too! Jesus! Rachel and Jen.. and.. whatever."

 

Dylan: "I don't like you, Rachel and Jen, you're stuck up little bitches, you're ###### little.. Christian, Godly little whores!"

[Hear this and the line above]

 

Eric: "Yeah.. 'I love Jesus! I love Jesus!' -- shut the ###### up!"

 

Dylan: "What would Jesus do? What the ###### would I do..?" (he acts like he's shooting the camera with his hand, with sound to accompany it)

 

Eric: "I would shoot you in the motherfucking head! Go Romans! Thank God they crucified that ######."

[Hear the above 3 lines]

 

Eric and Dylan: "Go Romans!" "Go Romans!!" "Yeah!!" "Wooo!"

 

Eric discusses "Arlene", his 12-gauge Savage shotgun. "Thanks to the gun show, and to Robyn. Robyn is very cool."

 

The boys then decide to take a video tour of "Reb's room" and "all the illegal ######" in it. Dylan backs out of the room with the camera and pretends to be Eric's mother.

[tikigods 76]

Rachel Scott's situation was much different than Cassie's. She, Rachel, was in the wrong place at the wrong time. The killers had intended on blowing up two large propane tanks in the cafe during A lunch at 11:15. During the confusion they were going to shoot students exiting the building. They had to rework their plan because the fuses on the propane bombs didn't work. When they approached the entrance they shot Rachel and Danny. Rachel wasn't a target because of her religion.

 

Eric was a psychopath. Dylan was a depressive. The combination of leader and lead was deadly. Ironically, Eric had laid it all out on his website that was turned over to the police by the Brown family nearly a year before the shootings. The police did nothing.

 

The biggest misunderstanding about Columbine was it was meant to be an explosion like Oklahoma City....not a random school shooting. They wanted to kill most of the students with the bombs.

[naomi 343]

Rachel Scott's situation was much different than Cassie's. She, Rachel, was in the wrong place at the wrong time. The killers had intended on blowing up two large propane tanks in the cafe during A lunch at 11:15. During the confusion they were going to shoot students exiting the building. They had to rework their plan because the fuses on the propane bombs didn't work. When they approached the entrance they shot Rachel and Danny. Rachel wasn't a target because of her religion.

 

Eric was a psychopath. Dylan was a depressive. The combination of leader and lead was deadly. Ironically, Eric had laid it all out on his website that was turned over to the police by the Brown family nearly a year before the shootings. The police did nothing.

 

The biggest misunderstanding about Columbine was it was meant to be an explosion like Oklahoma City....not a random school shooting. They wanted to kill most of the students with the bombs.

 

Here's the thing. I've never been bent on saying any of the victims were shot with Erik and Dylan thinking "this is because you're a Christian." I think they were indiscriminate and they let on themselves that in the midst of everything, they might kill some of the people they were cool with. What allegedly happened to Cassie was discredited, and a girl who survived reported that she was asked if she believed in God and after answering yes she was shot. A kid that survived and thought he saw Cassie being asked that pointed investigators to where this other girl was shot. Sooo...they did have categories of people they were more vocal about hating, and according to this girl who's alive and this kid, someone was asked that before they were shot. Again I'm not bent on communicating it one way or another, but it's kinda odd to me that people factually dismiss there were people on their hotter list of hate. I understand that it sucks that the book about Cassie Bernall has sold a ton when it's based on misinformation, but I don't understand the eagerness to dismiss that general allegation either and skate over Erik and Dylan's own words.

[wiffleball 4,629]

God, Naomi, that website made me sick. They started with a lie and built and empire on exploiting her daughter's death. They have SIX different books and videos being sold on that website!! Publishing her personal journals? Don't you think she would have blogged those if she wanted them posted for all to see?

 

Early news reports said that one of the gunmen, after having first shot Rachel in her leg, asked the wounded girl if she still believed in God, and that she had simply answered "You know I do", provoking a second, fatal shot to her head at point-blank range.[2] Some accounts attributed this version of events to Castaldo, though he later denied telling this story.[4] The FBI later concluded that this interaction did not take place.

wiki.

 

Noami, I have no doubt about two things:

 

1) She was a special, wonderful girl. and

 

2) You have been sincerely moved by her.

 

I don't mock or criticize any of that. But what her parents are doing? All based upon an initial lie? - And continuing on today?

 

Check out the carp that these people are selling:

 

Bracelets

Clearance

Clothing

Literature

Media/DVD

Miscellaneous

Posters

 

I think her parents are trying to either

 

1) Exploit their daughter's death or

2) Make a senseless death into something it wasn't. - And in so doing, exploiting their daughter's death.

 

I hope they have the best of intentions. But when you publish a book ten years later "Rachel's Tears: 10 Years After Columbine...Rachel Scott Lives On" First they stayed fast to the BS story of "Do you believe in God", now they're trying to justify their marketing by saying "they made fun of her in videotapes - so she was targeted and a martyr."

 

Except:

Nor did they have any specific targets as those on their target list had all graduated the previous year.

Their target list didn't have her on it.

 

12 other people were killed by these jackholes. Where's THEIR books?

 

I hope others have been inspired. But inspiration based upon a lie is no different than the lies about the 72 virgins. If God's truth is so great, lies should have no place. - But in commerce....

[tikigods 76]

Here's the thing. I've never been bent on saying any of the victims were shot with Erik and Dylan thinking "this is because you're a Christian." I think they were indiscriminate and they let on themselves that in the midst of everything, they might kill some of the people they were cool with. What allegedly happened to Cassie was discredited, and a girl who survived reported that she was asked if she believed in God and after answering yes she was shot. A kid that survived and thought he saw Cassie being asked that pointed investigators to where this other girl was shot. Sooo...they did have categories of people they were more vocal about hating, and according to this girl who's alive and this kid, someone was asked that before they were shot. Again I'm not bent on communicating it one way or another, but it's kinda odd to me that people factually dismiss there were people on their hotter list of hate. I understand that it sucks that the book about Cassie Bernall has sold a ton when it's based on misinformation, but I don't understand the eagerness to dismiss that general allegation either and skate over Erik and Dylan's own words.

 

Val Schnurr was the girl who actually made some comment about God before one of the shooters got distracted by an exploding pipe bomb and left the library. Craig Scott, Rachel's brother, was the one who told the story of Cassie Bernall. When investigators brought him back into the library after the shootings, he incorrectly identified where Cassie had been. This was when the FBI and Detective Battan knew the martyr story had been exaggerated. Cassie, in fact, had had her head blown off with a sawed off shotgun by Harris and said nothing. This was supported by Emily Wyant, who was under the table with Cassie.

 

Valeen Schnurr, had been hiding. Schnurr's mother says Valeen was lying wounded on the library floor and was praying when one of the gunmen approached her and asked if she believed in God. The News article says she replied by saying, "Yes, I believe in God." The gunman did nothing more and Valeen survived. The Salon article says Valeen was saying, "Oh, my God, oh, my God, don't let me die," when one of the gunmen asked her if she believed in God. She said "yes" and was then asked why. She said, "Because I believe and my parents brought me up that way." Salon says that in the end, the investigators concluded that Valeen's was the only encounter in the library where anyone was asked about God. None of those who thought the question had been asked of Cassie actually witnessed it, they only heard it and, it is suggested, heard Valeen's voice, not Cassie's.

[naomi 343]

Wiff I haven't checked out that whole site before, just read her journals a few years ago. You're quoting wiki about an initial incorrect report surrounding her death and saying her parents are profiting off that account. ...I've never been aware of even an alleged narrative. I'll have to see if their site is saying that, are you seeing it there?

[wiffleball 4,629]

Val Schnurr was the girl who actually made some comment about God before one of the shooters got distracted by an exploding pipe bomb and left the library.

 

Schnurr, who had been hurt badly, began to cry out at that point, "Oh, God help me!" Klebold went back to her and asked her if she believed in God. She floundered in her answer, saying no and then yes, trying to get the answer right. He asked her why; she said it was because it was what her family believed. He taunted her then walked away. This incident eventually led to the Cassie Bernall controversy, as some believe the eyewitnesses who continue to back the Bernall claim may have wrongfully attributed the Schnurr/Klebold remark to Bernall due to possible similarities in voice and appearance.

 

Huh, how many teenage girls have uttered the phrase "Oh. My. God!" "Oh God, he's cute!"

 

Look, if Schnurr got shot shouting "Oh God!" whilst getting drilled by the quarterback, that doesn't make Rachel Scott - or Cassie Bernall - a freaking martyr for Pete's sake. They were innocent victims - not unlike the other 11 victims.

[naomi 343]

Val Schnurr was the girl who actually made some comment about God before one of the shooters got distracted by an exploding pipe bomb and left the library. Craig Scott, Rachel's brother, was the one who told the story of Cassie Bernall. When investigators brought him back into the library after the shootings, he incorrectly identified where Cassie had been. This was when the FBI and Detective Battan knew the martyr story had been exaggerated. Cassie, in fact, had had her head blown off with a sawed off shotgun by Harris and said nothing. This was supported by Emily Wyant, who was under the table with Cassie.

 

Right...I mentioned Val a few posts ago. Is your second quote from Wiki too?

 

I think the idea that kids might have been killed or wounded after a direct "do you believe in God?" "Yes"...*Bam*..way irks people.* That's totally what I'm getting from this thread. There has been misinformation about that so I think it's completely right to want to know the truth, but it's like there's a motivation to cancel out any connection they had something against believers, and meanwhile there is also solid information they did have something against them...among others.

 

*there seems to be a zeal in proving that's not how it happened, beyond just the zeal of knowing the actual truth which is good and understandable.

 

Another account:

 

“Schnurr was screaming and then Kreutz heard a gunman from behind her ask Schnurr is she believed in God. The gunman asked again and she recalls Schnurr answering ‘no.’ At that point, Schnurr was laying on the ground next to table #2 on the east side. The gunman may have shot Schnurr again. In the course of this questioning of Schnurr or just at the completion of it, Kreutz got shot several times.”

 

Another account from the Skeptical Review online, supposedly going by Val's own testimony:

 

According to Ms. Schnurr, a shotgun blast had struck her while she was hiding under a library table. Bleeding from nearly three dozen wounds she had received from the blast, Ms. Schnurr said that she then pled for her life, "Oh, my God, oh, my God, don't let me die." She said that one of the gunmen then asked her if she believed in God, and she said yes. While the gunman was reloading, she managed to crawl away, but a friend who had been hiding with her was killed along with Cassie Bernall and ten others.

Tiki (sorry.. missattributed this to Wiff earlier) what you bolded in the account you probably like the most interests me. It seems unlikely (not impossible) that would be said by someone in her situation. Little too much thought in it. BUT it is what people like to believe about Christians, you are one because you're not thinking about it, just going by your parents beliefs, etc.

 

Get the resentment over the sales of the Bernall's book on Cassie. Don't get eagerness to downplay people may have been particularly hated because they believed. Think there's an undercurrent of to Christianity in general because you wanted to bold those words attributed to Val. Am I wrong? Is it all resentment over profit over a lie as is the case of the Bernalls or is something else going on...same reason you like the quote attributed to Val that you bolded.

 

As for Rachel Scott's family, still haven't checked out if her parents are claiming the same as that initial report, never heard that connection myself, just that she was shot.

[tikigods 76]

Right...I mentioned Val a few posts ago. Is your second quote from Wiki too?

 

I think the idea that kids might have been killed or wounded after a direct "do you believe in God?" "Yes"...*Bam*..way irks people.* That's totally what I'm getting from this thread. There has been misinformation about that so I think it's completely right to want to know the truth, but it's like there's a motivation to cancel out any connection they had something against believers, and meanwhile there is also solid information they did have something against them...among others.

 

*there seems to be a zeal in proving that's not how it happened, beyond just the zeal of knowing the actual truth which is good and understandable.

 

Another account:

Another account from the Skeptical Review online, supposedly going by Val's own testimony:

Tiki (sorry.. missattributed this to Wiff earlier) what you bolded in the account you probably like the most interests me. It seems unlikely (not impossible) that would be said by someone in her situation. Little too much thought in it. BUT it is what people like to believe about Christians, you are one because you're not thinking about it, just going by your parents beliefs, etc.

 

Get the resentment over the sales of the Bernall's book on Cassie. Don't get eagerness to downplay people may have been particularly hated because they believed. Think there's an undercurrent of to Christianity in general because you wanted to bold those words attributed to Val. Am I wrong? Is it all resentment over profit over a lie as is the case of the Bernalls or is something else going on...same reason you like the quote attributed to Val that you bolded.

 

As for Rachel Scott's family, still haven't checked out if her parents are claiming the same as that initial report, never heard that connection myself, just that she was shot.

 

My quote did not come from Wiki...part of it came from the book and the rest was from her website, I think.

 

I'm not railing on Christians just the Evangelicals who took full advantage of it. Saying the Devil was in Littleton...or referring to the Devil as The Enemy. It was a good recruitment tool used on the scared and weak minded. The situation is very similar to al-Qaeda using the US invasion as a recruitment tool. Everyone has an enemy to fight.

[naomi 343]

My quote did not come from Wiki...part of it came from the book and the rest was from her website, I think.

 

I'm not railing on Christians just the Evangelicals who took full advantage of it. Saying the Devil was in Littleton...or referring to the Devil as The Enemy. It was a good recruitment tool used on the scared and weak minded. The situation is very similar to al-Qaeda using the US invasion as a recruitment tool. Everyone has an enemy to fight.

 

In Cassie Bernall's parents case, I can't assume they ever objectively considered the conclusions from the investigations. They may have been just profiting, or they thought what they wrote happened with their daughter and then leaned on it as a way of honoring her. I don't know what Rachel Scott's family thinks, haven't seen anything that indicates they've profited off an incorrect version of the story. Rachel was specifically mentioned by the shooters in their basement tapes, but all I've ever heard is she got shot, not a narrative along with it. As for Val Schnurr, I wonder about the lengthier quote attributed to her. I've read several accounts today and Schnurr and witnesses indicate a lot less wordy of an exchange than that. Dylan and Eric mocked believers for believing, among other people. It's not all they cared about, they indicated they'd wind up being indiscriminate too.

 

You have two teenagers working together like this in a quiet little city who wind up killing 13 people. Whenever evil prevails, it's not uncommon for a bible believing Christian to believe the devil has had influence. All things considered I don't think there was a concerted effort to dupe "weak minded" people. Scare them to what, too? Church? If you put aside those cynical conclusions, was there enough material for people to get that impression and just legitimately have it and not for ulterior motives? I will agree that there can be a "rally effect" and people hold onto the information that unifies them, and politicians pander to that kind of stuff, but in the mix is genuine personal impressions too. You heard Rachel Scott's dad speak, I'm guessing you didn't get the impression he was just a hack.

[tikigods 76]

In Cassie Bernall's parents case, I can't assume they ever objectively considered the conclusions from the investigations. They may have been just profiting, or they thought what they wrote happened with their daughter and then leaned on it as a way of honoring her. I don't know what Rachel Scott's family thinks, haven't seen anything that indicates they've profited off an incorrect version of the story. Rachel was specifically mentioned by the shooters in their basement tapes, but all I've ever heard is she got shot, not a narrative along with it. As for Val Schnurr, I wonder about the lengthier quote attributed to her. I've read several accounts today and Schnurr and witnesses indicate a lot less wordy of an exchange than that. Dylan and Eric mocked believers for believing, among other people. It's not all they cared about, they indicated they'd wind up being indiscriminate too.

 

You have two teenagers working together like this in a quiet little city who wind up killing 13 people. Whenever evil prevails, it's not uncommon for a bible believing Christian to believe the devil has had influence. All things considered I don't think there was a concerted effort to dupe "weak minded" people. Scare them to what, too? Church? If you put aside those cynical conclusions, was there enough material for people to get that impression and just legitimately have it and not for ulterior motives? I will agree that there can be a "rally effect" and people hold onto the information that unifies them, and politicians pander to that kind of stuff, but in the mix is genuine personal impressions too. You heard Rachel Scott's dad speak, I'm guessing you didn't get the impression he was just a hack.

 

I agreed with most of the points Darrell Scott made particularly about gun control. Knee jerk reactions to things of this nature are not good for the law biding citizens just going about their everyday lives. I also agreed that violent video games and music are scapegoats. The blame rests on Eric Harris' biological make up. Psychopathy is something in his nature that was nurtured along the way.

 

Scott pushed for more God in schools. We lacked a moral compass. I disagree. Organized religion, especially Evangelical Christianity, does more harm than good. Some of the moderate ministers in the Littleton area were appalled at this use of tragedy for recruitment. Others loved it. I've seen this before....in Iraq. Religion is often used to polarize people in a movement. Colorado Evangelicals wanted to use it go after video games and music...particularly Marilyn Manson, who Harris didn't even listen to. He was into German industrial metal.

[naomi 343]

I agreed with most of the points Darrell Scott made particularly about gun control. Knee jerk reactions to things of this nature are not good for the law biding citizens just going about their everyday lives. I also agreed that violent video games and music are scapegoats. The blame rests on Eric Harris' biological make up. Psychopathy is something in his nature that was nurtured along the way.

 

Scott pushed for more God in schools. We lacked a moral compass. I disagree. Organized religion, especially Evangelical Christianity, does more harm than good. Some of the moderate ministers in the Littleton area were appalled at this use of tragedy for recruitment. Others loved it. I've seen this before....in Iraq. Religion is often used to polarize people in a movement. Colorado Evangelicals wanted to use it go after video games and music...particularly Marilyn Manson, who Harris didn't even listen to. He was into German industrial metal.

 

When you think of Evangelical Christianity, do you mean a specific movement comprised of people who are Evangelical Christians, or the whole set of beliefs? When I look at the definition, I think I'd be considered one. Not sure where the harm in my beliefs is. Again, I don't think people were using it to "recruit"...if those preachers were speaking their minds and some people were alerted to their take. Could it be just that? I didn't know Evangelical people wanted to go after video games and such, I remember the news media kinda harped on that after Columbine happened. If you compare the effects of this "polarizing" opinion factor you're mentioning...so some people who agreed with that take started looking into churches, maybe reading the bible in Littleton (don't know that that happened). Compare this to what the polarizing pull is in Iraq...fundamentalists see Islam's ultimate destiny is to be spread world wide, with force if necessary. Your cynical explanation assumed correct, ultimately having the context to pray in school if you want it is encouraged nationally as something to allow on one hand, spread of a religion by force is on the other.

 

My guess is if you saw (or read about) some preachers in Littleton, zealous in their faith, being vocal on the heels of the events, they were being genuine. On the national level, on the periphery...on the business side of things, I will bet there was advantage taken. The events and connective ideas were used to sell books and so on. But to say that those preachers IN Littleton we're just using it at a time like that...and not instead saying what they were genuinely impressed with is a sad accusation. Sad if it's true, sad they're accused of it if it's not.

[VikesFan 1]

Oh Dear Lord people... I cannot believe how many people on both sides ignore such simple facts just to get their agenda through. The bottom line is this, there is contradictory eye witness information regarding whether Cassie said this or not. In other words, no one, short of God Himself, knows whether or not she said it. Any argument over this is utterly ridiculous... No one knows... including you guys.

 

What is worse is that people waste tons of space arguing about the minutia of a very chaotic event while ignoring the fact that cops sat outside the school for hours while kids were being killed... even preventing armed parents from entering the school. You want to talk about ridiculous gun laws? Let the parents in... Less would be dead. Same with VT. Had students been armed, a whole lot less would be dead. When seconds are precious the cops are 5 minutes away... or in this case... a few hours.

 

I know this, if that ever happens at my kid's school, those cops will be shooting me or getting out of my way.

[tikigods 76]

NH is trying to expand the Castle Doctrine so people can use deadly force when their person is in danger. The anti-gun nuts are going apeshit over it but Vikes brings up some valid points. Armed people can stop things like this from happening.

 

On another note to naomi, Rachel Scott was never mentioned on the Basement Tapes. It was concluded that no one that was shot or killed was ever mentioned by name by the killers.

[naomi 343]

On another note to naomi, Rachel Scott was never mentioned on the Basement Tapes. It was concluded that no one that was shot or killed was ever mentioned by name by the killers.

 

Then those basement tape transcipts (linked in this thread) are fabricated. OR they're mentioning another Rachel (that also has a rep for being Christian)

 

Vikes Fan you're right, in the end Cassie could have said that...but no one here is disagreeing that she seems to have been confused with someone else. I don't care about the minutia in of itself, but it might take reconciling the information there is, to deal with a blanket dismissal that, though indiscriminate in action, they had rationale for hating some people more. Again unless those transcripts were fabricated, they seemed to.

[remote controller 133]

Anything worth reading here??? :giantsfanthread:

[kutulu 1,541]

These two tards went to my sons school..they be focked

 

 

Two Attleboro idiots charged with posting Columbine-style threats on Facebook are guilty of nothing more than poor judgment, say parents who acknowledge what they describe as an immature prank will have grown-up consequences....

[naomi 343]

Wow, you guys really mean it when you say I'm difficult to understand.

I just had a hard time following myself.

[DanXIII 8]

I was in Denver when this happened, such a sad event

[tikigods 76]

Wow, you guys really mean it when you say I'm difficult to understand.

I just had a hard time following myself.

 

At some point I think I just started to ignore you. Nothing personal.