Manziel

[Cruzer 1,992]

I dunno what the Browns thought they would be able to do with Manziel.

 

I really wish Jerry had got his way and drafted him.

I was happy as hell that we took Z. Martin with our 1st round pick - many were not..... Funny, you don't hear any of that now.. The Browns and their fans have to be sick to their stomach after seeing that. As crazy as it sounds - they actually have to look to drafting a qb again.

[NewbieJr 540]

The Browns will bring in a Matt Schaub-type veteran to be the "backup", knowing full well that he'll really be the starter around week 5.

[DaBeerz 88]

I was happy as hell that we took Z. Martin with our 1st round pick - many were not..... Funny, you don't hear any of that now.. The Browns and their fans have to be sick to their stomach after seeing that. As crazy as it sounds - they actually have to look to drafting a qb again.

 

Drafting Oline is critical to success, but it's not flashy. Good coaches and GM's draft these type of blue chip players. Stupid coaches/GMs/Owners draft a flashy hype guy the fans want. There is actually a very shitty movie I watched on the plane called "Draft Day" with Kevin Costner, but I swear to god it was based on Manziel, and it was the Browns GM as well. He doesn't want to take a flashy "can't miss" QB with some very questionable personal red flags.

 

The Browns will bring in a Matt Schaub-type veteran to be the "backup", knowing full well that he'll really be the starter around week 5.

 

Exactly this. There are many journeymen who are certainly better than Manziel, and will give them an out of "Manziel needs to learn the game more from the sidelines." With Cleveland's history of QB draft busts, they really should have been smarter.

[Filthy Fernadez 2,696]

The problem with Manziel being behind most any journeyman QB is that with each suspect performance, the fans and media will be calling for JFF to be rolled out again. They'll forget just how bad he is and playing musical QBs in the NFL is not the way to go.

[JT 137]

The problem with Manziel being behind most any journeyman QB is that with each suspect performance, the fans and media will be calling for JFF to be rolled out again. They'll forget just how bad he is and playing musical QBs in the NFL is not the way to go.

 

You're right, but there's no way to unring the bell. They took him with a first round choice and won't admit their foolishness so quickly. NFL teams rarely do. So he'll be there in camp, and as long as he isn't as bad as he was yesterday, he'll have a chance to fight for the job.

 

IMO they'll bring in two: a guy like Schaub along with a younger guy who may have had some success as a spot-starter, but never really had a chance to develop with a decent team.

 

Funny thing is, those guys will come from the same tier of players that includes McCoy, Weeden and Hoyer.

[DaBeerz 88]

The problem with Manziel being behind most any journeyman QB is that with each suspect performance, the fans and media will be calling for JFF to be rolled out again. They'll forget just how bad he is and playing musical QBs in the NFL is not the way to go.

 

Fans and media are stupid.

 

The kid's a bust, saying it right now, it just depends on how much of a bust. Is there something there that's salvageable? Some 20 something drunktard who thinks he can be an NFL QB. Look at the other successful QB's in the league, a lot of them keep a low profile. Defenses across the board will be fired up to play against this kid just to mock his ridiculous celebration, it will just beome a mockery.

[murf74 461]

Browns get pressured into drafting qbs who slide. Grow some balls and pass. You are ruining your franchise over and over no matter the leaders.

[Skinny_Bastard 154]

Some franchises build a team to win for the long haul. The Browns are the other type of franchises that build to please the fans no matter how poor the decision is.

[Flyfreak 84]

the browns are built for suckage and futility

[roroco 75]

Manziel should stick with his pre-Snickers career of Jazzercise. Quarterbacking in the NFL is not his thing.

[Frank M 181]

I'm tending to believe they're giving the idiot fans what they want; regardless of the result. JFF helps the gate and it's ALL about the gate. People will buy tickets just to watch the dumpster fire and see JFF fail.

 

 

The Browns sell out every year. Regardless of how bad they suck or who's playing QB.

[Frank M 181]

As a Cleveland fan who has seen every game, let me add a bit of perspective, because the idea that the Browns were ever going to make the playoffs and putting Johnny in there ruined any chances of it is ill-informed if you haven't seen the whole body of work from the team.

 

They have had two good games all year. Two. The win against Pittsburgh and the win against Cincinnati. That's it. The rest of their wins were comebacks after being down by a lot (which doesn't happen to good teams, by the way) or poorly played games they managed to pull out with help from the other team. They have three wins against the AFC South. This in and of itself should tell you something about the quality of competition they've faced. In fact, all the AFC North teams have padded their records against the NFC South. I don't see any of them moving past a single game in the playoffs.

 

Brian Hoyer is a game manager that needs every part of the offense clicking to be successful. He does not have a strong arm, he is not that accurate, and he makes some poor decisions. Lots of his throws in the early season should have been picked off and weren't. Once other teams got tape, those throws started being picked off. Then Alex Mack went down, the zone blocking scheme fell apart, and the run game went into the sh1tter. Coincidentally (or not), this is when Hoyer started to struggle. The Browns have had four centers since then. Throw in the fact that Ben Tate was pissed from the beginning that they even drafted a running back, let alone picking up a second one after the draft, and became a locker room cancer after the run game tailed off, and you have a recipe for disaster. Also throw in the fact that Josh Gordon was suspended and once he came back, didn't know the playbook and has not played well. Are all of these problems on Hoyer? Of course not, but a better QB overcomes a lot of them.

 

Now as for whether putting Johnny in was a good idea, I'll remind everybody that in the Buffalo game, the Brown's offense was absolutely putrid, and Johnny came in and drove them 80 yards down the field and scored a TD. He looked good, albeit against a soft Buffalo prevent D. Was anyone saying that Cincy's D was going to match Buffalo's D? No, so it was a good bet that Johnny could have had some success against them. Then Cincinnati comes in and looks like the focking Steel Curtain. The offensive line gets pushed around all day. The Bengals take the opening kickoff and drive the length of the field and score a TD and eat up 7 minutes. Then they have another drive and TD on their second possession. Did Johnny suck all day? Absolutely. So did everybody else, offense and defense. I doubt that the result would have been better under Hoyer based on his play of late. And with the playoffs on the line, do you go with a guy that got you seven wins but only generated 1 TD vs 8 Ints in the four previous games and looked horrific against a suspect Indianapolis D the game before, or with a guy who admittedly has issues on and off the field but generated a spark and looked decent in spot play? Which flavor of sh1t sandwich do you want? Both choices were poor in light of the situation they were facing.

 

I don't envy the situation Pettine is in with an owner who wanted Manziel and probably lobbied for them to take him where they did. There were reports of division among the coaches with Shanahan and the QB coach wanting Johnny and Pettine, who's loyal to a fault, wanting to stick with Hoyer. Unless Johnny makes a dramatic turnaround, it looks like the first round of their draft is a bust, since Justin Gilbert looks like warmed over crap, too. The rest of their draft and free agent pickups after the draft look really solid, though. But make no mistake. The Browns are and always have been an 8-8 team with a first year head coach and GM who have had some stumbles out of the gate. Even with those mistakes, they look light years better than anything we've had since the Browns came back.

 

Let's see how Johnny plays the next two games before declaring him an absolute bust. I'll admit, it doesn't look good after one game, but neither did a lot of good QBs, even guys in the HOF.

[Skinny_Bastard 154]

Let's see how Johnny plays the next two games before declaring him an absolute bust. I'll admit, it doesn't look good after one game, but neither did a lot of good QBs, even guys in the HOF.

 

But most of those QB have the physical & mental attributes to succeed. Johnny don't have the arm, height, pocket awareness and work ethic to get there.

[Frank M 181]

 

But most of those QB have the physical & mental attributes to succeed. Johnny don't have the arm, height, pocket awareness and work ethic to get there.

 

Agreed. I'm not confident. But I want to see how he responds.

[DankNuggs 305]

I think this is an overreaction. We have short memories that the vast majority of future successful QB's who played very early in their careers struggled. Manziel is the type of QB you have to build a gameplan around. I think it takes a little bit of time, which is why it made alot of sense to sit manziel this year, have him master the playbook and get comfortable with the game speed and details of being an NFL QB.

 

It was one bad game. I only saw the highlights, but it looked like he was forcing the ball and not letting the game come to him. Gordon being generally clueless, and Cameron clearly being limited didn't make anything easier.

[Flyfreak 84]

Best quote: 6th round talent at first round price

[Frank M 181]

I think this is an overreaction. We have short memories that the vast majority of future successful QB's who played very early in their careers struggled. Manziel is the type of QB you have to build a gameplan around. I think it takes a little bit of time, which is why it made alot of sense to sit manziel this year, have him master the playbook and get comfortable with the game speed and details of being an NFL QB.

 

It was one bad game. I only saw the highlights, but it looked like he was forcing the ball and not letting the game come to him. Gordon being generally clueless, and Cameron clearly being limited didn't make anything easier.

 

The hope is that this game had the effect of making him realize that he needs to be more serious and not rely on his athletic ability to overcome his physical deficiencies and penchant for unpreparedness.

[Reality 2,710]

Bump for the haters. Enjoy.

[brotherbock 349]

Bump for the haters. Enjoy.

You bumped for a 13/182/1/1 line, with 35 rushing, 3 sacks, and two fumbles? And the loss?

[murf74 461]

You bumped for a 13/182/1/1 line, with 35 rushing, 3 sacks, and two fumbles? And the loss?

Yeah WTF is this guy thinking

[Reality 2,710]

You bumped for a 13/182/1/1 line, with 35 rushing, 3 sacks, and two fumbles? And the loss?

I bumped it when he came into the game, for the discussion, his line played like garbage though. Clear on the field and in his stat line.

 

I liked what I saw from the kid.

 

[Reality 2,710]

Nice win for Johnny today, solid play with 2 beautiful deep TD throws. The arrow is pointing up.

[brotherbock 349]

Nice win for Johnny today, solid play with 2 beautiful deep TD throws. The arrow is pointing up.

 

I'll give him the TD pass to Benjamin I saw, over the middle (not sure which one that was, just saw a highlight). That was, in fact, a very pretty pass.

[Cloaca du jour 2,064]

The second TD pass was tarkington'esque with the spin move to get out of trouble and launch it down the field. Things are looking up.