Ray_T

to be clear, I am not dismissing Harrison as a prospect. I am loving what I am seeing. but it is good to know he was running close to 4.4 even in High school. so I am guessing hes just as fast as Nabors (possibly faster) but we still dont know for sure. Like I said earlier (though it may have been on a different thread) even assuming Nabors is faster, Harrison is a more NFL ready prospect. his body control/catch radius is very impressive and his physicality is superior. to be clear, I think both of them become the #1 on the team that drafts them by the end of the season. the only question I have is how quickly that happens. With Harrison it could happen day one as he has skills that translate immediately. its good info you brought to this conversation and I thank you for that.

something just occurred to me. its possible he refused to do a 40 time in the hopes that he drops a few slots to a team he actually wants to play for. Though the tape on him is good enough that I dont know that this would scare anyone away.

ok that is a measure of the top speed. not the same as a 40 time which takes into account acceleration from not moving. usually when you see no 40 time like what is the case with him, you assume hes not as fast as advertised. I know Nabers at a 4.38 on the 40 is blazing fast too and he looks a bit faster on tape. (though that can be deceiving too) the other factor is playing speed is not always the same as running the 40 on a track built for speed. running on Turf is slightly different (usually slower) to that end, I'm surprised they dont have the guys run their 40 on turf. it would give a better idea as to the true playing speed of that WR.

yeah, looking at Nabers, its possible he could be better. I think the ceiling is higher with him but Harrison is more of a finished product today and there is less risk with him (in my opinion) Even if Harrison was slow (which he isnt) his catch radius and route running alone makes his floor that of a WR3. I think his game translates more easily to the NFL and he will make an immediate impact on day 1. Nabers likely makes an imact but it may take a few games (or up to a season) to get fully attuned to the pro game. he depends more on speed to get open and as a smaller WR he may get a lot more Jams at the line and such to try to knock him off of his route. While that may happen with Harrison, hes a big, physical receiver so that kind of play could easily backfire when defending a guy like him so I dont see a lot of DB's trying that technique against him. as for Odunze, I have not seen enough tape on him yet. based on scouting reports, he shouldnt be as good but it is worth noting all scouting reports I have seen have those 3 as being fairly close and they all stand above the rest.

well, I could see San Fran wanting at least a first for him. but hes younger and not injury prone like Keenan Allen was. but it would be a very quick way to rebuild the WR room for the chargers. and both teams are in different conferences. So that is actually a plus. if in the same conference/division the chances of a deal like this going down is low. while I dont know that this happens, if it did, I'd sure love watching the Chargers play this next year. I like Nabers. hes more of a burner than Harrison I think. I have not seen any times on Harrison but he looks slower (but more physical) than Nabers. and no surprise. I think Nabers was timed at sub 4.4 at his pro day which makes him a very scary WR to cover for most DB's. I think Harrison is technically superior in the sense that he runs more routes and more precise routes that dont depend as much on his speed. either way, the reason I dont think they do this is because they bailed on Keenan Allen (likely for cap reasons) so why would they bring in a player who will want likely close to the same money when his contract comes up? but we can dare to dream. I do think Herbert throwing to him and Nabers would be a very sweet situation indeed.

I do like what he brings to the table in the tape I have watched so far. I especially like the catch radius and the ability to fight and beat out the corner from the ball while maintaining body control. that particular skill is high end. possibly elite. for me that skill is what sets him apart from Nabers who, I'll admit gets open a little more readily but who doesnt have that catch radius/body control ability. and Harrison is a bigger bodied receiver which has other benefits. who in your opinion are the top 2 WR in this draft?

if they are in the process of a negotiation of sorts these things can get emotional for the player. but it certainly adds fuel to the story that he may have requested a trade.

I get it. but the problem is those are usually only band aid solutions. Most of these free agents are in the 28-30 year old range so you are buying 2 or 3 years of good production and then those last couple years on the contract are.... dicey. so there is no perfect solution. and you are still getting a QB that is likely) acut below elite anyway. Much like the guy you are replacing. it is also possible they looked into the option and didnt think they could sign the guys they wanted to so went the path of least resistance.

I really love this kid. he not as physical as Harrison and harrison has some pretty sick body control that allows him to do a better job on the contested catches. but this kid is super quick and looks to be able to turn on a dime at top speed which allows him to get better separation at times. I do notice its often the same route for him. the team didnt vary it a whole lot so he may need some work with route running but it could also be a case where nobody was able to stop him even when they knew what route he was gonna run. so it could be a case of ....... if it aint broken, dont go fixing it. we will go with these 4 or 5 routes until someone shows up that can stop you. but it never happened at the college level. at the pro level he may need a year to refine some of those other routes, but its also possible he already can run them but we just didnt see a whole lot of it. but for me both this kid and Harrison are amazing talents. I'd say Harrison is slightly ahead based on his contested catch ability but its very close. I'd project both of them to quickly (likely less than 1 season) become their teams #1 WR.

well, I like the plan of taking a QB late in round 1 or early round 2. but like I earlier said. I think it is unlikely to happen. but you can usually get a really good guard/Center in round 2 or 3 most years, so if they took a QB in round 1 then came back in round 2/3 and took a guard and Center they might be ok by the time that QB is ready to play (assuming they sit him at least half a season) alternatively they could take an O lineman in round 1 then trade up in round 2 to get that 2nd tier QB and come back in round 3 and take a Center. only problem is you are not upgrading the defense at all so you better nail those picks if you do it that way.

the real problem with Mayfield..... I dont think hes a terrible QB but hes just good enough to keep the team from getting a top draft pick that can be used to draft a franchise QB. granted this season the QB class is deep enough that I think a good candidate can be had in the first and early 2nd rounds. for all we know, maybe that is the plan. if taking a QB in round 2 or late in round 1, the pressure to play him may not be what it is if you take a kid in the top 10 picks overall. You can actually justify sitting him for a year before throwing him in there. That said, I honestly think the odds of this happening is low. but if you draft a QB in round 2 you likely can justify sitting the kid and/or working on his mechanics or whatever deficiencies he has until he is ready. (which in my opinion is what most of the QB's in this class likely need) either way, they do have other holes to fill and there are some plug and play O line guys available in this draft, so the line can be rebuilt if there is a will on the part of management. I see the value in that, but there are far too many teams who do not. I guess we will see.

yeah, thats kind of how I feel about Cousins. hes a regular season darling, but come playoff time..... he kinda stinks

pretty sure you are right. the only difference between guys drafted in the first round and everyone else is that the guys drafted in the first round have the 5th year option

well, I dont fully agree. 2 back to back good years proves the first good year wasnt a fluke. if he was drafted high in the first round hed have a year and a bit of good production along with the pedigree as he performed at a super high level in college. but he was the last pick of the NFL draft. he needs to prove it a bit more if he wants to get top dollar. Personally I think part of his value comes from the system and team he plays with. outstanding weapons on offense and a good O line that keeps him from facing too much heat. if he goes elsewhere the situation isnt nearly as good. his best value as a player is where he is at. another top notch season and hes getting top dollar from multiple offers. it becomes the whole Kirk Cousins thing where his value just kept going up. and he is definitely in the situation to make that happen. screwing around with a holdout with 2 years left on his contract? not a good idea.

I was never suggesting you thought Dak was worth 60M. I just saw it as a market comparable. I was mostly pointing out that the market is also crazy because I dont think Dak is worth 60M either. but that seems to be where the market is for top 10 QB's. I dont honestly know that ANY player should be worth this much. either way, the team has a cap crunch coming. drafting a WR to replace one of the departing ones may not be a bad idea. and drafting a TE to replace an aging kittle in a year or so may also not be a bad idea. but that's their problem not mine (thankfully)