Davante Adams vs other 2nd tier WRs

[RedzoneMonster 102]

Am I crazy for ranking Davante Adams higher than all the below WR’s?

 

 

B. Cooks – Pros: Played well when healthy last year. Good QB. Cons: N.O. has let it known they are committed more to the run this year.

 

J. Matthews – Pros: Played well down the stretch last year (When Sanchez came in he got more targets). Cons: I know it’s the Chip Kelly system now, but has Sam Bradford ever made any WR a star?

 

M. Evans – Pros: Played EXTREMELY well last year. Cons: Do you trust a rookie QB? I know Winston is “better” than last years QB, but that doesn’t necessarily mean better production from Evans. (ex. Mathews playing better with Sanchez than Foles last year).

 

Adams – Pros: Played well in limited action last year. Was the unofficial “MVP” of camp this year. Rodgers is QB. Will be on the field every down now with Jordy out. GB has let it be known they plan to play a more up tempo offense this year.

 

I just don’t see any Cons for Adams like the other guys…

 

 

[tanatastic 2,061]

A fair case and Adams is my wr2 in a couple leagues. About Bradford, he single handedly got Danny Amendola every dime hes made in the nfl since that one year he forcefed him 80 balls or something, I forget. Got Danny labeled as a stud white possession wr ever since even tho hes garbage. I had to listen to people rank him as a great ppr beast every focking year after that, made my stomach churn. But its more about Chip , less about Sam. Sam is just a tool for chip to utilize to the fullest potential.

[RedzoneMonster 102]

A fair case and Adams is my wr2 in a couple leagues. About Bradford, he single handedly got Danny Amendola every dime hes made in the nfl since that one year he forcefed him 80 balls or something, I forget. Got Danny labeled as a stud white possession wr ever since even tho hes garbage. I had to listen to people rank him as a great ppr beast every focking year after that, made my stomach churn. But its more about Chip , less about Sam. Sam is just a tool for chip to utilize to the fullest potential.

 

Very true about Amendola. I forgot about him. I guess ultimately I feel Adams is the "safest" of the bunch.

[Frozenbeernuts 1,652]

Cooks and matthews both have higher ceilings

[tanatastic 2,061]

 

Very true about Amendola. I forgot about him. I guess ultimately I feel Adams is the "safest" of the bunch.

Another factor your not seeing is the trust level with Rodgers. I love Adams role but he hasnt earned the clout to guarantee his role all season. For example, however unlikely, ii Ty comes on strong and Adams makes some bad drops you could see Ty take over. Cobb has his role cemented but these other guys are still making their name.

[giraldi02 470]

I'd take the other three aforementioned guys before Adams

[weepaws 2,460]

Am I crazy for ranking Davante Adams higher than all the below WRs?

 

 

B. Cooks Pros: Played well when healthy last year. Good QB. Cons: N.O. has let it known they are committed more to the run this year.

 

J. Matthews Pros: Played well down the stretch last year (When Sanchez came in he got more targets). Cons: I know its the Chip Kelly system now, but has Sam Bradford ever made any WR a star?

 

M. Evans Pros: Played EXTREMELY well last year. Cons: Do you trust a rookie QB? I know Winston is better than last years QB, but that doesnt necessarily mean better production from Evans. (ex. Mathews playing better with Sanchez than Foles last year).

 

Adams Pros: Played well in limited action last year. Was the unofficial MVP of camp this year. Rodgers is QB. Will be on the field every down now with Jordy out. GB has let it be known they plan to play a more up tempo offense this year.

 

I just dont see any Cons for Adams like the other guys

 

Not to sure at this time that Winston is better than what they had last season . I think Evans number take a hit this season . I like Adams more than Evans but not over Cooks and Matthews .

[Crystal Meth Tweekers 26]

I feel "Juice" Landry deserves more props also. The guy caught 84 balls last year and most of that was coming on late. He has been the apple of Tannehill's eye this off season. Tannehill hit 80% of his preseason passes and looked great. The guys hitting his deep passes alot better this year in camp too. I would say hes a lock for 100 catches and could easily get close to 10 TD's as he has been a favorite of Tannehill's in the redzone this preseason. I feel he's a lock as a solid WR2 this year.

 

http://www.rotoworld.com/player/nfl/9405/jarvis-landry

[R8RMick 242]

Another factor your not seeing is the trust level with Rodgers. I love Adams role but he hasnt earned the clout to guarantee his role all season. For example, however unlikely, ii Ty comes on strong and Adams makes some bad drops you could see Ty take over. Cobb has his role cemented but these other guys are still making their name.

 

 

I'm sorry I usually respect your posts but this take is downright preposterous. I'm not arguing Adams over Cooks and/or Matthews. In fact I've said here that I was big on Brandin Cooks in that Saints offense. Right now Roto has Matthews at WR12, Cooks at WR13, and Adams at WR19 (behind the likes of Allen Robinson, Emmanuel Sanders, and AJ.) While I'm OK with the ranking of the three guys in the OP's question, I would caution against sleeping on Davante Adams. And to say he hasn't 'earned the clout' in that Packers offense is way off base. There have been questions as to whether Adams can step into the Jordy Nelson role. After hearing how Janis and even the rook Montgomery would take that role in at least 3 wide sets I did some research.

 

Right now, Davante Adams is the starting split end on an offense quarterbacked by Aaron Rodgers. Period. Is he going to put up Jordy Nelson's 98/1500/13 line from last season? Lol... probably not. But rest assured he is qualified to assume that role. At 6-1 215 Adams has the size to play outside. His 4.51 straight line speed is not optimal, sure, but Adams possesses slick moves, superior open field elusiveness coming out of his breaks, and elite leaping ability. He attacks the football rather than allowing defenders to make a play. It's been argued by some on this board that straight line speed is overrated in a football player. I would agree with this in Adams' case, especially playing a position where he is already operating in space and not trying to get to it (ala a RB.)

 

On nearly every Fresno State offensive play in college, Adams ran as the split end. So he has experience being tethered to the line and not benefiting from motion moves before the snap. But more importantly, primary strengths of Adams are his tenacity at the point of attack and his ability to release, both large aspects of playing split end. He has a 'hop release' and a slight stutter move, both of which are lethal when coupled with the ability of Adams to use his large frame to separate.

 

Finally, the contrast from a rookie season to second year for a young WR is night and day (folks touting Ty Montgomery should heed such). When asked recently by a Pack beat reporter what was the difference between this and last season Adams laughed and said, "everything..." The game slows down, information is processed quicker, and the player learns to trust their own technique.They've also become familiar with teammates and the playbook, and have an entire season of tape to self-scout.

 

Not a huge fan of BR, but saw this story from earlier this year which scouted Adams BEFORE the Nelson injury. I've rehashed a lot of it already, but it breaks down some specific routes and displays the techniques and skills Adams possesses to succeed as the X WR in the Green Bay offense. Of particular interest is some throws that Rodgers makes, which downplay the added attention Adams will receive. Again, not hyping Adams over Matthews or Cooks, but just cautioning against downplaying him.

 

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2496982-why-packers-receiver-davante-adams-will-break-out-in-his-2nd-nfl-season

[Flgatorguy87 160]

I like him more than Evans

[AintNoStoppinMeNow 68]

I think the targets he saw in the playoff game vs Dallas last season was more than enough to convince me that Rodgers trusts Adams.

[tanatastic 2,061]

 

 

I'm sorry I usually respect your posts but this take is downright preposterous. I'm not arguing Adams over Cooks and/or Matthews. In fact I've said here that I was big on Brandin Cooks in that Saints offense. Right now Roto has Matthews at WR12, Cooks at WR13, and Adams at WR19 (behind the likes of Allen Robinson, Emmanuel Sanders, and AJ.) While I'm OK with the ranking of the three guys in the OP's question, I would caution against sleeping on Davante Adams. And to say he hasn't 'earned the clout' in that Packers offense is way off base. There have been questions as to whether Adams can step into the Jordy Nelson role. After hearing how Janis and even the rook Montgomery would take that role in at least 3 wide sets I did some research.

 

Right now, Davante Adams is the starting split end on an offense quarterbacked by Aaron Rodgers. Period. Is he going to put up Jordy Nelson's 98/1500/13 line from last season? Lol... probably not. But rest assured he is qualified to assume that role. At 6-1 215 Adams has the size to play outside. His 4.51 straight line speed is not optimal, sure, but Adams possesses slick moves, superior open field elusiveness coming out of his breaks, and elite leaping ability. He attacks the football rather than allowing defenders to make a play. It's been argued by some on this board that straight line speed is overrated in a football player. I would agree with this in Adams' case, especially playing a position where he is already operating in space and not trying to get to it (ala a RB.)

 

On nearly every Fresno State offensive play in college, Adams ran as the split end. So he has experience being tethered to the line and not benefiting from motion moves before the snap. But more importantly, primary strengths of Adams are his tenacity at the point of attack and his ability to release, both large aspects of playing split end. He has a 'hop release' and a slight stutter move, both of which are lethal when coupled with the ability of Adams to use his large frame to separate.

 

Finally, the contrast from a rookie season to second year for a young WR is night and day (folks touting Ty Montgomery should heed such). When asked recently by a Pack beat reporter what was the difference between this and last season Adams laughed and said, "everything..." The game slows down, information is processed quicker, and the player learns to trust their own technique.They've also become familiar with teammates and the playbook, and have an entire season of tape to self-scout.

 

Not a huge fan of BR, but saw this story from earlier this year which scouted Adams BEFORE the Nelson injury. I've rehashed a lot of it already, but it breaks down some specific routes and displays the techniques and skills Adams possesses to succeed as the X WR in the Green Bay offense. Of particular interest is some throws that Rodgers makes, which downplay the added attention Adams will receive. Again, not hyping Adams over Matthews or Cooks, but just cautioning against downplaying him.

 

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2496982-why-packers-receiver-davante-adams-will-break-out-in-his-2nd-nfl-season

Ok this post was wayyyy too long in response to mine. I said in the previous post that I loved Adams and I took him in rnd 4 of 2 different drafts as my wr2. I was simply showing the other side of the coin to calling Adams safe, just playing devils advocate. I hardly think my post was "preposterous" lol. Its preposterous to say an unproven guy is not cemented in his role in the offense? AGAIN...I like Adams and even reached for him in multiple drafts to start for me.

[smash-a-mus 6]

Im with tantastic. I'm not completely sold on Adams either. I liked him better when he was a sleeper in the late rounds. I think his value is grossly inflated now. I agree that he is going to have more targets as the result of the injury but I don't think he's in the same category as Cooks, Matthews and Evans. I would take Hopkins, sanders, maclin, and even andre johnson over him.

 

I know a lot of attention has been given to Adam but the Nelson injury actually benefits Cobb and Lacy more so that Adams. Not enough has been said about the increased looks that Cobb and increased carries/ dump offs that Lacy will have as result of the Nelson injury.

[R8RMick 242]

Ok this post was wayyyy too long in response to mine. I said in the previous post that I loved Adams and I took him in rnd 4 of 2 different drafts as my wr2. I was simply showing the other side of the coin to calling Adams safe, just playing devils advocate. I hardly think my post was "preposterous" lol. Its preposterous to say an unproven guy is not cemented in his role in the offense? AGAIN...I like Adams and even reached for him in multiple drafts to start for me.

 

 

Apologies. My intent was merely to dispute your claim that Adams wasn't ready, or hasn't earned the gig. He is, and he has. But I have been looking closely at the prospect of him taking over cleanly for Nelson at the X WR position in that offense. Wasn't aware he was the defacto split end at Fresno State, where he caught a ga-zillion passes from Derek Carr. Saw some stuff in the BR article that cements the notion he indeed can handle that role in 2 or 3 wide sets ie. his skills at separating etc.

 

Nelson saw 151 freaking targets last year, and most of those will go to Adams. Cobb snatched 91 catches off 127 targets. I'm really not sure how they can force feed very much more than that. Lacy had 55 targets last year, even IF he got into Matt Forte territory that still leaves a ton of work for Adams out at the X receiver position. Plus how much do you want to over work Lacy? Again, Adams is the #1 split end in an Aaron Rodgers offense.

[Frozenbeernuts 1,652]

Im with tantastic. I'm not completely sold on Adams either. I liked him better when he was a sleeper in the late rounds. I think his value is grossly inflated now. I agree that he is going to have more targets as the result of the injury but I don't think he's in the same category as Cooks, Matthews and Evans. I would take Hopkins, sanders, maclin, and even andre johnson over him.

 

I know a lot of attention has been given to Adam but the Nelson injury actually benefits Cobb and Lacy more so that Adams. Not enough has been said about the increased looks that Cobb and increased carries/ dump offs that Lacy will have as result of the Nelson injury.

Adams gets less of a bump for becoming Rodgers #2 receiver than Cobb and Lacy? Do you realize how ridiculous this sounds? Cobb and Lacy are already established good fantasy players. They really cant go THAT much higher because of the already high level they play at. Adams, however, was being drafted as a late round flier and wasnt even expected to be a consistent flex option. Id say Adams has a hell of a lot more room to grow than the other two and its not even close.

[Dueces Will Be Wild 15]

I think I would put the other 3 right above Adams but I still like him a lot this year. I have him in all three auctions I've done so far this year.

[Flgatorguy87 160]

Let's throw out numbers for Adams....

 

90/1170/8

 

165 standard 255 PPR

 

Is this reasonable?

[Dueces Will Be Wild 15]

Yes that's reasonable. I personally don't like predicting stats as I think that's pretty arbitrary but I would say 1100-1200 yards would be my midline but he has a higher ceiling and only a slightly lower floor barring injury imo.

[Flgatorguy87 160]

I think predicting stats is the only way to go. It's easy to love a player but putting real numbers on his season takes it to another level.

[smash-a-mus 6]

Adams gets less of a bump for becoming Rodgers #2 receiver than Cobb and Lacy? Do you realize how ridiculous this sounds? Cobb and Lacy are already established good fantasy players. They really cant go THAT much higher because of the already high level they play at. Adams, however, was being drafted as a late round flier and wasnt even expected to be a consistent flex option. Id say Adams has a hell of a lot more room to grow than the other two and its not even close.

 

Just because cobb and lacy have high prices doesn't mean that their fantasy value can't increase. Everyone's value system is different but I value Cobb and Lacy much higher than the ridiculous prices that they are already going for. I would take Lacy #1 or Cobb (if healthy) over Demar, Aj, Calvin putting him in the category of the Top tier WRs. That's how much I value those guys this year as result of the Nelson Injury.

 

Conversely, I DONT value Adams as high as others this year. I see that his value increases but there is no guarantee that Ty or Janis ends up eating up the extra looks or maybe Adam's stats last year was predicated on Cobb and Nelson clearing out the defense? Im not paying 2nd or 3rd round prices on a WR that has question marks for me. I would have been perfectly happy drafting him towards the end with hopes that he develops.

 

I hope that clarifies my point a little bit.

[Mike Nice 40]

Let's throw out numbers for Adams....

90/1170/8

165 standard 255 PPR

Is this reasonable?

Yup and ronnie hillman will get 1000 yards rushing......

[Flgatorguy87 160]

Yup and ronnie hillman will get 1000 yards rushing......

Your numbers?

[R8RMick 242]

Let's throw out numbers for Adams....

 

90/1170/8

 

165 standard 255 PPR

 

Is this reasonable?

He needs to drastically improve his catch to target ratio if he wants to hit those numbers. I really should have caveated my post with that comment. Last season his rec/target ratio was 57%. In reference Cobb caught 91 of the 127 passes thrown his way for a sick ratio of 71%.

 

I highlighted all of that 2nd year WR business thinking these numbers would improve for Adams.

[Dueces Will Be Wild 15]

Yup and ronnie hillman will get 1000 yards rushing......

There'd be a good chance if CJ got injured like Jordy did.

[Mike Nice 40]

Your numbers?

I'd say

 

76 984 7 0 0 0 214.4

 

I really don't see much mire than that, MAYBE 80-1000

[Mike Nice 40]

There'd be a good chance if CJ got injured like Jordy did.

Because he did that last.....wait a minute

[Flgatorguy87 160]

I don't know much about the guy. I drafted him pre-injury for cheap.

 

I really am interested to see numbers on him.

 

I looked at expected totals for Rodgers, targets for Jordy, YPC for Jordy, receptions, and then obviously knocked them down.

 

My projections put him at the WR15 last year.

[Flgatorguy87 160]

I'd say

 

76 984 7 0 0 0 214.4

 

I really don't see much mire than that, MAYBE 80-1000

Seems reasonable as well. Your YPC are in the same neighborhood as mine & TDs as well. Just reception totals as the variable.

[Mike Nice 40]

Seems reasonable as well. Your YPC are in the same neighborhood as mine & TDs as well. Just reception totals as the variable.

Yea not bad but the thing is nobody knows really.

 

Matthews and cooks are safer and have more upside.

 

Evans - the jury is still out with Winston.

[Flgatorguy87 160]

Yea not bad but the thing is nobody knows really.

 

Matthews and cooks are safer and have more upside.

 

Evans - the jury is still out with Winston.

Agree

[R8RMick 242]

I'd say

 

76 984 7 0 0 0 214.4

 

I really don't see much mire than that, MAYBE 80-1000

 

 

If he saw 125 targets this season (about what Cobb saw in 2014) and performed at his same receptions per target ratio and ypc, I can see your numbers. If he bumps his catches to targets ratio even up to 65%, we're looking at about 85-90 receptions.

[tanatastic 2,061]

I like to look at guys and compare them to other guys seasons rather than project stats. For example, I look at Adams and think of a floor and a ceiling. Ceiling looks like Jordys typical year. Id say thats fair if he gets the same routes and develops chemistry with Rodgers and flashes his talent. For floor id look at something like Keenan Allens year last year. He was the wr1 yet wildly dissapointing. Thats within reason for Adams on both counts id say. Dont be so quick to say he cant possibly do what Jordy did, that would be underestimating Rodgers star making power.

[Beyond Chaos 75]

He needs to drastically improve his catch to target ratio if he wants to hit those numbers. I really should have caveated my post with that comment. Last season his rec/target ratio was 57%. In reference Cobb caught 91 of the 127 passes thrown his way for a sick ratio of 71%.

 

I highlighted all of that 2nd year WR business thinking these numbers would improve for Adams.

It would be AaRod who needs to improve that ratio, not Adams. Adams had a 3.0 drop % vs. Cobbs 4.7%.

[Boilermaker04 11]

It would be AaRod who needs to improve that ratio, not Adams. Adams had a 3.0 drop % vs. Cobbs 4.7%.

Not a fair comp, degree of difficulty between them last year was wildly different.

[R8RMick 242]

It would be AaRod who needs to improve that ratio, not Adams. Adams had a 3.0 drop % vs. Cobbs 4.7%.

Wow that's s pretty strong statement considering the lasers that Rodgers typically deals! I'd say look at Adams' rookie year route running and his adjustments to hot reads etc... was not even considering dropped passes.

[Beyond Chaos 75]

Wow that's s pretty strong statement considering the lasers that Rodgers typically deals! I'd say look at Adams' rookie year route running and his adjustments to hot reads etc... was not even considering dropped passes.

Do you have any stats on that?

[giraldi02 470]

Adams gets less of a bump for becoming Rodgers #2 receiver than Cobb and Lacy? Do you realize how ridiculous this sounds? Cobb and Lacy are already established good fantasy players. They really cant go THAT much higher because of the already high level they play at. Adams, however, was being drafted as a late round flier and wasnt even expected to be a consistent flex option. Id say Adams has a hell of a lot more room to grow than the other two and its not even close.

 

I'm not 100%, but I think the bump that was mentioned is applicable towards their FLOORS

[stonewall 647]

FWIW I own Adams as my WR2 in one league

 

However, I keep getting visions of Finley a few pre-seasons ago. I know he was a TE.......but he had Rodgers and was a Can't Miss!

[Flgatorguy87 160]

I'm not sure I'd have the stones to draft Adams as a WR2...which is what I think he is. I guess it's not a confident projection.

 

I'm just glad I got him late and cheap.

[BobSanders_33 127]

I took Adams in the 4th as a WR2 in both of my leagues. Rodgers is a star maker and had high praise for Adams in camp:

 

Rodgers, who previously went on the record saying Adams is "starting to reach" his "humongous upside," is talking up his second-year wideout every chance he gets. "Davante is a very polished player, and he has an excellent demeanor for a guy who’s going to be a star," Rodgers said. "I mean, he carries himself like a star – which is a very high compliment. There’s only been a few guys around here who’ve had that charisma: Charles (Woodson), Julius (Peppers), Greg (Jennings) always had it as a young player. But there’s very few guys that really ‘get it." Adams is going to erupt if anything happens to Jordy Nelson or Randall Cobb.

 

I see him as having a high floor and high ceiling. I'll take a guy that is going to be the 2nd passing option in a Rodgers offense. Adams looked like a stud against Dallas in the playoffs and he should just get better. James Jones caught 15 TD passes in a year from Rodgers. I would take him over all of the guys listed except Cooks. I just don't know what Evans is going to do with Winston even though he should be better than what Evans had to work with last year. I like Matthews but you never know what kind of sports science Chip is cooking up from week to week.