NFL rule for sacks?

[nygiants 0]

Just curious if no gain by the QB is considered a sack by the defense. I lost by less than a point vs the Steelers D. They gave them a sack on a play where Cassel was stopped for no gain. I assume they got it right but wanted to confirm. Basically my season is over now so looking for any hope at this point lol.

[Patriotsfatboy1 1,432]

Just curious if no gain by the QB is considered a sack by the defense. I lost by less than a point vs the Steelers D. They gave them a sack on a play where Cassel was stopped for no gain. I assume they got it right but wanted to confirm. Basically my season is over now so looking for any hope at this point lol.

 

I believe that there are 2 criteria that have to be met:

1. Has to be a pass play. If there is a botched handoff or a QB draw called, there is no sack

2. The QB does not get back to the line of scrimmage. They are generous on "no gain" calls even though the guy may have lost a foot or an inch. If he lost anything, then it is a sack.

[TheUsualSuspect 207]

Just curious if no gain by the QB is considered a sack by the defense. I lost by less than a point vs the Steelers D. They gave them a sack on a play where Cassel was stopped for no gain. I assume they got it right but wanted to confirm. Basically my season is over now so looking for any hope at this point lol.

Keep an eye on "stat corrections" later on this week.

[DexterMorgan 5]

My game is currently tied and STL D, who I played against, had a 0 yard sack as well. Praying.

[Houston Texans 10]

I believe that there are 2 criteria that have to be met:

1. Has to be a pass play. If there is a botched handoff or a QB draw called, there is no sack

2. The QB does not get back to the line of scrimmage. They are generous on "no gain" calls even though the guy may have lost a foot or an inch. If he lost anything, then it is a sack.

Pretty sure the 2nd criteria is wrong. If the QB doesn't pass the LOS on a pass drop-back it's a sack. Therefore, getting back to the LOS (but no further) on a pass attempt is considered a sack.

[mzf5c5 0]

Pretty sure the 2nd criteria is wrong. If the QB doesn't pass the LOS on a pass drop-back it's a sack. Therefore, getting back to the LOS (but no further) on a pass attempt is considered a sack.

 

Isn't it not a sack also if he tucks the ball in like a rb and run's with it? Turning it into a running play? I thought where he had the ball factored also.

[Houston Texans 10]

Isn't it not a sack also if he tucks the ball in like a rb and run's with it? Turning it into a running play? I thought where he had the ball factored also.

That was the 1st criteria the previous poster mentioned. From what I understand, if the play is a designed pass play, and the QB gets tackled/forced out of bounds before he crosses the LOS, it's a sack. It doesn't matter if he tucks the ball, unless the official scorer determines that it was a designed run play.

[Patriotsfatboy1 1,432]

Pretty sure the 2nd criteria is wrong. If the QB doesn't pass the LOS on a pass drop-back it's a sack. Therefore, getting back to the LOS (but no further) on a pass attempt is considered a sack.

 

Based on what?

 

This was the definition from eHow based on what the league has described. Elias has no definition on their site.

 

Definition of Sack

The league defines a sack as tackling the quarterback behind the line of scrimmage while he is attempting to pass. All three elements must be present. It has to be the quarterback, not another player taking a handoff or pitch and throwing an option pass. It has to be behind the line of scrimmage; a quarterback who is chased across the line is credited with run yardage. And the quarterback must be trying to pass; designed run plays that are stopped behind the line of scrimmage are not considered sacks.

[DexterMorgan 5]

I'd be interested in going back and looking at these plays.

 

Are these saying that they were change TO a sack or FROM a sack?

 

Week 1:

 

Sam Bradford, StL QB Rushing Attempts (RA) -1

Rushing Yards (RY) -1

Sacked (SKD) 1

 

Week 2:

 

Kevin Kolb*, Ari QB O Rushing Attempts (RA) -1

Rushing Yards (RY) -3

Sacked (SKD) 1

 

Week 6:

 

Ryan Tannehill, Mia QB Rushing Attempts (RA) -1

Rushing Yards (RY) 17

Sacked (SKD) 1

 

WEEK 9:

 

Ryan Fitzpatrick, Buf QB Rushing Attempts (RA) -1

Rushing Yards (RY) -4

Sacked (SKD) 1

[DexterMorgan 5]

Do stat corrections periodically come out or are they all released in one lump?

[Stewburtx8 67]

If the QB is tackled for ZERO yards on a pass play, it is a sack. He must get past the statistical line of scrimmage. It's always been that way even though most of the definitions you see say BEHIND the LOS.

 

DexterMorgan- I believe the stat corrections usually come out on Wednesday. All the major fantasy sites usually post a list of them all at once. I know Espn and Yahoo run stat corrections by Wednesday evening/Thursday morning. Any corrections that come out after that won't be updated by the sites.

[DexterMorgan 5]

Thanks Here's to hoping.

 

Gat Damn 4th and 15

[Houston Texans 10]

Based on what?

 

This was the definition from eHow based on what the league has described. Elias has no definition on their site.

Based on the fact that it is possible to record a sack for a loss of zero yards.

 

It is logical, especially when you consider that a QB is supposed to be behind the LOS when he throws a pass, but he can actually be right on top of the LOS, and the pass would still be legal. The NFL seems to consider the LOS itself as "behind" the LOS, when dealing with sacks and legal forward passes.

[Patriotsfatboy1 1,432]

Based on the fact that it is possible to record a sack for a loss of zero yards.

 

It is logical, especially when you consider that a QB is supposed to be behind the LOS when he throws a pass, but he can actually be right on top of the LOS, and the pass would still be legal. The NFL seems to consider the LOS itself as "behind" the LOS, when dealing with sacks and legal forward passes.

 

Sort of. A QB can throw a forward pass with the ball ahead of the LOS, so long as any part of his body is at or behind the line.

[Houston Texans 10]

Based on the fact that it is possible to record a sack for a loss of zero yards.

 

It is logical, especially when you consider that a QB is supposed to be behind the LOS when he throws a pass, but he can actually be right on top of the LOS, and the pass would still be legal. The NFL seems to consider the LOS itself as "behind" the LOS, when dealing with sacks and legal forward passes.

Sort of. A QB can throw a forward pass with the ball ahead of the LOS, so long as any part of his body is at or behind the line.

How is this "sort of?" You posted the same thing I did, merely using different words.

he can actually be right on top of the LOS, and the pass would still be legal.

 

A QB can throw a forward pass with the ball ahead of the LOS, so long as any part of his body is at or behind the line.

 

Right on top of the LOS = any part of his body is AT or behind the line.

 

How are those not 2 different ways of saying the same thing?

[Patriotsfatboy1 1,432]

How is this "sort of?" You posted the same thing I did, merely using different words.

 

 

 

 

Right on top of the LOS = any part of his body is AT or behind the line.

 

How are those not 2 different ways of saying the same thing?

 

The spot of the ball is where the ball is when the player is tackled. The ball can be beyond the LOS and the QB can still throw a forward pass. If the QB were to be tackled at that point, then the ball would be spotted beyond the line of scrimmage, which makes your point in the prior post really a "sort of".

 

Get it?

[tanatastic 2,061]

There's also things like wether the linemen are downfield that dictate units a designed run or not. Like if the linemen are too far the qb can't throw right? An if it's a designed run its not a sack. Could be mistaken, but I think linemen position is a factor.

[Houston Texans 10]

The spot of the ball is where the ball is when the player is tackled. The ball can be beyond the LOS and the QB can still throw a forward pass. If the QB were to be tackled at that point, then the ball would be spotted beyond the line of scrimmage, which makes your point in the prior post really a "sort of".

 

Get it?

No, I don't get it, because I NEVER mentioned the ball. The only part of your post that had anything to do with mine was the part where you stated the QB could be "at or behind the line." I stated that the QB could be right on top of the LOS when he threw the ball, which is the same thing as your "at the line of scrimmage." If the QB were tackled (on a pass play) with the ball IN FRONT of the LOS, then it wouldn't be a sack for 0 yards lost, it would be a rush for 1 yard, 1/2 yard, 1/4 yard, 0 yards, etc.

[Patriotsfatboy1 1,432]

No, I don't get it, because I NEVER mentioned the ball. The only part of your post that had anything to do with mine was the part where you stated the QB could be "at or behind the line." I stated that the QB could be right on top of the LOS when he threw the ball, which is the same thing as your "at the line of scrimmage." If the QB were tackled (on a pass play) with the ball IN FRONT of the LOS, then it wouldn't be a sack for 0 yards lost, it would be a rush for 1 yard, 1/2 yard, 1/4 yard, 0 yards, etc.

 

Here is what you posted about a sack being considered a tackle at or behind the LOS.

 

Based on the fact that it is possible to record a sack for a loss of zero yards.

 

It is logical, especially when you consider that a QB is supposed to be behind the LOS when he throws a pass, but he can actually be right on top of the LOS, and the pass would still be legal. The NFL seems to consider the LOS itself as "behind" the LOS, when dealing with sacks and legal forward passes.

 

Read the bolded part and you should be able to see what I am talking about. The NFL does not consider the LOS to be the LOS or behind when speaking of a legal forward pass. It considers only whether any part of the QB is at the LOS or behind.

 

For a sack, it considers only where the ball is at the time of the tackle.

[Houston Texans 10]

Here is what you posted about a sack being considered a tackle at or behind the LOS.

 

 

 

Read the bolded part and you should be able to see what I am talking about. The NFL does not consider the LOS to be the LOS or behind when speaking of a legal forward pass. It considers only whether any part of the QB is at the LOS or behind.

 

For a sack, it considers only where the ball is at the time of the tackle.

I get what you mean. But you are missing my point. My point was that the NFL considers the LOS to be "behind the LOS" on both pass attempts & sacks. If a QB (or any part of his body) is "on" the LOS, he is considered "behind" the LOS, and can therefore make a legal forward pass. Likewise, if the QB is tackled (on a pass play) while he is "on" the LOS, it's considered "behind" the LOS, and therefore a sack.

 

I wasn't dealing with placement of the ball, or how the NFL marks forward progress, etc. I was referring the the OP's question, which was if a QB was tackled at the LOS on a pass play, should it be considered a sack. Despite the confusion with regards to the wording the NFL uses in their rules, I was merely pointing out that sacks for 0 yards were consistent with other NFL rules, regarding the LOS.

[Thornton Melon 542]

My understanding is that it doesn't need to be a designed run (i.e., QB draw) to be not recorded as a sack. If the QB is being pressured, and decides to tuck the ball and run with it, it's not a sack if he runs toward the line of scrimmage, even if he gets tackled for negative yardage. At the point he starts running toward the LOS, it's a rushing attempt. If he tucks it and runs away from the LOS, and gets tackled, it's a sack. Of course, there would have to be some judgement on the official scorer's part as to the QB's intent.

[Houston Texans 10]

My understanding is that it doesn't need to be a designed run (i.e., QB draw) to be not recorded as a sack. If the QB is being pressured, and decides to tuck the ball and run with it, it's not a sack if he runs toward the line of scrimmage, even if he gets tackled for negative yardage. At the point he starts running toward the LOS, it's a rushing attempt. If he tucks it and runs away from the LOS, and gets tackled, it's a sack. Of course, there would have to be some judgement on the official scorer's part as to the QB's intent.

I don't believe this is correct. I've seen Roethlisberger tuck and run many times and if he's tackled behind the line, it's a sack.

 

More recently, NO sacked Vick 7 times a few weeks ago, and I know for a fact that on (at least) 2 of those, Vick was running towards the LOS.

[Thornton Melon 542]

I don't believe this is correct. I've seen Roethlisberger tuck and run many times and if he's tackled behind the line, it's a sack.

 

More recently, NO sacked Vick 7 times a few weeks ago, and I know for a fact that on (at least) 2 of those, Vick was running towards the LOS.

 

I'm wrong? Damn, that's twice this month!

[DexterMorgan 5]

Has anyone seen a list of week 11 stat corrections?