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#201 madd futher mucker

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Posted 04 May 2012 - 02:32 PM

This may be a starting point for you. FWIW I'll give you guys my post draft PPR startup dynasty top 10+ players for each position. This ranking takes age and risk into account.

QBs
1. Rodgers
2. Stafford
3. Newton
4. Luck
5. RG3

6. Brees
7. Rivers
8. Eli
9. Romo
10. About a 5 way tie!

RBs
1. Foster
2. Richardson (yes, I'd take him that high)
3. McCoy
4. Rice
5. McFadden
6. Peterson
7. MJD
8. (6 way tie - Mathews, C Johnson, Forte, Lynch, Martin, Sproles (PPR monster)

WRs
1. Calvin
2. AJ Green
3. Nicks
4. Julio
5. Fitz
6. Wallace
7. Jennings
8. Harvin
9. 5 way tie - Blackmon, Floyd, V Jackson, Bowe, A Brown? (this one is really tough)

TEs
1. Gronk
2. Graham
3. Hernandez
4. Finley
5. V Davis
6. Gresham
7. Pettigrew
8. Celek
9. Fleener
10. Cook

Some will question me for leaving a few "short window" older players off this list. Your rules will determine how much weight to put on player age when making your rankings.

I am assuming that you guys are in the FFToday Zealots league. I sure hope that Evil Genius posts the pick-by-pick start-up draft.

I retired from a 25 year marriage and a very brief sideline job as a Fantasy Football Analyst.  So now i only have my day job and my dog to keep me occupied. 


#202 The Next Generation

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Posted 04 May 2012 - 03:44 PM

No Foster mfm? I'm assuming you just forgot...
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#203 madd futher mucker

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Posted 04 May 2012 - 03:46 PM

No Foster mfm? I'm assuming you just forgot...


You just misread because Foster is on the same line with the caption "RBs." He is #1 of course.
Edit - I'll move him down to his own line.

I retired from a 25 year marriage and a very brief sideline job as a Fantasy Football Analyst.  So now i only have my day job and my dog to keep me occupied. 


#204 The Next Generation

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Posted 05 May 2012 - 06:56 AM

You just misread because Foster is on the same line with the caption "RBs." He is #1 of course.
Edit - I'll move him down to his own line.


:thumbsup:
Resistance is Futile!

#205 ralphster

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Posted 05 May 2012 - 10:30 AM

Some will question me for leaving a few "short window" older players off this list. Your rules will determine how much weight to put on player age when making your rankings.

I am assuming that you guys are in the FFToday Zealots league. I sure hope that Evil Genius posts the pick-by-pick start-up draft.


Thanks MFM - this is pretty much exactly what I was looking for. Good info too.

Two questions:

1. No love for Roddy White?
2. Any changes for a 1 point ppr league?
“When I played pro football, I never set out to hurt anyone deliberately - unless it was, you know, important, like a league game or something” ~ D. Butkus

#206 MTSkiBum

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Posted 05 May 2012 - 11:14 AM

14 team league:

Jaquizz rodgers

Or

2.10
3.05



For reference in a 12 team league those are picks 2.12 and 3.09
Steeler's Fan

#207 WhiteWonder

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Posted 05 May 2012 - 01:18 PM

This may be a starting point for you. FWIW I'll give you guys my post draft PPR startup dynasty top 10+ players for each position. This ranking takes age and risk into account.

QBs
1. Rodgers
2. Stafford
3. Newton
4. Luck
5. RG3

6. Brees
7. Rivers
8. Eli
9. Romo
10. About a 5 way tie!

RBs
1. Foster
2. Richardson (yes, I'd take him that high)
3. McCoy
4. Rice
5. McFadden
6. Peterson
7. MJD
8. (6 way tie - Mathews, C Johnson, Forte, Lynch, Martin, Sproles (PPR monster)

WRs
1. Calvin
2. AJ Green
3. Nicks
4. Julio
5. Fitz
6. Wallace
7. Jennings
8. Harvin
9. 5 way tie - Blackmon, Floyd, V Jackson, Bowe, A Brown? (this one is really tough)

TEs
1. Gronk
2. Graham
3. Hernandez
4. Finley
5. V Davis
6. Gresham
7. Pettigrew
8. Celek
9. Fleener
10. Cook

Some will question me for leaving a few "short window" older players off this list. Your rules will determine how much weight to put on player age when making your rankings.

I am assuming that you guys are in the FFToday Zealots league. I sure hope that Evil Genius posts the pick-by-pick start-up draft.


you know i dont factor age into the equation much when talking about dynasties or deep keepers. i just think there are enough opportunities for trades and turnover of your roster that if you continually draft too much on potential, you will never actually find the winners circle.

so while i might leave peyton manning off my list of QB's as you have, i wouldnt leave Brady off. Even if Brady plays 3 more years, i would still rank him above Romo, Eli, Rivers. At a position like QB, im not passing up a proven stud like Brady or Brees for a ? like RGIII. Even if RG turn out to be a beast, it might not be for 3-4 years. I'd rather win some titles behind Brees and then trade him for something and rebuild.

i do like your rankings but i wanted to chime in.

No way I have Celek 8th but leave Gates off the list. again i will take 2-3 years of good production from Gates rather than hoping the flashes Celek has shown actually manifest into true stardom. Plus if age is a concern Celek is already 27 only 4 years younger than the proven Gates.


runningback is probably the one position where I will let age influence my decision. most back are done by 30 anyway if not sooner in this age of committees and fresh legs.

i probably differ from most people when it comes to WR's. WR's have a longer shelf life than RB's so i would likely shy away from drafting someone like blackmon who i don't think will have a good QB for a while and opt to instead go for Roddy White who can easily have 5 more years of elite production.

#208 madd futher mucker

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Posted 05 May 2012 - 02:04 PM

Roddy should probably made it a 6 way tie. In general I agree with White Wonder, but start-up drafts are much different than valuation for trades in established dynasty leagues. Especially in the first couple or 3 rounds, I want to form a nucleus that will be around for a long time. But I believe that the league we are referring to has 3 year max veteran contracts. This would make it seem that age isn't quite as important; but in my view age is still very important with these early picks, because you want to draft with the potential resale value (trade value 3 years out) in mind.

We are only talking about the early "franchise building" picks here. In the rounds 4th and later, you should probably draft for maximum present value regardless of age.

I retired from a 25 year marriage and a very brief sideline job as a Fantasy Football Analyst.  So now i only have my day job and my dog to keep me occupied. 


#209 madd futher mucker

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Posted 05 May 2012 - 06:24 PM

14 team league:

Jaquizz rodgers

Or

2.10
3.05



For reference in a 12 team league those are picks 2.12 and 3.09


This is a trick question because I'd advise the average dynasty player to keep the bird in the hand. I've ranked and studied the rookie class down low enough so I've got a pretty good idea of some talent likely to be available at these spots, so I personally would go for the two in the bush, betting that at least one of them will have a better career than Quizz.

I retired from a 25 year marriage and a very brief sideline job as a Fantasy Football Analyst.  So now i only have my day job and my dog to keep me occupied. 


#210 Quickolas1

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 06:47 PM

This is a trick question because I'd advise the average dynasty player to keep the bird in the hand. I've ranked and studied the rookie class down low enough so I've got a pretty good idea of some talent likely to be available at these spots, so I personally would go for the two in the bush, betting that at least one of them will have a better career than Quizz.


readable cliff notes:
the picks > jacq

#211 Patmos

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 07:08 PM

Is there some kind of a guideline for the value of a future draft choice? For example, I could expect to get a 3rd round pick this year for next year's 1st round pick, or a 6th round pick for next year's 2nd round? I'm trying to get some kind of framework for trading as I am part of the new dynasty league and, believe it or not, I have never made a trade before...and I don't want to be "that guy" who keeps low-balling everybody with trades they would never consider.


I'm aware of the trade calculators that are available, but they only compare values for picks in the current year (at least the ones I have seen).

#212 madd futher mucker

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 08:16 PM

Is there some kind of a guideline for the value of a future draft choice? For example, I could expect to get a 3rd round pick this year for next year's 1st round pick, or a 6th round pick for next year's 2nd round? I'm trying to get some kind of framework for trading as I am part of the new dynasty league and, believe it or not, I have never made a trade before...and I don't want to be "that guy" who keeps low-balling everybody with trades they would never consider.


I'm aware of the trade calculators that are available, but they only compare values for picks in the current year (at least the ones I have seen).


A good general rule of thumb to follow is that a current 2nd rounder is roughly equal to a next years 1st; current 3rd rounder approximates a next year's 2nd.

It gets a little more complicated when there are both players and picks involved. And sometimes, when you really want to do a deal, you might even sweeten the pot a little more. Here's a trade I made yesterday:
•The Mighty Pinksburg Orgasmics gave up Flynn, Matt SEA QB;Salas, Greg STL WR; Year 2012 Draft Pick 3.04; Year 2013 Round 1 Draft Pick from The Mighty Pinksburg Orgasmics
•Cheesehead gave up Year 2012 Draft Pick 1.07;Year 2012 Draft Pick 4.12

I really wanted 1.07 (this year is a super strong draft class); my trading partner needed a back-up QB and I had Flynn as my #3. So I threw in my 2013 1st AND Gregg Salas who I would have had to drop anyway. I think it was a pretty fair deal for both of us, given that I initiated the trade and I really wanted him to accept it with no negotiation. I have no hesitation about overpaying a little to get a deal I really want.

If you look at the list of trades in the next post, you will see a number of swaps for future picks. I've bolded the trades that involved future (2013) picks.

Good luck and I hope this helps.

I retired from a 25 year marriage and a very brief sideline job as a Fantasy Football Analyst.  So now i only have my day job and my dog to keep me occupied. 


#213 madd futher mucker

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 08:32 PM

Shifting the discussion from the appropriateness of questions about multiple hypothetical trade scenarios, here are our dynasty league trades from the first two weeks of April. These are presented to perhaps stimulate some discussion or give you an idea of relative player valuation in our league. I wasn't extremely aggressive, but I pulled the trigger twice, in trades #5 and #7.

Our first four rounds are the rookie/ developmental draft and round 5 begins the 1st round of the 5 round supplemental draft, so 5.01 would be the first pick of five rounds of "leftovers" after the rostered 15 active players and the 4 round rookie draft is over.

That said, here were the deals:

1. •Duh Manning! gave up * Davis, Knile FA RB
•San Diego Schmucks gave up Little, Greg CLE WR

2. •San Diego Schmucks gave up Year 2012 Draft Pick 2.06;Year 2012 Draft Pick 5.11
•Cheesehead gave up Year 2012 Draft Pick 1.11;Year 2012 Draft Pick 7.07

3. •Cheesehead gave up Baldwin, Jon KCC WR;Tamme, Jacob DEN TE
•Silly Rabbit gave up Year 2012 Draft Pick 1.06

4. •Duh Manning! gave up Year 2012 Draft Pick 3.01;Year 2012 Draft Pick 5.09
•Cincinnati Prancers gave up Bush, Michael CHI RB

5. •The Mighty Pinksburg Orgasmics gave up Cobb, Randall GBP WR; Year 2012 Draft Pick 6.04;Year 2012 Draft Pick 7.04
•Yeti Brethren gave up Wayne, Reggie IND WR; Year 2012 Draft Pick 5.03;Year 2012 Draft Pick 9.03

6. •Combative Clowns gave up Gresham, Jermaine CIN TE
•ColourHaze gave up Ingram, Mark NOS RB

7. •The Mighty Pinksburg Orgasmics gave up McGahee, Willis DEN RB; Year 2013 Round 3 Draft Pick from The Mighty Pinksburg Orgasmics
•HitNRun gave up Year 2013 Round 1 Draft Pick from HitNRun

FWIW, these trades, combined with the trades made in March, makes 18 trades since trading opened March 1st. San Diego Schmucks was most active with 7 trades and I (The Mighty Pinksburg Orgasmics) am tied for second most with Cheesehead. We each pulled the trigger 6 times.


Here are the Fat Bastard Dynasty league trades from 2nd week of April through May 5th:
1. •Combative Clowns gave up Cutler, Jay CHI QB;Lloyd, Brandon NEP WR
•The Mighty Pinksburg Orgasmics gave up Manning, Eli NYG QB; Year 2012 Draft Pick 2.09

2. •San Diego Schmucks gave up McCluster, Dexter KCC RB;Royster, Evan WAS RB; Year 2012 Draft Pick 4.01;Year 2012 Draft Pick 7.07; Year 2013 Round 3 Draft Pick from San Diego Schmucks
•HitNRun gave up Year 2012 Draft Pick 3.02;Year 2012 Draft Pick 5.12; Year 2013 Round 2 Draft Pick from HitNRun

3. •Yeti Brethren gave up Cobb, Randall GBP WR; Year 2012 Draft Pick 2.03
•San Diego Schmucks gave up Year 2012 Draft Pick 1.11;Year 2012 Draft Pick 2.02


4. •Cheesehead gave up Year 2012 Draft Pick 2.06
•San Diego Schmucks gave up Sanders, Emmanuel PIT WR

5. •San Diego Schmucks gave up Year 2012 Draft Pick 2.03;Year 2012 Draft Pick 5.02
•The Mighty Pinksburg Orgasmics gave up Year 2012 Draft Pick 1.04;Year 2012 Draft Pick 9.04

6. •HitNRun gave up Turner, Michael ATL RB;Robinson, Laurent JAC WR
•The Hype Machines gave up Greene, Shonn NYJ RB;Johnson, Steve BUF WR

7. •The Hype Machines gave up Year 2012 Draft Pick 2.05
•HitNRun gave up Rodgers, Jacquizz ATL RB

8. •The Mighty Pinksburg Orgasmics gave up Flynn, Matt SEA QB;Salas, Greg STL WR; Year 2012 Draft Pick 3.04; Year 2013 Round 1 Draft Pick from The Mighty Pinksburg Orgasmics
•Cheesehead gave up Year 2012 Draft Pick 1.07;Year 2012 Draft Pick 4.12

Note: We cut our rosters down to 15 players, and then rounds 1 thru 4 are Rookie Draft picks. Rounds 5 - 9 are supplemental picks to bring the total roster size to 24 per team. The early round 5 picks tend to be quite valuable because the supplemental draft is mid August, and there will be just a few players who will emerge as special values prior to that draft, but after that there will be a significant drop-off in talent.

Since trading opened up on March 1st for the 2012 year, we have had 26 total trades in this league, or about 3 trades per week. These trades will give you some idea of how our league values players and picks. As always, I'll be happy to answer any questions.

I retired from a 25 year marriage and a very brief sideline job as a Fantasy Football Analyst.  So now i only have my day job and my dog to keep me occupied. 


#214 Patmos

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Posted 07 May 2012 - 04:36 AM

"A good general rule of thumb to follow is that a current 2nd rounder is roughly equal to a next years 1st; current 3rd rounder approximates a next year's 2nd". <br style="color: rgb(28, 40, 55); font-size: 13px; line-height: 19px; background-color: rgb(250, 251, 252); ">

This is exactly what I was looking for - thanks! No doubt adding players makes it more complicated. With this being an initial draft for the league start up, I thankfully don't have to deal with that additional level of complexity -yet.

#215 Patmos

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Posted 07 May 2012 - 05:42 AM

I've been thinking about this, and it doesn't seem right to me. Maybe MFM, you were talking in context of rookie draft this year vs. rookie draft next year...not a start up draft? I would gladly trade next year's #1 for this year's #2, etc.
In our league, since it is year one, we are combining the rookie draft with the general draft (that may have been a significant point I should not have left out :)

#216 Stewburtx8

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Posted 07 May 2012 - 10:25 AM

Good stuff as usual MFM, but I tend to agree with WW's line of thinking. Youth should obviously play a factor, but I don't personally put a ton of weight on it. I am always playing to win now if at all possible. So for me, your rankings are "a little" youth heavy, especially with respect to the rookies. I tend to use a "3 year window" rule when valuing players. If I feel a player has at least 3 more high level years of production in them, I would still prefer them over less proven youth. Obviously leagues rules could change this a little. There is a difference between a league where you can keep a player forever and there is very little turnover versus a league with limits on years kept and a lot of turnover. If a league has a lot of turnover, I always feel I can rebuild my team through trades and drafting if necessary.

My biggest question is why so high on Trent Richardson? Do you think he is the next Adrian Peterson? I can't say I really see that in him. Great talent, but not elite in my opinion. The track record of first round RB's isn't that great really. Even the ones who pan out have often taken several years to find the right team/system/style. I'd much rather have a 23 year old Lesean McCoy or even 25 year old Ray Rice over a soon to be 22 year old Trent Richardson. McCoy and Rice are proven PPR monsters, while Richardson has never taken a snap in the NFL. I'd probably prefer a few others over Richardson as well.

Agree with WW on Brady and Gates as well. I think I'd have to put them both in my top 10 at their respective positions, just because they could provide elite production even for 2-3 more years, if not more in Brady's case. Gates is a little more understandable though because he can't seem to get/stay healthy. He has been my fantasy kryptonite for the last few years.

One other thing.... Jamaal Charles not in your top 13 RB's it looks like? Don't believe he comes back healthy? Peyton Hillis scare you?

#217 Kopy

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 08:08 AM

Allstars,Madd or anyone else.
Has anyone looked ahead towards this years college season and the 2013 prospects yet? Specifically the RB and WR potential class?

......SEATTLE SEAHAWKS......
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#218 420allstars

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 08:27 AM

Allstars,Madd or anyone else.
Has anyone looked ahead towards this years college season and the 2013 prospects yet? Specifically the RB and WR potential class?


MFM is your guy for devolopmental players! I'm usless till they are a few months away from going pro! :dunno:

#219 Kopy

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 09:46 AM

MFM is your guy for devolopmental players! I'm usless till they are a few months away from going pro! :dunno:

I used to never pay attention until right around Thanks Giving time. Once I switched to a Dynasty league, I started looking a full year ahead.

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#220 Stewburtx8

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 11:28 AM

Allstars,Madd or anyone else.
Has anyone looked ahead towards this years college season and the 2013 prospects yet? Specifically the RB and WR potential class?



Other than watching a decent amount of college football, I can't say I have any great information on these guys. Most of this is based off of various lists I could find and read up on. MFM can probably expand upon this. But these names seem to be the top 2013 draft prospects at this point:

RB
1. Marcus Lattimore, So Carolina
2. Knile Davis, Arkansas
3. Montee Ball, Wisconsin
4. Le'Veon Bell, Michigan St.

From what I'm seeing, this isn't a very strong RB class. The top spot is very interchangeable. I've seen Bell ranked anywhere from 2nd in the class to outside the top 10. Both Lattimore and Davis (probably the two most talented RB's) are coming off injuries.

WR
1. Robert Woods, USC
2. Keenan Allen, Cal
3. Marquess Wilson, Wash St.
4. Justin Hunter, Tennessee
5. Da'Rick Rogers, Tennessee
6. Cobi Hamilton, Arkansas
7. Terrence Williams, Baylor

Robert Woods might be the safest "developmental" player you can find. Barring injury, no reason to believe he doesn't reproduce or better his 2011 season, which should keep him at the top of the WR list.

#221 coryjagfan28

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 12:25 AM

Just traded in my dynasty league.

Needed a RB REAL bad. Had these picks going in

1.02
1.03
1.05
1.09
1.10
2.03

2013
1st round
1st round


traded
1.05
2.03

for

Shon Greene
2013 first round


I get a starting RB that I would of had to hope 1.05 turns into. And traded my 2nd rounder, for another first next year

I figure that still leaves me

Martin at 1.02
RG3 at 1.03
Hillman at 1.09
Fleener at 1.10

#222 420allstars

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 06:52 AM

Just traded in my dynasty league.

Needed a RB REAL bad. Had these picks going in

1.02
1.03
1.05
1.09
1.10
2.03

2013
1st round
1st round


traded
1.05
2.03

for

Shon Greene
2013 first round


I get a starting RB that I would of had to hope 1.05 turns into. And traded my 2nd rounder, for another first next year

I figure that still leaves me

Martin at 1.02
RG3 at 1.03
Hillman at 1.09
Fleener at 1.10


I guess there is two ways to look at this trade..

1: you did get a clear cut starter. the Jets surprised me and I am sure most by not addressing the RB spot in free agency or the draft (although they did take Baylor running back Terrance Ganaway late) but I he doesn’t seem to be any threat for touches this year

2: depending on your WR core you probably have made your team better in the short term.. my thought is could you not have gotten a better RB for those picks? in most rookie drafts I have been part of you gets owners frothing at the mouth for high picks like that.. 1.05 (probably Blackmon/Floyd/luck) end up looking like mega/fitz and Peyton)

long story short I hope you did the leg work to make sure this is the best you could do, if it was I see no big problem with that deal.. :cheers:

#223 coryjagfan28

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 07:12 AM

I guess there is two ways to look at this trade..

1: you did get a clear cut starter. the Jets surprised me and I am sure most by not addressing the RB spot in free agency or the draft (although they did take Baylor running back Terrance Ganaway late) but I he doesn’t seem to be any threat for touches this year

2: depending on your WR core you probably have made your team better in the short term.. my thought is could you not have gotten a better RB for those picks? in most rookie drafts I have been part of you gets owners frothing at the mouth for high picks like that.. 1.05 (probably Blackmon/Floyd/luck) end up looking like mega/fitz and Peyton)

long story short I hope you did the leg work to make sure this is the best you could do, if it was I see no big problem with that deal.. :cheers:



oh yea. I worked all my picks to all the owners. I couldnt even get Quiz Rodgers.

Just seemed like my favorite rookies ( James, Miller, blackmon, and Wright), all landed in undesireable cities.

And this sets me up with 3 fist rounders next year as well

#224 madd futher mucker

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 02:51 PM

Other than watching a decent amount of college football, I can't say I have any great information on these guys. Most of this is based off of various lists I could find and read up on. MFM can probably expand upon this. But these names seem to be the top 2013 draft prospects at this point:

RB
1. Marcus Lattimore, So Carolina
2. Knile Davis, Arkansas
3. Montee Ball, Wisconsin
4. Le'Veon Bell, Michigan St.

From what I'm seeing, this isn't a very strong RB class. The top spot is very interchangeable. I've seen Bell ranked anywhere from 2nd in the class to outside the top 10. Both Lattimore and Davis (probably the two most talented RB's) are coming off injuries.

WR
1. Robert Woods, USC
2. Keenan Allen, Cal
3. Marquess Wilson, Wash St.
4. Justin Hunter, Tennessee
5. Da'Rick Rogers, Tennessee
6. Cobi Hamilton, Arkansas
7. Terrence Williams, Baylor

Robert Woods might be the safest "developmental" player you can find. Barring injury, no reason to believe he doesn't reproduce or better his 2011 season, which should keep him at the top of the WR list.


I agree with Cory's list and comments as a starting point. There is a strong consensus that the 2013 class will be much weaker than the 2012 class is. Playing in a league that allows for drafting college players eligible for the next NFL draft, I've really come to appreciate how much things can change in one college season. Because of the extra element of risk, I don't think I'd draft any 2013 player any higher than about the 2.05 pick in this year's rookie draft.

I retired from a 25 year marriage and a very brief sideline job as a Fantasy Football Analyst.  So now i only have my day job and my dog to keep me occupied. 


#225 WhiteWonder

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 04:45 PM

I guess there is two ways to look at this trade..

1: you did get a clear cut starter. the Jets surprised me and I am sure most by not addressing the RB spot in free agency or the draft (although they did take Baylor running back Terrance Ganaway late) but I he doesn’t seem to be any threat for touches this year


they like bilal powell

#226 madd futher mucker

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 05:44 PM

they like bilal powell


I agree with Wonder. IMO this was a bad trade for you. Double bad if this was a PPR.
The Jets are not strongly committed to Greene as he has been much less than impressive.

I would put my money on Bilal Powell, but there is also a chance of a timeshare among Greene and McKnight as well as Powell.

In addition to Doug Martin with your 1.02 pick, I believe that you could have gotten another quality and potential stud RB with your 1.05 who will timeshare this year but likely take over as the lead back in a year or two, plus a quality rookie WR with your 2.03.

I would have easily have traded 2.03 even up for Greene in regular scoring, but probably would have passed on him completely in PPR.



But how in the world did you accumulate so many early draft picks?

I retired from a 25 year marriage and a very brief sideline job as a Fantasy Football Analyst.  So now i only have my day job and my dog to keep me occupied. 


#227 coryjagfan28

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Posted 11 May 2012 - 10:35 PM

I won last year, but I traded picks during the season. So that got me from 1.12 to 1.05

then I traded Calvin Johnson for 1.2 and 1.3 and a first round next year

then I traded SJax for 1.09, 1.10, and 2.03

#228 GreenTD

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Posted 12 May 2012 - 08:29 AM

I won last year, but I traded picks during the season. So that got me from 1.12 to 1.05

then I traded Calvin Johnson for 1.2 and 1.3 and a first round next year

then I traded SJax for 1.09, 1.10, and 2.03


I know you got a great deal in two early 1st rounders this year & a 1st rounder next year for Calvin but how hard was it to finalize that trade? I would've lost sleep for a week mulling that decision over in my head.

Secondly, you must've found a owner really hard up for a starting running back to get that trade for SJax.

Nice work on both trades though, Cory!

#229 GreenTD

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Posted 12 May 2012 - 08:31 AM

@ coryjagfan28, was wondering if you could post your roster before & after the rookie draft. Really interested in seeing how you went from a championship roster into making all these moves.

#230 Frozenbeernuts

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Posted 12 May 2012 - 10:44 AM

Do you really have that much faith in the rookies coming out this year to trade away calvin?

#231 GreenTD

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Posted 12 May 2012 - 10:50 AM

That's why I'd have a hard time pulling the trigger on that trade. Having the 1.2 & 1.3 guarantees him the choice of Martin, Luck, RGIII or Blackmon. Basically trading one starter for two eventual starters down the road.

Definitely a risky move considering the unknowns that rookies present but could pay huge dividends if he gets the picks right.

#232 WhiteWonder

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Posted 12 May 2012 - 12:52 PM

id have to know alot of the league and roster information before determining if i could trade Calvin Johnson for high rookie picks. Rookies are still unknowns and without 1.1 you cant even lock up the most sure thing rookie in the class. the careers of Martin and RG3 are anything but sure. Yet Calvin Johnson (madden cover aside) is a sure thing BEAST.

i really don't see any way i could ahve made that trade personally unless the rest of my team was in utter disrepair.

#233 coryjagfan28

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Posted 13 May 2012 - 12:17 AM

PPR yardage league. QB/RB/RB/WR/WR/TE FLEX

I won the championship last year with smoke and mirrors. with the exception of Best, everyone stayed healthy. And Robinson was a godsend from the waiver wire

Stafford
Cassel
Best
Morris
Benson
S Jackson
Branch
Cribbs
LRobinson
Calvin
Desean Jackson
Aaron Hernandez
Shockey
Lions D

Then the offseason came, and Robinson went to JAX, and Benson went nowhere.

I couldnt count on another season of perfect health. I had no depth. so, I traded calvin. Then another owner came up offering picks for SJax. I couldnt turndown the buffet of picks I received for SJax.

In hindsite, if I had done the SJax trade first, I probably wouldnt have traded Calvin. It was definitely hard to trade him, being a lions fan. But I really needed to rebuild my RB corps with only Jackson starting.

not that it changes anything either, but I also received Ben Tate in the Calvin trade

#234 GreenTD

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Posted 13 May 2012 - 04:38 PM

PPR yardage league. QB/RB/RB/WR/WR/TE FLEX

I won the championship last year with smoke and mirrors. with the exception of Best, everyone stayed healthy. And Robinson was a godsend from the waiver wire

Stafford
Cassel
Best
Morris
Benson
S Jackson
Branch
Cribbs
LRobinson
Calvin
Desean Jackson
Aaron Hernandez
Shockey
Lions D

Then the offseason came, and Robinson went to JAX, and Benson went nowhere.

I couldnt count on another season of perfect health. I had no depth. so, I traded calvin. Then another owner came up offering picks for SJax. I couldnt turndown the buffet of picks I received for SJax.

In hindsite, if I had done the SJax trade first, I probably wouldnt have traded Calvin. It was definitely hard to trade him, being a lions fan. But I really needed to rebuild my RB corps with only Jackson starting.

not that it changes anything either, but I also received Ben Tate in the Calvin trade


Wow! You're even a Lions fan & you gave up Calvin & broke up the Stafford-Calvin hook-up? That makes this trade a little hazy for my liking.

Seeing your roster, you're gonna need DJax to be a lot more consistent than he's known for to fill your WR1 slot. After that your wideouts are pretty sketchy.

Without SJax as your #1, that Detroit backfield needs to produce along with Benson finding a starting job somewhere or you're going to be behind the 8-ball.

Now to your rookie picks. I think we can all assume Richardson is going 1.1 so your 1.2 & 1.3 picks leave you with the following: Martin, RGIII, Luck, Blackmon & Floyd. Martin is already a lock but what do you do next? RGIII is tempting but you're already strong at that position with Stafford. With your questionable WR2 position I believe you have to make a decision between Blackmon & Floyd. Only problem is you already have Blackmon's running mate in Robinson & Gabbert needs to improve. Plus Floyd is going to be the #2 WR on his team also with a sketchy quarterback position.

If you have to make a pick at 1.3 the pick is Blackmon, especially since it's PPR. I'd try to dangle that 1.3 pick to a quarterback needy team who really wants RGIII or Luck. Otherwise this year might be be a rebuilding year for your championship defending squad.

That or pray the guy with 1.1 either is an LSU fan or hates the Browns so Richardson falls in your lap. Good luck either way Cory!

#235 WhiteWonder

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Posted 13 May 2012 - 05:34 PM

Wow! You're even a Lions fan & you gave up Calvin & broke up the Stafford-Calvin hook-up? That makes this trade a little hazy for my liking.

Seeing your roster, you're gonna need DJax to be a lot more consistent than he's known for to fill your WR1 slot. After that your wideouts are pretty sketchy.

Without SJax as your #1, that Detroit backfield needs to produce along with Benson finding a starting job somewhere or you're going to be behind the 8-ball.

Now to your rookie picks. I think we can all assume Richardson is going 1.1 so your 1.2 & 1.3 picks leave you with the following: Martin, RGIII, Luck, Blackmon & Floyd. Martin is already a lock but what do you do next? RGIII is tempting but you're already strong at that position with Stafford. With your questionable WR2 position I believe you have to make a decision between Blackmon & Floyd. Only problem is you already have Blackmon's running mate in Robinson & Gabbert needs to improve. Plus Floyd is going to be the #2 WR on his team also with a sketchy quarterback position.

If you have to make a pick at 1.3 the pick is Blackmon, especially since it's PPR. I'd try to dangle that 1.3 pick to a quarterback needy team who really wants RGIII or Luck. Otherwise this year might be be a rebuilding year for your championship defending squad.

That or pray the guy with 1.1 either is an LSU fan or hates the Browns so Richardson falls in your lap. Good luck either way Cory!


i know hindsight is 20/20 and cory already said as much but if i knew i could move jackson for picks i would have absolutely kept calvin. don't think he got even close to proper value for a young stud.

and at that point, why trade pick 1.5 for shonn greene? the team was already blown up in effect, why give away a building block for a guy who is running out of chances to prove his worth?

i'd be looking to trade 1.3 to a QB needy team for a proven, youngish player. Keep 1.2 and draft Martin

#236 GreenTD

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Posted 13 May 2012 - 07:44 PM

i know hindsight is 20/20 and cory already said as much but if i knew i could move jackson for picks i would have absolutely kept calvin. don't think he got even close to proper value for a young stud.

and at that point, why trade pick 1.5 for shonn greene? the team was already blown up in effect, why give away a building block for a guy who is running out of chances to prove his worth?

i'd be looking to trade 1.3 to a QB needy team for a proven, youngish player. Keep 1.2 and draft Martin


Basically you agree with me, right WhiteWonder?

In Cory's defense of that trade for Greene, atleast he still received a 1st rounder next year so it was essentially his 2.03 pick for Shonn Greene. Hopefully it becomes a higher pick than 1.05, so only time will tell.

I think he should be able to get good value out of that 1.03 pick with Luck, RGIII & Blackmon available. If not, he's gonna miss #81 catching bombs for the rest of his career.... Gulp

#237 420allstars

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Posted 14 May 2012 - 06:18 AM

PPR yardage league. QB/RB/RB/WR/WR/TE FLEX

I won the championship last year with smoke and mirrors. with the exception of Best, everyone stayed healthy. And Robinson was a godsend from the waiver wire

Stafford
Cassel
Best
Morris
Benson
S Jackson
Branch
Cribbs
LRobinson
Calvin
Desean Jackson
Aaron Hernandez
Shockey
Lions D

Then the offseason came, and Robinson went to JAX, and Benson went nowhere.

I couldnt count on another season of perfect health. I had no depth. so, I traded calvin. Then another owner came up offering picks for SJax. I couldnt turndown the buffet of picks I received for SJax.

In hindsite, if I had done the SJax trade first, I probably wouldnt have traded Calvin. It was definitely hard to trade him, being a lions fan. But I really needed to rebuild my RB corps with only Jackson starting.

not that it changes anything either, but I also received Ben Tate in the Calvin trade


Without replaying everything you have already heard I will just say that I think you have made a couple bad trades! agree your team (even with the championship win) was thin you needed to make a move or two but I just dont see the value in the Calvin trade.. Mega is a every week plug in as your WR1 and somthing I think you will be looking to replace for years to come..

being a Lions fan too I cant see how you could do that deal! I only own Calvin in one of my 4 leagues and have agressivly tried to pick him up for a long time now in the other three..

either way best of luck to you this year and I would love to see how things shake out for you.. you never know we may all be full of it :banana:

#238 jgcrawfish

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Posted 14 May 2012 - 08:55 AM

PPR yardage league. QB/RB/RB/WR/WR/TE FLEX

I won the championship last year with smoke and mirrors. with the exception of Best, everyone stayed healthy. And Robinson was a godsend from the waiver wire

Stafford
Cassel
Best
Morris
Benson
S Jackson
Branch
Cribbs
LRobinson
Calvin
Desean Jackson
Aaron Hernandez
Shockey
Lions D

Then the offseason came, and Robinson went to JAX, and Benson went nowhere.

I couldnt count on another season of perfect health. I had no depth. so, I traded calvin. Then another owner came up offering picks for SJax. I couldnt turndown the buffet of picks I received for SJax.

In hindsite, if I had done the SJax trade first, I probably wouldnt have traded Calvin. It was definitely hard to trade him, being a lions fan. But I really needed to rebuild my RB corps with only Jackson starting.

not that it changes anything either, but I also received Ben Tate in the Calvin trade


So specifically, what did you get in exchange for Calvin? For Jackson? Have you guys had your rookie draft yet? What picks do you have?

Without replaying everything you have already heard I will just say that I think you have made a couple bad trades! agree your team (even with the championship win) was thin you needed to make a move or two but I just dont see the value in the Calvin trade.. Mega is a every week plug in as your WR1 and somthing I think you will be looking to replace for years to come..

being a Lions fan too I cant see how you could do that deal! I only own Calvin in one of my 4 leagues and have agressivly tried to pick him up for a long time now in the other three..
either way best of luck to you this year and I would love to see how things shake out for you.. you never know we may all be full of it :banana:


I'm with you. My team is lacking a shoe-in #1 WR and I would move heaven and earth to get Calvin if I could. Not trying to pick on the guy, but that is the weakest championship team I've ever seen, it must have been the perfect storm of circumstances for it to come.to fruition.

"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing." (Edmund Burke)

#239 coryjagfan28

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Posted 14 May 2012 - 08:05 PM

So specifically, what did you get in exchange for Calvin? For Jackson? Have you guys had your rookie draft yet? What picks do you have?



I'm with you. My team is lacking a shoe-in #1 WR and I would move heaven and earth to get Calvin if I could. Not trying to pick on the guy, but that is the weakest championship team I've ever seen, it must have been the perfect storm of circumstances for it to come.to fruition.


Yea, I knew I got lucky. and couldnt depend on that team to get me there again.

so it was either, stay mediocre, and get to watch Calvin and try to get better over the next 3-5 years.
or
trade calvin, still get to watch stafford, and try to rebuild the team.

I picked Doug Martin at 1.2
I was stuck on what to do with 1.3. RG3/Luck were there, but with stafford, I didnt want to spend the 3rd pick on a bye week player. And I didnt like where Blackmon landed. I was thinking Wilson for the Giants.

But then I got offered the 1.08 and a first rounder next year for the 3rd spot. so, I moved back 5 spots and grabbed another first.

Draft played like this

1. Richardson
2. Martin
3. Wilson
4. Luck
5. Floyd
6. RG3
7. Blackmon
8. Hillman
9. Quick
10. James

still waiting on 11 and 12 to draft.

So, my team looks like this

Stafford
Hill
Cassel
Best
Benson
Martin
James
Hillman
Greene
Desean Jackson
Wayne
Lurant Robinson
Quick
Hester
Cribbs
Henderson
Hernandez
Shockey

and 4 first round picks next year

#240 WhiteWonder

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Posted 14 May 2012 - 08:49 PM

id have without a doubt kept Calvin knowing all that.

As it looks right now you have a great young QB who can contend for top QB honors. No legit #1 RB, no safe #2. the best thing you have is Martin and god knows what will happen his rookie year. You have 2 #3 WR's in D-Jax and Wayne....