It’s Impossible to “Get By” In the US

[Voltaire 5,491]

....no boat, no light, no motor car

not a single luxury...

[nobody 2,889]

You have to pay another $400 per month for property taxes. He didn't include that in the $1022 per month figure. That's a lot, I know. That's $1,400 per month for home mortage payments.

 

Yeah, but they also left 300 a month off his income by just taking his bi-weekly pay times 2 instead of 45k/12. the way they did it ignores the months where Joe gets three checks. We can call it a wash.

[Frank M 181]

The reason you are getting your ass kicked here is that you insist on using the word "necessity." Families with kids and two parents working have existed for a long time before cell phones and got by. Families without food or water, not so much.

 

I gave an opinion, and Strike and Gutter don't agree with it. That's getting my ass kicked?

 

Okay.

[RLLD 4,275]

 

I gave an opinion, and Strike and Gutter don't agree with it. That's getting my ass kicked?

 

Okay.

 

 

While I also do not subscribe to the idea that a cell phone, or any phone really, is a necessity....I know I sure do find having one to be VERY useful; and I would not be inclined to suggest that it is or is not a necessity for someone else. Every situation is different, and I don't have complete knowledge of everyone to suggest that I have the right answer for them.

[Frank M 181]

While I also do not subscribe to the idea that a cell phone, or any phone really, is a necessity....I know I sure do find having one to be VERY useful; and I would not be inclined to suggest that it is or is not a necessity for someone else. Every situation is different, and I don't have complete knowledge of everyone to suggest that I have the right answer for them.

 

 

I'm okay with that. As I said before, the argument can be made that anything beyond food, clothing, and shelter is a luxury.

 

I do find it funny that expressing an opinon has somehow become right or wrong on this bored. It's my opinion, you can agree or not agree. Sign of the times, I guess.

[RLLD 4,275]

I'm okay with that. As I said before, the argument can be made that anything beyond food, clothing, and shelter is a luxury.

 

I do find it funny that expressing an opinon has somehow become right or wrong on this bored. It's my opinion, you can agree or not agree. Sign of the times, I guess.

 

I can see where ones opinion has become a target for people over time. There is an element on the forearm that is convinced that if you do not agree with them you are an "idiot" and there can be only one possible position, and that is their own.....

 

Its not exclusive to this bored either, there is a strong sense of it throughout our culture. We appear to have lost our ability to debate and disagree....

[Frank M 181]

I can see where ones opinion has become a target for people over time. There is an element on the forearm that is convinced that if you do not agree with them you are an "idiot" and there can be only one possible position, and that is their own.....

Its not exclusive to this bored either, there is a strong sense of it throughout our culture. We appear to have lost our ability to debate and disagree....

 

 

Gee, whoever could you be talking about?

[Fenster 6]

My husband has been unemployed for almost 3 months.

 

 

Did the freak show close down?

[edjr 6,899]

Cell phones were sure a necessity in the 80's when I was growing up.

[RLLD 4,275]

Gee, whoever could you be talking about?

 

[jerryskids 7,091]

I'm okay with that. As I said before, the argument can be made that anything beyond food, clothing, and shelter is a luxury.

 

I do find it funny that expressing an opinon has somehow become right or wrong on this bored. It's my opinion, you can agree or not agree. Sign of the times, I guess.

Are you new here? You could say that the sun rises in the east and people would argue with you. But they would be arguing against a statement of fact, not opinion. The fact is that a cell phone is not a necessity. A very, very useful luxury for some, perhaps the first they would choose (over say, computers, internets, TVs, etc.), but a luxury nonetheless. People have molded their family lives/routines around the fact that they have them, and it would be a difficult transition in many cases if they didn't have them, I grant you that. But it could be done.

[BLS 314]

Or a van pulls up behind your daughter and drags her into the back and you find her body three weeks later.

 

We can do this all day. You say a cell phone is a luxury, I say it's a necessity. We disagree.

 

 

Buy her a gun and teach her to use it. It will cost alot less.

 

It never runs out of minutes, doesn't fail to operate if you drop it, and is considerably more effective than threatening to call 911.

[edjr 6,899]

Did the freak show close down?

 

they stopped filming for the Addam's Family

[Frank M 181]

Are you new here? You could say that the sun rises in the east and people would argue with you. But they would be arguing against a statement of fact, not opinion. The fact is that a cell phone is not a necessity. A very, very useful luxury for some, perhaps the first they would choose (over say, computers, internets, TVs, etc.), but a luxury nonetheless. People have molded their family lives/routines around the fact that they have them, and it would be a difficult transition in many cases if they didn't have them, I grant you that. But it could be done.

 

I'm sorry you came in at the end, Jerry, because I'm already tired of the subject.

 

I disagree with you. In my opinion, a cell phone is a necessity in this day and age for a family with kids and working parents. Unless you want to argue that everything beyond food, shelter, and clothing is a luxury, then we just have to agree to disagree.

[edjr 6,899]

I'm sorry you came in at the end, Jerry, because I'm already tired of the subject.

 

I disagree with you. In my opinion, a cell phone is a necessity in this day and age for a family with kids and working parents. Unless you want to argue that everything beyond food, shelter, and clothing is a luxury, then we just have to agree to disagree.

 

You're just a control freak that needs to know where everyone in the family is at all times.

 

Think of how much your life would suck if this were 1985, you'd be a nervous wreck.

[Strike 6,023]

I'm sorry you came in at the end, Jerry, because I'm already tired of the subject.

 

I disagree with you. In my opinion, a cell phone is a necessity in this day and age for a family with kids and working parents. Unless you want to argue that everything beyond food, shelter, and clothing is a luxury, then we just have to agree to disagree.

 

Why does it matter when JK's came in? You just keep repeating the same statement. All I've done is ask you to support it. I'm fine with a difference of opinion, as long as both sides have SUPPORTED their opinion. You haven't offered one iota of support for your position. Seems like you have no rational reasoning as to how you formed this opinion.

[Frank M 181]

Why does it matter when JK's came in? You just keep repeating the same statement. All I've done is ask you to support it. I'm fine with a difference of opinion, as long as both sides have SUPPORTED their opinion. You haven't offered one iota of support for your position. Seems like you have no rational reasoning as to how you formed this opinion.

 

Early on in this thread, I made the contention that to coordinate the daily activities of life for a family with working parents, a cell phone is a necessity. What else do you need? When you are all in different places with different agendas, it's important to be able to communicate.

[RLLD 4,275]

I know that having the phone available has proven to be absolutely integral to keeping our family schedule in order and on track. Without it we would likely not be able to coordinate everything we have on our plate.

 

The alternative would be to find a way to have less on our plate, but our life is what it is....therefore, for us the tool has become a necessity, and perhaps has created the way we handle a our schedule.....

[Strike 6,023]

Early on in this thread, I made the contention that to coordinate the daily activities of life for a family with working parents, a cell phone is a necessity. What else do you need? When you are all in different places with different agendas, it's important to be able to communicate.

 

Again, that's a very vague answer. I'd like specifics? What, you gotta pick up Susie from Basketball practice? Aren't those scheduled? Don't they have phones in the gym? I mean, seriously, give me something specific to illustrate what you're saying. It shouldn't be that difficult since we're talking about a "necessity".

[TD Ryan2 316]

I know that having the phone available has proven to be absolutely integral to keeping our family schedule in order and on track. Without it we would likely not be able to coordinate everything we have on our plate.

 

The alternative would be to find a way to have less on our plate, but our life is what it is....therefore, for us the tool has become a necessity, and perhaps has created the way we handle a our schedule.....

 

with this logic, I would argue that a cell phone is a deterrent to our quality of life and as such an "anti-necessity".

 

I would like nothing more than to have "less on my plate" but the technology and speed/mobility of everything in our world makes it expected that you can have/handle more on your plate.

 

cell phones are the suxor.

[Frank M 181]

Again, that's a very vague answer. I'd like specifics? What, you gotta pick up Susie from Basketball practice? Aren't those scheduled? Don't they have phones in the gym? I mean, seriously, give me something specific to illustrate what you're saying. It shouldn't be that difficult since we're talking about a "necessity".

 

 

Can't just disagree, can you?

[Strike 6,023]

Can't just disagree, can you?

 

From a previous post:

 

All I've done is ask you to support it. I'm fine with a difference of opinion, as long as both sides have SUPPORTED their opinion. You haven't offered one iota of support for your position. Seems like you have no rational reasoning as to how you formed this opinion.

[FeelingMN 273]

How about we just say life is easier if you have a cell phone....although TD Ryan2 makes a good point. Still, in the hectic pace of today's world, cell phones do provide a certain benefit, right?

 

Anyone absolutely disagree with this?

[TheNewGirl 1,637]

Even when my husband was working, I wouldn't think that a cell phone was a neccessity. I agree with jerry in that it is a luxury that has become very important, but it is not neccessary.

 

ITA with Strike that if you have to drop off/pick up kids from practices, those are scheduled. SO, you and the wife sit down and say, "OKay, you pick up Jack from practice on Tuesdays, I will pick up Jack on Thursdays, then run Susie over to gymnastics. We're home by 6. Can you make sure that dinner is done by 6?" Or, that those nights are take-out nights.

 

Print off a calendar from the computer, jot it all down, post it on the fridge, carry it around with you.

 

We still have phones, and we do this ALL the time. On the weekends, we sit down and say, "Okay, what's going on this week?" and we have a calendar up on our fridge that anyone can write stuff on at any time; right next to the weekly dinner meal plans. Around Tuesday or Wednesday, we talk about the weekend plans and if there is anything we have to go buy; birthday gifts, whatever.

 

It's not that hard and you (general you) shouldn't have to be calling your spouse all the time to figure out where you're suposed to be or what you're supposed to be doing.

[Strike 6,023]

How about we just say life is easier if you have a cell phone....although TD Ryan2 makes a good point. Still, in the hectic pace of today's world, cell phones do provide a certain benefit, right?

 

Anyone absolutely disagree with this?

 

Of course not. Only one person has really argued it's a necessity. There's no doubt cell phones are a great convenience. But the context of this thread is a family of four trying to get by on 45k gross in today's world. Within that context it's very hard to make a case that a cell phone, especially for every member of the family, is a "necessity".

[Strike 6,023]

Even when my husband was working, I wouldn't think that a cell phone was a neccessity. I agree with jerry in that it is a luxury that has become very important, but it is not neccessary.

 

ITA with Strike that if you have to drop off/pick up kids from practices, those are scheduled. SO, you and the wife sit down and say, "OKay, you pick up Jack from practice on Tuesdays, I will pick up Jack on Thursdays, then run Susie over to gymnastics. We're home by 6. Can you make sure that dinner is done by 6?" Or, that those nights are take-out nights.

 

Print off a calendar from the computer, jot it all down, post it on the fridge, carry it around with you.

 

We still have phones, and we do this ALL the time. On the weekends, we sit down and say, "Okay, what's going on this week?" and we have a calendar up on our fridge that anyone can write stuff on at any time; right next to the weekly dinner meal plans. Around Tuesday or Wednesday, we talk about the weekend plans and if there is anything we have to go buy; birthday gifts, whatever.

 

It's not that hard and you (general you) shouldn't have to be calling your spouse all the time to figure out where you're suposed to be or what you're supposed to be doing.

 

Exactly. And, I've previously made allowance for pre paid cell phones for this family of four for emergencies. I just think the notion that you have to have a regular cell phone plan is ridiculous for a family on such a limited income. Still waiting for examples to prove otherwise though.

[TheNewGirl 1,637]

How about we just say life is easier if you have a cell phone....although TD Ryan2 makes a good point. Still, in the hectic pace of today's world, cell phones do provide a certain benefit, right?

 

Anyone absolutely disagree with this?

 

 

I will agree that cell phones are beneficial in certain situations.

 

However, they are still not neccessary to get through day to day life.

[parrot 789]

What's funny is that while everyone is debating cell phones, Frank M's even more silly contention, that high-speed internet is a necessity, has gone virtually unremarked upon.

[TheNewGirl 1,637]

What's funny is that while everyone is debating cell phones, Frank M's even more silly contention, that high-speed internet is a necessity, has gone virtually unremarked upon.

 

 

Now, THIS I will agree that High Speed is a neccessity if you want to access sites and have it not take forever. Moreso because of the fact that so many sites have advertisements and things like that that can take a long time to load, etc.

[Strike 6,023]

What's funny is that while everyone is debating cell phones, Frank M's even more silly contention, that high-speed internet is a necessity, has gone virtually unremarked upon.

 

I must have missed it. The only mentions of Internet Access I see don't specify high speed. Can you point me to a post number?

[parrot 789]

I must have missed it. The only mentions of Internet Access I see don't specify high speed. Can you point me to a post number?

Post 25. Gutterboy asked if he needed high-speed, he said yes.

 

Regardless, or high-speed or otherwise, internet service is not a necessity.

[FeelingMN 273]

Of course not. Only one person has really argued it's a necessity. There's no doubt cell phones are a great convenience. But the context of this thread is a family of four trying to get by on 45k gross in today's world. Within that context it's very hard to make a case that a cell phone, especially for every member of the family, is a "necessity".

 

No, I agree. I don't think I'd call cell phones a neccessity....but they're extremely helpful. I think everyone agrees with this. The reason I bring it up is to try and make the point that if a family doesn't have a cell phone because they can't afford it, life is that much harder for them. That's all. Although, if you actually have to decide between a cell phone and food/clothing...then really, not having a cell phone is the least of your problems.

 

I think a more apt "neccessity" would be a car. People/families could survive without a car...technically....in an urban area. But their lifestyles would be limited. Families without reliable transportation....in suburban/exurban areas.....life would be really, really challenging I would think.

[Strike 6,023]

Post 25. Gutterboy asked if he needed high-speed, he said yes.

 

Regardless, or high-speed or otherwise, internet service is not a necessity.

 

Ah. I saw Gutterboy's first post about internet access and he didn't mention high speed. Clearly high speed internet is not a necessity but I think basic Internet for the family can be argued a lot more so than everyone having a cell phone. Might not be a necessity but if I were a parent I'd do everything in my power for my kids to have a computer and basic internet access. I think they'd be at a distinct disadvantage without access to those. Cell phones not so much. And, of course, if you're close enough to your neighbor you don't have to pay for internet access......

[parrot 789]

Ah. I saw Gutterboy's first post about internet access and he didn't mention high speed. Clearly high speed internet is not a necessity but I think basic Internet for the family can be argued a lot more so than everyone having a cell phone. Might not be a necessity but if I were a parent I'd do everything in my power for my kids to have a computer and basic internet access. I think they'd be at a distinct disadvantage without access to those. Cell phones not so much. And, of course, if you're close enough to your neighbor you don't have to pay for internet access......

 

I don't have internet access at home, my kids haven't suffered any adverse affects.

[Strike 6,023]

I don't have internet access at home, my kids haven't suffered any adverse affects.

 

Really? Wow. Curious as to the reasoning, and the ages of the kids.

[Strike 6,023]

I don't have internet access at home, my kids haven't suffered any adverse affects.

 

This is impossible to quantify BTW.

[parrot 789]

Really? Wow. Curious as to the reasoning, and the ages of the kids.

 

Kids are 8 & 11. 11 year old has always been a straight A student. 8 year old is pretty close but gets the occasional B.

 

Reasoning is I'm cheap basically. It's not that we couldn't afford it, it's just not a priority. It's a pain in the ass sometimes but nowhere near the point where I would consider it a necessity...

 

though that may change since the wife just bought me a PS3 for my birthday.

[parrot 789]

This is impossible to quantify BTW.

 

True. Just my feeling as a parent, based on where my kids are academically and overall. I don't see where they've been disadvantaged, and we don't have the hassle of monitoring where they go and what they look at. I think the internet acts as more of distraction to a lot of kids than as a productive tool. I think you could make the case that internet access, on the whole, is probably not beneficial to a whole lot of kids. While her friends are posting on Facebook, my daughter is out working on her drop-step.

[edjr 6,899]

of course internet is a necessity for Gutterboy.

 

Where else can he act like such a big guy?

[GutterBoy 2,900]

of course internet is a necessity for Gutterboy.

 

Where else can he act like such a big guy?

 

inside your GF's twat.