Time for Bob Kraft to do the right thing. Fire Bill Belichick

[IGotWorms 3,302]

If Brady could make a throw, they'd be in the superbowl. That loss was all on Brady.

Not true. Brady missed a couple critical throws but the Pats were outplayed in every facet of the game. The result would've been the same but perhaps the Pats could've at least made a game of it.

[edjr 5,547]

If Brady could make a throw, they'd be in the superbowl. That loss was all on Brady.

 

And you call yourself a fan?

 

If Brady completed that early, WIDE OPEN pass to Edleman they would have been up 7 to 0, for sure. No excuses, that was a terrible Mark Sanzhezesque pass.

 

He missed another huge throw as well.

 

Other than that, he was decent and threaded one really great pass to Vereen.

 

If he completes those 2 passes do they win? No, but the game would have been closer.

 

Brady wasn't out there allowing Denver to go 8 for 8 on 3rd downs in the 2nd half.

[parrot 789]

 

And you call yourself a fan?

 

If Brady completed that early, WIDE OPEN pass to Edleman they would have been up 7 to 0, for sure. No excuses, that was a terrible Mark Sanzhezesque pass.

 

He missed another huge throw as well.

 

Other than that, he was decent and threaded one really great pass to Vereen.

 

If he completes those 2 passes do they win? No, but the game would have been closer.

 

Brady wasn't out there allowing Denver to go 8 for 8 on 3rd downs in the 2nd half.

 

They were outplayed in all three phases, and much more completely than the final score appeared. If Brady makes those passes it's a better game, but the Pats still lose.

[Canadianfan 76]

There is a problem with firing Belichick as GM..... He may of had his best coaching and MANAGING season of his career. If we knew that Mayo, Talib (in-and-out all year), Wilford, Kelly, Amendola, Gronk and Hernandez (jail) were going to be injured this year, how many of you would have predicted a 12-4 season?

 

the answer is 0

 

 

Robert Kraft is a Columbia University and Harvard Business School graduate. His net worth is about 3 billion.... No offence EDJR, but he's probably a little more knowledgeable on weather Belichick can coach and manage a team at the same time than the guy who wrote that article. He evaluates Belichick after every season, and would not have a problem firing him if he thought he was incapable of doing both jobs. don't you think?

[RoadLizard 73]

 

And you call yourself a fan?

 

If Brady completed that early, WIDE OPEN pass to Edleman they would have been up 7 to 0, for sure. No excuses, that was a terrible Mark Sanzhezesque pass.

 

He missed another huge throw as well.

 

Other than that, he was decent and threaded one really great pass to Vereen.

 

If he completes those 2 passes do they win? No, but the game would have been closer.

 

Brady wasn't out there allowing Denver to go 8 for 8 on 3rd downs in the 2nd half.

Right - its extremely clear to me that NEs defense has become very average these days and that vaunted, opportunistic ddfense they had during the SB run is loooooong gone. Talib is nice but him being hurt didnt change the outcome of that game. The Pats cannot stop the run very well, they have minimal pass rushing capabilities and therefore dont play the pass well.

 

Looking at defenses that are able to beat the big name QBs I think you will find they all share on common trait: They can and do get pressure with just the front 4 and maybe an LB. The Giants in 2008 beat NE because of this. The Steelers used to beat Manning because of this.

 

4 man front getting pressure = a WIN for that team against ANY QB.

[southcarolina 166]

Right - its extremely clear to me that NEs defense has become very average these days and that vaunted, opportunistic ddfense they had during the SB run is loooooong gone. Talib is nice but him being hurt didnt change the outcome of that game. The Pats cannot stop the run very well, they have minimal pass rushing capabilities and therefore dont play the pass well.

 

Looking at defenses that are able to beat the big name QBs I think you will find they all share on common trait: They can and do get pressure with just the front 4 and maybe an LB. The Giants in 2008 beat NE because of this. The Steelers used to beat Manning because of this.

 

4 man front getting pressure = a WIN for that team against ANY QB.

NE's run defense was pretty good in 2012...9th fewest yards allowed and 6 lowest yards per attempt. This year the first 4 games they were averaging giving up under 100 yards per game on the ground (which carried thru an entire season would have them again ranked in the top 8-10 teams) when Big Vince got hurt. Then starting DT Tommy Kelly got hurt the next week. Their defense isnt the dominating unit it was 10 years ago. But to ignore the effect of the numerous injuries on the defense this year is disingenuous. Im actually pretty excited about the direction the defense is going.

[FeelingMN 273]

Patriots are playing in their 6th AFC Championship in the last 9 years.

 

Time to clean house.

[Patriotsfatboy1 1,432]

Wait. Ed posted something stupid? I am shocked.

[edjr 5,547]

Great thread

 

He still SUCKS at drafting

 

HTH

 

What a bang up job they did of putting pressure on the QB yesterday with all those awesome draft picks.

 

Thank god BB has Brady to save his bacon

[edjr 5,547]

as General Manager.

 

 

 

[IGotWorms 3,302]

[edjr 5,547]

 

Clearly you can't read either.

[FeelingMN 273]

Great thread

 

He still SUCKS at drafting

 

HTH

 

What a bang up job they did of putting pressure on the QB yesterday with all those awesome draft picks.

 

Thank god BB has Brady to save his bacon

When Brady missed a year....the Pats still finished 11-5. Plenty of talent on that team.

 

Ozzie Newsome he is not. But he still finds guys to fit his system, and they are perennially contending for Championships. The list of GMs who can say that is pretty short.

[Djgb13 2,338]

He may not draft the best but his team certainly does make it to playoffs and championships an awful lot

[IGotWorms 3,302]

He drafts pretty damn well with the exception of WRs and CBs.

[GreenTD 56]

Bob Kraft is getting burned worse than Jimmy Graham owners

[edjr 5,547]

Bob Kraft is getting burned worse than Jimmy Graham owners

 

[edjr 5,547]

When Brady missed a year....the Pats still finished 11-5. Plenty of talent on that team.

 

Ozzie Newsome he is not. But he still finds guys to fit his system, and they are perennially contending for Championships. The list of GMs who can say that is pretty short.

 

They don't win because he's a good GM, they win because of his coaching and that #12 guy doesn't hurt.

 

Had Brady not come back in 2009 and Cassell was still the QB, they would have not gone .500

[parrot 789]

Bob Kraft is getting burned worse than Jimmy Graham owners

[FeelingMN 273]

They don't win because he's a good GM, they win because of his coaching and that #12 guy doesn't hurt.

 

Had Brady not come back in 2009 and Cassell was still the QB, they would have not gone .500

Why should he be fired if he's a good GM?

 

The reason the Patriots win is because they're one of, if not the best run organization in sports. BB as GM is part of that. Just because you don't win the SB you don't go fire a guy who's helped construct a dynasty.

[edjr 5,547]

Why should he be fired if he's a good GM?

 

The reason the Patriots win is because they're one of, if not the best run organization in sports. BB as GM is part of that. Just because you don't win the SB you don't go fire a guy who's helped construct a dynasty.

 

They'd have at least 1 possibly 2 more Super Bowl wins if he were a good GM and didn't let certain players go. Law, Branch, Samuel, to name a few. Their best WR in 2006 was crazy eyes Caldwell? They should have beat Indy in the AFC championship and easily would have beaten Rex Grossman and da bears in the SB.

 

 

Great draft before the 2006 season too

 

Round Overall Player Position College

1 21 Laurence Maroney Running back Minnesota

2[45] 36 Chad Jackson Wide receiver Florida

3 86 David Thomas Tight end Texas

4[46] 106 Garrett Mills Tight end Tulsa

4 118 Stephen Gostkowski Kicker Memphis

5[47] 136 Ryan O'Callaghan Offensive tackle California

6 191 Jeremy Mincey Defensive end Florida

6 205 Dan Stevenson Offensive guard Notre Dame

6 206 Le Kevin Smith Defensive tackle Nebraska

7 229 Willie Andrews Defensive back Baylor

[TUM301 10]

 

 

They'd have at least 1 possibly 2 more Super Bowl wins if he were a good GM and didn't let certain players go. Law, Branch, Samuel, to name a few. Their best WR in 2006 was crazy eyes Caldwell? They should have beat Indy in the AFC championship and easily would have beaten Rex Grossman and da bears in the SB.

 

 

Great draft before the 2006 season too

 

Round Overall Player Position College

1 21 Laurence Maroney Running back Minnesota

2[45] 36 Chad Jackson Wide receiver Florida

3 86 David Thomas Tight end Texas

4[46] 106 Garrett Mills Tight end Tulsa

4 118 Stephen Gostkowski Kicker Memphis

5[47] 136 Ryan O'Callaghan Offensive tackle California

6 191 Jeremy Mincey Defensive end Florida

6 205 Dan Stevenson Offensive guard Notre Dame

6 206 Le Kevin Smith Defensive tackle Nebraska

7 229 Willie Andrews Defensive back Baylor

 

2006, please stop digging this hole.

[Groundhog 24]

Seahawks fan here. I think the bigger issue for the Pats is the loss of Pioli. I think that guy did a lot for the talent evaluation. Belichick is a great game-day coach and is very disciplined about letting go guys a year too soon instead of a year too late. Had we waited another two years, would he have gotten a 1st rounder for Richard Seymour from the Raiders? Probably not.

 

The problem is that if you are letting guys go a year too soon, then the new talent you bring in to replace the established guys had better step up. This is where a lack of raw talent from the draft is hurting. The Pats are getting to take a ton of shots in the draft, it's just that they're missing on too many of them.

[FeelingMN 273]

The problem is that if you are letting guys go a year too soon, then the new talent you bring in to replace the established guys had better step up. This is where a lack of raw talent from the draft is hurting. The Pats are getting to take a ton of shots in the draft, it's just that they're missing on too many of them.

 

Considering the Pats are playing in their 4th consecutive AFC Championship, and have been a championship contender the better part of 15 years....I don't think letting players go too soon is really hurting them much.

 

Or maybe it is. They should be winning Super Bowls every year but aren't because BB is a bad GM.

[Groundhog 24]

I think BB is doing a pretty good job all things considered. I think they do a good job with free agency, and you're right, being competitive year in and year out is a major accomplishment. But if we're looking for things to nitpick, I'd say it's the draft. I don't think his overall record suggests hiring a new GM, but i do think he could benefit from another strong voice in the draft room, which has been missing since Pioli left.

[IGotWorms 3,302]

 

 

They'd have at least 1 possibly 2 more Super Bowl wins if he were a good GM and didn't let certain players go. Law, Branch, Samuel, to name a few. Their best WR in 2006 was crazy eyes Caldwell? They should have beat Indy in the AFC championship and easily would have beaten Rex Grossman and da bears in the SB.

 

 

Great draft before the 2006 season too

 

Round Overall Player Position College

1 21 Laurence Maroney Running back Minnesota

2[45] 36 Chad Jackson Wide receiver Florida

3 86 David Thomas Tight end Texas

4[46] 106 Garrett Mills Tight end Tulsa

4 118 Stephen Gostkowski Kicker Memphis

5[47] 136 Ryan O'Callaghan Offensive tackle California

6 191 Jeremy Mincey Defensive end Florida

6 205 Dan Stevenson Offensive guard Notre Dame

6 206 Le Kevin Smith Defensive tackle Nebraska

7 229 Willie Andrews Defensive back Baylor

You do realize this was almost a decade ago, right?

 

 

 

Damn I suddenly feel old

[edjr 5,547]

You do realize this was almost a decade ago, right?

 

 

 

Damn I suddenly feel old

 

their Super Bowl titles don't count because they were over a decade ago?

 

I'm saying BB's GM prowess, or lack of, cost them definitely 1, possibly 2 more super bowls. Who cares when it was?

[parrot 789]

 

their Super Bowl titles don't count because they were over a decade ago?

 

I'm saying BB's GM prowess, or lack of, cost them definitely 1, possibly 2 more super bowls. Who cares when it was?

 

You mean the same GM prowess that got them to those SuperBowls, or at least within spitting distance?

[FeelingMN 273]

You mean the same GM prowess that got them to those SuperBowls, or at least within spitting distance?

 

Right? Dude has his fingerprints all over the Patriot dynasty....and people knock him because he doesn't win a SB every year. Talk about fantasy football.

[parrot 789]

Right? Dude has his fingerprints all over the Patriot dynasty....and people knock him because he doesn't win a SB every year. Talk about fantasy football.

 

Branch and Law are two of the big ones ed likes to mention.

 

The Pats let Branch walk after 05 and their receivers were sh!t in 06. True enough. But if we sign Branch to a lucrative long-term deal we probably never bring in Moss in 07. Yeah, maybe we never got that SuperBowl with Moss, but does anyone think they would have been a better team with Branch?

 

And Law? Yeah, he was great for them for many years, but he was a 30yo CB coming off an injury that caused him to miss the last 9 games of the regular season and the playoffs. In the 7 games he did play that year he had one pick and three passes defensed. He carried a $12.5m cap number, and, keep in mind, this was 10 years ago. They also had Asante Samuel to think about. It's really hard for me to criticize that move much either.

 

The Welker move was another criticism du jour, we all see how that one turned out.

 

He has missed on a lot of picks, particularly at WR and CB, as someone else mentioned. But other than that, he's built that team, especially the defense, almost completely through the draft.

[edjr 5,547]

 

 

He has missed on a lot of picks, particularly at WR and CB, as someone else mentioned. But other than that, he's built that team, especially the defense, almost completely through the draft.

 

Dude c'mon, their defense has SUCKED since 2004. Especially on 3rd downs. Consistently in the bottom 1/3 of the league. It's good this year, sure. Revis and Browner?

he typically can't draft people that can get after the QB either (Jones) . Last week was a joke.

[parrot 789]

 

Dude c'mon, their defense has SUCKED since 2004. Especially on 3rd downs. Consistently in the bottom 1/3 of the league. It's good this year, sure. Revis and Browner?

he typically can't draft people that can get after the QB either (Jones) . Last week was a joke.

 

They have had a top 10 scoring defense 8 out of the 10 seasons since 04. 8th on average. Four times they've been top 5. They were 17th in 05, the only time they fell into the bottom half of the league. The defense does what Belichick designs it to do, keep the other team from scoring.

[edjr 5,547]

 

They have had a top 10 scoring defense 8 out of the 10 seasons since 04. 8th on average. Four times they've been top 5. They were 17th in 05, the only time they fell into the bottom half of the league. The defense does what Belichick designs it to do, keep the other team from scoring.

 

So that's how you judge a defense?

 

Let me know when you want to stop sucking on belichick's toes and sound like Paul Pirelo and the rest of the suck ups around New England.

 

How did they do at stopping the other team from scoring when it matters on the final drive of a 4th quarter? yeah, thought so. I guess you don't care about 3rd downs either.

 

That Patriots koolaid must have been yummy.

 

He was so great the last 8 years of drafting, he traded for Revis and Browner? He finally gave a sh1t in 2014

[Patriotsfatboy1 1,432]

 

So that's how you judge a defense?

 

Let me know when you want to stop sucking on belichick's toes and sound like Paul Pirelo and the rest of the suck ups around New England.

 

How did they do at stopping the other team from scoring when it matters on the final drive of a 4th quarter? yeah, thought so. I guess you don't care about 3rd downs either.

 

That Patriots koolaid must have been yummy.

 

He was so great the last 8 years of drafting, he traded for Revis and Browner? He finally gave a sh1t in 2014

Last time I checked, you win by scoring more points than the opposition. Did they change it so that you win if you have better 3rd down efficiency?

 

Just when I thought you couldn't sound any dumber...

[FeelingMN 273]

 

He was so great the last 8 years of drafting, he traded for Revis and Browner? He finally gave a sh1t in 2014

The Pats didn't trade for Revis and Browner.

[IGotWorms 3,302]

Last time I checked, you win by scoring more points than the opposition. Did they change it so that you win if you have better 3rd down efficiency?

 

Just when I thought you couldn't sound any dumber...

[parrot 789]

 

So that's how you judge a defense?

 

Let me know when you want to stop sucking on belichick's toes and sound like Paul Pirelo and the rest of the suck ups around New England.

 

How did they do at stopping the other team from scoring when it matters on the final drive of a 4th quarter? yeah, thought so. I guess you don't care about 3rd downs either.

 

That Patriots koolaid must have been yummy.

 

He was so great the last 8 years of drafting, he traded for Revis and Browner? He finally gave a sh1t in 2014

 

Bill's "bend don't break" philosophy is pretty common knowledge. Maybe you really are a pink hatter.

[parrot 789]

 

+1. Look at ed being all edgy.

[edjr 5,547]

All those Super Bowl rings the last 9 years.

 

great D Bill. good drafting. Clutch.

 

Funny. All you clowns wait a year to spout off and not after they get demolished by the Broncos, who couldn't even score in the Super Bowl.

 

Classic.

[parrot 789]

All those Super Bowl rings the last 9 years.

 

great D Bill. good drafting. Clutch.

 

Funny. All you clowns wait a year to spout off and not after they get demolished by the Broncos, who couldn't even score in the Super Bowl.

 

Classic.

 

Yeah, last year was a down year for the Pats, only making it to the divisional round of the playoffs. Bill is clearly in over his head. They really need to find one of these many GMs running around with a better record of success than Bill.