What's the story with Amari Cooper

[jgcrawfish 232]

I made a trade mid-season to get the kid and he KILLING me right now. Raiders homers (or frequent viewers of the team) has he just hit the rookie wall or what's the deal?

[weepaws 2,457]

Crabtree

[R8RMick 242]

Cut and plagiarized from another thread...

 

 

Coop has averaged almost nine targets per game this season and I'd say if anything he would hit this number against Denver. Unfortunately, he has a catch to target ratio of 59%. Not quite Davante Adams territory but also less than optimal. This is probably due to several things.

1) He's dropping some passes.

2) He's usually seeing a lot of the other guys top cover corners. Normally not daunting, but probably just a little more so as Coop is still a rook. Case in point Darius Slay ate his lunch in Detroit a few weeks back. Starting in Week 1 with Pac Man Jones, opposing corners have been extremely physical with Cooper and severely testing him. The kid has battled through it, all the while learning the trade, but he may have hit a wall.

3) His QB is himself still learning the game. For all the stellar play Carr has made some bonehead mistakes and killed drives.

4) The Raiders have finally found themselves a legit slot WR in Seth Roberts, who has taken targets AND Tds away from both Coop and Crabs.

I'd be leery of starting the kid against Denver. I see a tight, fairly low scoring game with the Broncos quarterbacked by Osweiler. Cooper has a decent floor, but in reality has not topped 20 points in a game in standard scoring all season. There may be more upside with Watkins. Good luck.

[LSUtiger 9]

IMO it's really just a combination of factors contributing to his recent dip in production...

 

1. Rookie wall (a real thing)

 

2. Crabtree drawing more single coverage, and maximizing his opportunities with it, to siphon looks from Cooper

 

3. Carr being very streaky with his play

 

4. Cooper running up against some very good defenses/individual defender (i.e. Det's Slay, Denver D again this week, etc.)

 

 

I'm benching Cooper this week @DEN but he'll likely be back in my lineup next week, assuming I'm still alive...

[tanatastic 2,061]

Simple combination of Crabtree playing well and Carr getting better. Cooper is a fine talent but as Carr has improved he has been able to make better reads and reliably get the ball to other playmakers.

[murf74 461]

Rookie wAll

[Kent 228]

Wall.

 

Odb avoided the wall last year when he missed a bunch of early games.

 

Cooper was great at the start and is feeling that long NFL season.

[Woble Eth 11]

Yep, the wall, and some nasty defenses.. can't run him out there this week.. Between him, Jordan Matthews (that is another story in itself) and Spencer Ware, I am using Ware at flex this week.

 

I mean it's only the playoffs..

[HarbingerTG 1]

hes on my bench, again

[jgcrawfish 232]

News yesterday about a foot injury makes some sense, although there's no way to know how long it's been bothering him or it was a fresh practice injury.

[R8RMick 242]

Nothing on the Raider boreds, and the word is it was a practice injury from this week.

[brotherbock 349]

He's still shaking off Bill Romanowski randomly punching him in the nuts at a fundraiser last month. It's labeled a 'groin injury'.

[R8RMick 242]

He's still shaking off Bill Romanowski randomly punching him in the nuts at a fundraiser last month. It's labeled a 'groin injury'.

 

Dude, you DO know there can be only one Filthy Fernandez on this bored right lol...?

[brotherbock 349]

 

Dude, you DO know there can be only one Filthy Fernandez on this bored right lol...?

 

LOL. Just having fun. (I'm not a Raider hater, but Romanowski is a *#%^$$%@#, right?)

[dschddny 0]

The consensus seems to be to bench Cooper this week vs Denver. My alternative would be Devante Parker, however I am already starting Jarvis Landry. Other factors to consider, big bonus are awarded in my league for TD's and especially for long TD's.

 

Thoughts anyone?

 

Thanks!!!!!

[R8RMick 242]

Oh yeah, Romo was NEVER a true Raider. Even the worst of us wouldn't condone this.

 

[brotherbock 349]

Oh yeah, Romo was NEVER a true Raider. Even the worst of us wouldn't condone this.

 

 

Ugh. And oblivious Madden just talking about the X's and O's.

 

No, Raiders have had some of my favorite small name players over the years, guys like Kaufman, and quality guys like Carr now. In fact, Madden was definitely at his greatest when he was with the Raiders. Hate to talk bad about the dead sometimes, but with Al gone, you guys are on your way up.

[thewrathofkuhn 40]

Coop has averaged almost nine targets per game this season and I'd say if anything he would hit this number against Denver. Unfortunately, he has a catch to target ratio of 59%. Not quite Davante Adams territory but also less than optimal. This is probably due to several things.

 

Ironically, Adams was Carr's guy at Fresno State.

[R8RMick 242]

 

Ironically, Adams was Carr's guy at Fresno State.

Yes he was. Both Carr and Coop are light years ahead of most players at this stage in their careers. In Coop's case no other rook WR comes close, and Carr is holding his own in comparison to Bortles, Bridgewater et al.

 

This is a nice fantasy stack for years to come.

[thegame 8]

I'm tempted to play either Zach Miller or Fleener over him in an FFPC league where TEs get 1.5 per reception.

[brotherbock 349]

Yes he was. Both Carr and Coop are light years ahead of most players at this stage in their careers. In Coop's case no other rook WR comes close, and Carr is holding his own in comparison to Bortles, Bridgewater et al.

 

This is a nice fantasy stack for years to come.

What do you think about Carr's ceiling into his career? It looks like I'm going to have to choose between him and Luck in my keeper league for next year, trying to get a handle on him.

[thewrathofkuhn 40]

What do you think about Carr's ceiling into his career? It looks like I'm going to have to choose between him and Luck in my keeper league for next year, trying to get a handle on him.

 

Given where you presumably drafted Carr (and if you do draft slotting for keepers) it seems a no-brainer.

[brotherbock 349]

 

Given where you presumably drafted Carr (and if you do draft slotting for keepers) it seems a no-brainer.

Oops, deleted when I went to edit.

 

Nope, no draft slotting, more cut throat. No slotting, no term limits.

 

So, all else being equal, still Carr? That's the way I'm leaning for other reasons. It may end up out of my hands. We're expanding the league by adding two teams next year, and they'll get to pick keepers from our rosters before we pick our entire compliment. So I don't know who I'm prioritizing yet.

 

But all else equal...opinions?

[thewrathofkuhn 40]

Oops, deleted when I went to edit.

 

Nope, no draft slotting, more cut throat. No slotting, no term limits.

 

So, all else being equal, still Carr? That's the way I'm leaning for other reasons. It may end up out of my hands. We're expanding the league by adding two teams next year, and they'll get to pick keepers from our rosters before we pick our entire compliment. So I don't know who I'm prioritizing yet.

 

But all else equal...opinions?

 

If no draft slotting I wouldn't keep Luck or Carr.

 

The per game point deviation for a QB drafted in round 4 to that of round 10 is very small, as is the YOY change of mean at the top 20 for the position. Using a valuable keeper spot on a QB doesn't really make sense given you're going to have just as many early picks as every other owner.

 

But man, no draft slotting – that's brutal. Are you forced to keep a player or players then? What happens if you don't, do you get an extra early round pick?

[brotherbock 349]

 

If no draft slotting I wouldn't keep Luck or Carr.

 

The per game point deviation for a QB drafted in round 4 to that of round 10 is very small, as is the YOY change of mean at the top 20 for the position. Using a valuable keeper spot on a QB doesn't really make sense given you're going to have just as many early picks as every other owner.

 

But man, no draft slotting that's brutal. Are you forced to keep a player or players then? What happens if you don't, do you get an extra early round pick?

We don't see it as brutal. Forces teams to stay involved, even if they're out of the running that year. Play waivers, grab free agents, so even if you're in last place, you'll try to grab a guy like Rawls when he comes available. And because you keep them as long as you want, trying to figure out who the next Brady or Manning is becomes pretty important. We have limits on number of players at any position, and no benefit to not keeping a player.

 

Been working well for fifteen years

[R8RMick 242]

What do you think about Carr's ceiling into his career? It looks like I'm going to have to choose between him and Luck in my keeper league for next year, trying to get a handle on him.

 

 

Right now that's a difficult choice to make, a year ago not so much. Everything is apples and oranges on this bored, as far as individual leagues. You start talking keeper, and most folks in re-draft will ask what round you drafted that player. I play auction, with specifically modified keeper rules for my league. Also we play 6pt TD scoring for QBs, which makes them a valuable commodity in my league. I made a mistake of acquiring Matt Ryan this year and it pretty much sank my battleship.

 

As for your original question... I see nice upside with Carr and his situation in Oakland. But I'm not sure I'd take him over Andrew Luck, injuries aside.

[brotherbock 349]

 

 

Right now that's a difficult choice to make, a year ago not so much. Everything is apples and oranges on this bored, as far as individual leagues. You start talking keeper, and most folks in re-draft will ask what round you drafted that player. I play auction, with specifically modified keeper rules for my league. Also we play 6pt TD scoring for QBs, which makes them a valuable commodity in my league. I made a mistake of acquiring Matt Ryan this year and it pretty much sank my battleship.

 

As for your original question... I see nice upside with Carr and his situation in Oakland. But I'm not sure I'd take him over Andrew Luck, injuries aside.

Thanks for the input I see upside for both, trying to get some homer input on both as well. Carr really seems to have the mental tools to keep improving. I'm not sure Luck has showed that this year. Some bad decisions when things got tough. I also think Carr has the better offense around him right now, believe it or not. Man, it's a good day for the NFL when you can say that about Oakland.

[R8RMick 242]

Thanks for the input I see upside for both, trying to get some homer input on both as well. Carr really seems to have the mental tools to keep improving. I'm not sure Luck has showed that this year. Some bad decisions when things got tough. I also think Carr has the better offense around him right now, believe it or not. Man, it's a good day for the NFL when you can say that about Oakland.

 

Probably the best thing Carr has going for him fantasy-wise is the Raiders defense. Talk about splashing gasoline on a fire.

[brotherbock 349]

 

Probably the best thing Carr has going for him fantasy-wise is the Raiders defense. Talk about splashing gasoline on a fire.

LOL. Last week aside, he's careful with the ball generally, too. If he has to chuck it a lot, so be it.

[R8RMick 242]

Hope you guys benched him this week. Aquib Talib slapped the kid today. Just owned him.

[brotherbock 349]

Hope you guys benched him this week. Aquib Talib ###### slapped the kid today. Just owned him.

Right now my choice to bench Carr and start Hoyer isn't going so well.

[dschddny 0]

I benched Amari and started Devante Parker. Was patting myself on the back for the smart move when Amari got 0 points in my league............then Parker scored 0 for me too!!!!! Didn't matter anyway as i won thanks to Eli's big game.

[thewrathofkuhn 40]

We don't see it as brutal. Forces teams to stay involved, even if they're out of the running that year. Play waivers, grab free agents, so even if you're in last place, you'll try to grab a guy like Rawls when he comes available. And because you keep them as long as you want, trying to figure out who the next Brady or Manning is becomes pretty important. We have limits on number of players at any position, and no benefit to not keeping a player.

 

Been working well for fifteen years

 

Right – but that's my point. If a team grabs a guy like Rawls off waivers or drafted DeVonta Freeman in the 14th round designated them keepers – they should be rewarded with a leg up at the next years draft. More so if they finished at the bottom of the standings. As you aptly put, teams in last place with weaker rosters or loaded with early round busts should benefit the following season from young emerging talent. A team who drafted Julio Jones with their #1 designated him a keeper shouldn't get as many #1 picks the following year as a guy who didn't keep their first or second round pick.

 

The point of Keeper Leagues is to mimic RL franchise building. If you keep Carr 'just cause you can – but another guy keeps Rodgers AND they have as many early round picks as you they already hold a significant advantage w/o penalty. The team that drafted Edelman in the 4th or 5th should see ROI on that pick.

[LSUtiger 9]

Sat Cooper last week (thankfully), but really eying a bounce back game this week in a potential shootout v GB. For me it'll boil down to whether GB's top CB Shields is out from the concussion he suffered last week. Shields didn't practice today:

 

"Shields' return will be subject to the protocol for head injuries, but his lack of activity Wednesday indicates that he's still in the early stages. If he's ruled out in Week 15, the Packers will likely trot out a pair of starting rookie cornerbacks (Damarious Randall and Quinten Rollins)."

[R8RMick 242]

This would be the week to roll out Coop. Raiders are also a much better team in the Black Hole. Unlike many of the other mutts this team has not quit and has plenty of fight left.

[Donkey 34]

Oops, deleted when I went to edit.

 

Nope, no draft slotting, more cut throat. No slotting, no term limits.

 

So, all else being equal, still Carr? That's the way I'm leaning for other reasons. It may end up out of my hands. We're expanding the league by adding two teams next year, and they'll get to pick keepers from our rosters before we pick our entire compliment. So I don't know who I'm prioritizing yet.

 

But all else equal...opinions?

Keeping Carr over Luck is crazy, man. Hard to understand how someone could come to that conclusion.

[LSUtiger 9]

Sat Cooper last week (thankfully), but really eying a bounce back game this week in a potential shootout v GB. For me it'll boil down to whether GB's top CB Shields is out from the concussion he suffered last week. Shields didn't practice today:

 

"Shields' return will be subject to the protocol for head injuries, but his lack of activity Wednesday indicates that he's still in the early stages. If he's ruled out in Week 15, the Packers will likely trot out a pair of starting rookie cornerbacks (Damarious Randall and Quinten Rollins)."

Shields (GB's best CB) is out. GB rolling out two rookie CBs. Starting Cooper in a bounce back game at home in a hopeful shootout.

[LSUtiger 9]

Shields (GB's best CB) is out. GB rolling out two rookie CBs. Starting Cooper in a bounce back game at home in a hopeful shootout.

[R8RMick 242]

 

Nice bounce back game for the rook. It's always good to see a gamble pay off, and starting him today was a definite gamble.

 

Well played.

 

Edit- That Randall kid for the Pack is a player.

[Frozenbeernuts 1,652]

I survived my opponent starting Cooper and Antonio. Ohhhh yeah