Suicide of dietician makes news. Are all suicides "cowardice" ?

[tubby_mcgee 686]

Not sure on the coward part. People are always quick to call these folks cowards.

I think of coward as one that maybe got caught doing something, goes in debt, etc then kills him/herself. The spontaneous ones. Out of anger/rage/jealousy...those are cowards. Or dummies. Or both.

I don't think of all suicides as coward/selfish.

This one made the news.....

https://www.foxnews.com/us/new-york-dietitian-27-hangs-herself-after-posting-suicide-note

 

 

 

Here is here "goodbye" on her website.

https://www.taracondell.com/

 

 

Oh...and I can't believe she smoked cigarettes. Doesn't fit the lifestyle. (dietician/healthy food person) AT ALL. Weird.

 

Thoughts?

[MDC 5,890]

Calling suicide cowardice is dumb.

[cyclone24 1,814]

Couple things. 1st of all she could have at least shown her cans on the way out. Secondly why do people do it by hanging? Thats a pretty brutal way to go if you don't know what you're doing and can't snap the neck.

 

And I'll never understand why people say they need to kill themselves but then list a 100 things they love and will miss.

[tubby_mcgee 686]

Calling suicide cowardice is dumb.

 

 

I agree...in most cases. But i think SOME are....like ....the guy who got caught siphoning money from the corporate office, the guy who is getting chased by cops for beating his wife, then as they are closing in, he shoots himself. .Those types of situations are cowardice.

[RLLD 3,455]

Calling suicide cowardice is dumb.

 

 

+1

[sderk 1,040]

This explains it:

 

"I live alone in the second greatest American city (San Francisco, you’ll always have my heart)."

 

This is impossible to form opinions on one way or the other if you don't know this person. For instance, if she has serious depression, that ruins people's lives. I know a girl who has struggled with that all of her life and she hit some serious lows. I could never put myself in their shoes. If it took this girl 10 years to write the note, and just came across as she is bored, then I gotta think something else is up.

 

Plus she lives in Pelosi's stomping grounds.

[supermike80 1,285]

I wont call it dumb, but I do think it can be really really sh!tty and selfish..depending on the situation.

[5-Points 2,726]

Cowardice? No. Cowards wouldn't follow through with actually killing themselves. They'd chicken out. I do think it's selfish in most cases though.

[RaiderHaters Revenge 3,577]

somewhere between coward and loser imo, or maybe both

 

its nothing but a look at me

[fandandy 3,311]

Maybe not cowardice but having a look at me moment post-suicide is retarded.

[Strike 3,957]

Wood.....

[MDC 5,890]

Wood.....

Dont do it Strike.

[wiffleball 4,638]

 

 

I agree...in most cases. But i think SOME are....like ....the guy who got caught siphoning money from the corporate office, the guy who is getting chased by cops for beating his wife, then as they are closing in, he shoots himself. .Those types of situations are cowardice.

Ultimate is prolly school shooters - or pedos.

[wiffleball 4,638]

I'm usually pretty understanding given my background with this subject.

 

and, unlike many of you, I really liked Anthony Bourdain's work. His snark, his not taking himself too seriously and him openly mocking some of the idiots on the food Network.

 

Having said all that, I still harbor anger towards him. Not that he or anybody else gives a fucck. But not only did he have life by the balls, more cogent to this post is that he had an 11 year old girl.

 

I understand the myopia that surrounds deepest darkest depression. But no amount of myopia or depression can blind one to the existence and impact upon one's own child. Suicide is the gift that keeps on giving. And I know for a fact that she'll spend the rest of her life with his death and the manner in which he died rolling around her noggin. She'll never be quite healed from that.

 

All I'm saying is he had 20 or 30 years prior and he only had about half a dozen more years to wait. Honestly, a lot of people live with that darkness. Suck it up and your globe-trotting lifestyle 4 five or six more years sport. There's never a good time, but they're definitely worse times. And he chose just about the worst.

[Filthy Fernadez 2,696]

Wood.....

 

She'll just lay there.

[dain11279 927]

 

She'll just lay there.

 

That's normally what they do anyway

[wiffleball 4,638]

Wood.....

I hear she's well hung.

[Filthy Fernadez 2,696]

I hear she's well hung.

 

She likes just hanging out and chillin.

[wiffleball 4,638]

Hey, is that a hickey on your neck?

[EternalShinyAndChrome 2,513]

Wood.....

 

Before or after the suicide?

[sderk 1,040]

Before or after the suicide?

Was she left or right?

[edjr 5,556]

Cowardice is not committing suicide.

[kutulu 1,545]

Can't take it, never could

Time to end it, wish you would

Friends and family, they're all gone

Life for you is just a con

Dig yourself a hole in the ground

Push up daisies six feet down

Take a dirt nap, buy the farm

Inject a bubble in your arm

 

[CHORUS]

Kill yourself, kill yourself

Why don't you kill yourself

 

Don't rely on no one else

End it all just kill yourself

 

Life is just a one way ticket

Everyone must go around

Here's a bucket go and kick it

Slit your wrists without a sound

When you go don't make a big deal

No dramatics, don't overplay

Cause don't you know that we'll all feel

Better once you've gone away

[CHORUS-MOSH PART]

 

You're a loser, there's nothing left for you

A worthless loser, at everything you do

 

[tubby_mcgee 686]

somewhere between coward and loser imo, or maybe both

 

its nothing but a look at me

 

 

here's the thing no, and if you disagree with my first statement, you'll retarded.

 

Someone/a situation could get you to commit suicide.

 

Cage you. Poke you with a stick. Day in day out. A shift of people all poking you. Sure, at first you'd fight back. Then what after that? When the poking keeps on. Sometimes with a sharp stick that slightly pierces your skin, sometimes a whack that leaves yellow bruises. Day in. Day out. You never get more than a 15 minute break without 10-15 pokes or whacks. Also, the periodic slap across your face with a paddle. Your 15 minute breaks come ever 3 hours. Aside from that, the poking and whacking and slapping is non-stop.

 

Lemme guess, you'll tough it out? You'll out last the never ending supply of people poking you? You'd take away the stick and "get 'em all"?

 

I guarantee when the opportunity arose, you'd end it. 100%.

 

 

I'd imagine that, some people feel the way you would, but its not physical poking.

 

So which are you?

1.) Retarded

2.) Coward

3.) Loser

[naomi 343]

This explains it:

 

 

This is impossible to form opinions on one way or the other if you don't know this person. For instance, if she has serious depression, that ruins people's lives. I know a girl who has struggled with that all of her life and she hit some serious lows. I could never put myself in their shoes. If it took this girl 10 years to write the note, and just came across as she is bored, then I gotta think something else is up.

 

Plus she lives in Pelosi's stomping grounds.

I had that thought too but I think because she references helping someone enduring a long illness when she was young, and going the career path she did in part out of wanting to help people, and ends with the fact this is going to make her selfishly happy...and she talks about "coming home" to her dad...the most profound thing in her whole life was losing her dad. It mattered, nothing else had mattered. Nothing in this life seemed to have the ability to move her. Success wasn't sweet, nothing was sweet. Momentarily sweet sure, sensually gratifying, but not worth all the deeper..nothing here.

 

Sounds like she was depressive in that really stoic way people sometimes can be, and missed her dad a lot. It was basically the sensible choice, in that vacuum.

 

It's hard not to project. I would absolutely hate a really urban lifestyle, its soul sucking to me, so it makes me wonder if she didn't ever experience enough of an alternative to it, to feel more alive. Struggling for 10 years with writing that letter though, she must have thought about a different setting herself and reckoned it wouldn't change her.

 

As for hanging, just me speculating, but I think it shows some resentment, not at any person or situation on earth, but it's like a message to the fact/the objective reality itself of you having to have been here. You're taking control now and you're done. Didn't will yourself in here, hung in (pun definetely not intended) for a while though, and resent that hassle.

[Hardcore troubadour 12,626]

I hate the ones who kill their kids and then themselves. I feel sorry for the ones who do themselves.

[wiffleball 4,638]

There's no one equation. What I can tell you is this.

 

There are at least two kinds of depression. And that's what a lot of people don't understand. There's situational depression. We all face that. We break up, we get divorced, loved ones die. That's a part of life.

 

Then there's clinical depression. Or whatever the you want to call it. It's like a anchor around your heart and your soul. It sucks your energy, your joy, your life. It's as real as cancer or diabetes or anything else. You know you should feel better. But you just don't. And then you feel like crap because you should feel better. She references that in her note.

 

When situational and clinical depression meet up? Jesus. I wouldn't wish that on my worst enemy. It's a hell of a thing.

[RaiderHaters Revenge 3,577]

 

 

here's the thing no, and if you disagree with my first statement, you'll retarded.

 

Someone/a situation could get you to commit suicide.

 

Cage you. Poke you with a stick. Day in day out. A shift of people all poking you. Sure, at first you'd fight back. Then what after that? When the poking keeps on. Sometimes with a sharp stick that slightly pierces your skin, sometimes a whack that leaves yellow bruises. Day in. Day out. You never get more than a 15 minute break without 10-15 pokes or whacks. Also, the periodic slap across your face with a paddle. Your 15 minute breaks come ever 3 hours. Aside from that, the poking and whacking and slapping is non-stop.

 

Lemme guess, you'll tough it out? You'll out last the never ending supply of people poking you? You'd take away the stick and "get 'em all"?

 

I guarantee when the opportunity arose, you'd end it. 100%.

 

 

I'd imagine that, some people feel the way you would, but its not physical poking.

 

So which are you?

1.) Retarded

2.) Coward

3.) Loser

 

3) Loser for getting captured

 

Jews in concentration camps had a very low suicide rate fwiw

[joneo 529]

Suicides are usually selfish in nature. Most people aren't looking at the pain they'll inflict on families and friends. They just want to escape the pain they're in. Some do commit suicide to intentionally inflict pain on others. They are azzholes.

[titans&bucs&bearsohmy! 2,745]

somewhere between coward and loser imo, or maybe both

 

its nothing but a look at me

When I was in my suicidal phase, that was one thing that always bothered me about it.

 

I didn't want to be found. I didn't want my family to have to identify me. I didn't want there to be a funeral or a body to dispose of.

 

I had the Roger rabbit notion of buying a boat. Go as far out as the docket will go in to the sea. Hole it. Tie anchors around my waist and ankles. Eat a gun before you go under. You would have pre sent suicide letters to loved ones/law enforcement beforehand via snail mail so nobody looks for you.

 

Ultimately that was what stopped me. The thought of my family grieving.

[DonS 3,067]

When I was in my suicidal phase, that was one thing that always bothered me about it.

 

I didn't want to be found. I didn't want my family to have to identify me. I didn't want there to be a funeral or a body to dispose of.

 

I had the Roger rabbit notion of buying a boat. Go as far out as the docket will go in to the sea. Hole it. Tie anchors around my waist and ankles. Eat a gun before you go under. You would have pre sent suicide letters to loved ones/law enforcement beforehand via snail mail so nobody looks for you.

 

Ultimately that was what stopped me. The thought of my family grieving.

Wouldn't the Roger Rabbit route of diving into some Dip be easier?

 

All kidding aside, I had a spell of mild depression about 10 yrs ago. Any fleeting thoughts of suicide (aka suicidal ideation sp?) were quickly dispelled by thinking of the impacts on my family. I can't imagine how bad one must get to overlook how badly you'll fock up everyone you care about.

[jerryskids 5,191]

IMO you have to be focked up in the head to off yourself. So I tend to look at it as a mental issue vs. selfish. I mean, how messed up do you need to be to never want to wake up again.

 

I'm not talking situations like severe chronic pain, stage 4 cancer, etc. I get that. Sorta. I hope to never get that actually.

[joneo 529]

IMO you have to be focked up in the head to off yourself. So I tend to look at it as a mental issue vs. selfish. I mean, how messed up do you need to be to never want to wake up again.

 

I'm not talking situations like severe chronic pain, stage 4 cancer, etc. I get that. Sorta. I hope to never get that actually.

 

I agree it is a mental health issue. But it is still a selfish act.

[sderk 1,040]

 

I agree it is a mental health issue. But it is still a selfish act.

Well, I have a feeling that a lot of people who kill themselves tend to think they are a burdon on others and believe they are doing the right thing for those around them.

[wiffleball 4,638]

Back to one of the original points. I remember seeing this story pop up early in the morning. And literally that was my first thought. Why the hell is this making front Page News? It's not that I didn't care about this person. But I read the whole article waiting for her to be the dietitian to George Clooney or somebody famous. Why her? Because I guarantee you at least 300 other people killed themselves that same night. Because she was pretty? Because it was New York? I honest to God can't even venture a reasonable guess.

 

And, living in a town that was a suicide hotspot for teenagers? I can tell you I am all for the idea of not publicizing suicide. Too many young girls especially just desperately want attention and they see their classmates getting all the attention and people crying and saying how wonderful that person was and God damn if impressionsble little girls don't kill themselves just seeking that same level of attention. We stopped advertising that shiit. And it seemed to help. Regardless of efficacy. being part of a family of suicide, I'll tell you that shouldn't be newsworthy. It's a tragedy. But it's a personal family tragedy. Nothing more. There's no Mass serial killer. The community isn't at risk. So keep it the fuuck out of the news.

[kilroy69 994]

I don't see it as cowardice. I mean there are situations where I can see ending my life realistically. It's not that I am suicidal at all. I love my life. Love my kid. However in cases where people have been living with chronic pain it would be easy to see how they would give up. The grind of being in pain every day of your life is draining.

 

How about if you find out you have Parkinson's? People sell you on the idea that soon there will be a cure. However that has been being sold for 50 years. Would you want to watch as your body gave into tremors that will strip you of your ability to sit still.

 

How about M.S.? You ever seen someone die from M.S.? I have. I cared for and watched my stepdad. The best man I have ever known. Vietnam war vet. 6 ft 2 200 plus pounds. I watched him die. In front of my eyes over the period of 10 years. The last 5 being brutal culminating in me finding him dead from choking on his own puke in a specially designed bed called a Pegasus. In order for him to not get bed sores.

 

I'll kill myself before I ever let that happen. Ever.

[MLCKAA 395]

I can maybe add a little bit to this. Maybe not.

 

Was never diagnosed, but dealt with general depression from about age 17 until about age 40. It wasnt situational. I would find myself inconsolably, deeply sad for weeks and weeks at a time and there was no explanation for it. There was also no getting by it until it resolved on its own. These would be awful periods of inexplicable grief. Over nothing. Just insurmountable darkness.

 

Many times in my late twenties and much of my thirties I contemplated suicide. Looking back I cant explain why I didnt do it. Glad I didnt.

 

All this to say, outsiders cant always understand it or judge it.

[jerryskids 5,191]

I can maybe add a little bit to this. Maybe not.

 

Was never diagnosed, but dealt with general depression from about age 17 until about age 40. It wasnt situational. I would find myself inconsolably, deeply sad for weeks and weeks at a time and there was no explanation for it. There was also no getting by it until it resolved on its own. These would be awful periods of inexplicable grief. Over nothing. Just insurmountable darkness.

 

Many times in my late twenties and much of my thirties I contemplated suicide. Looking back I cant explain why I didnt do it. Glad I didnt.

 

All this to say, outsiders cant always understand it or judge it.

 

Thanks for sharing. If you don't mind my asking, how did you pull out of it around 40?

[sderk 1,040]

I can maybe add a little bit to this. Maybe not.

 

Was never diagnosed, but dealt with general depression from about age 17 until about age 40. It wasnt situational. I would find myself inconsolably, deeply sad for weeks and weeks at a time and there was no explanation for it. There was also no getting by it until it resolved on its own. These would be awful periods of inexplicable grief. Over nothing. Just insurmountable darkness.

 

Many times in my late twenties and much of my thirties I contemplated suicide. Looking back I cant explain why I didnt do it. Glad I didnt.

 

All this to say, outsiders cant always understand it or judge it.

I would say that any people that call others cowards for how they are dealing with certain levels of depression or like diagnosis, without knowing those persons and their lives in great detail, are dopes. It is just not fair.

[MLCKAA 395]

Thanks for sharing. If you don't mind my asking, how did you pull out of it around 40?

Honestly can’t really say. Never saw anyone for treatment or whatever. It just kind of diminished. Now I probably haven’t had suicidal thoughts in probably 5 years.

 

I still find myself sometimes melancholy, but nothing like the dark shadows I knew before.

 

As an addendum to what I posted before, this was never woe-is-me feelings I had. Imagine if your kids or wife or mother or best friend died and the grief you’d have. I had intense sadness like that without the actual loss. And it was always SOOOO perplexing to feel that way knowing nothing had gone wrong, nothing had changed from the day before. I think it was brain chemistry imbalance.