Geeks who're politically Centrist

[The Observer 641]

4 minutes ago, TBayXXXVII said:

I'm sorry, but I see zero logic in this.  The fault completely lies with the liberal agenda of welfare, rights, and total access to free education (even at the college level), for all who come here illegally.

Your great-great-grandparents came here in search of a better life. No different than anyone else coming here today. You just been conned into thinking it's worse because they're not white like you.

[TBayXXXVII 2,114]

Just now, The Observer said:

Your great-great-grandparents came here in search of a better life. No different than anyone else coming here today. You just been conned into thinking it's worse because they're not white like you.

That's not "entirely" true.  Yes, my great (not great-great - technicality - which isn't important), grandparents did come here.  But they came here LEGALLY, when there was no such thing as welfare.  Yes, they had the right to vote and the ability to get a driver's license... but again, that's because they came here LEGALLY.  I don't give a rats azz what race they are.  Come here LEGALLY!  They're coming here ILLEGALLY because of what the democrats are providing for them without being legal.  That's 0% Trump's fault.

[The Observer 641]

6 minutes ago, TBayXXXVII said:

That's not "entirely" true.  Yes, my great (not great-great - technicality - which isn't important), grandparents did come here.  But they came here LEGALLY, when there was no such thing as welfare.  Yes, they had the right to vote and the ability to get a driver's license... but again, that's because they came here LEGALLY.  I don't give a rats azz what race they are.  Come here LEGALLY!  They're coming here ILLEGALLY because of what the democrats are providing for them without being legal.  That's 0% Trump's fault.

I'm driving and didn't read your entire post, but saw the word legally typed in caps many times. We are in agreement there. I am against illegal immigration.

[Intense Observer 344]

1 hour ago, MTSkiBum said:

The climate is perfect for a centrist, do not let the polarizing media fool you.

It is a shame that one party has decided to use "climate change" as their emotional propaganda platform.

Most reasonable people would agree that man has an influence on the environment. Pollution and (lack of) conservation are the two most obvious and detrimental impacts. Yet fixing these two require personal responsibility, can't be solved by taxing the rich, can't be solved by imaginary chips that are traded, etc.

The earth has been changing (climate, sea levels, atmospheric content, etc) for billions of years, mostly due to geology and solar cycles.

This is all too logical though. People are manipulated using emotions. People vote based on emotions.

"Man made climate change (because of carbon emissions) will destroy the planet in X number of years" is the atheist equivalent of the resurrection. Nobody can prove it but you can scare everyone into submission, while those in charge get rich.

 

A politician campaigning on environmental conservation and reduction of pollution would get my vote. Any time I hear someone utter the words climate change though it tells me that they are either an uninformed idiot who skipped science class or they are profiting off of it.

[TBayXXXVII 2,114]

1 minute ago, The Observer said:

I'm driving and didn't read your entire post, but saw the word legally typed in caps many times. We are in agreement there. I am against illegal immigration.

 

DON'T TEXT AND DRIVE!! 

[titans&bucs&bearsohmy! 2,745]

11 hours ago, edjr said:

I was a centrist when I started posting here. if I had to put myself into a category it would be libertarian now. I hate both sides equally. 

I used to love politics. Election night used to be my favorite event.

Now I also despise both sides and Washington in general. I don't even pay attention anymore. 

[Voltaire 4,556]

I'm a centrist because there are issues that I agree with one party on and issues I agree with the other party on. Then, when one side gets too far into their crazy, I switch to the other side. Right now the Dems are scary crazy catering to their fringe playing their cultural warfare games and I am voting GOP to tell them to fock off, that I despise SJWs.

Top three issues:

Cultural Conservativism (and I rank this #1 despite being an atheist who ten years ago was getting bent out of shape over creationism in public schools)

Economic Security (Trump's trade policies are awesome)

National Debt (neither party cares, GOP is more hypocritical)

[Drizzay 645]

1. Allow us to have fun (this is more a State level issue).  Make sports betting legal, make recreational marijuana legal, remove all blue laws from alcohol sales, allow "real" fireworks sales, allow some form of legal prostitution.  Quit babying us.

2.  Term limits, and no lobbyists.  These freeloaders need to be sent back into the real world.  Perhaps give them some sort of monetary/benefit incentive to good job in Congress.  If they didn't accomplish anything, then no benefits!

3.  Bring manufacturing back.  We need more low-skilled and mid-skilled labor jobs.  Just having the entertainment/food industry is not enough.

 

There may be more.

[supermike80 1,285]

21 hours ago, naomi said:

What do you think makes you Centrist? Besides just being seemingly center of the aisle, what is it worldview and personality wise that lands you there (in a few sentences). What do you think is the biggest commonality amongst Centrists? What are the top 3 most important issues to you?

I think I'm centrist because I am open to ideas from wherever they come from.  

[MDC 5,890]

I think the idea of what is left, right or center has been totally skewed by the media and people arguing at the fringes.

According to polls there is broad public support for gay marriage, gun control, government action on climate change, single payer healthcare etc. but these are considered fringe left / liberal positions. I’m not sure why that is. 

I consider myself a centrist generally. I support gay marriage and dignity for trans people but I think common sense should prevail when it comes to gender fluidity, trans “women” competing with actual women in sports etc.

I think the gun debate is over focused on mass shootings and we would get more traction on strengthening laws to prevent straw purchases and the black market. I absolutely support a right to responsible private gun ownership.

I think MMGW is undeniable at this point but I am skeptical that we can reasonably do anything to reverse it and think we will mostly need to talk about acclimating / preparing for changes.

I have become a big supporter of single payer but only because I am sure our current system is going to collapse and it’s killing businesses right now.

I think these are reasonable positions but I am pretty much Noam Chomsky on this forearm.

[Voltaire 4,556]

7 minutes ago, MDC said:

I think the idea of what is left, right or center has been totally skewed by the media and people arguing at the fringes.

According to polls there is broad public support for gay marriage, gun control, government action on climate change, single payer healthcare etc. but these are considered fringe left / liberal positions. I’m not sure why that is. 

I consider myself a centrist generally. I support gay marriage and dignity for trans people but I think common sense should prevail when it comes to gender fluidity, trans “women” competing with actual women in sports etc.

I think the gun debate is over focused on mass shootings and we would get more traction on strengthening laws to prevent straw purchases and the black market. I absolutely support a right to responsible private gun ownership.

I think MMGW is undeniable at this point but I am skeptical that we can reasonably do anything to reverse it and think we will mostly need to talk about acclimating / preparing for changes.

I have become a big supporter of single payer but only because I am sure our current system is going to collapse and it’s killing businesses right now.

I think these are reasonable positions but I am pretty much Noam Chomsky on this forearm.

I think I can sign up for that, mostly. I’ve pretty much backtracked on gay marriage but, I’m back to opposing it again but feel it’s a lost cause, so why bother?

[MDC 5,890]

22 minutes ago, Voltaire said:

I think I can sign up for that, mostly. I’ve pretty much backtracked on gay marriage but, I’m back to opposing it again but feel it’s a lost cause, so why bother?

I don’t understand why you’d oppose marriage between consenting same sex adults just because of tranny bathroom SJW stuff or whatever. I bet the vast majority of ordinary hard working tax paying same sex couple have as little patience for gender fluidity and the “It’s M’AAM!” types as you and me.

I think the right wing has deliberately tried to conflate the fringe weirdos with your garden variety mo’s and you’re a smarter guy than that.

[titans&bucs&bearsohmy! 2,745]

2 minutes ago, MDC said:

I don’t understand why you’d oppose marriage between consenting same sex adults just because of tranny bathroom SJW stuff or whatever. I bet the vast majority of ordinary hard working tax paying same sex couple have as little patience for gender fluidity and the “It’s M’AAM!” types as you and me.

I think the right wing has deliberately tried to conflate the fringe weirdos with your garden variety mo’s and you’re a smarter guy than that.

I don't think they are the same. But I think many of us kinda hoped/thought that the ghey marriage thing was the end. That crusade is over.

Then it immediately pivots into 47 different freak shows. Yet another never ending social crusade that can never be over. 

[MDC 5,890]

Just now, titans&bucs&bearsohmy! said:

I don't think they are the same. But I think many of us kinda hoped/thought that the ghey marriage thing was the end. That crusade is over.

Then it immediately pivots into 47 different freak shows. Yet another never ending social crusade that can never be over. 

I’ve got no problem supporting gay marriage while also having no patience for (example) gender fluid stuff and new pronouns. Support for one doesn’t necessarily lead to another, for me. At least, I’m not going to change my opinion on Neil and Bob down the block because of some Game Stop weirdo they don’t know and probably would hate if they did.

[iam90sbaby 2,122]

39 minutes ago, MDC said:

I’ve got no problem supporting gay marriage while also having no patience for (example) gender fluid stuff and new pronouns. Support for one doesn’t necessarily lead to another, for me. At least, I’m not going to change my opinion on Neil and Bob down the block because of some Game Stop weirdo they don’t know and probably would hate if they did.

President Trump was the first president to openly support gay marriage in his campaign trail. But you guys are so far up your own a$$ you don’t even realize how centered he is. 

[MDC 5,890]

1 hour ago, iam90sbaby said:

President Trump was the first president to openly support gay marriage in his campaign trail. But you guys are so far up your own a$$ you don’t even realize how centered he is. 

I didn’t say anything about Trump at all. TDS?

[Cdub100 3,380]

9 hours ago, MDC said:

I think the idea of what is left, right or center has been totally skewed by the media and people arguing at the fringes.

According to polls there is broad public support for gay marriage, gun control, government action on climate change, single payer healthcare etc. but these are considered fringe left / liberal positions. I’m not sure why that is. 

I consider myself a centrist generally. I support gay marriage and dignity for trans people but I think common sense should prevail when it comes to gender fluidity, trans “women” competing with actual women in sports etc.

I think the gun debate is over focused on mass shootings and we would get more traction on strengthening laws to prevent straw purchases and the black market. I absolutely support a right to responsible private gun ownership.

I think MMGW is undeniable at this point but I am skeptical that we can reasonably do anything to reverse it and think we will mostly need to talk about acclimating / preparing for changes.

I have become a big supporter of single payer but only because I am sure our current system is going to collapse and it’s killing businesses right now.

I think these are reasonable positions but I am pretty much Noam Chomsky on this forearm.

This sh1t again. 

[Voltaire 4,556]

8 hours ago, titans&bucs&bearsohmy! said:

I don't think they are the same. But I think many of us kinda hoped/thought that the ghey marriage thing was the end. That crusade is over.

Then it immediately pivots into 47 different freak shows. Yet another never ending social crusade that can never be over. 

That’s exactly what happened with me.

I started from a position where I opposed all gay anything because it was creepy and gross and.their community was/is full of degenerates and perverts and sickos. So then they made a big hullabaloo about how they’re just like us, and some were. I appreciate Elton John and George Micheal and Anderson Cooper and I view them as good people, no better or worse than me. Then from there it was an easy step to accepting the position that they were born this way, which made sense, I could never choose that, maybe they can’t choose the other way. I’d always thought that they deserved to be treated with dignity anyway anyway. 

So I had just barely gotten this far in my thinking. When SCOTUS ruled in favor of gay marriage, I was genuinely happy for them. Who am I to tell them who to love or how to live their lives?

So then, a few hours later, I was watching The Daily Show, and of course this was the big news story of the day, and I got an image of two gay men kissing in celebration and my stomach turned. It was disgusting. But it’s a big day for them, of course they can be happy, I can deal with this.

Well, now images of gay men kissing is still focking disgusting. I was watching my favorite TV show (Game of Thrones) and the director put in a totally unnecessary and uncalled for and disgusting scene of two men pawing and intimate. I can handle the abstract concept of gay relationships, and in this case, my aphantasia is a blessing not a curse. I don’t want any visuals, thanks.  I deliberately avoid movies with gay themes because I can’t handle them. Even kissing and holding hands creeps me out, but I recognize that’s on me. They have every right to do that and I can divert my gaze, don’t engage, ignore it, and walk on.

Do your thing behind closed doors and I can avoid your bars and nightclubs and movies and I can keep my children away from your parades (which are conveniently placed far away in Oakland County),  and we’re OK.

But now it’s trannies in girls athletics and locker room,  and crossdresser reading, and suing their way into local St. Patrick’s Day parades, and bullying/suing bakers, and forcing pro-life Catholic single moms to turn their adoptable babies over to gay men.

 

 

[MDC 5,890]

14 minutes ago, Cdub100 said:

This sh1t again. 

Facts and data?

[Cdub100 3,380]

2 minutes ago, MDC said:

Facts and data?

Polls are not facts. You also didn't link to any. You just threw out a blanket statement and are now claiming it as fact.  so yeah, not this sh1t again.

[jerryskids 5,191]

9 hours ago, MDC said:

I don’t understand why you’d oppose marriage between consenting same sex adults just because of tranny bathroom SJW stuff or whatever. I bet the vast majority of ordinary hard working tax paying same sex couple have as little patience for gender fluidity and the “It’s M’AAM!” types as you and me.

I think the right wing has deliberately tried to conflate the fringe weirdos with your garden variety mo’s and you’re a smarter guy than that.

I don't know why you would blame the right wing for " deliberately tried to conflate the fringe weirdos with your garden variety mo’s".  That's on the libs, sorry.  I'm pretty sure the right in general has come to terms with gay marriage.  If you disagree let me know.

[MDC 5,890]

38 minutes ago, Cdub100 said:

Polls are not facts. You also didn't link to any. You just threw out a blanket statement and are now claiming it as fact.  so yeah, not this sh1t again.

You have a better way to gage public opinion? 

[MDC 5,890]

23 minutes ago, jerryskids said:

I don't know why you would blame the right wing for " deliberately tried to conflate the fringe weirdos with your garden variety mo’s".  That's on the libs, sorry.  I'm pretty sure the right in general has come to terms with gay marriage.  If you disagree let me know.

I think most people are comfortable with gay marriage too. But I see way more posts like this one:

I don't see why anyone would worry about being labeled anti-gay anymore than than would about being labeled anti-cancer or anti-violence. 

Coming from the bored Trumpers than anyone else. Maybe I’m splitting hairs here but I usually don’t see the anti-gay or anti-trans stuff making any distinction between people who happen to be gay / trans whatever and are worthy of dignity and fringe weirdos who are aggressively insisting on being celebrated in some way. I often see homersexuality here referred to as a “mental disorder” and that’s only coming from one side of the aisle. 

:dunno:

[Cdub100 3,380]

39 minutes ago, MDC said:

You have a better way to gage public opinion? 

I don't parade polls as facts. Especially with how flawed polls have been these past years.

[Brad GLuckman 518]

I'm a former Republican, mostly because I was raised that way. As I grew older, i became far more liberal. I am pro-gay marriage, want healthcare for all, believe in climate change, want defense spending cut, and feel that the system is rigged for the rich to keep getting richer. I hate that Repubs keep giving tax breaks to the rich.

But the Dems are just too far left. Last nights debates are everything I hate about the Democratic party. There really is no party for me.  

[titans&bucs&bearsohmy! 2,745]

9 minutes ago, Brad GLuckman said:

I'm a former Republican, mostly because I was raised that way. As I grew older, i became far more liberal. I am pro-gay marriage, want healthcare for all, believe in climate change, want defense spending cut, and feel that the system is rigged for the rich to keep getting richer. I hate that Repubs keep giving tax breaks to the rich.

But the Dems are just too far left. Last nights debates are everything I hate about the Democratic party. There really is no party for me.  

Yep. This is me 100%.

I look at the democrats and their rank socialism and their identity politics with utter disgust.

Similarly, I look at the republicans with disgust. They could not make it any plainer that they are the corporate rich man's party.

So as usual, we have the choice between socialist policies (which will of course turn into bloated corruption riddled sh!t shows) or late stage capitalist corruption. Neither interests me in the slightest.

Looking at the slate of candidates, I can't see one, including the incumbent, that I am comfortable having in the situation room when lives are on the line.

Looks like another case of our corrupt democracy failing the people to me. Hilary VS. Trump was bad. This go round may be worse.

Its sad when Biden is the frontrunner. That guy is just bland as toast stuffshirt washington insider to the core.

Bernie is a crank. Booker and Harris can kiss my white ass. So that leaves who? Warren? Mayor Pete? Hardly inspiring.

Swing and a big miss democrats. Looks like we are in for another turd sniffing contest to me. 

[MDC 5,890]

1 hour ago, Cdub100 said:

I don't parade polls as facts. Especially with how flawed polls have been these past years.

How do you judge what most people think about the issues? Intuition? 

[Hardcore troubadour 12,625]

2 hours ago, Brad GLuckman said:

I'm a former Republican, mostly because I was raised that way. As I grew older, i became far more liberal. I am pro-gay marriage, want healthcare for all, believe in climate change, want defense spending cut, and feel that the system is rigged for the rich to keep getting richer. I hate that Repubs keep giving tax breaks to the rich.

But the Dems are just too far left. Last nights debates are everything I hate about the Democratic party. There really is no party for me.  

Sorry, but the prevailing thought that the republicans are the party of the rich is outdated and obsolete. The democrats are just as bad now. 

[titans&bucs&bearsohmy! 2,745]

31 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

Sorry, but the prevailing thought that the republicans are the party of the rich is outdated and obsolete. The democrats are just as bad now. 

I think the takeover of America by corporate interest is one of the biggest problems in the country.

I would disagree with your assertion. Yes, the democrats are bad in this regard. But the Republicans are pretty openly all about deregulation and corporate welfare. 

[Voltaire 4,556]

46 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

Sorry, but the prevailing thought that the republicans are the party of the rich is outdated and obsolete. The democrats are just as bad now. 

The first year of Trump felt like we got a louder, more obnoxious, more orange Jeb! It's really only been the last year and a half that he's shed the neocons advice and become more serious on trade and border issues and hopefully soon tech censorship and remaining out of Iran.

[Hardcore troubadour 12,625]

22 minutes ago, titans&bucs&bearsohmy! said:

I think the takeover of America by corporate interest is one of the biggest problems in the country.

I would disagree with your assertion. Yes, the democrats are bad in this regard. But the Republicans are pretty openly all about deregulation and corporate welfare. 

There was no shortage of corporate welfare during the last two democratic administrations. None  whatsover.  As a matter of fact, possibly the biggest corporate give away ever was during Obama, when somehow the taxpayer now funds delivery of Amazons products. Nice deal. Helps when you own a newspaper that loses money like Bezos does. Dr. Fockin Evil. 

[Voltaire 4,556]

10 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

There was no shortage of corporate welfare during the last two democratic administrations. None  whatsover.  As a matter of fact, possibly the biggest corporate give away ever was during Obama, when somehow the taxpayer now funds delivery of Amazons products. Nice deal. Helps when you own a newspaper that loses money like Bezos does. Dr. Fockin Evil. 

Both parties are into corporate welfare. The GOP has traditionally been less likely to care while some of the Dems at least had the decency to recognize their own party's hypocrisy. This is one of the reasons why I like Trump. His base is made up of the ordinary everyday people and the swamp dwelling GOP insider political hacks either have to leave (like Paul Ryan and Jeff Flake) or play ball on the new rules and be a chameleon and try to wait him out (like Mitch McConnell or Lindsey Graham or D*ck Cheney's daughter or Mitt Romney's niece). When Trump leaves, I don't know if we can replace him with another populist nationalist or if the GOP swamp will re-emerge from hibernation.

Meanwhile the crooked corporate Dem swamp is actually the less evil option trying to fight off an insurgency the freak show. I never I'd see the day when I thought Nancy Pelosi was talking sense, but there she is doing it whenever she talks about Team AOC. It's why I don't hate AOC though, I find her needling of Pelosi entertaining. Better her than the Pelosi dingleberry(Crowley) that she replaced, their votes are the same.

[Hardcore troubadour 12,625]

21 minutes ago, Voltaire said:

Both parties are into corporate welfare. The GOP has traditionally been less likely to care while some of the Dems at least had the decency to recognize their own party's hypocrisy. This is one of the reasons why I like Trump. His base is made up of the ordinary everyday people and the swamp dwelling GOP insider political hacks either have to leave (like Paul Ryan and Jeff Flake) or play ball on the new rules and be a chameleon and try to wait him out (like Mitch McConnell or Lindsey Graham or D*ck Cheney's daughter or Mitt Romney's niece). When Trump leaves, I don't know if we can replace him with another populist nationalist or if the GOP swamp will re-emerge from hibernation.

Meanwhile the crooked corporate Dem swamp is actually the less evil option trying to fight off an insurgency the freak show. I never I'd see the day when I thought Nancy Pelosi was talking sense, but there she is doing it whenever she talks about Team AOC. It's why I don't hate AOC though, I find her needling of Pelosi entertaining. Better her than the Pelosi dingleberry(Crowley) that she replaced, their votes are the same.

If the GOP is smart they will get rid of the stuffed shirt republicans like Mitt Romney. What a turn of events. The GOP the party of the working man. Lets hope. They have ran off the Bush clan it seems 

[titans&bucs&bearsohmy! 2,745]

1 hour ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

If the GOP is smart they will get rid of the stuffed shirt republicans like Mitt Romney. What a turn of events. The GOP the party of the working man. Lets hope. They have ran off the Bush clan it seems 

Seems like the long and short of it is, nobody of any political stripe trusts either party. Seems like an outsider movement should take off.

Too bad the powers that be own the process almost completely. 

[Hardcore troubadour 12,625]

9 minutes ago, titans&bucs&bearsohmy! said:

Seems like the long and short of it is, nobody of any political stripe trusts either party. Seems like an outsider movement should take off.

Too bad the powers that be own the process almost completely. 

Not completely.  The electoral college is a beautiful thing. Don't forget how much establishment republicans hate Trump.  He still prevailed as an outsider. Maybe not the outsider you wanted, but one nonetheless.  

[titans&bucs&bearsohmy! 2,745]

1 hour ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

Not completely.  The electoral college is a beautiful thing. Don't forget how much establishment republicans hate Trump.  He still prevailed as an outsider. Maybe not the outsider you wanted, but one nonetheless.  

Thats why I said almost.

Yeah, Trump managed to get in, but he has been fairly effectively quarantined by the swamp creatures. The only significant legislation he's gotten was the tax cut, which was garden variety republican pork anyway.

Beyond that, the Republicans haven't played ball with him much. So he tries to do sh!t via executive orders and such.

In order to work, an outsider movement has to include congress. We need at a minimum a sizeable minority of independent congressmen. 

[MDC 5,890]

Take a look at Trump’s cabinet and appointees. They’re full of the same neocons, Wall Street insiders, Ivy leaguers and Christianitist weirdos you’d have gotten under Jeb! Maybe even worse. 

They love having Trump at the top. He distracts folks by acting like a clown while the GOP gets the same basic platform of corporate deregulation they always wanted. 

[RaiderHaters Revenge 3,577]

the whole rich get richer is a bunch of nonsense

everyone has gotten richer

 

[MDC 5,890]

1 hour ago, RaiderHaters Revenge said:

the whole rich get richer is a bunch of nonsense

everyone has gotten richer

 

The second a Democrat is in office again the GOP will become deficit hawks and argue that we need to cut Social Secrurity and Medicare / Medicaid to fix the debt they created. Book it.

[Voltaire 4,556]

34 minutes ago, MDC said:

The second a Democrat is in office again the GOP will become deficit hawks and argue that we need to cut Social Secrurity and Medicare / Medicaid to fix the debt they created. Book it.

Ah... 1993... 2009... I remember them as well.