Should we have a conversation about gun control now?

[Hawkeye21 1,853]

15 minutes ago, bostonlager said:

What exactly are you getting at? It seems to me you want to make people like me jump through more hoops to purchase firearms so loonies don't eat a bullet. 

It doesn’t matter anymore. 

[5-Points 2,729]

On 10/29/2019 at 6:42 AM, RaiderHaters Revenge said:

Remember when I made a lot of those points but that dr pen pu55y kept screaming suicides

 

That was his go to argument. That and you are more likely to be involved in a firearm related incident if you are around guns than if you aren't around them. Duh. You're more likely to be involved in a plane crash if you fly than if you don't fly. Solid reasoning there. 

 

As for suicide, I have no sympathy for those who kill themselves. I feel sorry for the family and friends left to figure out why somebody would do so. But if you're so mentally and emotionally fragile that you would choose to take your own life over something trivial, perhaps society and the species are better off without you. 

[GobbleDog 816]

13 hours ago, 5-Points said:

you are more likely to be involved in a firearm related incident if you are around guns than if you aren't around them. Duh. You're more likely to be involved in a plane crash if you fly than if you don't fly. Solid reasoning there. 

Firearm incidents are murder and suicide.  Airplane incidents are freak accidents, which almost never happen. Flawed reasoning.

13 hours ago, 5-Points said:

As for suicide, I have no sympathy for those who kill themselves. I feel sorry for the family and friends left to figure out why somebody would do so. But if you're so mentally and emotionally fragile that you would choose to take your own life over something trivial, perhaps society and the species are better off without you. 

That's cold. Teenagers and young adults are emotionally fragile.  Regardless suicide is a drop in the bucket in justifying gun control. We've got enough gun violence to fill several buckets.

[tubby_mcgee 686]

I still wonder, whoever is for removing guns from the public, are you willing to get your own peanus cut off to prevent rape? 

[5-Points 2,729]

4 hours ago, GobbleDog said:

Firearm incidents are murder and suicide.  Airplane incidents are freak accidents, which almost never happen. Flawed reasoning.

That's cold. Teenagers and young adults are emotionally fragile.  Regardless suicide is a drop in the bucket in justifying gun control. We've got enough gun violence to fill several buckets.

No it isn't. The point is, the more you are around or involved in a certain activity, the more likely you are to be involved in an incident concerning that activity. His argument about being around guns increases the likelihood that you'll be involved in a gun related incident is the same as me saying the more you fly, the more likely you are to be involved in a plane crash. Both are true but neither is a strong argument against owning a gun or traveling by plane. There are precautions that can be taken in both scenarios to reduce the likelihood of an unwanted incident/accident.

 

Yeah.  Lots of people are mentally or emotionally fragile. Most of them don't try to kill themselves over something trivial. 

The vast majority of gun crime/violence is committed by a certain segment of society in certain cities around the country. Whereas the vast majority of guns everywhere around the country are never used to commit crimes or violence. We don't have a gun problem, we have a people problem. 

 

[bostonlager 2,463]

6 hours ago, GobbleDog said:

That's cold. Teenagers and young adults are emotionally fragile.  Regardless suicide is a drop in the bucket in justifying gun control. We've got enough gun violence to fill several buckets.

Teenagers TODAY are fragile and that is because we have allowed them to be delicate little snowflakes. I have zero sympathy for the weak and if we have made today's youth so damn sensitive that a few of them off themselves, so be it. We don't need that type of weakness in our world. 

[GobbleDog 816]

8 hours ago, 5-Points said:

 We don't have a gun problem, we have a people problem.

Then why outlaw any type of weapon - from fully automatic guns to grenades?  After all, "it's a people problem."

Why outlaw drugs?  We don't have a drug problem, we have a people problem. 

[iam90sbaby 2,125]

7 minutes ago, GobbleDog said:

Then why outlaw any type of weapon - from fully automatic guns to grenades?  After all, "it's a people problem."

Why outlaw drugs?  We don't have a drug problem, we have a people problem. 

We have an immigrant problem. Be more specific than “people problem”.  No one is shooting each other up in Vermont. 

[5-Points 2,729]

2 hours ago, GobbleDog said:

Then why outlaw any type of weapon - from fully automatic guns to grenades?  After all, "it's a people problem."

Why outlaw drugs?  We don't have a drug problem, we have a people problem. 

I don't think there should be any restrictions on owning automatic weapons. 

The 2A doesn't cover ordnance so we don't have a constitutional right to keep and bear grenades or nuclear missiles. 

Drugs should be legal. 

 

[shorepatrol 1,737]

3 hours ago, 5-Points said:

I don't think there should be any restrictions on owning automatic weapons. 

The 2A doesn't cover ordnance so we don't have a constitutional right to keep and bear grenades or nuclear missiles. 

Drugs should be legal. 

 

It's almost like you  read the constitution. 

[5-Points 2,729]

45 minutes ago, shorepatrol said:

It's almost like you  read the constitution. 

I'm a big fan of individual liberty. 

 

[shorepatrol 1,737]

2 hours ago, 5-Points said:

I'm a big fan of individual liberty. 

 

Too few are. 

[GobbleDog 816]

 

7 hours ago, 5-Points said:

The 2A doesn't cover ordnance so we don't have a constitutional right to keep and bear grenades or nuclear missiles.

"The right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."  

Ok Mr. Liberty, where does the world "Arms" distinguish between rifles, pistols, fully-automatics, grenades, bombs, mines, rocket-launchers, or any other type of weapons you can think of? 

7 hours ago, 5-Points said:

Drugs should be legal.

Brings up my other radical idea. Heroin, meth, crack, oxicoton, and other physically addictive drugs ..... allow addicts to do it for FREE at local clinics. Doctors and social workers on site. Some (probably most) will seek help, some won't. Either way, you've put every drug dealer out of business and prevented future generations from even trying it..... because nobody's selling it.

It wouldn't work for recreational drugs... pot, coke, ecstasy, etc. Nobody's going down to a nasty addict clinic to do those type of drugs... even for free.   Pot should be legal. Not sure on the other one's being so dangerous.

[bostonlager 2,463]

All guns should be legal, period. Lib f@ggots can suck it or are welcome to come take mine. Bring your own body bag as you will need it. I will off you. 
 

All drugs should be legal especially heroin. It gets rid of the weak and stupid at an awesome rate. 

[RLLD 3,455]

If there is a positive to heroin it would be that it does kill the stupid pretty fast.... unlike smoking or drinking, its pretty effective at culling the herd.

[5-Points 2,729]

10 hours ago, GobbleDog said:

 

"The right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."  

Ok Mr. Liberty, where does the world "Arms" distinguish between rifles, pistols, fully-automatics, grenades, bombs, mines, rocket-launchers, or any other type of weapons you can think of? 

Brings up my other radical idea. Heroin, meth, crack, oxicoton, and other physically addictive drugs ..... allow addicts to do it for FREE at local clinics. Doctors and social workers on site. Some (probably most) will seek help, some won't. Either way, you've put every drug dealer out of business and prevented future generations from even trying it..... because nobody's selling it.

It wouldn't work for recreational drugs... pot, coke, ecstasy, etc. Nobody's going down to a nasty addict clinic to do those type of drugs... even for free.   Pot should be legal. Not sure on the other one's being so dangerous.

You're right, there is no distinction between semi, auto, grenades, artillery, etc.

And, as it is my belief that the founding fathers intended for the citizenry to be armed comparably to the gov, we should be able to own those too.

 

I think drugs should be legal. That is as far as the gov needs to be involved. You either choose to do drugs or you choose not to and you deal with the consequences of your choice.

[vuduchile 1,941]

The United States leads the industrialized world in firearms violence of all types—homicides, suicides, and unintentional deaths. Most of this violence involves the use of a handgun. Handguns are easily concealed, engineered to be lethal, cheap, and easy to get.

Handguns are used in nearly 70 percent of firearm suicides, and 80 percent of firearm homicides

We don't really have a gun problem.  Our problem is that we have too many violent criminals who are fully locked, loaded and ready to pull the trigger with little or no provocation.  

[Hawkeye21 1,853]

8 minutes ago, vuduchile said:

The United States leads the industrialized world in firearms violence of all types—homicides, suicides, and unintentional deaths. Most of this violence involves the use of a handgun. Handguns are easily concealed, engineered to be lethal, cheap, and easy to get.

Handguns are used in nearly 70 percent of firearm suicides, and 80 percent of firearm homicides

We don't really have a gun problem.  Our problem is that we have too many violent criminals who are fully locked, loaded and ready to pull the trigger with little or no provocation.  

I think a lot of us know about the the problems we have but no one seems to know how to solve these problems.  The 2nd Amendment makes it hard to do.

[iam90sbaby 2,125]

3 minutes ago, Hawkeye21 said:

I think a lot of us know about the the problems we have but no one seems to know how to solve these problems.  The 2nd Amendment makes it hard to do.

And what is the problem exactly?

[Hawkeye21 1,853]

1 minute ago, iam90sbaby said:

And what is the problem exactly?

Look at the post I quoted.  I was agreeing with him.

[vuduchile 1,941]

11 minutes ago, Hawkeye21 said:

I think a lot of us know about the the problems we have but no one seems to know how to solve these problems.  The 2nd Amendment makes it hard to do.

We're in a very tough spot here.  Gotta figure out a way to round up all the existing guns currently being used for nefarious purposes. Then we need an effective prison system that can not only hold all the violent criminals, but can actually rehab them.

At the same time, we need to put some reasonable measure in place to make sure new guns don't fall into the wrong hands.  

[5-Points 2,729]

2 hours ago, Hawkeye21 said:

I think a lot of us know about the the problems we have but no one seems to know how to solve these problems.  The 2nd Amendment makes it hard to do.

The 2A makes it hard to stop dooshbags from being dooshbags? 

Or are you saying we could easily solve the violence problem by making gun ownership illegal? 

[Hawkeye21 1,853]

1 minute ago, 5-Points said:

The 2A makes it hard to stop dooshbags from being dooshbags? 

Or are you saying we could easily solve the violence problem by making gun ownership illegal? 

I'm saying it makes it hard keeping guns away from them.

I'm not saying that either.

[5-Points 2,729]

1 minute ago, Hawkeye21 said:

I'm saying it makes it hard keeping guns away from them.

I'm not saying that either.

I suppose there's some truth to that. We law abiding folk have a constitutional right to keep arms, which means there will be a market for firearms from which to procure them. Which means they will also be available, legally or otherwise, for people with more nefarious purposes in mind. 

Which is why I'm a big proponent of firearm ownership. Ultimately, we are each responsible for our own personal safety. You can't count on somebody else being there when you need them or intervening if they are there. The only thing you can count on is your own ability to defend you and your's. 

[JustinCharge 2,397]

https://img-9gag-fun.9cache.com/photo/ag5n0ox_700b.jpg

[Strike 3,968]

Not sure why anyone would want to own their own gun when we have such great police there to help us in a moment's notice:

https://miami.cbslocal.com/2019/11/04/coral-springs-police-911-supervisor-watching-netflix-during-shooting-call/

 

[Mephisto 15]

On 10/29/2019 at 10:50 AM, Hawkeye21 said:

I wonder what the suicide rate would be if those people didn't have access to a gun.  I have a feeling it would be quite a bit lower.

You would be wrong.

[Hawkeye21 1,853]

1 minute ago, Mephisto said:

You would be wrong.

I certainly could be. Have any info to show I’m wrong?

[Mephisto 15]

Not today.  I've argued this topic countless times here before and elsewhere.  For the moment, I'll just take pot-shots over the top and let everyone fly into a tizzy.

[SUXBNME 1,328]

On 10/30/2019 at 9:42 PM, GobbleDog said:

Firearm incidents are murder and suicide.  Airplane incidents are freak accidents, which almost never happen. Flawed reasoning.

That's cold. Teenagers and young adults are emotionally fragile. Regardless suicide is a drop in the bucket in justifying gun control. We've got enough gun violence to fill several buckets.

They sure as hell didn't used to be 

[SUXBNME 1,328]

On 10/31/2019 at 8:38 PM, GobbleDog said:

 

"The right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."  

Ok Mr. Liberty, where does the world "Arms" distinguish between rifles, pistols, fully-automatics, grenades, bombs, mines, rocket-launchers, 

 

I'll be in the minority here, but I do not believe that the above bolded should be legal for the average citizen to own. 
And guess what? They're not. 

[Hawkeye21 1,853]

8 hours ago, SUXBNME said:

They sure as hell didn't used to be 

Teenagers and young adults didn't use to be emotionally fragile?  I'm not sure how we prove that one to be true.

[bostonlager 2,463]

3 minutes ago, Hawkeye21 said:

Teenagers and young adults didn't use to be emotionally fragile?  I'm not sure how we prove that one to be true.

Many good articles out there trying to explain it. You have your head intentionally buried in the sand if you think today's kids aren't a bunch of pusssies compared to previous generations. 

https://www.google.com/search?source=hp&ei=Ax7EXb6_MNDz5gLW4qvYCQ&q=why+are+kids+today+so+fragile&oq=why+are+kids+today+so+fragile&gs_l=psy-ab.3...133.7231..7339...7.0..1.146.2605.32j1......0....1..gws-wiz.......0j0i131j0i10j0i13.07Ng3jvuvUE&ved=0ahUKEwj-zPWXnNjlAhXQuVkKHVbxCpsQ4dUDCAg&uact=5

[Hawkeye21 1,853]

27 minutes ago, bostonlager said:

Many good articles out there trying to explain it. You have your head intentionally buried in the sand if you think today's kids aren't a bunch of pusssies compared to previous generations. 

https://www.google.com/search?source=hp&ei=Ax7EXb6_MNDz5gLW4qvYCQ&q=why+are+kids+today+so+fragile&oq=why+are+kids+today+so+fragile&gs_l=psy-ab.3...133.7231..7339...7.0..1.146.2605.32j1......0....1..gws-wiz.......0j0i131j0i10j0i13.07Ng3jvuvUE&ved=0ahUKEwj-zPWXnNjlAhXQuVkKHVbxCpsQ4dUDCAg&uact=5

That's not my argument though.  I agree that they do seem to be more emotionally fragile now.  My argument is that there were still emotionally fragile kids back in the day, just not as many.  Being an emotionally fragile teenager is nothing new.