Cam Newton

[dog19 2]

Are people flat out dropping him at this point?  I hate dead roster space, and I am also have holding onto AJ Green.  Who are people replacing Cam with this weekend and beyond that didn't have another QB on their roster?

[weepaws 2,451]

I haven’t seen him dropped yet. 

[jrokh 567]

How can you see anything, you don't watch football games?

[weepaws 2,451]

See their you go again, your on a ff post and not adding anything about ff on yet. 

You really do need to find a girl friend. 

[jrokh 567]

Is Mary Magdeline available?

[AxeElf 787]

He should be dropped in all but superflex leagues or the largest of normal leagues.

[huskyhater75 242]

He's a running QB, beat up beyond repair and in my mind (GOTTA get this off my hat) it's karma-he should've NEVER played in that BCS championship game against Oregon. What he got away with before that, if Oregon's QB would've done that the NCAA would've suspended him. His cockiness brought all of this on and the result was (HAHA) the NFL refs looking the other way when he'd get drilled late. Good riddance......................................

[crackills 19]

i dropped him after wk2.. if you still have him on your roster, you are waisting valuable roster space

[zftcg 84]

I'm holding for now because the WW options at QB in my 14-teamer basically consist of a Giant Douche and a Turd Sandwich. But if his absence extends beyond Week 4 I'll probably drop. Foot sprains are the kinds of injuries that tend to linger on and on before the guy finally goes on IR. Not saying that will definitely happen here but I am mentally prepared for that possibility.

In the meantime I'm riding Danny Dimes as far as he'll take me.

[Ray_T 587]

On 9/21/2019 at 12:34 PM, huskyhater75 said:

He's a running QB, beat up beyond repair and in my mind (GOTTA get this off my hat) it's karma-he should've NEVER played in that BCS championship game against Oregon. What he got away with before that, if Oregon's QB would've done that the NCAA would've suspended him. His cockiness brought all of this on and the result was (HAHA) the NFL refs looking the other way when he'd get drilled late. Good riddance......................................

yeah, Running QB's tend to have far shorter careers than pocket passers.

and Cam is definitely a running QB.

Take a look at your best running QB's over the last 10-15 years.

Donovan McNabb by the time he hit 29 was beginning a long streak of seasons where he could not remain healthy.  By the age of 30 he was largely done health wise.  he did play one full season after becoming a pocket passer in his mid 30's but was generally not healthy after the age of 28.

Michael Vick was injured often even while young.   his last full season was in 2006 when he was 26.

NcNair played one 16 game season after the age of 29.

RGIII had a good rookie season and was injury prone since

I'd argue Russell Wilson is the only Running QB who has maintained solid health beyond the age of 28 and he is only 30.    he's also a bit smarter about not taking big hits than Newton was.

That being said, this type of player seems to have much shorter careers. 

it is very possible that Cam Newton may be getting to that point where his body cant take it anymore.   I have seen him take some absolute MONSTER hits over his career.   

HOnestly if I had him, I'd sell to anyone who was willing to buy.

 

[shutdown 40]

I don't really get the sense Cam enjoys playing anymore, so I'm not sure how much he'll be willing to run and take the hits.  All depends on the size and type of league you're in, but if you aren't getting rushing points from Cam he's a bottom 10 QB, so probably drop-able in most.

[Ray_T 587]

1 hour ago, shutdown said:

I don't really get the sense Cam enjoys playing anymore, so I'm not sure how much he'll be willing to run and take the hits.  All depends on the size and type of league you're in, but if you aren't getting rushing points from Cam he's a bottom 10 QB, so probably drop-able in most.

I dont know about bottom 10, but I'll agree he shouldnt be started in regular leagues unless he gets you at least 40-50 rush yards per game.

in his current state of health, I dont see that happening.   

he only has value in 2 QB leagues and superflex leagues.

if you are not in one of these leagues he likely belongs on the waiver wire.   if he shows signs of being able to run the football again, you may want to pick him up as a flex starter/backup.

but right now hes worthless.

[jgcrawfish 232]

If I had him, I'd drop him if anything was available.  But i have zero shares...sooo....

[Ray_T 587]

1 minute ago, jgcrawfish said:

If I had him, I'd drop him if anything was available.  But i have zero shares...sooo....

ditto here.

dont get me wrong.  I love watching him play.  but its almost been painful to watch him so far this year.   hes not even a shadow of his former self.

maybe that will change once he gets healthy, but I fear hes nearing the end of the line due to reasons I mentioned above.   Running QB's take too many hits and just dont have long careers as a general rule.

[jgcrawfish 232]

Just now, Ray_T said:

ditto here.

dont get me wrong.  I love watching him play.  but its almost been painful to watch him so far this year.   hes not even a shadow of his former self.

maybe that will change once he gets healthy, but I fear hes nearing the end of the line due to reasons I mentioned above.   Running QB's take too many hits and just dont have long careers as a general rule.

I'm only trying to trade for him because I want Tyreek Hill and have something of asset in A. Rodgers that might be more valuable.  I don't think Cam's done, he's just not healthy.   I would be willing to hold him a few weeks and wait and see but only because I have better options.  

[Ray_T 587]

1 minute ago, jgcrawfish said:

I'm only trying to trade for him because I want Tyreek Hill and have something of asset in A. Rodgers that might be more valuable.  I don't think Cam's done, he's just not healthy.   I would be willing to hold him a few weeks and wait and see but only because I have better options.  

I guess only time will tell.   just dont overpay and you will be fine.  HIs value is almost as low  as it can get in standard leagues right now.    there is still value if you are in 2QB or superflex formats, but hes no longer a top 12 QB in his current state.

[kilroy69 993]

In single qb leagues I would not roster him. In 2qb leagues he is even iffy. He is bad this year. Really bad. And his backup suddenly steps in and tosses bombs. 

[Ray_T 587]

3 minutes ago, kilroy69 said:

In single qb leagues I would not roster him. In 2qb leagues he is even iffy. He is bad this year. Really bad. And his backup suddenly steps in and tosses bombs. 

yeah, his backup looked really good.   

But that was a fairly decent matchup for him.   So its hard to say what to make of that.

[AxeElf 787]

2 hours ago, zftcg said:

In the meantime I'm riding Danny Dimes as far as he'll take me.

If you have Jones, there's no reason to hold Cam at all.  Drop with confidence.

[Ray_T 587]

5 minutes ago, AxeElf said:

If you have Jones, there's no reason to hold Cam at all.  Drop with confidence.

chances are good the window to pick him up has opened and closed.

unless its one of those leagues where you bid with free agent dollars.  he might be around in some of those leagues.

[AxeElf 787]

Just now, Ray_T said:

chances are good the window to pick him up has opened and closed.

unless its one of those leagues where you bid with free agent dollars.  he might be around in some of those leagues.

I would guess that Jones is still unowned in more leagues than he is owned, but that's kind of irrelevant, since I was replying to someone who said (or implied) that they already had him.

[kilroy69 993]

2 hours ago, zftcg said:

I'm holding for now because the WW options at QB in my 14-teamer basically consist of a Giant Douche and a Turd Sandwich. But if his absence extends beyond Week 4 I'll probably drop. Foot sprains are the kinds of injuries that tend to linger on and on before the guy finally goes on IR. Not saying that will definitely happen here but I am mentally prepared for that possibility.

In the meantime I'm riding Danny Dimes as far as he'll take me.

I am in a 2qb league and traded for jones and haskins 2 weeks ago. Backups for backups. Mattenson and samuals for haskins and danny dimes. 

I will also be riding him out. His rushing ability and his willingness to push it down field caused him to hit 47 points on my bench. 

 

[GobbleDog 815]

I was optimistic about Cam this year.... but recent play and now foot injuries....  starting to look like the end is nigh.  When he heals up, he better be damn good because I think the Panthers are ready to move on.

[zftcg 84]

1 hour ago, AxeElf said:

I would guess that Jones is still unowned in more leagues than he is owned, but that's kind of irrelevant, since I was replying to someone who said (or implied) that they already had him.

Yeah, longtime family league with open waivers. You can pick someone up at any time, and only limitation on dropping someone is if they're in your starting lineup, in which case you have to wait until Monday morning. It's dumb, but that's how we've always done it and there's no appetite for change. So in that league I picked up Dimes last night.

2 hours ago, AxeElf said:

If you have Jones, there's no reason to hold Cam at all.  Drop with confidence.

What's leading me to hold off is it's a 14-team league where lots of teams have two QBs (even though we only start one). When Cam got hurt last week, my options were Rudolph and Minshew. Obviously, if Jones continues at this pace, I can move on from Cam with confidence. But if he turns back into a pumpkin I don't want to be back in the same place two weeks from now. There is certainly a world in which Cam heals up and returns to being a Top 5 QB, and if that happens, I don't want it to be on someone else's roster while I'm stuck starting Case Keenum or Josh Rosen. To  me that's worth holding the roster spot for another week or two.

[sderk 1,040]

Newton sucks.

[shutdown 40]

11 hours ago, zftcg said:

Yeah, longtime family league with open waivers. You can pick someone up at any time, and only limitation on dropping someone is if they're in your starting lineup, in which case you have to wait until Monday morning. It's dumb, but that's how we've always done it and there's no appetite for change. So in that league I picked up Dimes last night.

What's leading me to hold off is it's a 14-team league where lots of teams have two QBs (even though we only start one). When Cam got hurt last week, my options were Rudolph and Minshew. Obviously, if Jones continues at this pace, I can move on from Cam with confidence. But if he turns back into a pumpkin I don't want to be back in the same place two weeks from now. There is certainly a world in which Cam heals up and returns to being a Top 5 QB, and if that happens, I don't want it to be on someone else's roster while I'm stuck starting Case Keenum or Josh Rosen. To  me that's worth holding the roster spot for another week or two.

Right now Minshew is more valuable than Cam.  Rudolph is as valuable.  You don't lose anything by cutting him if those guys are options.

And I'm not sure what your scoring is, but in ESPN standard league Keenum is a top 10 QB (9).

The reality of the situation is that while there may be a 5% chance you get running top-5 Cam back, I'd wager it's far more likel that Minshew, Rudolph and Keenum finish with a better statistical year than Cam. 

One other consideration, the Panthers had a round 1 grade on Will Grier, as did other teams.  It doesn't mean they were right with the grade, but the fact they spent real draft capital on a QB and that Allen looked better than Cam (granted against a mediocre defense) all points to the fact the Panthers are preparing to move on from Cam.  Any lingering injury he has may just accelerate the timetable.

[shutdown 40]

Now there is speculation Cam is dealing with a Lisfranc injury.  If that's true you definitely need to dump him.

[weepaws 2,451]

13 hours ago, sderk said:

Newton sucks.

Had some really good ff seasons though. 

Hey thanks. 

[Ray_T 587]

1 hour ago, shutdown said:

Now there is speculation Cam is dealing with a Lisfranc injury.  If that's true you definitely need to dump him.

Lisfranc is the career killer for most RB's when they get it.

Cam isnt a RB but this will seriously hamper his ability to run.  

that being said, they are not doing surgery, so it may not be as serious as all that, but these injuries generally take a long time to heal from.   I suspect Cam may still play later in the year, but wont likely be fantasy relevant until at least fantasy football playoffs.  It is equally likely  he wont be fantasy relevant until next season.

If they announce a surgery, may may not be fantasy relevant again ever unless he masters the art of being a pocket passer.

[Ray_T 587]

as a followup, here is a relevant article for those of you who do not know much about this type of injury.

https://lermagazine.com/news/in-the-moment-sports-medicine/most-nfl-players-successfully-return-from-lisfranc-injury-but-it-takes-time

it can take some time to recover.   this is not likely a 3 or 4 week thing.

and  if they have to perform surgery, then it becomes a career threatening injury.

[zftcg 84]

20 hours ago, zftcg said:

Foot sprains are the kinds of injuries that tend to linger on and on before the guy finally goes on IR. Not saying that will definitely happen here but I am mentally prepared for that possibility.

I wrote this before news emerged about the Lisfranc, but today's news is exactly what I had in mind. Whenever someone has a "foot sprain", the scenario plays out the exact same way:

1. Player is diagnosed with foot sprain and we hear there's a chance they may not play that week
2. Oops, look like he may need to sit another week
3. OK, now it's been a few weeks, but he's still not progressing
4. Turns out it's the dreaded Lisfranc, but he's hoping to avoid IR
5. Guess what? He's going on IR

There is zero reason to hold on to Cam at this point. Even if we knew for sure he would only be out 4 weeks, I would still say he's droppable. But given the likelihood this extends further, possibly all season, he's a must-drop.

[Ray_T 587]

2 minutes ago, zftcg said:

I wrote this before news emerged about the Lisfranc, but today's news is exactly what I had in mind. Whenever someone has a "foot sprain", the scenario plays out the exact same way:

1. Player is diagnosed with foot sprain and we hear there's a chance they may not play that week
2. Oops, look like he may need to sit another week
3. OK, now it's been a few weeks, but he's still not progressing
4. Turns out it's the dreaded Lisfranc, but he's hoping to avoid IR
5. Guess what? He's going on IR

There is zero reason to hold on to Cam at this point. Even if we knew for sure he would only be out 4 weeks, I would still say he's droppable. But given the likelihood this extends further, possibly all season, he's a must-drop.

sometiimes the lisfranc is mis-diagnosed as turf toe but when it does not improve,  then they look at it further to determine the cause.  then re label as Lis Franc.

[zftcg 84]

2 minutes ago, Ray_T said:

sometiimes the lisfranc is mis-diagnosed as turf toe but when it does not improve,  then they look at it further to determine the cause.  then re label as Lis Franc.

Right, that's why whenever I hear the phrase "foot sprain" my spidey sense starts tingling. At least with ACLs/Achilles/etc we know right away that he's done for the season. Lisfrancs are like the ultimate tease

[Ray_T 587]

well cam gets a lot of his fantasy points by running the ball.   the Lis franc may have ruined  this for him.  

at least for this year......

if he plays, he will look like he did in week 1 and week 2.

I'll pass on that.

[jrbdmb 28]

I had Cam in both my main leagues, dropped him in both after Week 1 for Dak. Been running with Dak (no pun intended) ever since.

It only took that one week to see that Cam wasn't running. A Cam that isn't running isn't a viable fantasy QB. Drop him until he shows is he willing an able to be a running threat again.

(Note this is for a 10 team league with a 5-player bench. In large leagues or 2 QB leagues you need to be more patient.)

[SexyRexy 60]

I’m planning to drop him once the team confirms it’s a lisfranc. Right now it’s just a report and last week the team felt cam would practice tomorrow.

 

just want to truth to come from the source and I’ll go from there.

[zftcg 84]

4 hours ago, shutdown said:

And I'm not sure what your scoring is, but in ESPN standard league Keenum is a top 10 QB (9).

He's also almost certain to be benched within the next two weeks, if not the next two days.

Dropped Cam for KAllen (over Minshew/Rudolph). I think Carolina has better weapons than Jax/Pitt, plus the latter two seem intent on keeping the training wheels on their QBs. But my plan is to start Jones until he proves otherwise.

1 hour ago, Ray_T said:

if he plays, he will look like he did in week 1 and week 2.

If he looks like he did in Weeks 1-2, he ain't playing. No need to rush him back unless he's at full health

[Ray_T 587]

6 hours ago, zftcg said:

If he looks like he did in Weeks 1-2, he ain't playing. No need to rush him back unless he's at full health

for sure.   

you cant have him playing like  that.    He's not helping the team in that scenario.

But I have seen teams do things far more stupid than this

[GobbleDog 815]

I was wrong about Cam - thought he'd have a big year.  Feels like a career is ending before our eyes. 

Cam's kryptonite.... foot injuries. 

[vino 21]

Without reading everyone's comments, I haven't seen him dropped in 4 of my leagues, though I hold him in 2. I'm not sure who's on your ww to replace, so it's hard to answer.  So, for me, that sums it up, I would drop him if the right QB was available. I'm def not all in our Cam like I used to be, with his inability to run this year. I'm holding onto him but I'm also looking to drop or trade him if the right QB is there.  He's not a must own.