WaPo: US billionaires paid a lower effective tax rate than the lowest 50% in 2018

[MDC 5,877]

Study found the 400 richest families in the US paid an effective tax rate of a little more than a 1% lower than the bottom 50% of households.

The study includes sales / consumption taxes and indirect taxes on necessities like car registrations etc., which tend to be regressive. 

 

[TimmySmith 2,782]

2 minutes ago, MDC said:

Study found the 400 richest families in the US paid an effective tax rate of a little more than a 1% lower than the bottom 50% of households.

The study includes sales / consumption taxes and indirect taxes on necessities like car registrations etc., which tend to be regressive. 

 

I agree with the WaPo that sales taxes and car registrations are too high. 

[IGotWorms 3,300]

I’m not worried, Trump’s looking out for the little guy

[edjr 5,547]

didn't pay a lower one that me.

[Gladiators 1,903]

Says right in the article that the analysis isn't accurate.  

[TBayXXXVII 2,106]

"“The Triumph of Injustice,” by economists Emmanuel Saez and Gabriel Zucman of the University of California at Berkeley" = 0.0% credibility.

[Alias Detective 1,179]

Blame these 400 richest people.

https://www.forbes.com/forbes-400/#71fdf4067e2f

[Intense Observer 344]

2 hours ago, Gladiators said:

Says right in the article that the analysis isn't accurate.  

On the question of tax burden, Jason Furman, an economics professor at Harvard who chaired the White House Council of Economic Advisers under President Barack Obama, noted that Saez and Zucman did not include refundable tax credits, such as the earned-income tax credit (EITC), in their analysis.

The credit, which is intended to encourage low-income families to work, “is part of the tax code,” Furman said. A person who paid $1,000 in federal income taxes and then received a $1,500 credit would have a total federal tax burden of -$500, but Furman said that under Saez and Zucman’s analysis, that person would instead show a burden of $0. That result would make total tax burdens at the lower end of the income spectrum appear higher than they are.

[Cdub100 3,366]

Man that's a lot of Jews why is that?

[Reality 2,710]

2 hours ago, Intense Observer said:

On the question of tax burden, Jason Furman, an economics professor at Harvard who chaired the White House Council of Economic Advisers under President Barack Obama, noted that Saez and Zucman did not include refundable tax credits, such as the earned-income tax credit (EITC), in their analysis.

The credit, which is intended to encourage low-income families to work, “is part of the tax code,” Furman said. A person who paid $1,000 in federal income taxes and then received a $1,500 credit would have a total federal tax burden of -$500, but Furman said that under Saez and Zucman’s analysis, that person would instead show a burden of $0. That result would make total tax burdens at the lower end of the income spectrum appear higher than they are.

Good Lord.

[RaiderHaters Revenge 3,566]

how on earth can you include sales tax as part of a % they pay

lets see a guy making 1 billion goes and spends 300k on "stuff" annually his sales tax is such a minute %, compared to the guy who buys 15k of "stuff" on his 60k a year job

the whole first sentence eliminated this article completely

and car registration is not a tax, and it is solely dependant on the car you drive.  My 60k truck registration is a larger part of my income than billionaires registration on a 200k car

 

 

[Gladiators 1,903]

1 minute ago, RaiderHaters Revenge said:

how on earth can you include sales tax as part of a % they pay

lets see a guy making 1 billion goes and spends 300k on "stuff" annually his sales tax is such a minute %, compared to the guy who buys 15k of "stuff" on his 60k a year job

the whole first sentence eliminated this article completely

 

They’re socialist advocates.

[Hardcore troubadour 12,588]

This is the dumbest OP ever.  You have to be a moron to use this article as some sort of way to make your point. 

[jerryskids 5,169]

If I were a liberal I'd want to raise taxes on those evil rich folks, because that has been so successful the previous 3749029107 times. 

Also, we don't tax wealth, we tax income.

[EternalShinyAndChrome 2,493]

36 minutes ago, jerryskids said:

If I were a liberal I'd want to raise taxes on those evil rich folks, because that has been so successful the previous 3749029107 times. 

Also, we don't tax wealth, we tax income.

Which is funny, because most of those top 400 evil rich folks are liberals/leftists.  Liberals aren't talking about themselves when they say "tax the rich".

[Bert 1,087]

Did it say what % of total tax collected was paid by the top 400 "richest families"?

[Bert 1,087]

On 10/9/2019 at 1:04 PM, MDC said:

Study found the 400 richest families in the US paid an effective tax rate of a little more than a 1% lower than the bottom 50% of households.

The study includes sales / consumption taxes and indirect taxes on necessities like car registrations etc., which tend to be regressive. 

 

Aren't the services paid for by those taxes also regressive?  

[edjr 5,547]

19 hours ago, jerryskids said:

If I were a liberal I'd want to raise taxes on those evil rich folks, because that has been so successful the previous 3749029107 times. 

Also, we don't tax wealth, we tax income.

How much do does a person need to make in a year? honestly.

[drobeski 3,061]

What was the number in say, 2011 ?

[JustinCharge 2,397]

1 hour ago, edjr said:

How much do does a person need to make in a year? honestly.

Inflation can take off at any time because scarcity can occur at any time due to natural disasters or trade wars etc.

[Strike 3,948]

1 hour ago, edjr said:

How much do does a person need to make in a year? honestly.

Define need.

[RaiderHaters Revenge 3,566]

11 hours ago, edjr said:

How much do does a person need to make in a year? honestly.

the simple answer

as much as they can

them making as much as they can, doesnt change a damn thing in yours or my life, and doesn't affect either of us from making as much as we can

 

[JustinCharge 2,397]

https://img-9gag-fun.9cache.com/photo/am52956_700b.jpg

[cbfalcon 824]

On 10/9/2019 at 6:18 PM, RaiderHaters Revenge said:

how on earth can you include sales tax as part of a % they pay

lets see a guy making 1 billion goes and spends 300k on "stuff" annually his sales tax is such a minute %, compared to the guy who buys 15k of "stuff" on his 60k a year job

the whole first sentence eliminated this article completely

and car registration is not a tax, and it is solely dependant on the car you drive.  My 60k truck registration is a larger part of my income than billionaires registration on a 200k car

 

 

Maybe I’m drunk, but I think I’m missing something. If a guy makes $1B and spends $300k on “stuff”, he is only paying that low tax % on like 1/3000 of what he is being taxed on. Whereas your $60k guy that buys $15k of “stuff” is paying the low tax % on 20% of what he is being taxed on. 

Or am I missing a definition or something?

[sderk 1,040]

On 10/10/2019 at 3:31 PM, edjr said:

How much do does a person need to make in a year? honestly.

Should a person only be allowed to keep exactly what they need to live on and not a penny more? Basic food and shelter? The rest of their hard earned money should be passed along to someone else? Guess what happens to people's motivation to work and create new businesses if that were the case. Hell, there's already a death tax in place. 

[EternalShinyAndChrome 2,493]

12 minutes ago, sderk said:

Should a person only be allowed to keep exactly what they need to live on and not a penny more? Basic food and shelter? The rest of their hard earned money should be passed along to someone else? Guess what happens to people's motivation to work and create new businesses if that were the case. Hell, there's already a death tax in place. 

All we have to do is look back in the history of the world to find out EXACTLY what has happened.  In the 20th century alone, those who supposedly enforced "the common good" have a current body count of about 100+ million and counting.

[RaiderHaters Revenge 3,566]

1 hour ago, cbfalcon said:

Maybe I’m drunk, but I think I’m missing something. If a guy makes $1B and spends $300k on “stuff”, he is only paying that low tax % on like 1/3000 of what he is being taxed on. Whereas your $60k guy that buys $15k of “stuff” is paying the low tax % on 20% of what he is being taxed on. 

Or am I missing a definition or something?

That’s what I’m saying the article is skewed to say rich people pay less in taxes cause they are including sales tax. If everyone pays 20%. The guy making less is going to move the needle more

[cbfalcon 824]

1 minute ago, RaiderHaters Revenge said:

That’s what I’m saying the article is skewed to say rich people pay less in taxes cause they are including sales tax

I admittedly didn’t read it, but isn’t the article about tax “rate”?

Including sales tax, which is obviously taxed at a much lower rate than income, would disproportionately lower poor peoples overall “rate” more, as they spend a much higher percentage of their income than the rich....unless I’m misunderstanding something. 

[RaiderHaters Revenge 3,566]

7 minutes ago, cbfalcon said:

I admittedly didn’t read it, but isn’t the article about tax “rate”?

Including sales tax, which is obviously taxed at a much lower rate than income, would disproportionately lower poor peoples overall “rate” more, as they spend a much higher percentage of their income than the rich....unless I’m misunderstanding something. 

yes the point is its supposed to be an article about bad rich people, it would have been a better article had it excluded sales tax, like why dont they write an article about how much poor californians pay in taxes vs rich oregonians (no sales tax)

sales tax is pretty close to voluntary, you dont need to spend money on garbage if you dont have extra money

 

[sderk 1,040]

The rich buy more, then they pay more into the sales tax. What is tough about that? If they spend less, they pass less.

[RaiderHaters Revenge 3,566]

Just now, sderk said:

The rich buy more, then they pay more into the sales tax. What is tough about that?

but they should pay more even, cause they have more so sales tax on rich should be like 100% at least

 

[sderk 1,040]

Just now, RaiderHaters Revenge said:

but they should pay more even, cause they have more so sales tax on rich should be like 100% at least

 

So you are trying to de-incentivize people to wanting to make more money in life?

[RaiderHaters Revenge 3,566]

38 minutes ago, sderk said:

So you are trying to de-incentivize people to wanting to make more money in life?

learn your sides bro, obviously sarcasm

 

[sderk 1,040]

Just now, RaiderHaters Revenge said:

learn your sides bro, obviously sarcasm

 

Ahh, I did not read it that way. But then again, some people actually think that way. I am so confused with all the socialists and the trannys and the tranny mother want-be's for their kids. I'm lost anymore.

[IGotWorms 3,300]

G0ddamn some of you people are thick as molasses. And it’s always the same folks on the same “side.”

As a government you pick how and to what extent to tax people. All of them have value judgments and ramifications.
If you go with a progressive income tax then rich people are paying more, and as well they should.

If you go with a property tax then people with larger/more expensive homes and properties are paying more, so again the rich but that’s also a bit dangerous because the largest asset most middle class folks have is their home, so you’re hitting them as well (albeit not to the same extent).

If you go with an estate tax that only kicks in above a certain value then hooray! you’re only taxing the wealthiest individuals. And the person who will be receiving the estate inheritance hasn’t personally done jack sh1t to earn it. So yes this is definitely one of the best taxes and in my opinion we ought to lower the ceiling that Trump lifted as a huge gift to his rich friends and also make the rate like 70%.

But, if you go with a sales tax, it applies to everyone and at the same rate. There is a certain amount basically everyone has to spend on the necessities of life and we’re all being taxed on that equally regardless of how filthy rich or terribly poor we might be. Ah but the rich spend more! True but only to really a pretty minimal extent in the grand scheme of things. Generally they don’t spend all those excess millions and billions, they hoard it in trusts and so forth. Where, obviously, no sales tax is incurred. At most maybe they end up paying some property taxes or capital gains taxes at much much lower rates though often they manage to avoid even that. This is why sales tax is one of the most regressive forms of taxation.

So yeah, you gotta look at all forms and rates of taxation and you can’t ignore the most regressive forms just because you don’t care for the outcome. Bottom line the rich are making out like focking bandits and have been since at least the 80s—it just gets worse and worse every passing decade. Meanwhile the middle class is squeezed to death. The rich aren’t paying high taxes because they’ve bought the politicians and brainwashed the people. The poor aren’t paying much in taxes because they simply don’t have it. So who does that leave? That’s right, everyday folks like you and me constantly getting worked over more and more with each passing year.

[KSB2424 3,082]

I’ve always though if we just severely simplified the tax code it’d stop loopholes and tax havens.

[sderk 1,040]

44 minutes ago, IGotWorms said:

f you go with a progressive income tax then rich people are paying more, and as well they should

Why?

Why do you always have to hate people who work hard and smart and earn more than you do?

 

[Baker Boy 1,477]

Yet their rates were even lower under Obama.

[Baker Boy 1,477]

1 hour ago, IGotWorms said:

G0ddamn some of you people are thick as molasses. And it’s always the same folks on the same “side.”

As a government you pick how and to what extent to tax people. All of them have value judgments and ramifications.
If you go with a progressive income tax then rich people are paying more, and as well they should.

If you go with a property tax then people with larger/more expensive homes and properties are paying more, so again the rich but that’s also a bit dangerous because the largest asset most middle class folks have is their home, so you’re hitting them as well (albeit not to the same extent).

If you go with an estate tax that only kicks in above a certain value then hooray! you’re only taxing the wealthiest individuals. And the person who will be receiving the estate inheritance hasn’t personally done jack sh1t to earn it. So yes this is definitely one of the best taxes and in my opinion we ought to lower the ceiling that Trump lifted as a huge gift to his rich friends and also make the rate like 70%.

But, if you go with a sales tax, it applies to everyone and at the same rate. There is a certain amount basically everyone has to spend on the necessities of life and we’re all being taxed on that equally regardless of how filthy rich or terribly poor we might be. Ah but the rich spend more! True but only to really a pretty minimal extent in the grand scheme of things. Generally they don’t spend all those excess millions and billions, they hoard it in trusts and so forth. Where, obviously, no sales tax is incurred. At most maybe they end up paying some property taxes or capital gains taxes at much much lower rates though often they manage to avoid even that. This is why sales tax is one of the most regressive forms of taxation.

So yeah, you gotta look at all forms and rates of taxation and you can’t ignore the most regressive forms just because you don’t care for the outcome. Bottom line the rich are making out like focking bandits and have been since at least the 80s—it just gets worse and worse every passing decade. Meanwhile the middle class is squeezed to death. The rich aren’t paying high taxes because they’ve bought the politicians and brainwashed the people. The poor aren’t paying much in taxes because they simply don’t have it. So who does that leave? That’s right, everyday folks like you and me constantly getting worked over more and more with each passing year.

Here is the problem, there is plenty of money but it is how the government spends/wastes our money. If we would eliminate corruption and waste we would be running a surplus.

[IGotWorms 3,300]

21 minutes ago, sderk said:

Why?

Why do you always have to hate people who work hard and smart and earn more than you do?

 

Well there are many reasons such as they disproportionately use and benefit from all the advantages of this nation. But let’s focus on this idea that wealth=virtue. Where does that come from? Why would that be true? To say nothing of the fact that your assumptions are mostly false—generally the wealthy got there by starting off rich. It takes money to make money. Sure every now and then there’s a self-made rich guy but for the most part these are just snot nosed people born with a silver spoon in their mouth