Ft. Worth PD, shoot and kill woman in her home.

[Cruzer 1,992]

Body cam video has been released...... I don't know the full details of the story yet, but it doesn't look good.

Officers called to a home for a welfare check, never identify themselves as Police, shoot her from the outside/thru a window/in her home - dead... Very sad ending.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/texas-police-officer-shoots-woman-death-inside-her-home-n1065451

[Fireballer 2,369]

Bad deal.  The cop is gonna go down.

[TimmySmith 2,782]

Texas police certainly shoot first. 

[Strike 3,951]

This is pretty bad.  I just don't get how a cop can be so cavalier in their use of a deadly weapon.  Some of them seem to have a shoot, ask questions later mentality which is the exact opposite of the attitude they should have. 

[Hardcore troubadour 12,596]

This one doesn't sound good. The anti-police crowd should learn to wait for actual bad shootings like this (possibly) to jump up and down about. Not ones like Garner and Ferguson.  Which were complete BS. 

[IGotWorms 3,302]

Jesus what a monumental fockup with tragic results. Cop should be fired, no question, if he hasn’t been already. Probably prosecuted which is too bad for him but this just sounds totally unjustifiable.

I mean what were they doing even entering the property in the first place? As I understand they snuck through a back gate? All because a couple doors were supposedly ajar (which can’t be that unusual in focking Texas). Those aren’t exigent circumstances. You can’t just sneak onto somebody’s property with no warrant and for no immediate reason.

Just a really, really bad and illegal act all around from what I can tell. Of course this is all based on early reports which seem pretty solid (people have seen the body cam footage) but maybe something more comes out.

[Fireballer 2,369]

It 

5 minutes ago, IGotWorms said:

Jesus what a monumental fockup with tragic results. Cop should be fired, no question, if he hasn’t been already. Probably prosecuted which is too bad for him but this just sounds totally unjustifiable.

I mean what were they doing even entering the property in the first place? As I understand they snuck through a back gate? All because a couple doors were supposedly ajar (which can’t be that unusual in focking Texas). Those aren’t exigent circumstances. You can’t just sneak onto somebody’s property with no warrant and for no immediate reason.

Just a really, really bad and illegal act all around from what I can tell. Of course this is all based on early reports which seem pretty solid (people have seen the body cam footage) but maybe something more comes out.

It was for a welfare check.  Call was from neighbor.

[IGotWorms 3,302]

1 minute ago, Fireballer said:

It 

It was for a welfare check.  Call was from neighbor.

Yeah but you can’t sneak in like Rambo or something. You go up and knock on the front door like anyone else. Albeit perhaps very carefully if you think something may be afoot.

[Filthy Fernadez 2,696]

6 minutes ago, IGotWorms said:

Jesus what a monumental fockup with tragic results. Cop should be fired, no question, if he hasn’t been already. Probably prosecuted which is too bad for him but this just sounds totally unjustifiable.

I mean what were they doing even entering the property in the first place? As I understand they snuck through a back gate? All because a couple doors were supposedly ajar (which can’t be that unusual in focking Texas). Those aren’t exigent circumstances. You can’t just sneak onto somebody’s property with no warrant and for no immediate reason.

Just a really, really bad and illegal act all around from what I can tell. Of course this is all based on early reports which seem pretty solid (people have seen the body cam footage) but maybe something more comes out.

I've said it before; we need to pay cops a lot more to get a better crop of them. Ones that aren't scared sh!tless, undersized, etc. 

That they were doing a welfare check and this guy shot through a window without being able to identify her as a threat tells us this guy probably should have never been hired as a cop. 

[Strike 3,951]

1 minute ago, Filthy Fernadez said:

I've said it before; we need to pay cops a lot more to get a better crop of them. Ones that aren't scared sh!tless, undersized, etc. 

That they were doing a welfare check and this guy shot through a window without being able to identify her as a threat tells us this guy probably should have never been hired as a cop. 

I don't think money is the reason cops act stupid. 

[Fireballer 2,369]

6 minutes ago, IGotWorms said:

Yeah but you can’t sneak in like Rambo or something. You go up and knock on the front door like anyone else. Albeit perhaps very carefully if you think something may be afoot.

 I was just adding context to your post.  Im sure Texor is the same as my state where a welfare call and open doors would have been a community caretaker exigency. But yes, in those instances you make sure you announce who you are and your intent.   

[fandandy 3,311]

Focking nosy neighbors.  

[Filthy Fernadez 2,696]

2 minutes ago, Strike said:

I don't think money is the reason cops act stupid. 

The money draws more people to a field then you weed the bad ones out by psychological testing.

[Hardcore troubadour 12,596]

Raise the standards for hiring that libtards demanded be lowered because diversity. You can still have diversity, just get the right people. 

[IGotWorms 3,302]

47 minutes ago, Fireballer said:

 I was just adding context to your post.  Im sure Texor is the same as my state where a welfare call and open doors would have been a community caretaker exigency. But yes, in those instances you make sure you announce who you are and your intent.   

I’m admittedly behind in my criminal law but I don’t believe community caretaker is exigent circumstances to search a home. It applies to vehicles where you can search an abandoned vehicle before towing or something like that. Doesn’t mean you can just barge into a house (or “curtilage” of the house) without a warrant. For that you need something more like seeing or hearing someone being actively killed or maimed. Is my understanding at least.

[Strike 3,951]

2 minutes ago, IGotWorms said:

I’m admittedly behind in my criminal law but I don’t believe community caretaker is exigent circumstances to search a home. It applies to vehicles where you can search an abandoned vehicle before towing or something like that. Doesn’t mean you can just barge into a house (or “curtilage” of the house) without a warrant. For that you need something more like seeing or hearing someone being actively killed or maimed. Is my understanding at least.

FYP.  Look, the cops didn't randomly go to this house.  They were called there by a neighbor due to concerns he had.  He says the front door was open and lights were on and it was 2:00 in the morning and that wasn't normal for them.  So I can understand the cop being concerned that something might be going on and I don't think it's unreasonable for him to walk around the house to scope things out.  What is unreasonable is the cop not announcing him/herself, seeing a threat that didn't exist, and shooting.  Much like Amber Guyger, this person needs to be prosecuted criminally.  I'm just concerned that they will be given too much benefit of the doubt because they were on duty, unlike Amber.

[IGotWorms 3,302]

1 hour ago, Strike said:

FYP.  Look, the cops didn't randomly go to this house.  They were called there by a neighbor due to concerns he had.  He says the front door was open and lights were on and it was 2:00 in the morning and that wasn't normal for them.  So I can understand the cop being concerned that something might be going on and I don't think it's unreasonable for him to walk around the house to scope things out.  What is unreasonable is the cop not announcing him/herself, seeing a threat that didn't exist, and shooting.  Much like Amber Guyger, this person needs to be prosecuted criminally.  I'm just concerned that they will be given too much benefit of the doubt because they were on duty, unlike Amber.

All true but once you enter the curtilage of the home, which it sounds like this guy did, you must have a warrant or exigent circumstances, which it sounds like he did not. Of course, I wasn’t there and so these are all suppositions based on the reports we have thus far.

[Fireballer 2,369]

1 hour ago, IGotWorms said:

I’m admittedly behind in my criminal law but I don’t believe community caretaker is exigent circumstances to search a home. It applies to vehicles where you can search an abandoned vehicle before towing or something like that. Doesn’t mean you can just barge into a house (or “curtilage” of the house) without a warrant. For that you need something more like seeing or hearing someone being actively killed or maimed. Is my understanding at least.

CC (comm caretaker) does apply in those instances you cited, as well as entering the curtlidge for a welfare check if the totality of info makes it reasonable that there could be a problem.  Based a a neighbors call in good faith coupled with the open doors, I would personally pull the trigger (no pun intended) on a warrentless search. The threshold for this is much lower than PC.  

But, the Constitution assumes all searches are unconstitutional.  Law enforcement bares the burden to overcome that with an exemption. 4th amendment stuff can get quirky.  It may be that only a man in a black robe will deem it legal or not.

[Hardcore troubadour 12,596]

3 minutes ago, IGotWorms said:

All true but once you enter the curtilage of the home, which it sounds like this guy did, you must have a warrant or exigent circumstances, which it sounds like he did not. Of course, I wasn’t there and so these are all suppositions based on the reports we have thus far.

He clearly had a right to enter the curtilage. Stop 

[Strike 3,951]

2 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

He clearly had a right to enter the curtilage. Stop 

Don't mind Worms.  It's not like he works in the legal profession.

[IGotWorms 3,302]

3 minutes ago, Fireballer said:

CC (comm caretaker) does apply in those instances you cited, as well as entering the curtlidge for a welfare check if the totality of info makes it reasonable that there could be a problem.  Based a a neighbors call in good faith coupled with the open doors, I would personally pull the trigger (no pun intended) on a warrentless search. The threshold for this is much lower than PC.  

But, the Constitution assumes all searches are unconstitutional.  Law enforcement bares the burden to overcome that with an exemption. 4th amendment stuff can get quirky.  It may be that only a man in a black robe will deem it legal or not.

I’ve dealt with a few cases in somewhat similar circumstances though not ending in a shooting. Like I said it’s been a few years so I wouldn’t hold myself out as an expert in the area, but with that said I doubt this would hold up as a lawful entry into the property even separate and apart from the use of deadly force. Focked up all around 

[Patriotsfatboy1 1,432]

Cop resigned.  No need to fire him.  My guess is that charges are forthcoming.

[Strike 3,951]

3 minutes ago, Patriotsfatboy1 said:

Cop resigned.  No need to fire him.  My guess is that charges are forthcoming.

To expand on this:

 

Quote

The Fort Worth officer who shot and killed Atatiana Jefferson in her home while responding to a welfare check has resigned from the department before he could be fired, officials said.

Quote

At a news conference Monday afternoon, Interim Police Chief Ed Kraus identified the officer as Aaron Dean. Kraus said Dean was going to be fired Monday morning, but the officer turned in his resignation before he could do so.

 

 

Quote

In an update Sunday, police said the officers responding to the call didn’t park their marked cars in front of the house nor did they identity themselves as officers at any time.

https://dfw.cbslocal.com/2019/10/14/fort-worth-officer-aaron-dean-resigns-after-killing-atatiana-jefferson/

[Fireballer 2,369]

27 minutes ago, IGotWorms said:

I’ve dealt with a few cases in somewhat similar circumstances though not ending in a shooting. Like I said it’s been a few years so I wouldn’t hold myself out as an expert in the area, but with that said I doubt this would hold up as a lawful entry into the property even separate and apart from the use of deadly force. Focked up all around 

Keep in mind, CC is predominately thought to be outside of a LEOs traditional law enforcement duties.  Hence the "caretaker" element.   We're not talking about entering suspecting that something criminal is necessarily afoot. If a warrant was needed for these entries, I dont know of any magistrate that would give you a warrant.  Theres no PC.  Theres not even reasonable suspicion theres a  crime.  You really have zero to work off of except the CC exemption.   But as I said earlier, the 4th is a slippery slope, especially homes.  You would have to articulate the reasonable  concern that someone is in imminent danger and your entry is outside your traditional law enforcement duties.  

[Patriotsfatboy1 1,432]

2 hours ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

Raise the standards for hiring that libtards demanded be lowered because diversity. You can still have diversity, just get the right people. 

I thought that this cop was a white male.  Shouldn't he have had appropriate credentials since he is not in a protected class?

[Hardcore troubadour 12,596]

1 minute ago, Patriotsfatboy1 said:

I thought that this cop was a white male.  Shouldn't he have had appropriate credentials since he is not in a protected class?

The standards are the same for everyone. So it would reason that substandard white males would get hired as well. 

[Patriotsfatboy1 1,432]

27 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

The standards are the same for everyone. So it would reason that substandard white males would get hired as well. 

I thought they lowered the standards to allow minorities and women in.  Did they just lower the standards across the board and decide to do a shitty job in picking the best ones?

[KSB2424 3,082]

3 hours ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

Raise the standards for hiring that libtards demanded be lowered because diversity. You can still have diversity, just get the right people. 

Nobody wants to go into law enforcement anymore in this climate.  The standards will more than likely have to be lowered to fill positions.

[Hardcore troubadour 12,596]

5 minutes ago, Patriotsfatboy1 said:

I thought they lowered the standards to allow minorities and women in.  Did they just lower the standards across the board and decide to do a shitty job in picking the best ones?

They did. I'll say it again: if you lower the standards, you lower them for everyone. If everyone gets a 90, and everyone can pass the easy physical, and they don't disqualify based on background checks, then it just becomes a matter of who gets in line first. Seeing as most applicants are still white males, you end up with substandard white males too. 

[Mike Honcho 4,010]

 

Quote

 

Former Fort Worth police officer charged with murder for killing Atatiana Jefferson in her own home

The former Fort Worth police officer who fatally shot Atatiana Jefferson in her home Saturday morning was arrested and charged with murder Monday, police said.

The officer, identified as Aaron Dean, is being held in the Tarrant County Jail, the Fort Worth Police Department wrote on Twitter.

"The family of Atatiana Jefferson is relieved that Aaron Dean has been arrested & charged with murder," Lee Merritt, an attorney for Jefferson's family, said in a statement.

"We need to see this through to a vigorous prosecution & appropriate sentencing. The City of Fort Worth has much work to do to reform a brutal culture of policing."

 

Wow---moving fast.

[titans&bucs&bearsohmy! 2,745]

4 hours ago, Mike Honcho said:

 

Wow---moving fast.

Aaron Dean. Sounds white. Killed Atatiana Jefferson. Sounds... Not. 

He's going down. Deservedly so it seems. 

There was a case in Nashville years ago where the sheriffs office went to serve a no knock warrant. They went to the wrong address. Guy pulls a gun, as you do when someone busts through your door. They killed him. Oops. 

[sderk 1,040]

12 hours ago, Patriotsfatboy1 said:

Cop resigned.  No need to fire him.  My guess is that charges are forthcoming.

As punishment, he should be given an HK416 assault rifle and forced to be on patrol on the south side of Chicago for the remainder of his career.

[lickin_starfish 1,478]

What did this woman know about the Clintons?

[IGotWorms 3,302]

So apparently she fished a handgun out of her purse upon hearing a prowler in the backyard. Dumbass cop who shouldn’t have been there in the first place thought this was threatening and shot her through the window.

Police chief has publicly apologized

[Hardcore troubadour 12,596]

12 minutes ago, IGotWorms said:

So apparently she fished a handgun out of her purse upon hearing a prowler in the backyard. Dumbass cop who shouldn’t have been there in the first place thought this was threatening and shot her through the window.

Police chief has publicly apologized

And you don't think that's important? And why shouldn't he have been there? 

[IGotWorms 3,302]

5 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

And you don't think that's important? And why shouldn't he have been there? 

Sure it’s important but I don’t think it’s exculpating mostly because he never should’ve been there in the first place. As for why, see the discussion up thread.

[TimmySmith 2,782]

2 minutes ago, IGotWorms said:

Sure it’s important but I don’t think it’s exculpating mostly because he never should’ve been there in the first place. As for why, see the discussion up thread.

What on earth are you talking about? 

[Strike 3,951]

A couple of years ago my Mom actually had the local cops out here do a wellness check on me.  She hadn't heard from me in a while and thought I was ignoring her or something.  Still not sure why she didn't just call but whatever.  Anyways, the local cops came to our front door, rang the doorbell, and asked my GF if I was home.  I went to the front door, they told me why there were there and suggested I call my Mom, and went on their way.  No guns, no one died.  Just seems like an appropriate way to handle a wellness check.  Creeping around someone's backyard in the middle of the night, not parking your POLICE car in front of the house so they might see that you're a cop, and not identifying yourself as one before shooting all seem like a recipe for disaster.  And here we are.

[Hardcore troubadour 12,596]

Where is this wellness check coming from? They were called because a door was wide open at 2 in the morning. Are you guys just telling stories now? This looks bad enough. No embellishment is necessary. 

[Cruzer 1,992]

1 hour ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

Where is this wellness check coming from?

I'm not sure which technical category this call falls under - but several of the news outlets are reporting the call as a welfare check.

I'm sure it's wrong, but that's what many are calling it.