Top 50 Rookies

[jrokh 567]

2 minutes ago, TBayXXXVII said:

I don't watch college football.

Nothing else needs to be said. The defense rests...

[TBayXXXVII 2,107]

5 minutes ago, jrokh said:

Nothing else needs to be said. The defense rests...

LOL

[Utilit99 4,099]

7 hours ago, jrokh said:

Nothing else needs to be said. The defense rests...

Even if you are resting, you lost that battle. Cory Clement? 

[weepaws 2,452]

Mmm I don’t know, he’s played in 31 games in his three seasons , last two ended on injured reserve, but in those 31 games he’s played in he’s totaled, 895 total yards plus he’s scored 8 tds, for a back up undrafted free agent , that’s ok.  

 

[jrokh 567]

6 hours ago, Utilit99 said:

Even if you are resting, you lost that battle. Cory Clement? 

Ignorance is bliss...

[TBayXXXVII 2,107]

On 5/18/2020 at 4:13 AM, weepaws said:

Mmm I don’t know, he’s played in 31 games in his three seasons , last two ended on injured reserve, but in those 31 games he’s played in he’s totaled, 895 total yards plus he’s scored 8 tds, for a back up undrafted free agent , that’s ok.  

 

32 receptions, 895 yards, 8 tds equals 5.5 fantasy points per game.  You gonna start that guy.... ever?

 

Basically 2 full seasons... his average season is 16 receptions, 450 yards, and 4 tds.  What round would you draft that guy in?

[weepaws 2,452]

As it pertains to ff , no he’s not going to start for anyone, but as a undrafted free agent who’s also missed a lot of games, his yardage total and td total isn’t bad for a player of his caliber, as for ff he’s not even worthy of a roster spot, but as a nfl player he’s posted fair numbers for a player that wasn’t even drafted, so not much really was expected. 

Yea I don’t think he’s done that bad for himself, and his numbers would be better if not for the injury’s.  

Good job Clement.  

Thanks 

[TBayXXXVII 2,107]

1 hour ago, weepaws said:

As it pertains to ff , no he’s not going to start for anyone, but as a undrafted free agent who’s also missed a lot of games, his yardage total and td total isn’t bad for a player of his caliber, as for ff he’s not even worthy of a roster spot, but as a nfl player he’s posted fair numbers for a player that wasn’t even drafted, so not much really was expected. 

Yea I don’t think he’s done that bad for himself, and his numbers would be better if not for the injury’s.  

Good job Clement.  

Thanks 

Sure, he's done nice for himself... but this is a fantasy football topic.  If you want to use a player to justify a stance on fantasy football, the player should be good for fantasy purposes.

[jrokh 567]

56 minutes ago, TBayXXXVII said:

Sure, he's done nice for himself... but this is a fantasy football topic.  If you want to use a player to justify a stance on fantasy football, the player should be good for fantasy purposes.

Normally that is true, but A) it's the offseason (during a lockdown)

b) more importantly, you yourself made it about something other than fantasy when you said you didn't trust Jonathan Taylor because he played his college ball at Wisconsin. By doing that, you opened the door for arguments that supported or negated that opinion. Cory Clement played at Wisconsin, he far exceeded his draft position. Thus his playing at Wisconsin didn't seem to affect his pro prospects adversely, in fact quite the opposite. Same thing for James White. Your side of the debate would point to Montee Ball and Ron Dayne as players who underachieved relative to their draft position/expectations. So as you can see, based on the artificial criteria you yourself created, Corey Clement is relevant to this particular debate. To quote some grandpa in Reno 'thanks m, always a pleasure'.

[AxeElf 787]

On 5/13/2020 at 2:15 PM, AxeElf said:

The way Rivers used Ekeler in California, Hines may axually be the Colt RB to own this season (at least in PPR).

Source: The Indianapolis Star - Joel A. Erickson

"Indianapolis Colts RB Nyheim Hines will be involved in the passing game and could catch as many as 10 passes in a game this upcoming season, according to head coach Frank Reich."

With Hines staring at 160 receptions this season, I'd say Axe Elf was right again.

[jrokh 567]

Just now, AxeElf said:

Source: The Indianapolis Star - Joel A. Erickson

"Indianapolis Colts RB Nyheim Hines will be involved in the passing game and could catch as many as 10 passes in a game this upcoming season, according to head coach Frank Reich."

With Hines staring at 160 receptions this season, I'd say Axe Elf was right again.

In these weird times anything that gives me a chuckle is worth acknowledging. So hats off to you for this one brief moment...

[weepaws 2,452]

12 hours ago, TBayXXXVII said:

Sure, he's done nice for himself... but this is a fantasy football topic.  If you want to use a player to justify a stance on fantasy football, the player should be good for fantasy purposes.

Yeap I would agree. 

But I’ll say it once again. He’s done a good job for a undrafted player. 

Plus he hasn’t been able to stay healthy, I think of a player named Guice of the Redskins, he hasn’t stayed healthy either put he’s ranked as a low rb2 , high rb3 on the ff calculator, but yet was he done ? 

So the point being made is, I agree that he’s not a value for ff , but I still think he’s notched out a good career so far for a undrafted player.  

I like going back and forth with you on every single topic, your a class person, Thanks. 

[weepaws 2,452]

12 hours ago, jrokh said:

Normally that is true, but A) it's the offseason (during a lockdown)

b) more importantly, you yourself made it about something other than fantasy when you said you didn't trust Jonathan Taylor because he played his college ball at Wisconsin. By doing that, you opened the door for arguments that supported or negated that opinion. Cory Clement played at Wisconsin, he far exceeded his draft position. Thus his playing at Wisconsin didn't seem to affect his pro prospects adversely, in fact quite the opposite. Same thing for James White. Your side of the debate would point to Montee Ball and Ron Dayne as players who underachieved relative to their draft position/expectations. So as you can see, based on the artificial criteria you yourself created, Corey Clement is relevant to this particular debate. To quote some grandpa in Reno 'thanks m, always a pleasure'.

Lol

[TBayXXXVII 2,107]

11 hours ago, weepaws said:

Yeap I would agree. 

But I’ll say it once again. He’s done a good job for a undrafted player. 

Plus he hasn’t been able to stay healthy, I think of a player named Guice of the Redskins, he hasn’t stayed healthy either put he’s ranked as a low rb2 , high rb3 on the ff calculator, but yet was he done ? 

So the point being made is, I agree that he’s not a value for ff , but I still think he’s notched out a good career so far for a undrafted player.  

I like going back and forth with you on every single topic, your a class person, Thanks. 

Yeah, he's done well, but there's a lot of players who were drafted late or even undrafted that have "done well".  That doesn't make them fantasy relevant though.  This is a fantasy football message board where the thread is about drafting players who are fantasy relevant.  I didn't think certain things needed to be spelled out.  Apparently other people do... not you per se.

 

Guice has been injury prone.  I had him in the same category as I had Todd  Gurley.  When guys get torn ACL's in college, I'm always very leery of them.  I'm not taking them in a dynasty league at all and when it comes to a re-draft, they need to prove to me that they can do it for 2 full seasons.  Guys with torn ACL's can have a great season, then never again.  Guice is a guy that I would take very late in the draft, a lottery ticket kind of guy.  I'm thinking like, round 12 or something.

[polecatt 399]

On 5/17/2020 at 11:21 AM, Frozenbeernuts said:

I dont see any way I would take Juedy or Lamb ahead of Taylor. Taylor is in such a great spot, and he looks like Saquon Barkley. Why did Barkley have so much more hype than Taylor? Is it just the fumbles? That's about the most fixable thing in the nfl. Behind a stud offensive line, and inferior other running backs, the guy is on a great spot.

Lamb has Cooper ahead of him with another solid receiver in Gallup to compete with. Juedy has Sutton, Fant, Hamler, and his coach is more of a run first coach. 

Im not saying Lamb or Juedy are poor options, but a stud running back is more important in dynasty. 

I have to think a big part if, Barkley was what? The 2nd overall pick? Taylor was a 2nd round pick, and has Marlon Mack to compete with. I don't know exactly why, maybe it's the fumbles but the NFL scouts think Barkley was a much better value.

As for dynasty, I think a potential stud WR is of better value. Jeudy or Lamb can potentially lockdown a roster spot for 7-8 years if not more. Those two guys are as close as it comes to reliably becoming a DeAndre Hopkins, or Michael Thomas. A guy like Taylor is just not nearly as reliable long term. They're all rookies so, you never know but the chance to get a stud WR is one that's tough to pass up. Chances are none of them are more than a fill in this season. I'm not saying Taylor is a bad pick by any means, he just has a lot of competition this season.

[weepaws 2,452]

55 minutes ago, TBayXXXVII said:

Yeah, he's done well, but there's a lot of players who were drafted late or even undrafted that have "done well".  That doesn't make them fantasy relevant though.  This is a fantasy football message board where the thread is about drafting players who are fantasy relevant.  I didn't think certain things needed to be spelled out.  Apparently other people do... not you per se.

 

Guice has been injury prone.  I had him in the same category as I had Todd  Gurley.  When guys get torn ACL's in college, I'm always very leery of them.  I'm not taking them in a dynasty league at all and when it comes to a re-draft, they need to prove to me that they can do it for 2 full seasons.  Guys with torn ACL's can have a great season, then never again.  Guice is a guy that I would take very late in the draft, a lottery ticket kind of guy.  I'm thinking like, round 12 or something.

I didn’t have him in the same class as Gurley, I think and thought Gurley was a much better player.  Even with the injury problem in his college football days   

Gurley as been in the nfl since 2015, and in non ppr, has been worst then a rb1 only once, and he was the top rb if ff back to back seasons in 17 and 18.  

I think things might have been different for Clement if he had been able to stay healthy, like Guice, and sometimes it simply comes down to placement , we know the Bucs have had a need for a rb for sometime, and I think a healthy Clement could have filled that role as their rb1.  

But hey it’s all good. 

Thanks for the reply 

[weepaws 2,452]

25 minutes ago, polecatt said:

I have to think a big part if, Barkley was what? The 2nd overall pick? Taylor was a 2nd round pick, and has Marlon Mack to compete with. I don't know exactly why, maybe it's the fumbles but the NFL scouts think Barkley was a much better value.

As for dynasty, I think a potential stud WR is of better value. Jeudy or Lamb can potentially lockdown a roster spot for 7-8 years if not more. Those two guys are as close as it comes to reliably becoming a DeAndre Hopkins, or Michael Thomas. A guy like Taylor is just not nearly as reliable long term. They're all rookies so, you never know but the chance to get a stud WR is one that's tough to pass up. Chances are none of them are more than a fill in this season. I'm not saying Taylor is a bad pick by any means, he just has a lot of competition this season.

Yeah I don’t think Taylor is in a great spot, I agree, I think Mack and Hines won’t just do nothing.  

Having a rough time moving Taylor up from being a low rb2.  

I think Mack is a good player, not the same talent as Taylor and Hines is going to be sharp in the passing game, Rivers likes his Rbs in the passing game, so I don’t see Taylor being worthy of more then a low rb2.  

In smaller leagues maybe even a rb3.  

In a 14 ream non ppr myself. 

Thanks. 

[TBayXXXVII 2,107]

24 minutes ago, weepaws said:

I didn’t have him in the same class as Gurley, I think and thought Gurley was a much better player.  

Gurley as been in the nfl since 2015, and in non ppr, has been worst then a rb1 only once, and he was the top rb if ff back to back seasons in 17 and 18.  

I think things might have been different for Clement if he had been able to stay healthy, like Guice, and sometimes it simply comes down to placement , we know the Bucs have had a need for a rb for sometime, and I think a healthy Clement could have filled that role as their rb1.  

But hey it’s all good. 

Thanks for the reply 

Whether one was a better prospect or not is irrelevant.  They both tore their ACL's prior to the NFL.  That's what I mean by "same category".

 

If Clement does get and stay healthy, then becomes a good player, that would validate my original opinion.  Don't trust Wisconsin RB's.  White validates it already as does Melvin Gordon.  Meaning, don't buy into Wisconsin RB's until AFTER they prove it.  Any person who used a draft pick on Gordon, Clement, or White in their rookie season, did not get a valid return on investment.  Well, Clement might have... if you picked him up off waivers the week before he scored 3 TD's.

[jrokh 567]

7 minutes ago, TBayXXXVII said:

  Meaning, don't buy into Wisconsin RB's until AFTER they prove it.  Any person who used a draft pick on Gordon, Clement, or White in their rookie season, did not get a valid return on investment. 

Do you not see how flawed your argument is? Any RB who doesn't produce for any reason during their rookie year could be tied to the College they attended. Dalvin Cook only 65 FP his rookie year, guess you can't trust RB's from FSU. Derrick Henry only 450 yards rushing and 5 td his rookie year, guess you can't trust Alabama RB's. Joe Mixon 3.5 yards on 178 carries his rookie year, whoops there goes Oklahoma RB's. You have yet to provide ANY evidence that Wisconsin RB's in particular should be less trusted than anywhere else, or at least way less than average. Also the discussion was partially about Dynasty Leagues, which means projecting players beyond their rookie campaigns. By that standard you wouldn't draft any player UNTIL they proved it. Thus you would probably be in last place in a league with that format.

[weepaws 2,452]

1 hour ago, TBayXXXVII said:

Whether one was a better prospect or not is irrelevant.  They both tore their ACL's prior to the NFL.  That's what I mean by "same category".

 

If Clement does get and stay healthy, then becomes a good player, that would validate my original opinion.  Don't trust Wisconsin RB's.  White validates it already as does Melvin Gordon.  Meaning, don't buy into Wisconsin RB's until AFTER they prove it.  Any person who used a draft pick on Gordon, Clement, or White in their rookie season, did not get a valid return on investment.  Well, Clement might have... if you picked him up off waivers the week before he scored 3 TD's.

I do understand what you meant by the same category because of their injuries, but I didn’t.  

I thought Gurley would still be darn good, and he’s been, I didn’t think that about the Guice. 

And Clement did post two good outing in his rookie season in back to back weeks. 

He was the Eagles rb to own at that time, so he was worthy of owning in ff. 

[Raider 84 29]

I love Lamb, but why such a huge leap in the rankings? He moved up 12 spots. Was the previous ranking pre-draft?

[The Football Guru 211]

59 minutes ago, Raider 84 said:

I love Lamb, but why such a huge leap in the rankings? He moved up 12 spots. Was the previous ranking pre-draft?

I'm not sure what you're talking about ... jump from what to what?

[AxeElf 787]

On 5/13/2020 at 2:15 PM, AxeElf said:

...Hines may axually be the Colt RB to own this season (at least in PPR).

 

On 5/19/2020 at 1:57 PM, AxeElf said:

Source: The Indianapolis Star - Joel A. Erickson

"Indianapolis Colts RB Nyheim Hines will be involved in the passing game and could catch as many as 10 passes in a game this upcoming season, according to head coach Frank Reich."

With Hines staring at 160 receptions this season, I'd say Axe Elf was right again.

Thank you, Axe Elf!

[Buttmonkey 8]

On 5/19/2020 at 12:57 PM, AxeElf said:

Source: The Indianapolis Star - Joel A. Erickson

"Indianapolis Colts RB Nyheim Hines will be involved in the passing game and could catch as many as 10 passes in a game this upcoming season, according to head coach Frank Reich."

With Hines staring at 160 receptions this season, I'd say Axe Elf was right again.

I know most of your comments are trolling. In this case, you did not lean one way or the other,  you protected yourself by saying "he may". This way if you are wrong you have an out, but if correct, you can gloat. With Mack out of the way the path is clearer for Hines, so you can take credit I guess. 

[AxeElf 787]

4 hours ago, Buttmonkey said:

With Mack out of the way the path is clearer for Hines, so you can take credit I guess. 

Hines had 17 PPR fantasy points before Mack even left the game, so yeah, I guess I can.

[Buttmonkey 8]

On 9/15/2020 at 11:38 AM, AxeElf said:

Hines had 17 PPR fantasy points before Mack even left the game, so yeah, I guess I can.

So, still saying you were right about Hines? What is your spin on this now after week 2?

[AxeElf 787]

2 hours ago, Buttmonkey said:

So, still saying you were right about Hines? What is your spin on this now after week 2?

Well, they definitely kicked the tires on Jonathan Taylor and Mo Alie-Cox last week, and Hines watched along with everyone else.  Obviously, I didn't REALLY think Hines was going to catch 160 balls on the year, and now that the lead back duties are not being split between two RBs any longer, I wouldn't even say that Hines is "the Colt RB to own this year" (even Axe Elf can't predict injuries), but I still think he's a viable flex play most weeks in PPR leagues 12 teams and up.