Trump has been using the NLRB to roll back labor relations

[Frozenbeernuts 1,652]

4 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

Oh, I thought you made a comment about my pension and benefits and assumed they just appeared out of nowhere. Only you work hard I guess. 

That's not what I suggested at all. I was just pointing out that the pension and benefits wouldn't have been anywhere near as good as they are without a union. 

[Strike 3,950]

Just now, Frozenbeernuts said:

You're the one with such a problem with my wage. I don't come on here and tell people they make too much when they are trying to get what they can for their families and futures. It's sad that you are so against unions allowing people to live comfortably in middle class.

Where did I say I have a problem with your wage?  I simply answered the questions you posed, such as why I would care what a person in a private sector union makes since my tax dollars aren't paying it.  While I really don't "care" I know it increases the cost of products.  I answered the question.  Simple as that.  What I learned from you:

1)  You don't care about other unions.  You just care about YOU.

2)  You know that you need a union to make what you make.  Personally, I know what I'm worth and I get paid accordingly, without needing to extort that wage from my employer. 

3)  You're really defensive about all of this.  I mean, I understand wanting to make as much as you can.  We all do.  But you could at least acknowledge the realities. 

[Strike 3,950]

1 minute ago, Frozenbeernuts said:

That's not what I suggested at all. I was just pointing out that the pension and benefits wouldn't have been anywhere near as good as they are without a union. 

You don't know this at all.  That's just an assumption based on "Unions good.  All employers screw their employees!!!"

[Frozenbeernuts 1,652]

4 minutes ago, Strike said:

Where did I say I have a problem with your wage?  I simply answered the questions you posed, such as why I would care what a person in a private sector union makes since my tax dollars aren't paying it.  While I really don't "care" I know it increases the cost of products.  I answered the question.  Simple as that.  What I learned from you:

1)  You don't care about other unions.  You just care about YOU.

2)  You know that you need a union to make what you make.  Personally, I know what I'm worth and I get paid accordingly, without needing to extort that wage from my employer. 

3)  You're really defensive about all of this.  I mean, I understand wanting to make as much as you can.  We all do.  But you could at least acknowledge the realities. 

I do acknowledge the realities. I am pro union but I realize that when it becomes too powerful, just like anything else, it becomes detrimental. That would be a lot of public unions. They have no consequence for becoming too powerful and are screwing my state over to the point of bankruptcy. If a union can be reasonable, I will support them completely.

This is the shitty part, I'm a union guy and I can recognize the issues with unions. Then you jump on me for A being in a union and B not supporting every union without question like a lemming. When you bring this kind of logic to the discussion, there's really no point in continuing because you won't get it

[Frozenbeernuts 1,652]

9 minutes ago, Strike said:

You don't know this at all.  That's just an assumption based on "Unions good.  All employers screw their employees!!!"

No I do get it. It's obvious having a union to bargain a wage usually ends up in higher wages. There really isn't a way to refute that. There may be a few, a very small percentage of people who make a lot more, and then everyone else makes less. 

[MDC 5,877]

How could anyone claim to support the working class on the one hand and say they’re unwilling to pay more for products and services on the other? That’s how you support the working class. You contribute to paying them a living wage. 

 

[Hardcore troubadour 12,593]

Why isn’t Amazon unionized yet? How is that possible? I have a theory.  Anyone else have one? 

[Herbivore 904]

38 minutes ago, Strike said:

You don't know this at all.  That's just an assumption based on "Unions good.  All employers screw their employees!!!"

If a Co's cost go up, they raise prices.  If they go down, do they lower prices?  Gas does, but others?  I don't think so.  Most employers "screw" their workers on some level.  

[Strike 3,950]

3 minutes ago, Herbivore said:

If a Co's cost go up, they raise prices.  If they go down, do they lower prices?  Gas does, but others?  I don't think so.  Most employers "screw" their workers on some level.  

I own stocks.  I'm ok with companies making me more money. 

My company pays me fairly and has excellent benefits.  I'm sorry if you chose a field where you weren't capable of getting a job where you don't feel screwed.

[Herbivore 904]

45 minutes ago, Strike said:

I own stocks.  I'm ok with companies making me more money. 

My company pays me fairly and has excellent benefits.  I'm sorry if you chose a field where you weren't capable of getting a job where you don't feel screwed.

Yeah, you only care about you.  Stick with ignoring the realities for other people.  

[Reality 2,710]

1 hour ago, Herbivore said:

If a Co's cost go up, they raise prices.  If they go down, do they lower prices?  Gas does, but others?  I don't think so.  Most employers "screw" their workers on some level.  

Electronics, literally all of them.

[Strike 3,950]

25 minutes ago, Herbivore said:

Yeah, you only care about you.  Stick with ignoring the realities for other people.  

What part of my answer indicated I only care about me?  Do you own any stocks?  Do you have a 401k?   Most, if not all, people should.  And if they do they should want those companies to make money. 

[Utilit99 4,099]

I worked on a project in Detroit for a couple years. I was leading a group of people who were testing one of our software implementations that impacted the call centers in how they would be using the software for all the information they need to do their jobs. A small part of those testers were about 6-7 specific unionized call center reps. These ladies were in heaven doing this job being away from their normal 9-5 work. Even though they were so happy about it, they didn't work very hard at it. If they got stuck on how to do something they would just sit around and chat about nothing until I would walk over to them and ask what's up. They wouldn't seek out assistance which was available to them all over the place. They were not self motivated, they were more concerned about everything else except for the work that was sitting right in front of them. All but 1 lady. She worked well and ended up doing a good job overall. The time came when they had to go back to their normal jobs. Except for one of the them. The business wanted her to stay on and continue to be involved in the effort. Surprise, surprise it was the lady who worked hard and did good work. A couple days later I somehow ran in to one of the ladies that had to go back to the call center and she was in a foul mood. She told me it wasn't fair that only that one lady got to stay behind while herself and the others didn't. So she told management that she refused to go back to her job until her and her union rep could meet with management to fix the "problem". I don't know what came of it, but dang, is that what unionized workers are like? No thanks.

[Utilit99 4,099]

Another guy once told me he worked for a bit in a place that had a union. He was pulled aside by his boss one day who told him he was working too hard and getting too much done and in shorter amount of time than his peers and he was both making them look bad and raising possible expectations that the upper management could end up putting on everyone. He was told to reel it in a bit.

[Herbivore 904]

2 hours ago, Strike said:

What part of my answer indicated I only care about me?  Do you own any stocks?  Do you have a 401k?   Most, if not all, people should.  And if they do they should want those companies to make money. 

its based on most of your answers and how you spoke to frozenbeernuts.  yes, yes.  of course people generally want companies to make money, they also want the employees to make the proper amount of money for their work.  and they want the community to benefit via both.  

[Herbivore 904]

2 hours ago, Reality said:

Electronics, literally all of them.

maybe...cause of the mining element?

[Strike 3,950]

9 minutes ago, Herbivore said:

its based on most of your answers and how you spoke to frozenbeernuts.  yes, yes.  of course people generally want companies to make money, they also want the employees to make the proper amount of money for their work.  and they want the community to benefit via both.  

That's really the rub, isn't it?  'Nuts flat out admitted he makes more than he should in a capitalist society.   So yeah, if the bolded is our goal then he's the one who only cares about himself, not me.  I agree that a FAIR wage should be the goal.   Why is it you feel you're not making a fair wage? 

[Frozenbeernuts 1,652]

19 minutes ago, Strike said:

That's really the rub, isn't it?  'Nuts flat out admitted he makes more than he should in a capitalist society.   So yeah, if the bolded is our goal then he's the one who only cares about himself, not me.  I agree that a FAIR wage should be the goal.   Why is it you feel you're not making a fair wage? 

I may a fair market wage. Non union makes a lower wage for their lower skill set. Not to mention non union is a huge supporter of bringing non English speaking people over the boarder to work in construction. 

[Herbivore 904]

1 hour ago, Strike said:

That's really the rub, isn't it?  'Nuts flat out admitted he makes more than he should in a capitalist society.   So yeah, if the bolded is our goal then he's the one who only cares about himself, not me.  I agree that a FAIR wage should be the goal.   Why is it you feel you're not making a fair wage? 

fair wage...should be the goal.  I don't feel that, nice try though.  I know people in unions that did right by them.  even told a story about it.

[drobeski 3,061]

17 hours ago, Strike said:

Unions artificially inflate the value of the work.  This causes higher prices for the goods being produced.  That DOES affect me.  Are you not confident in your ability to get a job without a union?  Without a union they'd still need people to do what you do.  If you're good at it you shouldn't have trouble finding work. 

Nailed it. 

[wiffleball 4,631]

The Little River band?

[Frozenbeernuts 1,652]

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-06-18/u-s-ranked-worst-for-workers-rights-among-major-economies

U.S. Ranked Worst for Workers’ Rights Among Major Economies

 

I will never understand why so many middle class Americans just don't give a fock about how workers are treated in this country. It's easy to say that there are laws protecting us while you're in an office all day, and you can't possibly be physically harmed from management pushing you for more productivity. 

[Hardcore troubadour 12,593]

5 hours ago, Frozenbeernuts said:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-06-18/u-s-ranked-worst-for-workers-rights-among-major-economies

U.S. Ranked Worst for Workers’ Rights Among Major Economies

 

I will never understand why so many middle class Americans just don't give a fock about how workers are treated in this country. It's easy to say that there are laws protecting us while you're in an office all day, and you can't possibly be physically harmed from management pushing you for more productivity. 

Looks like we’re gonna get Juneteenth off now though. That’s progress 

[MTSkiBum 1,593]

5 hours ago, Frozenbeernuts said:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-06-18/u-s-ranked-worst-for-workers-rights-among-major-economies

U.S. Ranked Worst for Workers’ Rights Among Major Economies

 

I will never understand why so many middle class Americans just don't give a fock about how workers are treated in this country. It's easy to say that there are laws protecting us while you're in an office all day, and you can't possibly be physically harmed from management pushing you for more productivity. 

Without data in hand it is impossible to believe. The site does not link back to the source data, nor does it even give an overview of how the data was collected.

 

I do believe that most of europe does have more worker rights than the US, which is why even though i technically work for a French company, its headquarters are based in Houston. It is because of executives and management. Do you know how much more time off would be required if the management, IT, engineering, and lab technicians worked in a European company, this would mean more overhead and less profits.

The ridiculous laws that some of the european countries have on their books related to maternity/paternity leave, vacation, and laying people off is why large multinational corporations have their headquarters in the US instead of europe.

You really need to take articles like the one above with a grain of salt.

[MTSkiBum 1,593]

38 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

Looks like we’re gonna get Juneteenth off now though. That’s progress 

If they add a holiday fine, but if they take one of my two floating holidays and make me take it on Juneteenth I would be pissed.

[drobeski 3,061]

5 hours ago, Frozenbeernuts said:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-06-18/u-s-ranked-worst-for-workers-rights-among-major-economies

U.S. Ranked Worst for Workers’ Rights Among Major Economies

 

I will never understand why so many middle class Americans just don't give a fock about how workers are treated in this country. It's easy to say that there are laws protecting us while you're in an office all day, and you can't possibly be physically harmed from management pushing you for more productivity. 

I'm shocked a union publication found the US sucks. Shocked

[Frozenbeernuts 1,652]

10 hours ago, MTSkiBum said:

Without data in hand it is impossible to believe. The site does not link back to the source data, nor does it even give an overview of how the data was collected.

 

I do believe that most of europe does have more worker rights than the US, which is why even though i technically work for a French company, its headquarters are based in Houston. It is because of executives and management. Do you know how much more time off would be required if the management, IT, engineering, and lab technicians worked in a European company, this would mean more overhead and less profits.

The ridiculous laws that some of the european countries have on their books related to maternity/paternity leave, vacation, and laying people off is why large multinational corporations have their headquarters in the US instead of europe.

You really need to take articles like the one above with a grain of salt.

Europe has some extremes for sure. I'm not looking for extremes, just to hold companies accountable for providing adequate compensation and rights for their employees.