Evangelicals turning on Trump

[Hardcore troubadour 12,593]

5 minutes ago, KSB2424 said:

BINGO

Trump happened to be the “anti-establishment outsider” at just the right time and rode that wave to the WH.  Those people nor that angst goes away with Trump leaving office.  

If you want to get the real scoop on how the Trump thing got going watch the Steve Bannon interview on frontline. It’s called America’s great divide. It’s a few hours long, but it’s really interesting. The chess games that got played before and during that election are eye opening. He doesn’t hold too much back either. Trump gets his lumps too. 

[t.j 35]

56 minutes ago, Fumbleweed said:

It didn't all start in mid-2016 for millions upon millions of people in the US. It started in 2009 and has continued from that day forward. Trump's election was only a surprise to those who were ignorant of what was going on below the surface from 2009-2016. Conservative Americans felt trampled on during that period as did many Rural Americans and certainly Christian Americans. The "this whole mess started in 2016" thing comes only from a left perspective. For those to the right of center on the political spectrum, 2016 was more of when the volcano erupted than when it became active. Trump's election was a reaction to what happened the eight years prior. 

I appreciate the perspective of your experience. In my experience, my conservative friends and family (save for a lot of "Thanks Obama!" complaints about Obamacare and such) went from 0 to 60 in 2016, and then to 100 in 2020. And during that time it went from mostly vocal Obama (and Clinton/establishment) hate to vocal hatred of all liberals and all Democrats, echoing Trump's ever-escalating rhetoric. But if conservatives were already as upset as you say for the 8 years preceding and the volcano was simply filling up per your analogy, I suppose that explains the "silent majority electoral college plurality" phenomenon.

Back to my point, electing and supporting Trump ensured that liberals (and in a lot of cases, independents) are incredibly wary of conservatives' priorities now. To your point, a cyclical pattern. Which unfortunately promotes revenge and division over integrity and the common good. Again I recognize that's both sides. I certainly understood wanting respite from the establishment but I felt that backing Trump to achieve that end was as reckless as using a grenade to unlock your house's front door. And at best it seems its accomplished making a lot of people trust the establishment over disruption, even people who were disillusioned with the establishment to begin with.

Going full circle to Rusty's point, what is it specifically that you feel Christians and rural Americans felt trampled on about? (We can skip the third group you mentioned, conservatives, as that seems more obvious.) Again it's incredibly hard for me to understand how supporting someone who lives the complete antithesis of Christian values can be viewed as a desired solution for Christians. Hard to understand how a big city silver-spoon fed enricher of the wealthy, who f***ed over farmers with the China trade war, can be viewed as a champion for rural Americans. Clearly he got them to buy in to a populist movement but it doesn't make sense to me in terms of their well-being. I'd like to think the anger and the response were not just as simple as party loyalty.

[nospk 230]

Rusty Newbie- bigger and bolder text makes people believe it more

[nospk 230]

So for sake of discussion, if he really has lost a portion of supporters, do you get to hang a big W somehow in your clubhouse? Big fockin deal

[nzoner 936]

39 minutes ago, t.j said:

Again it's incredibly hard for me to understand how supporting someone who lives the complete antithesis of Christian values can be viewed as a desired solution for Christians.

Speaking for myself it's because God can and has used many types of people  to accomplish his will.The following link is a small example.

Does God sometimes use evil to accomplish His plans

[MDC 5,877]

1 hour ago, KSB2424 said:

BINGO

Trump happened to be the “anti-establishment outsider” at just the right time and rode that wave to the WH.  Those people nor that angst goes away with Trump leaving office.  

Tax cuts and corporate deregulation. What a maverick.

No wonder the establishment hates him.

[KSB2424 3,082]

10 minutes ago, MDC said:

Tax cuts and corporate deregulation. What a maverick.

No wonder the establishment hates him.

He did run as a republican...duh.

But why do you think the whole "Drain the Swamp" resonated so much?  The "swamp" was the career politician status quo, I'll rub your back you rub mine, stuff that I think the majority of the country dislikes.  Trump wasn't scared to call that out and it resonated.  It's why the Mitt Romney's of the world hated him.  

Just think of the next four years......Mitch McConnell - Nancy Pelosi - Joe Biden are the three most powerful politicians in America.  All are old as hell, lifetime politicians and all got rich doing so.   Congrats.  

#termlimits

[MDC 5,877]

6 minutes ago, KSB2424 said:

He did run as a republican...duh.

But why do you think the whole "Drain the Swamp" resonated so much?  The "swamp" was the career politician status quo, I'll rub your back you rub mine, stuff that I think the majority of the country dislikes.  Trump wasn't scared to call that out and it resonated.  It's why the Mitt Romney's of the world hated him.  

Just think of the next four years......Mitch McConnell - Nancy Pelosi - Joe Biden are the three most powerful politicians in America.  All are old as hell, lifetime politicians and all got rich doing so.   Congrats.  

#termlimits

Trump didn’t drain the swamp. His cabinet was full of the same corporate lobbyists and Ivy leaguers we get in any administration with an added dose of moonbat weirdo. 

The Mitt Romney’s of the world hated Trump because he’s uncouth and not beholden to them. They were more than happy to let him play court jester while enacting their pro corporate / anti labor policies. 

I got a little amusement of watching Trump act like Rodney Dangerfield at Bushwood. But in the end he’s a country club Republican, only a far bigger ass hole. He didn’t do a single thing to threaten the establishment other than make them look bad.

 

[Rusty Syringes 478]

1 hour ago, nospk said:

So for sake of discussion, if he really has lost a portion of supporters, do you get to hang a big W somehow in your clubhouse? Big fockin deal

W

[KSB2424 3,082]

I just can’t anymore.  

[Rusty Syringes 478]

Just now, KSB2424 said:

I just can’t anymore.  

Can't never could.

[Hardcore troubadour 12,593]

Ben Carson and Mike Pompeo are corporate lobbyists? Betsy Devos? Some people just say stuff. Same guy said China was a Republican boogeyman the other day. Pay no mind to the troll. 

[t.j 35]

15 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

Ben Carson and Mike Pompeo are corporate lobbyists? Betsy Devos? Some people just say stuff. Same guy said China was a Republican boogeyman the other day. Pay no mind to the troll. 

Yeah corporate lobbyists is not the right word. More like wealthy know-nothing yes men. Trump's cabinet picks and his entire administration only made the government more ineffective and corrupt, the opposite of the supposed purpose of draining the swamp.

[KSB2424 3,082]

1 minute ago, t.j said:

Yeah corporate lobbyists is not the right word. More like wealthy know-nothing yes men. Trump's cabinet picks and his entire administration only made the government more ineffective and corrupt, the opposite of the supposed purpose of draining the swamp.

Wow

[Hardcore troubadour 12,593]

2 minutes ago, t.j said:

Yeah corporate lobbyists is not the right word. More like wealthy know-nothing yes men. Trump's cabinet picks and his entire administration only made the government more ineffective and corrupt, the opposite of the supposed purpose of draining the swamp.

 Betsy Devos was great for normal people.  Freaks hated her. 

[OldMaid 1,838]

2 minutes ago, t.j said:

Yeah corporate lobbyists is not the right word. More like wealthy know-nothing yes men. Trump's cabinet picks and his entire administration only made the government more ineffective and corrupt, the opposite of the supposed purpose of draining the swamp.

That’s not fair. They did drain the government of a lot of things. Mainly knowledge, policy and money.

[Hardcore troubadour 12,593]

4 minutes ago, t.j said:

Yeah corporate lobbyists is not the right word. More like wealthy know-nothing yes men. Trump's cabinet picks and his entire administration only made the government more ineffective and corrupt, the opposite of the supposed purpose of draining the swamp.

So now that all those inept and corrupt trumpers are all getting runout of town, we should see a great improvement. 

[Gladiators 1,903]

1 minute ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

So now that all those inept and corrupt trumpers are all getting runout of town, we should see a great improvement. 

Yep, buckle up and enjoy the ride. I’m excited for all the bored lefties who came out of hibernation in the last couple months. 

[t.j 35]

Also tried to appoint Barry Myers and Michael Flynn in roles they were the opposite of trustworthy to fulfill. Horrible.

[Gladiators 1,903]

I’ve been debating whether to dump a bunch of money into the market. It’s is only going up for the next 8 years, right?

[MDC 5,877]

42 minutes ago, t.j said:

Yeah corporate lobbyists is not the right word. More like wealthy know-nothing yes men. Trump's cabinet picks and his entire administration only made the government more ineffective and corrupt, the opposite of the supposed purpose of draining the swamp.

Trump’s head of the DHS was a pharmaceutical executive. His head of the EPA was a coal lobbyist. His head of the Dept of the Interior was an oil lobbyist. His head of Education was a school choice lobbyist. His administration was full of lobbyists and industry execs.

But these morons think Trump drained the swamp.  

[Rusty Syringes 478]

44 minutes ago, MDC said:

Trump’s head of the DHS was a pharmaceutical executive. His head of the EPA was a coal lobbyist. His head of the Dept of the Interior was an oil lobbyist. His head of Education was a school choice lobbyist. His administration was full of lobbyists and industry execs.

But these morons think Trump drained the swamp.  

[Fnord 1,124]

@t.j is OWNING this thread right now.

From my perspective, the mindset and anger that put Trump in office was one I was fully on board with. Being fed up with the career DC plutocrats and all the corporate special interests that they were fully beholden to over the best interests of their own constituencies should have all of us 99%ers pissed off. I was pissed then and still am.

The problem was the vehicle they chose. Trump is the most ill-equipped person I can imagine to make any of the necessary changes. His inadequacies are infinite. This, IMO, is where the nastiness really started. Those of us that are not hard-right in our politics could not fathom what anyone saw in Trump. There was literally zero appeal.

Then he took office and quickly proved that our fears were not only completely deserving, he was seemingly exponentially worse than what we feared he would be. So we attacked. Relentlessly. And Trump rallied his people and attacked back. There was never anything remotely resembling a unifying spirit anywhere in his administration. He never said a conciliatory word toward anyone. It was going to be his way and fuk anyone that disagreed.

Covid is the worst crisis the world has faced since WW2. This was the worst-case disaster scenario that always unified Americans in the past. But not under Trump. Public health became a political issue, and his divisiveness only ratcheted up. The guy was presented the opportunity to be a heroic leader that likely would have won re-election in a landslide. He could have saved countless lives. He could have unified us in a fight against "the invisible enemy." But he chose the exact opposite course. He denied the science, refused to put together a coherent plan, prioritized profits over people, cut funding for pandemic relief and the CDC, took us out of the WHO, and blamed everyone else for the catastrophic failures that predictably followed.

I know to someone that supports him, the attacks seemed like they were beyond all reason and came from little crybaby snowflake whiners. The attacks were awful. They were vicious, personal and malignant. I hope I never see anything like them again. But they were not coming from a vacuum. They were not done for the sake of political sport or tribalism. They came from a place of existential dread and fear. Trumpers may think that's ridiculous, how could we act like that just because stupid Hillary lost? That had nothing to do with it. You will forever underestimate the intense passion with which we reviled that man because you simply refuse to believe we felt that way. 

[Hardcore troubadour 12,593]

New guys: Less words. Thanks. 

[Rusty Syringes 478]

4 minutes ago, Fnord said:

@t.j is OWNING this thread right now.

From my perspective, the mindset and anger that put Trump in office was one I was fully on board with. Being fed up with the career DC plutocrats and all the corporate special interests that they were fully beholden to over the best interests of their own constituencies should have all of us 99%ers pissed off. I was pissed then and still am.

The problem was the vehicle they chose. Trump is the most ill-equipped person I can imagine to make any of the necessary changes. His inadequacies are infinite. This, IMO, is where the nastiness really started. Those of us that are not hard-right in our politics could not fathom what anyone saw in Trump. There was literally zero appeal.

Then he took office and quickly proved that our fears were not only completely deserving, he was seemingly exponentially worse than what we feared he would be. So we attacked. Relentlessly. And Trump rallied his people and attacked back. There was never anything remotely resembling a unifying spirit anywhere in his administration. He never said a conciliatory word toward anyone. It was going to be his way and fuk anyone that disagreed.

Covid is the worst crisis the world has faced since WW2. This was the worst-case disaster scenario that always unified Americans in the past. But not under Trump. Public health became a political issue, and his divisiveness only ratcheted up. The guy was presented the opportunity to be a heroic leader that likely would have won re-election in a landslide. He could have saved countless lives. He could have unified us in a fight against "the invisible enemy." But he chose the exact opposite course. He denied the science, refused to put together a coherent plan, prioritized profits over people, cut funding for pandemic relief and the CDC, took us out of the WHO, and blamed everyone else for the catastrophic failures that predictably followed.

I know to someone that supports him, the attacks seemed like they were beyond all reason and came from little crybaby snowflake whiners. The attacks were awful. They were vicious, personal and malignant. I hope I never see anything like them again. But they were not coming from a vacuum. They were not done for the sake of political sport or tribalism. They came from a place of existential dread and fear. Trumpers may think that's ridiculous, how could we act like that just because stupid Hillary lost? That had nothing to do with it. You will forever underestimate the intense passion with which we reviled that man because you simply refuse to believe we felt that way. 

Excellent!

[Fnord 1,124]

Just now, Hardcore troubadour said:

New guys: Less words. Thanks. 

And to think some misguided individuals are under the impression that Trumpers aren't intelligent enough to understand more advanced concepts or nuance. I mean, I don't agree with them, I'm just saying.

[Rusty Syringes 478]

2 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

New guys: Less words. Thanks. 

I'll allow it. 

[OldMaid 1,838]

6 minutes ago, Fnord said:

@t.j is OWNING this thread right now.

From my perspective, the mindset and anger that put Trump in office was one I was fully on board with. Being fed up with the career DC plutocrats and all the corporate special interests that they were fully beholden to over the best interests of their own constituencies should have all of us 99%ers pissed off. I was pissed then and still am.

The problem was the vehicle they chose. Trump is the most ill-equipped person I can imagine to make any of the necessary changes. His inadequacies are infinite. This, IMO, is where the nastiness really started. Those of us that are not hard-right in our politics could not fathom what anyone saw in Trump. There was literally zero appeal.

Then he took office and quickly proved that our fears were not only completely deserving, he was seemingly exponentially worse than what we feared he would be. So we attacked. Relentlessly. And Trump rallied his people and attacked back. There was never anything remotely resembling a unifying spirit anywhere in his administration. He never said a conciliatory word toward anyone. It was going to be his way and fuk anyone that disagreed.

Covid is the worst crisis the world has faced since WW2. This was the worst-case disaster scenario that always unified Americans in the past. But not under Trump. Public health became a political issue, and his divisiveness only ratcheted up. The guy was presented the opportunity to be a heroic leader that likely would have won re-election in a landslide. He could have saved countless lives. He could have unified us in a fight against "the invisible enemy." But he chose the exact opposite course. He denied the science, refused to put together a coherent plan, prioritized profits over people, cut funding for pandemic relief and the CDC, took us out of the WHO, and blamed everyone else for the catastrophic failures that predictably followed.

I know to someone that supports him, the attacks seemed like they were beyond all reason and came from little crybaby snowflake whiners. The attacks were awful. They were vicious, personal and malignant. I hope I never see anything like them again. But they were not coming from a vacuum. They were not done for the sake of political sport or tribalism. They came from a place of existential dread and fear. Trumpers may think that's ridiculous, how could we act like that just because stupid Hillary lost? That had nothing to do with it. You will forever underestimate the intense passion with which we reviled that man because you simply refuse to believe we felt that way. 

Winner, winner, chicken dinner!

[Hardcore troubadour 12,593]

Just now, Fnord said:

And to think some misguided individuals are under the impression that Trumpers aren't intelligent enough to understand more advanced concepts or nuance. I mean, I don't agree with them, I'm just saying.

Just break it up. See how dopey Rusty quoted you and all the space it takes up? I agree with almost none of what you said., and I just glanced through it. But you’re mad that we are out of the W.H.O. ? Why? They suck. 

[Rusty Syringes 478]

2 minutes ago, Fnord said:

And to think some misguided individuals are under the impression that Trumpers aren't intelligent enough to understand more advanced concepts or nuance. I mean, I don't agree with them, I'm just saying.

The plate in Hardcore troubadour's head starts vibrating when his brain has to process big words, sentences exceeding three words and more than two sentences at a time. Bless his heart.

[GutterBoy 2,277]

How about you guys gargle my balls

[Fnord 1,124]

2 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

Just break it up. See how dopey Rusty quoted you and all the space it takes up? I agree with almost none of what you said., and I just glanced through it. But you’re mad that we are out of the W.H.O. ? Why? They suck. 

They are the World Health Organization. They may suck, they may be prone to outside influence and politics, but they are dedicated to promoting health across the world, which is in the grip of a devastating disease. For all their many faults, they are a valuable ally in the fight against Covid.

[Hardcore troubadour 12,593]

2 minutes ago, Fnord said:

They are the World Health Organization. They may suck, they may be prone to outside influence and politics, but they are dedicated to promoting health across the world, which is in the grip of a devastating disease. For all their many faults, they are a valuable ally in the fight against Covid.

Yeah.  A guy from Somalia with a PhD , not an MD, is in charge of it, is as corrupt as can be, and China picked him. Pass. Hard pass. Ever think Trump may have gotten a thing or two right, like this? 

[Fnord 1,124]

Just now, GutterBoy said:

How about you guys gargle my balls

Holy shite. Someone liquified your balls? This guy...

To quote the Hormone Monster, "You're a little fuking freak, I like hanging out with you."

[Rusty Syringes 478]

5 minutes ago, GutterBoy said:

How about you guys gargle my balls

Those little chick peas would be more size-appropriate for a toy poodle to gargle. 

[Fnord 1,124]

1 minute ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

Yeah.  A guy from Somalia with a PhD , not an MD, is in charge of it, is as corrupt as can be, and China picked him. Pass. Hard pass. Ever think Trump may have gotten a thing or two right, like this? 

He may have gotten a thing or two right. Operation Warp Speed was close to right. But y'know, sometimes the guy in charge is not an accurate reflection of the organization as a whole.

Exhibit A: Donald fuking Trump

[OldMaid 1,838]

11 minutes ago, GutterBoy said:

How about you guys gargle my balls

[GutterBoy 2,277]

Oh and the only thing that tj owns is a bunch of hats.

[OldMaid 1,838]

Just now, GutterBoy said:

Oh and the only thing that tj owns is a bunch of hats.

And dead bodies in his basement. 

 

 

 

Allegedly 

 

 

 

 

 

If you listen to Wilzone.

[t.j 35]

Well yeah. Each body needs its own hat.