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Utilit99

In a dynasty, what would you seek for QB Watson?

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6 hours ago, WhiteWonder said:

I wasn’t meaning Watsons situation was exactly the same. I meant more that they all fall under the category of some for of domestic or abuse issue. In this case sexual abuse. 
 

where as weepaws? Was comparing his situation to Josh Gordon. A drug addict. Complete apples and oranges. 

Sexual abuse? He paid some ladies for a handjob. The case is garbage and they know it. I think he comes out fine.

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1 minute ago, IGotWorms said:

I think he comes out fine.

That's what she said.

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1 hour ago, IGotWorms said:

Sexual abuse? He paid some ladies for a handjob. The case is garbage and they know it. I think he comes out fine.

I’m just saying that’s what it falls under. I agree, it’s a garbage case of some women looking for a big payday 

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11 minutes ago, WhiteWonder said:

I agree, it’s a garbage case of some women looking for a big payday 

Is that a Payday in your pocket, or are you just glad to see me?

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On 6/12/2021 at 1:10 PM, Utilit99 said:

Well, fumbles are fumbles. 29 total. Fine.

How many TDs did he throw for last year in 14 games?

The answer is 11 tds folks. 11 tds thrown in 14 games. How good do you feel about that? With allllll the fumbles included.

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What I think is going to end up happening is, Watson goes on the NFL Exempt list and settles out of court,. He's sorry for disappointing his fans, the city of Houston and his mom. Finds Jesus and ask for  forgiveness. Traded before 2022 draft.

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2 hours ago, Super Cubs said:

What I think is going to end up happening is, Watson goes on the NFL Exempt list and settles out of court,. He's sorry for disappointing his fans, the city of Houston and his mom. Finds Jesus and ask for  forgiveness. Traded before 2022 draft.

That only happens if he goes to jail, he’ll go to a new team , new massage place will take him as a costumer and he’ll repeat until another one of the staff comes out again to gain a settlement. 

And than it’ll continue once again. 

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17 hours ago, Super Cubs said:

What I think is going to end up happening is, Watson goes on the NFL Exempt list and settles out of court,. He's sorry for disappointing his fans, the city of Houston and his mom. Finds Jesus and ask for  forgiveness. Traded before 2022 draft.

This is where I'm at.  Once he settles, the clock starts.  Some vet will also introduce him to the concept of escorts.  Hell he can even have them pretend to be masseuses if he wants.

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12 hours ago, weepaws said:

That only happens if he goes to jail, he’ll go to a new team , new massage place will take him as a costumer and he’ll repeat until another one of the staff comes out again to gain a settlement. 

And than it’ll continue once again. 

time and winning cures everything. Just look at Big Ben, Kobe, and even Ray Lewis. Worse that might happen to Watson is he's suspended a few games.   As far as the future goes I'm pretty sure he's rolling with the Dave Chappelle Love Contract from now on.

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34 minutes ago, Super Cubs said:

time and winning cures everything. Just look at Big Ben, Kobe, and even Ray Lewis. Worse that might happen to Watson is he's suspended a few games.   As far as the future goes I'm pretty sure he's rolling with the Dave Chappelle Love Contract from now on.

Sadly winning does, teams will over look problems for production, time to make a change. 

I hope Watson learns his lesson and doesn’t want to go through this once again, but I’m so sure he will, we’ve seen others that don’t get it.  

 

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Here's my take.  Dynasty league.

Watson: 3 pro bowls in his first 4 years. 

Only 25 years old. 

Career 68% completion rate

104 TDs to 36 INTs

Legal issue but he will play at one point in the next year. 

Jones: 0 pro bowls in his first 2 years

62% completion rate

35 TD to 22 INTs.

29 fumbles in 27 games. 

If he fumbles like he did in the past two years, Giants have a lot of draft capital to move up and get a QB they may like next year.

 

One has proven success on a shltty team. The other has not. 

Of course everything could turn around because it's fantasy football, but I'm not risking the smart move and am hanging on to Watson rather than take that deal.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Jones focking sucks and Watson *could* be one of the best to play the game. I mean he probably won’t end up in that category because he’ll have to stay healthy for a long time and have much more team success, but he could.

It’s not even a debate.

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So does that now mean the OP doesn’t need draft picks and qbs? 

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29 minutes ago, IGotWorms said:

Jones focking sucks and Watson *could* be one of the best to play the game. I mean he probably won’t end up in that category because he’ll have to stay healthy for a long time and have much more team success, but he could.

It’s not even a debate.

I thought the debate was DJ and a 1st round pick, Not whose better Watson and Jones. For this year, I predict DJ and whoever you draft in the first round will have wayyyy more fantasy points than Watson, and it's not focking close....

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22 minutes ago, weepaws said:

So does that now mean the OP doesn’t need draft picks and qbs? 

I have 3 first rounders at this point and want to go younger overall,  but if I trade a 25 y.o. Watson, for a an unknown 1st rounder ( could even be a #10 or 11 next year) and a QB that has only thrown 11 TDs last year, it may be wrong decision in the end, but I'll take my chances in a dynasty with Watson in this case.

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1 hour ago, Utilit99 said:

I have 3 first rounders at this point and want to go younger overall,  but if I trade a 25 y.o. Watson, for a an unknown 1st rounder ( could even be a #10 or 11 next year) and a QB that has only thrown 11 TDs last year, it may be wrong decision in the end, but I'll take my chances in a dynasty with Watson in this case.

Axe Elf washes his hands of your fantasy ruin.

Parenthetically, Jones threw 21 of his 24 TDs as a rookie when Barkley was active.  Barkley was not active for 14 weeks last year.  Jones is going into his third year, with weapons the likes of which he has never seen before--and a healthy Barkley.

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3 minutes ago, AxeElf said:

Axe Elf washes his hands of your fantasy ruin.

Parenthetically, Jones threw 21 of his 24 TDs as a rookie when Barkley was active.  Barkley was not active for 14 weeks last year.  Jones is going into his third year, with weapons the likes of which he has never seen before--and a healthy Barkley.

You didn't even know how many fumbles jones had. :blink:

11 TDs in 14 games. Seriously?

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11 minutes ago, Utilit99 said:

You didn't even know how many fumbles jones had. 

What are fumbles minus 50 points in your league. Who cares?

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12 minutes ago, Utilit99 said:

You didn't even know how many fumbles jones had. :blink:

You're going to have a hard time proving that, when the correct number of rushing fumbles jones had has been included in several of my previous posts.

13 minutes ago, Utilit99 said:

11 TDs in 14 games. Seriously?

Those numbers are correct, seriously.  I sincerely hope you weren't starting him in 2020, with Barkley out for all but 2 games.

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1 minute ago, jrokh said:

What are fumbles minus 50 points in your league. Who cares?

In a dynasty league, a person thinks about if that QB keeps fumbling 18 times a year, along with only throwing 11 TDs and many INTs, that's not a good investment. Just my take. :dunno:

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10 minutes ago, AxeElf said:

You're going to have a hard time proving that, when the correct number of rushing fumbles jones had has been included in several of my previous posts.

Those numbers are correct, seriously.  I sincerely hope you weren't starting him in 2020, with Barkley out for all but 2 games.

So, in this case, Jones' stats and career depends upon barkley. Not his own ability to produce. Gotcha.

And in 2020, Jones had 2 games with barkley, Jones had 2 TDs passing and 3 INTs, and they lost both games. Ok. 

Those stats are killing it. 

 

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12 minutes ago, Utilit99 said:

In a dynasty league, a person thinks about if that QB keeps fumbling 18 times a year, along with only throwing 11 TDs and many INTs, that's not a good investment. Just my take. :dunno:

Oh, so if following the way a person thinks in dynasty leagues, Jones went from 11 fumbles lost his rookie year to 6 fumbles lost this past season. So a thinking man in a Dynasty League would expect that Jones will have 3 fumbles lost this season. Those three lost fumbles must be pretty costly for a thinking man's dynasty player to avoid trading for said player...

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11 minutes ago, jrokh said:

Oh, so if following the way a person thinks in dynasty leagues, Jones went from 11 fumbles lost his rookie year to 6 fumbles lost this past season. So a thinking man in a Dynasty League would expect that Jones will have 3 fumbles lost this season. Those three lost fumbles must be pretty costly for a thinking man's dynasty player to avoid trading for said player...

He had 18 fumbles his first season, then 11 his second season. And in his second season only threw for 11 TDs. Probably because he was worried about fumbling more or throwing more interceptions than TDs. Yeah, that's not good. That's why the guy offered me Jones and a pick for Watson. Who is a three time 25 year old pro-bowler in his first 4 years.   

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3 minutes ago, Utilit99 said:

He had 18 fumbles his first season, then 11 his second season. And in his second season only threw for 11 TDs. Probably because he was worried about fumbling more or throwing more interceptions than TDs. Yeah, that's not good. That's why the guy offered me Jones and a pick for Watson. Who is a three time 25 year old pro-bowler in his first 4 years.   

you are looking at fumbles, not fumbles lost. In most fantasy leagues if not all of them you don't lose points for fumbles that are recovered by the offensive team. I would've thought that a thinking man in a dynasty league would know that.  He only threw for 11td's his second season because his OL was rated 32nd in pass blocking by PFF, and when Barkley went down and shepherd went down he had no one open or time to hit them even if they were. For a Thinking Man's Dynasty League you sure don't do a lot of thinking...

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3 minutes ago, jrokh said:

you are looking at fumbles, not fumbles lost. In most fantasy leagues if not all of them you don't lose points for fumbles that are recovered by the offensive team. I would've thought that a thinking man in a dynasty league would know that.  He only threw for 11td's his second season because his OL was rated 32nd in pass blocking by PFF, and when Barkley went down and shepherd went down he had no one open or time to hit them even if they were. For a Thinking Man's Dynasty League you sure don't do a lot of thinking...

Alright, you love jones as long as he has the best offense in the league around him. :dunno:

I like Watson better with less skilled players around him. 

Fumbles are fumbles. Fumble. Can't hang on to the ball. Can't throw for TDs. Whatever.

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1 minute ago, Utilit99 said:

Alright, you love jones as long as he has the best offense in the league around him. :dunno:

I like Watson better with less skilled players around him. 

Fumbles are fumbles. Fumble. Can't hang on to the ball. Can't throw for TDs. Whatever.

I like Watson more than Jones as a player, obviously he’s better by a lot. However the whole reason you brought up this thread are for non football reasons. Who knows what will happen with Watson. I doubt Watson plays this year at all.

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57 minutes ago, jrokh said:

What are fumbles minus 50 points in your league. Who cares?

He’s a sh1tty actual quarterback. Which means he probably won’t have his job forever. Definitely matters bigly in a dynasty league

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7 minutes ago, jrokh said:

I like Watson more than Jones as a player, obviously he’s better by a lot. However the whole reason you brought up this thread are for non football reasons. Who knows what will happen with Watson. I doubt Watson plays this year at all.

Yeah. If this was for a one year deal, I would take Jones to be safe for sure. I hope the guy succeeds, but I really am worried if he has a bad year after the Giants went hard after players to help him. Why didn't they go after line play though? Maybe they did and I am not aware. 

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6 minutes ago, IGotWorms said:

He’s a sh1tty actual quarterback. Which means he probably won’t have his job forever. Definitely matters bigly in a dynasty league

Not really his 61.5 Total QBR in 2020 suggests he is above average, although not by much. When compared to his peers meaning 1st and second year QBs only Kyler Murray and Justin Herbert had a higher Total QBR.  So compared to those two I guess you can say he sucked,  but compared to him, Drew Lock, Dwayne Haskins, Jalen Hurts, et.al sucked. So as an actual QB you are misinformed…

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37 minutes ago, jrokh said:

Not really his 61.5 Total QBR in 2020 suggests he is above average, although not by much. When compared to his peers meaning 1st and second year QBs only Kyler Murray and Justin Herbert had a higher Total QBR.  So compared to those two I guess you can say he sucked,  but compared to him, Drew Lock, Dwayne Haskins, Jalen Hurts, et.al sucked. So as an actual QB you are misinformed…

No, it means he’s mediocre at best and that won’t keep you starting indefinitely

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2 hours ago, AxeElf said:

You're going to have a hard time proving that, when the correct number of rushing fumbles jones had has been included in several of my previous posts.

:lol: 

Was your intent to only include rushing fumbles?

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1 hour ago, jrokh said:

you are looking at fumbles, not fumbles lost. In most fantasy leagues if not all of them you don't lose points for fumbles that are recovered by the offensive team. I would've thought that a thinking man in a dynasty league would know that.  He only threw for 11td's his second season because his OL was rated 32nd in pass blocking by PFF, and when Barkley went down and shepherd went down he had no one open or time to hit them even if they were. For a Thinking Man's Dynasty League you sure don't do a lot of thinking...

Now it is literally turning into the exact same discussion of Kurt Warner fumbles we had 12 or so years ago.  I was waiting for someone to make the distinction between fumbles and lost fumbles to really drive it home. 

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1 hour ago, IGotWorms said:

He’s a sh1tty actual quarterback. Which means he probably won’t have his job forever. Definitely matters bigly in a dynasty league

The problem with Jones is he's wildly high variance.  He has like four games where he managed to score 4+ TDs.  Then he has a ton of dud games. 

Let's say he can single handedly win you some weeks.  The problem is he's probably going to lose you just as many if not more.  He's essentially a poor man's Ryan Fitzpatrick, so my suggestion would be to just go get Ryan Fitzpatrick because you can probably get him for peanuts. 

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5 minutes ago, nobody said:

The problem with Jones is he's wildly high variance.  He has like four games where he managed to score 4+ TDs.  Then he has a ton of dud games. 

Let's say he can single handedly win you some weeks.  The problem is he's probably going to lose you just as many if not more.  He's essentially a poor man's Ryan Fitzpatrick, so my suggestion would be to just go get Ryan Fitzpatrick because you can probably get him for peanuts. 

I think that’s a great analogy. He’s definitely good enough to be a top backup and he’s probably good enough to start on a handful  of desperate teams. But he’s not what you want, in the end.

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2 minutes ago, IGotWorms said:

I think that’s a great analogy. He’s definitely good enough to be a top backup and he’s probably good enough to start on a handful  of desperate teams. But he’s not what you want, in the end.

I will add you to the list of those who will look foolish when I break out these quotes later on during the season.

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12 minutes ago, jrokh said:

I will add you to the list of those who will look foolish when I break out these quotes later on during the season.

Go for it. Wouldn’t be the first time I’m wrong but I’m pretty confident on this one

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There is no question that Watson to date is the better ff Qb , and going forward might still be, I mean he does want out of Texas, and the Texans have problems, but i do find it interesting he wants out the same time he’s been involved in a legal matter, I mean he wants to leave town to start over imo, but I digress , if he Watson does go play with the likes of the Broncos will that could be enough to take him up  closer to Mahomes standards, I mean he’s pretty close based on ff points, and he plays on a team and for a organization that’s been pretty horrible lately unlike what Mahomes inherited when he took over in KC.  

I wouldn’t want D Jones over Watson , but based on his legal issue and with playing time in doubt for this upcoming season, the OP said that they wanted in return for Watson a Qb plus draft picks, than a deal for Watson for D Jones and a first round draft pick was offered  and I think that would have been a good deal. 

I do think D Jones has been given a lot of very good talent that could take him into the next level, if you look at his rookie season he did avg 23 points per game the last nine games, and now he not only should have Barkely back but a legit wr1 plus a good quality back up for Engram once he decides he’s to hurt to participate again, and Toney is going to be a good playmaker. 

Turns out the OP didn’t like the deal so it’s over. 

Thanks. 

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On 6/11/2021 at 4:27 PM, The Football Guru said:

His only other QB at this point of the draft is Winston at 18.08, so I would say no. (We are midway through Round 20 of 22.)

He's a gambler I see.  😀

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