Alec Baldwin killed a woman

[joneo 529]

15 minutes ago, KSB2424 said:

I'm not a Alec Baldwin fan at all.  

However unless something nefarious comes out more than what I've seen and read this was an accident.  Sure there will be people fired, there will be civil lawsuits for negligence.  However criminally speaking this may be something but it IS NOT manslaughter as I know it.  It may be some other smaller charge but yeah....

man·slaugh·ter

/ˈmanˌslôdər/

Learn to pronounce

 

noun

 

1. the crime of killing a human being without malice aforethought, or otherwise in circumstances not amounting to murder.

[posty 2,295]

58 minutes ago, KSB2424 said:

I'm not a Alec Baldwin fan at all.  

However unless something nefarious comes out more than what I've seen and read this was an accident.  Sure there will be people fired, there will be civil lawsuits for negligence.  However criminally speaking this may be something but it IS NOT manslaughter as I know it.  It may be some other smaller charge but yeah....

I would lean towards involuntary manslaughter first…

[tubby_mcgee 685]

1 hour ago, Fireballer said:

 

They were shooting cans with a prop gun?

 

Oh...wait. So..they were fully aware that the gun wasn't a prop gun.  LOL. 

This is getting funnier all the time (not the death, libtards) but liberals around guns...not having a clue how to handle them... yet handling them. "They're like toys" "Gee, guns are fun"

"Bang" -- shoots can, puts hole in can
"Bang" --shoots can puts hole in can
"Bang" -- shoots at can, misses, dirt flies
and so on and so on

"Bang" -- shoots woman's guts out her back

"Oh golly gee how did that happen?"  

Focking liberals. 
 

[KSB2424 3,082]

57 minutes ago, joneo said:

man·slaugh·ter

/ˈmanˌslôdər/

Learn to pronounce

 

noun

 

1. the crime of killing a human being without malice aforethought, or otherwise in circumstances not amounting to murder.

What is the normal criminal charge for a person who is sober, driving normally, and a tire blows, said driver crosses the median, hits a car head on and kills person.

What is that charge?

[Utilit99 4,099]

2 minutes ago, KSB2424 said:

What is the normal criminal charge for a person who is sober, driving normally, and a tire blows, said driver crosses the median, hits a car head on and kills person.

What is that charge?

But the gun didn't malfunction. Or...blow a tire.

[KSB2424 3,082]

6 minutes ago, Utilit99 said:

But the gun didn't malfunction. Or...blow a tire.

The blown tire manufacturer in my analogy is the set production dude who handed him a live weapon by accident.  

Look, I am not an Alec Baldwin fan.  However you are showing your Conservative Rose colored glasses to push for some sort of murder here.....unless there is more information that comes out later....but as of right now.....dont be that guy. 

[Utilit99 4,099]

2 hours ago, KSB2424 said:

The blown tire manufacturer in my analogy is the set production dude who handed him a live weapon.  

Look, I am not a Alec Baldwin fan.  However you are showing your Conservative Rose colored glasses to push for some sort of murder here.....unless there is more information that comes out later....but as of right now.  

I have zero idea if there was foul play in the death of that lady. I have no inside information. I speculate nothing on murder/no murder. The only thing I do think, which is apparent and obviously true, is that the person who pulled the trigger did not ensure the gun was safe to use for the purpose it was intended to be used. And it sounds like from what I have read that guns on stage should never be pointed at a person. Involuntary manslaughter is not a stretch.

[joneo 529]

58 minutes ago, KSB2424 said:

What is the normal criminal charge for a person who is sober, driving normally, and a tire blows, said driver crosses the median, hits a car head on and kills person.

What is that charge?

Foreseen negligence vs. Unforseen negligence. 

[Fireballer 2,367]

This is what it comes down to...not any bullsh!t about who handed who the gun or who's paid to check this or that.

New Mexico statute

 Involuntary manslaughter consists of manslaughter committed in the commission of an unlawful act not amounting to felony, or in the commission of a lawful act which might produce death in an unlawful manner or without due caution and circumspection.

Whoever commits involuntary manslaughter is guilty of a fourth degree felony.

If his handling of the gun is "without due caution or circumspection", he could be fuked.

Furthermore, if he's found to have recklessly mishandled the gun, that would meet the "unlawful act not meeting a felony" for it to be involuntary manslaughter.

Reckless handling of a firearm(3) endangering the safety of another by handling or using a firearm or other deadly weapon in a negligent manner

 

[KSB2424 3,082]

5 minutes ago, joneo said:

Foreseen negligence vs. Unforseen negligence. 

So you're saying Alec Baldwin knew it was loaded and fired off a round?

If he did, fine, I get your point.  Odds are you are wrong. 

[joneo 529]

Just now, KSB2424 said:

So you're saying Alec Baldwin knew it was loaded and fired off a round?

If he did, fine, I get your point.  Odds are you are wrong. 

You're being obtuse. I never said nor implied any such thing. You are coming across as a moron. First, you give a crappy analogy and then you double down on idiocy by trying to put false words on my explanation.  Maybe you can get a job with CNN or MSNBC....but your crap rhetoric doesn't fly here. 

[Hardcore troubadour 12,552]

So it’s ok for these Hollywood clowns to shoot cans, but if a cop shoots a can there are riots. 

[TimmySmith 2,782]

If you are an actor/producer and you want to kill someone, I would suggest hiring an armorist with a less than stellar track record. 

[Alias Detective 1,177]

2 hours ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

So it’s ok for these Hollywood clowns to shoot cans, but if a cop shoots a can there are riots. 

Only if it’s an Afri can.

[jerryskids 5,151]

9 hours ago, Utilit99 said:

I have zero idea if there was foul play in the death of that lady. I have no inside information. I speculate nothing on murder/no murder. The only thing I do think, which is apparent and obviously true, is that the person who pulled the trigger did not ensure the gun was safe to use for the purpose it was intended to be used. And it sounds like from what I have read that guns on stage should never be pointed at a person. Involuntary manslaughter is not a stretch.

That’s going to eliminate, well, any movies where people shoot at other people.   

[DonS 3,063]

With all the discussions of possible charges for the people involved, I think it's time we step back and reflect upon the elephant in the room.... 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Why do we still use the horribly gendered term MANslaughter?   THIS IS THE REAL CRIME HERE!!!! 

 

[Strike 3,934]

1 hour ago, jerryskids said:

That’s going to eliminate, well, any movies where people shoot at other people.   

It's not.  They point it slightly left or right of target and use camera angles and/or other tricks to make it look like it's pointed at the person.  I was surprised by this as well but have seen it mentioned in several articles I've read after this incident occurred.

[jerryskids 5,151]

4 minutes ago, Strike said:

It's not.  They point it slightly left or right of target and use camera angles and/or other tricks to make it look like it's pointed at the person.  I was surprised by this as well but have seen it mentioned in several articles I've read after this incident occurred.

Interesting.  So an actor who presumably is generally not a marksman is expected to film a shootout where they shoot slightly left or right of their target in rapid succession, often while moving themselves?  It’s extremely hard to hit a moving target; it must be equally hard if not harder to intentionally just miss one.   

[Strike 3,934]

Just now, jerryskids said:

Interesting.  So an actor who presumably is generally not a marksman is expected to film a shootout where they shoot slightly left or right of their target in rapid succession, often while moving themselves?  It’s extremely hard to hit a moving target; it must be equally hard if not harder to intentionally just miss one.   

Well, when I say slightly I think we're talking feet not inches.  There is also a lot of CGI and other special effects used in Hollywood.  I suspect in the other cases you're talking about they use prop guns for the filming and CGI to make it look like it actually fired at the person.  I mean, I assume that when you see a bunch of bullets hit the ground and kick up dust over and over again around a person you don't actually believe the shooter is shooting bullets really close to the person they're trying to shoot.  From what I've read real guns with real blanks are used mostly in low budget movies because CGI can get expensive. 

[lod001 1,235]

59 minutes ago, DonS said:

With all the discussions of possible charges for the people involved, I think it's time we step back and reflect upon the elephant in the room.... 

 

Why do we still use the horribly gendered term MANslaughter?   THIS IS THE REAL CRIME HERE!!!! 

 

This is a great point. In the libtard world, he should be charged with PERSONSlaughter.

[Utilit99 4,099]

8 minutes ago, jerryskids said:

Interesting.  So an actor who presumably is generally not a marksman is expected to film a shootout where they shoot slightly left or right of their target in rapid succession, often while moving themselves?  It’s extremely hard to hit a moving target; it must be equally hard if not harder to intentionally just miss one.   

Well, actors since the beginning of acting have needed to learn skills to perform their roles. But again, I'll refer to the Actors Equity Association safety guidelines. 

https://www.actorsequity.org/resources/Producers/safe-and-sanitary/safety-tips-for-use-of-firearms/

SAFETY TIPS FOR USE OF FIREARMS

• Use simulated or dummy weapons whenever possible.
• Treat all guns as if they are loaded and deadly.
• Unless you are actually performing or rehearsing, the property master must secure all firearms.
• The property master or armorer should carefully train you in the safe use of any firearm you must handle. Be honest if you have no knowledge about guns. Do not overstate your qualifications.
• Follow all instructions given by the qualified instructor.
• Never engage in horseplay with any firearms or other weapons. Do not let others handle the gun for any reason.
• All loading of firearms must be done by the property master, armorer or experienced persons working under their direct supervision.
• Never point a firearm at anyone including yourself. Always cheat the shot by aiming to the right or left of the target character. If asked to point and shoot directly at a living target, consult with the property master or armorer for the prescribed safety procedures.
• If you are the intended target of a gunshot, make sure that the person firing at you has followed all these safety procedures.
• If you are required to wear exploding blood squibs, make sure there is a bulletproof vest or other solid protection between you and the blast packet.
• Use protective shields for all off stage cast within close proximity to any shots fired.
• Appropriate ear protection should be offered to the cast members and stage managers.
• Check the firearm every time you take possession of it. Before each use, make sure the gun has been test-fired off stage and then ask to test fire it yourself. Watch the prop master check the cylinders and barrel to be sure no foreign object or dummy bullet has become lodged inside.
• Blanks are extremely dangerous. Even though they do not fire bullets out of the gun barrel, they still have a powerful blast than can maim or kill.
• Never attempt to adjust, modify or repair a firearm yourself. If a weapon jams or malfunctions, corrections shall be made only by a qualified person.
• When a scene is completed, the property master shall unload the firearms. All weapons must be cleaned, checked and inventoried after each performance.
• Live ammunition may not be brought into the theatre.
• If you are in a production where shots are to be fired and there is no qualified property master, go to the nearest phone and call Actors' Equity Association. A union representative will make sure proper procedures are followed.
• State and federal safety laws must be honored at all times.
• If any of the above safety tips conflict with the instructions given by a qualified instructor, abide by the instructions from the qualified instructor. If you are still not sure, contact your Equity Business Representative.

[Big Guy 1,400]

3 hours ago, Alias Detective said:

Only if it’s an Afri can.

you won the internet today!

[Big Guy 1,400]

Alec Baldwin: Detailed Account Of The Accident That Took One Person's Life

https://culturacolectiva.com/history/alec-baldwin-rust-incident-witness-reports?fbclid=IwAR2sjLifrUJzOG0TRgOf9_rKNRvreBB9_KybrjoEoP4kpg6hPfiD53opjYk

[Utilit99 4,099]

3 minutes ago, Big Guy said:

Alec Baldwin: Detailed Account Of The Accident That Took One Person's Life

https://culturacolectiva.com/history/alec-baldwin-rust-incident-witness-reports?fbclid=IwAR2sjLifrUJzOG0TRgOf9_rKNRvreBB9_KybrjoEoP4kpg6hPfiD53opjYk

I wonder if the democrats would be using the term 'accident' instead of 'shooting' if this were a hardcore conservative who pulled the trigger?

On the other hand, cameraman Reid Russel was standing next to Souza and Hutchins when the accident occurred and assured

[Hardcore troubadour 12,552]

53 minutes ago, Big Guy said:

you won the internet today!

I get no props for the set up? 

[Hardcore troubadour 12,552]

I predict there will be no charges. I’d assume New Mexico wants to attract more filming in their state. Money talks. 

[Djgb13 2,338]

So are we thinking he actually does any time or is he going to get off with a slap on the wrist? 

[Hardcore troubadour 12,552]

1 minute ago, Djgb13 said:

So are we thinking he actually does any time or is he going to get off with a slap on the wrist? 

Your little emoticons aren’t part of ignoring someone. 

[avoiding injuries 1,220]

3 hours ago, DonS said:

Why do we still use the horribly gendered term MANslaughter?   THIS IS THE REAL CRIME HERE!!!! 

 

Awomen. 

[Baker Boy 1,474]

20 hours ago, KSB2424 said:

I'm not a Alec Baldwin fan at all.  

However unless something nefarious comes out more than what I've seen and read this was an accident.  Sure there will be people fired, there will be civil lawsuits for negligence.  However criminally speaking this may be something but it IS NOT manslaughter as I know it.  It may be some other smaller charge but yeah....

Involuntary Manslaughter. Charge him and this could be a teaching moment on the handling of firearms, ‘anyone  handling a firearm is responsible for the outcome when it is in their possession ’. Of course this does not fit the MO of the Deep State.

[Mike Honcho 3,998]

3 hours ago, Djgb13 said:

So are we thinking he actually does any time or is he going to get off with a slap on the wrist? 

I'll stick with my prediction.  Actor Baldwin is not charged at all. Producer Baldwin may face some criminal and most definitely civil costs. 

[Mike Honcho 3,998]

Search warrant: "Rust" assistant director acknowledges failure to fully check Baldwin’s gun

The assistant director on "Rust" who handed Alec Baldwin the gun that fired the fatal shot acknowledged to investigators that he did not check all the rounds loaded in the weapon prior to the lethal shooting of cinematographer Halyna Hutchins, a detective wrote in a search warrant affidavit made public Wednesday.

Detective Alexandria Hancock described her interviews with first assistant director David Halls and armorer Hannah Reed-Gutierrez.

“David advised when Hannah showed him the firearm before continuing rehearsal, he could only remember seeing three rounds. He advised he should have checked all of them but didn’t, and couldn’t recall if she spun the drum," the affidavit said.

An earlier affidavit stated Halls shouted “cold gun” (meaning the gun did not have a blank or a live round that contained gunpowder that could explode), before handing it to Baldwin.

Investigators added the request to search the van after interviewing several members of the movie crew, including Reed-Gutierrez, who told investigators the weapons used in filming were stored in a safe inside the van or “prop truck” to which only a few people had access and the combination.

Santa Fe Sheriff Adan Mendoza said Wednesday a suspected live round killed Hutchins and wounded director Joel Souza. Yet in the warrant, Hancock says Reed-Gutierrez told investigators, “No live ammo is ever kept on set.”

“David advised the incident was not a deliberate act,” the detective wrote of the interview with Halls.

More context: According to the affidavit, a van used to store weapons and props on the Santa Fe set of "Rust" was searched for evidence prompted by interviews from the film crew. The van was searched for firearms, ammunition, a gun safe, fingerprints, bodily fluids, and residue, the detective said.

“Hannah advised on the day of the incident, she checked the ‘dummies’ and ensured they were no ‘hot’ rounds,” the warrant states about the ammo used on set. While the firearms were secured inside the van, “ammo was left on a cart on the set, not secured,” Reed-Gutierrez told investigators.

The grey, two-tier cart also contained a western-style belt and other prop-ammunition.

Reed-Gutierrez told investigators she handed the gun to Baldwin a couple of times during the day’s filming, and also handed it to Halls.

Reid Russell, a cameraman standing next to Hutchins and Souza, also told deputies everyone seemed to be getting along, despite an earlier walkout of some crew members the previous day. He told deputies he had stepped out of the immediate area for about five minutes and was not sure whether the weapon was checked during his absence.

Souza, who sustained a gunshot wound to his shoulder in the incident, told law enforcement, “as far as he knows, no one gets checked for live ammunition on their person prior and after the scenes are being filmed.”

[wiffleball 4,629]

Man, I dont remember OJ getting all this attention...

[joneo 529]

4 hours ago, Mike Honcho said:

I'll stick with my prediction.  Actor Baldwin is not charged at all. Producer Baldwin may face some criminal and most definitely civil costs. 

Baldwin is Baldwin, no matter what hat you put on him. He pulled the trigger. He is responsible. He should be charged with manslaughter. 

[5-Points 2,715]

29 minutes ago, joneo said:

Baldwin is Baldwin, no matter what hat you put on him. He pulled the trigger. He is responsible. He should be charged with manslaughter. 

Involuntary, at most. 

Look, I hate the focking doosh, but there were people on set designated to assure the firearms were safe. He wasn't one of them. 

If something else comes to light, like he deliberately pointed the gun he was told was cold and pulled the trigger, it's still involuntary. 

That culpability falls on the guy whose responsibility it was to determine the status of the firearms on set prior to releasing them for use. 

He's an idiot for pointing a gun at anybody and pulling the trigger but he may not be criminally responsible for doing so. 

 

 

[Utilit99 4,099]

13 minutes ago, 5-Points said:

Involuntary, at most. 

Look, I hate the focking doosh, but there were people on set designated to assure the firearms were safe. He wasn't one of them. 

If something else comes to light, like he deliberately pointed the gun he was told was cold and pulled the trigger, it's still involuntary. 

That culpability falls on the guy whose responsibility it was to determine the status of the firearms on set prior to releasing them for use. 

He's an idiot for pointing a gun at anybody and pulling the trigger but he may not be criminally responsible for doing so. 

 

 

Did they find out who put the bullet in the gun and when and why they did it? 

Did they figure anything out other than the fact that there was a bullet in the gun and it came out of that one gun and killed the lady and lodged into the guy's shoullder?

I really haven't heard anything so maybe I'm just missing something.

[jerryskids 5,151]

22 minutes ago, 5-Points said:

Involuntary, at most. 

Look, I hate the focking doosh, but there were people on set designated to assure the firearms were safe. He wasn't one of them. 

If something else comes to light, like he deliberately pointed the gun he was told was cold and pulled the trigger, it's still involuntary. 

That culpability falls on the guy whose responsibility it was to determine the status of the firearms on set prior to releasing them for use. 

He's an idiot for pointing a gun at anybody and pulling the trigger but he may not be criminally responsible for doing so. 

 

 

This is where I am, including thinking he's a doosh.  I've often said I don't hate celebs.  But if I had to pick one for bad stuff to happen to, he would come to mind.

But I just don't see how Baldwin the shooter gets charged with anything presuming it was unintentional.

[shorepatrol 1,734]

Look at the folks who are "investigating" this. Baldwin will get a medal 

[joneo 529]

42 minutes ago, 5-Points said:

Involuntary, at most. 

Look, I hate the focking doosh, but there were people on set designated to assure the firearms were safe. He wasn't one of them. 

If something else comes to light, like he deliberately pointed the gun he was told was cold and pulled the trigger, it's still involuntary. 

That culpability falls on the guy whose responsibility it was to determine the status of the firearms on set prior to releasing them for use. 

He's an idiot for pointing a gun at anybody and pulling the trigger but he may not be criminally responsible for doing so. 

 

 

That's what manslaughter means. It is a non-intentional crime. The person who pulls the trigger is the one responsible. As far as civil recourse, yes, the people who were in charge of the gun and the studio are all culpable. 

[Hardcore troubadour 12,552]

This is like an episode of Columbo or one those other 70’s detective shows. And the bad guy ends up being some disgruntled member of the crew or a spurned lover. Cannon could solve this in one episode, even in a wheelchair. Mannixx too. I don’t know about Hart to Hart. But Stephanie Powers was sexy as hell.