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Gladiators

Vaccine mandate blocked

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2 minutes ago, GutterBoy said:

That's because you keep denying that it is a vaccine, and only a complete idiot would ever do that.

But when was it changed? 

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14 minutes ago, lod001 said:

People still comparing the useless juice for this weak ass virus to the polio vaccine are serious morons. The dumbest fucktards on the planet. It's amazing how one retard can spout off about polio vaccine and the rest of the idiots fall right in line with 'yeah, the polio vaccine......'.

Fine. Then replace polio with hepatitis B.

 

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11 minutes ago, RaiderHaters Revenge said:

wrong

That said, the effectiveness of most vaccines is high. After receiving the second dose of the MMR vaccine (measles, mumps and rubella) or the standalone measles vaccine, 99.7% of vaccinated individuals are immune to measles. The inactivated polio vaccine offers 99% effectiveness after three doses. The varicella (chickenpox) vaccine is between 85% and 90% effective in preventing all varicella infections, but 100% effective in preventing moderate and severe chicken pox.

.......................

from your own article, see that key word?  IMMUNE.  99.7 people are immune to measles, meaning if you are in the .3% where the vaccine doesn't work with you, then you are at risk always.  The other 99.7% of people will be 100% IMMUNE to measles, being around 1 million people with measles you will be 100% safe

for what its worth prior to the Chicken pox vaccine the standard of classification for a "vaccine" was 90% IMMUNITY, Rubela tested at 87% which is why they had to pair it with MMR in order to classify it as a vaccine (overall efficacy now 98%)  The Pox vaccine is 85-90% of making you IMMUNE, and if it doesn't reduces the severity at 100%

the covid "vaccine" does NOT fit with any of the above

 

Unfortunately that's not the way vaccines work, I'm sorry.  Here is some good info...

 

If a vaccine has an efficacy rate of 66%, many people think that means they'll still have a 34% risk of getting sick with COVID-19 after being immunized. That's not true! Their risk will actually be much lower.

A 66% efficacy rate means your risk of getting sick, whatever it was before getting vaccinated, is reduced by 66%. Let's say you were at high risk to begin with, due to your age or underlying conditions. Even if your risk was 25%, which is high, the vaccine would reduce your risk of becoming sick to 8.5% (a 66% reduction from 25%).

 

Efficacy is determined in clinical trials, which divide participants into two groups: those getting the shot, and those who do not get the shot but instead get a placebo (inactive substance). None of the participants know which group they are in.

At the end of the trial, researchers tally how many people in the vaccinated group got sick compared to how many people in the unvaccinated group did. That's what's known as vaccine efficacy.

Let's look at a hypothetical example. Let's say 2,000 people take part in a vaccine trial. Of these, 1,000 get the vaccine and 1,000 get the placebo. Now let's say that by the end of the trial, a total of 500 people get sick: 475 from the placebo group and 25 from the vaccinated group. Expressed as a percentage, 47.5% of unvaccinated people got sick, versus just 2.5% of vaccinated people.

From there, we figure out efficacy with an easy formula: the risk in the unvaccinated group, minus the risk among the vaccinated, divided by the risk among unvaccinated.

47.5 – 2.5 / 47.5  = 0.95

Our hypothetical vaccine's efficacy is 95%.

 

https://www.cedars-sinai.org/blog/clearing-up-covid-19-vaccine-efficacy-confusion.html

 

Hope this helps.

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1 minute ago, GutterBoy said:

Unfortunately that's not the way vaccines work, I'm sorry.  Here is some good info...

 

If a vaccine has an efficacy rate of 66%, many people think that means they'll still have a 34% risk of getting sick with COVID-19 after being immunized. That's not true! Their risk will actually be much lower.

A 66% efficacy rate means your risk of getting sick, whatever it was before getting vaccinated, is reduced by 66%. Let's say you were at high risk to begin with, due to your age or underlying conditions. Even if your risk was 25%, which is high, the vaccine would reduce your risk of becoming sick to 8.5% (a 66% reduction from 25%).

 

Efficacy is determined in clinical trials, which divide participants into two groups: those getting the shot, and those who do not get the shot but instead get a placebo (inactive substance). None of the participants know which group they are in.

At the end of the trial, researchers tally how many people in the vaccinated group got sick compared to how many people in the unvaccinated group did. That's what's known as vaccine efficacy.

Let's look at a hypothetical example. Let's say 2,000 people take part in a vaccine trial. Of these, 1,000 get the vaccine and 1,000 get the placebo. Now let's say that by the end of the trial, a total of 500 people get sick: 475 from the placebo group and 25 from the vaccinated group. Expressed as a percentage, 47.5% of unvaccinated people got sick, versus just 2.5% of vaccinated people.

From there, we figure out efficacy with an easy formula: the risk in the unvaccinated group, minus the risk among the vaccinated, divided by the risk among unvaccinated.

47.5 – 2.5 / 47.5  = 0.95

Our hypothetical vaccine's efficacy is 95%.

 

https://www.cedars-sinai.org/blog/clearing-up-covid-19-vaccine-efficacy-confusion.html

 

Hope this helps.

this might be the way they want to do some fancy math strictly regarding the covid "vaccine"

that has zero bearing on what I said above about actual vaccines

I understand how words work and I understand how %'s work

they have done very few if any placebo groups regarding covid

but we know that more than 25 out of 500 "vaccinated" have gotten covid on average. I'd say the number is likely close to 50%

 

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22 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

But when was it changed? 

Well? Why won’t you answer? 

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4 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

Well? Why won’t you answer? 

I don't know, look it up.  Google is your friend.

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8 minutes ago, RaiderHaters Revenge said:

this might be the way they want to do some fancy math strictly regarding the covid "vaccine"

that has zero bearing on what I said above about actual vaccines

I understand how words work and I understand how %'s work

they have done very few if any placebo groups regarding covid

but we know that more than 25 out of 500 "vaccinated" have gotten covid on average. I'd say the number is likely close to 50%

 

No, this is how vaccines have worked for decades.  It's not fancy math :lol:  We didn't invent clincial trials for covid.  Come on man, open your eyes here.

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1 minute ago, GutterBoy said:

I don't know, look it up.  Google is your friend.

Says it all. Note to self: Dismiss Gutterboy when he attempts to bolster his points referring to policy. He is either easily duped or leaves out pertinent facts in his references. 

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Also, there is an important decision between the efficacy determined from a clinical trial and real life scenarios.

We both agree that right now with this new variant, vaccines do very little at preventing spread.  But they still prevent serious disease pretty well.

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1 minute ago, GutterBoy said:

Why don't you answer him, idiot?

I already admitted I'm an idiot.  Everyone's an idiot if they don't already know the answer to something...at least according to you.

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1 minute ago, Gladiators said:

I already admitted I'm an idiot.  Everyone's an idiot if they don't already know the answer to something...at least according to you.

never said that, idiot.

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4 minutes ago, Gladiators said:

I already admitted I'm an idiot.  Everyone's an idiot if they don't already know the answer to something...at least according to you.

He thinks the definition wasn’t changed for political/ policy purposes. Pay no mind. 

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12 minutes ago, GutterBoy said:

No, this is how vaccines have worked for decades.  It's not fancy math :lol:  We didn't invent clincial trials for covid.  Come on man, open your eyes here.

Yes I understand how efficacy studies work. What I’m saying is that they have not occurred and the other vaccines offer Immunity 100% immunity 

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2 minutes ago, RaiderHaters Revenge said:

Yes I understand how efficacy studies work. What I’m saying is that they have not occurred and the other vaccines offer Immunity 100% immunity 

covid clinical trials haven't occurred?  Yes they have

Other vaccines offer 100% Immunity?  Very few.

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3 minutes ago, GutterBoy said:

covid clinical trials haven't occurred?  Yes they have

Other vaccines offer 100% Immunity?  Very few.

Every vaccine we have is 100% immunity unless your body doesn’t take the vaccine 

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Just now, RaiderHaters Revenge said:

Every vaccine we have is 100% immunity unless your body doesn’t take the vaccine 

:lol:

No I'm sorry that's not how vaccines work.  When you get the shot, your body takes the vaccine.  So everyone's body takes the vaccine.  Next what happens is your body has a response to the vaccine that "teaches your body how to respond", so that when you encounter the real virus, your immune system already knows what to do and eliminates it so you don't get sick.

Vaccines have differing efficacy, and we already talked about how that is measured.

So your assertion that other vaccines are 100% effective as long as your body takes it, is well just wrong.  I suggest you educate yourself.

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2 hours ago, GutterBoy said:

:lol:

No I'm sorry that's not how vaccines work.  When you get the shot, your body takes the vaccine.  So everyone's body takes the vaccine.  Next what happens is your body has a response to the vaccine that "teaches your body how to respond", so that when you encounter the real virus, your immune system already knows what to do and eliminates it so you don't get sick.

Vaccines have differing efficacy, and we already talked about how that is measured.

So your assertion that other vaccines are 100% effective as long as your body takes it, is well just wrong.  I suggest you educate yourself.

dude I am putting it simple in hopes you can follow it

when I got the vaccines as kids, my body took a small amount of the virus and learned how to defeat it on its own.  that was successful at 99.7 rate.  for those whose body did not defeat it successfully is where the .3 comes in.

assuming my body successfully defeated it, I am now 100% immune to it.  If I am around 1000 people with a disease I do not have a 0.3 chance of getting it.  I have a zero% chance of getting it....EVER

fast forward to covid

I take a "vaccine" that does not trigger my body to create natural immunity, they tell us its 90% efficient or whatever.  I am 90% efficient EACH time I encounter it as there is nothing in my body that will prevent me from getting covid, and your boy fauci has stated so as well.  Vaccinated or not, you will get covid.  Therefore it does NOT do what every previous vaccine did

I am sorry if this is too complex for you to understand

I cannot get MMR, Polio, Chicken Pox, Hep B as long as my body fought and succeeded to defeat the initial vaccine

I can get covid no matter how many jabs I get

 

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6 minutes ago, RaiderHaters Revenge said:

dude I am putting it simple in hopes you can follow it

when I got the vaccines as kids, my body took a small amount of the virus and learned how to defeat it on its own.  that was successful at 99.7 rate.  for those whose body did not defeat it successfully is where the .3 comes in.

assuming my body successfully defeated it, I am now 100% immune to it.  If I am around 1000 people with a disease I do not have a 0.3 chance of getting it.  I have a zero% chance of getting it....EVER

fast forward to covid

I take a "vaccine" that does not trigger my body to create natural immunity, they tell us its 90% efficient or whatever.  I am 90% efficient EACH time I encounter it as there is nothing in my body that will prevent me from getting covid, and your boy fauci has stated so as well.  Vaccinated or not, you will get covid.  Therefore it does NOT do what every previous vaccine did

I am sorry if this is too complex for you to understand

I cannot get MMR, Polio, Chicken Pox, Hep B as long as my body fought and succeeded to defeat the initial vaccine

I can get covid no matter how many jabs I get

 

We're just going in circles.  I suggest you do some research on how our immune systems work and how vaccines work.  It is much more complex than how you stated.  I can assure you to several things you stated are 100% wrong, but we've been over this several times in this thread and you don't get it.  So please, watch some youtube videos, read some articles.  Try and educate yourself here.  Have a great weekend.

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Company put out a memo today after the SCOTUS rulings."Mandate" WILL NOT APPLY TO MY COMPANY. :banana:  Still getting hit with a 1200 dollar a year "surcharge" for not being vaxxed though.<_< 2 hrs of OT a month sitting at home will more than cover that though. :banana:  FJB

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2 hours ago, GutterBoy said:

We're just going in circles.  I suggest you do some research on how our immune systems work and how vaccines work.  It is much more complex than how you stated.  I can assure you to several things you stated are 100% wrong, but we've been over this several times in this thread and you don't get it.  So please, watch some youtube videos, read some articles.  Try and educate yourself here.  Have a great weekend.

I am more than educated on it, trust me my wife was extremely vigilant on vaccines.  You cannot get polio if you are vaccinated against it, the only way is if you took the oral vaccine which is no longer administered in the US, and are recommended to take a lifetime booster if that was the case

here is regarding the MMR which once again if the vaccine worked initially you are 100% immune for life, in the rare case your body doesn't create the immunity you are at risk

It's possible, but very unlikely. The combination measles-mumps-rubella (MMR) vaccine is a two-dose vaccine series that effectively protects against all three viruses.

In fact, more than 93 percent of people who get the first dose of MMR develop immunity to measles. After the second dose, about 97 percent of people are protected.

 

The first dose of the MMR vaccine is recommended for children ages 12 months to 15 months. The second dose is recommended before your child begins kindergarten or first grade, around ages 4 to 6. If needed, however, the second dose can be given as soon as four weeks after the first dose.

Your child may need the second dose at a younger age if you plan to travel abroad. Infants ages 6 months to 11 months should receive one dose of measles vaccine before traveling.

The combined measles-mumps-rubella-varicella (MMRV) vaccine is another option for children that also protects against chickenpox (varicella). It's a single shot that may be used in place of the MMR and chickenpox vaccines. Talk to your doctor about both options.

If you're a teen or adult who isn't sure whether you've been properly vaccinated against measles, talk to your doctor. A blood test can confirm if you already have immunity from a previous vaccine.

If the test shows you don't have immunity, and you're a teen or young adult living in dormitory, your doctors will likely recommend that you get two doses of vaccine at least four weeks apart. Adults who don't have immunity are advised to get at least one dose of MMR vaccine. Your doctor can recommend what's best for your individual situation.

 

IMMUNITY is the key word.  You will not find a single mention of immunity in any Covid situation, however all other vaccines immunity is acheived

 

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20 hours ago, RaiderHaters Revenge said:

so I am not some petulant little fool

I had covid, didnt get vaccinated spent 3 days with 6 people who were all vaccinated and got covid, I got sick with the same symptoms as them, but didn't have covid

no solution any govt agency has pushed has had any success, so why bow down and listen to them just cause?

 

Lost in the pages of semantic arguing about vaccines in this thread, and all over the internets, is the question of Covid test accuracy.  If you were with 6 people who all got Covid, and you had the same symptoms but tested negative, Occam's Razor says that you had Covid but the test was incorrect.  Furthermore, as we increasingly hear about "asymptomatic positives" I'm inclined to call those "false positives."

Could the test accuracy change with different Covid variations, like vaccine efficacy has?

It is clearly in the interest of this government to avoid the question of test accuracy so it doesn't surprise me that they don't bring it up, but I'm surprised others don't.  Perhaps I'm missing something?  

14 hours ago, shorepatrol said:

Company put out a memo today after the SCOTUS rulings."Mandate" WILL NOT APPLY TO MY COMPANY. :banana:  Still getting hit with a 1200 dollar a year "surcharge" for not being vaxxed though.<_< 2 hrs of OT a month sitting at home will more than cover that though. :banana:  FJB

Sounds like a penalty to cover insurance costs.  I worked for a large company which charged a similar fee if you smoked, and you had to have a physical with blood work to prove you didn't.

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16 minutes ago, jerryskids said:

Lost in the pages of semantic arguing about vaccines in this thread, and all over the internets, is the question of Covid test accuracy.  If you were with 6 people who all got Covid, and you had the same symptoms but tested negative, Occam's Razor says that you had Covid but the test was incorrect.  Furthermore, as we increasingly hear about "asymptomatic positives" I'm inclined to call those "false positives."

Could the test accuracy change with different Covid variations, like vaccine efficacy has?

It is clearly in the interest of this government to avoid the question of test accuracy so it doesn't surprise me that they don't bring it up, but I'm surprised others don't.  Perhaps I'm missing something?  

Sounds like a penalty to cover insurance costs.  I worked for a large company which charged a similar fee if you smoked, and you had to have a physical with blood work to prove you didn't.

who knows bro, the thing is out of the 10 of us, we all got sick

the 7 vaccinated tested positive

the 3 unvaccinated tested neg (we all previously had covid)

my thought it that my (our) body fought the covid part off quickly killing it but there is also a cold/flu going around that we caught, and since the symptoms are the same we would never know

but the test itself is another fricken joke

 

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