jerryskids 5,165 Posted July 1, 2022 3 minutes ago, jerryskids said: What are the long-term effects on the immune systems of those young people? Quote CDC recommends COVID-19 vaccines for everyone ages 6 months and older, and boosters for everyone 5 years and older, if eligible. Better yet, the long-term effects on a 6 month old? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sean Mooney 1,184 Posted July 1, 2022 5 minutes ago, jerryskids said: What are the long-term effects on the immune systems of those young people? What are the long term effects on the immune system of the young people who got COVID? 1 minute ago, jerryskids said: Better yet, the long-term effects on a 6 month old? Considering they've had that vaccine for like 2 weeks there is not a ton of data yet BUT- there was enough data to deem it safe to administer. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jerryskids 5,165 Posted July 1, 2022 1 minute ago, Sean Mooney said: What are the long term effects on the immune system of the young people who got COVID? Considering they've had that vaccine for like 2 weeks there is not a ton of data yet BUT- there was enough data to deem it safe to administer. Well, there you go then. They've been on the level about masks, about the Wuhan lab leak, about their funding of said lab, about therapeutics like Vitamin D being effective... I mean, why would anyone question their integrity? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sean Mooney 1,184 Posted July 1, 2022 3 minutes ago, Hawkeye21 said: How many per million in those age groups died of covid? Best I can find is that 815 people ages 5-18 have died from COVID. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sean Mooney 1,184 Posted July 1, 2022 1 minute ago, jerryskids said: Well, there you go then. They've been on the level about masks, about the Wuhan lab leak, about their funding of said lab, about therapeutics like Vitamin D being effective... I mean, why would anyone question their integrity? So you don't have anything that points to them being unsafe just "feelings"? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hawkeye21 1,848 Posted July 1, 2022 1 minute ago, Sean Mooney said: Best I can find is that 815 people ages 5-18 have died from COVID. So, maybe about 500 more people died from covid than from the vaccine. With those small of numbers I see no reason to take the vaccine at all in that age range. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jerryskids 5,165 Posted July 1, 2022 Just now, Sean Mooney said: So you don't have anything that points to them being unsafe just "feelings"? I feel it is safe to question the effects of a radically new vaccine on a young child who is at a statistically approaching zero chance of negative effects of the virus. I know this is new news, we've only known it since, well, a few months into this thing, but kids aren't at risk, and the Religion of Covid fanatics pushing this on 6 month olds deserve a special place in whatever hell their religion supports. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hardcore troubadour 12,576 Posted July 1, 2022 4 minutes ago, jerryskids said: I feel it is safe to question the effects of a radically new vaccine on a young child who is at a statistically approaching zero chance of negative effects of the virus. I know this is new news, we've only known it since, well, a few months into this thing, but kids aren't at risk, and the Religion of Covid fanatics pushing this on 6 month olds deserve a special place in whatever hell their religion supports. Nailed it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RaiderHaters Revenge 3,565 Posted July 1, 2022 44 minutes ago, Sean Mooney said: If we had more vaccines out in the public we would have prevented the virus from mutating and all that. A vaccine affects many more people potentially. An abortion is a personal health decision. Again- this is not hard. The case you guys are making is- people should always have a kid regardless of how it could affect their life but the vaccine (which has been proven safe) is a no go. There is exactly zero proof that the “ vaccine” stops the spread nor does it stop mutations. So try again Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sean Mooney 1,184 Posted July 1, 2022 6 minutes ago, Hawkeye21 said: So, maybe about 500 more people died from covid than from the vaccine. With those small of numbers I see no reason to take the vaccine at all in that age range. Again that comes down to how much you view the greater good of disease fighting.....it's complicated. Certainly more complicated than just saying "vaccines are bad and this one is unsafe." Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sean Mooney 1,184 Posted July 1, 2022 6 minutes ago, jerryskids said: I feel it is safe to question the effects of a radically new vaccine on a young child who is at a statistically approaching zero chance of negative effects of the virus. I know this is new news, we've only known it since, well, a few months into this thing, but kids aren't at risk, and the Religion of Covid fanatics pushing this on 6 month olds deserve a special place in whatever hell their religion supports. But that does not mean it is unsafe. Again- that's just feelings? Science doesn't care about your feelings. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sean Mooney 1,184 Posted July 1, 2022 2 minutes ago, RaiderHaters Revenge said: There is exactly zero proof that the “ vaccine” stops the spread nor does it stop mutations. So try again Other than how disease experts understand how diseases mutate and spread....sure. I'm sure you have locked in on it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hawkeye21 1,848 Posted July 1, 2022 1 minute ago, Sean Mooney said: Again that comes down to how much you view the greater good of disease fighting.....it's complicated. Certainly more complicated than just saying "vaccines are bad and this one is unsafe." I never really saw the virus as being as big of deal as it was made out to be. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Masshole 642 Posted July 1, 2022 52 minutes ago, Hawkeye21 said: Yet it is attached to the woman's body and needs it to survive. 25 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said: Does the womens body need the fetus to survive? A child will perish without the full support of adult(s) until they are 8-10 years old or more. They are fully dependent on their parent(s) at least until 2-3 yrs old. Would literally starve to death or be eaten by a coyote if an adult wasn't tending to them. Does that mean we can just off a 2 yr old kid if we don't want to care for them or are struggling to support them? I never respected the "the fetus is dependent on the mother for its life" argument for abortion. Carry that logic to its end and think about what you've got. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hawkeye21 1,848 Posted July 1, 2022 1 minute ago, Masshole said: A child will perish without the full support of adult(s) until they are 8-10 years old or more. They are fully dependent on their parent(s) at least until 2-3 yrs old. Would literally starve to death or be eaten by a coyote if an adult wasn't tending to them. Does that mean we can just off a 2 yr old kid if we don't want to care for them or are struggling to support them? I never respected the "the fetus is dependent on the mother for its life" argument for abortion. Carry that logic to its end and think about what you've got. It's not the best argument because it only has some merit for the early stages of pregnancy in my opinion. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jerryskids 5,165 Posted July 1, 2022 9 minutes ago, Sean Mooney said: But that does not mean it is unsafe. Again- that's just feelings? Science doesn't care about your feelings. I have forgotten more about science than you've ever known. Medications are considered unsafe until proven safe, so the default is unsafe. Here is a statement on the long-term safety: Quote What are the long-term effects of the vaccines? Long-term effects are continuously being studied for COVID vaccines, but to date these vaccines have been shown to be safe. In general, any vaccine side effects from prior vaccines occurred within the first few weeks after vaccination. This is why the safety studies collected data for a few months, well beyond the time period that a reaction has ever been seen for existing vaccines. Can you see the logical flaw in using the behavior of prior vaccines to analyze the effects of a radically new type of vaccine? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sean Mooney 1,184 Posted July 1, 2022 13 minutes ago, jerryskids said: I have forgotten more about science than you've ever known. Medications are considered unsafe until proven safe, so the default is unsafe. Here is a statement on the long-term safety: Can you see the logical flaw in using the behavior of prior vaccines to analyze the effects of a radically new type of vaccine? And they've done enough testing to mark them safe and the after effects back that up. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jerryskids 5,165 Posted July 1, 2022 16 minutes ago, Sean Mooney said: And they've done enough testing to mark them safe and the after effects back that up. I'll take that as a "no, you can't see the flaw." Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Djgb13 2,338 Posted July 1, 2022 I wonder if libs forget they’re all on video saying these things https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZTRReyFpa/?k=1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TimHauck 1,790 Posted July 1, 2022 2 hours ago, RaiderHaters Revenge said: The dna that forms a separate life is not your body yes it is Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TimHauck 1,790 Posted July 1, 2022 3 hours ago, Masshole said: Just putting this out there, no reason really. . . They aren't, but let's stop with the facade that all Republicans "just want to give the power back to the states" Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TimHauck 1,790 Posted July 1, 2022 2 hours ago, jerryskids said: Not having the vaccine kills a human life a fraction of a fraction of a percent of the time. Having an abortion kills a human life 100% of the time. You're right Tim, great analogy, they are exactly the same, wheee$#@! Well for one I'm not the one that brought up the analogy. But again, they're also not the same because abortion will be a crime in some states. Not getting the vaccine is not a crime. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TimHauck 1,790 Posted July 1, 2022 1 hour ago, Masshole said: A child will perish without the full support of adult(s) until they are 8-10 years old or more. They are fully dependent on their parent(s) at least until 2-3 yrs old. Would literally starve to death or be eaten by a coyote if an adult wasn't tending to them. Does that mean we can just off a 2 yr old kid if we don't want to care for them or are struggling to support them? I never respected the "the fetus is dependent on the mother for its life" argument for abortion. Carry that logic to its end and think about what you've got. C'mon this is just playing word games. A fetus needs it's specific mother's body to survive until ~20-24 weeks. A child just needs someone, anyone really, to feed it and pick it up. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hardcore troubadour 12,576 Posted July 1, 2022 2 minutes ago, TimHauck said: Well for one I'm not the one that brought up the analogy. But again, they're also not the same because abortion will be a crime in some states. Not getting the vaccine is not a crime. You could lose your job and miss out on opportunities. Just like if a woman has a baby. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TimHauck 1,790 Posted July 1, 2022 2 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said: You could lose your job and miss out on opportunities. still not a crime Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Masshole 642 Posted July 1, 2022 4 minutes ago, TimHauck said: They aren't, but let's stop with the facade that all Republicans "just want to give the power back to the states" Tell me that you don't understand the constitution or the concept of "federalism" without saying that. . . At least the republicans are willing to let the states and their people debate the topics and make their own decisions. As opposed to the left that has to force everything thru executive order or agency or court over-reach because they can't win a debate on the substance of the issues. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Masshole 642 Posted July 1, 2022 4 minutes ago, TimHauck said: C'mon this is just playing word games. A fetus needs it's specific mother's body to survive until ~20-24 weeks. A child just needs someone, anyone really, to feed it and pick it up. You understand that you just made the argument to ban abortion and allow unwanted pregnancies/children to go full term and then be adopted or put into foster care? That's pretty extreme, I am not sure even I was willing to go that far. But you be you. Into the game of words, you come unarmed. . . 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hardcore troubadour 12,576 Posted July 1, 2022 6 minutes ago, TimHauck said: still not a crime I guess if a woman loses her job or opportunities because she had a kid then that’s not a crime either. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TimHauck 1,790 Posted July 1, 2022 11 minutes ago, Masshole said: Tell me that you don't understand the constitution or the concept of "federalism" without saying that. . . At least the republicans are willing to let the states and their people debate the topics and make their own decisions. As opposed to the left that has to force everything thru executive order or agency or court over-reach because they can't win a debate on the substance of the issues. Honestly I don't really follow politics that closely, enlighten me. How is it not hypocritical to simultaneously say "overturning Roe v Wade is just giving power back to the states!" and "putting in a nationwide ban on abortion is just an example of federalism!"? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TimHauck 1,790 Posted July 1, 2022 11 minutes ago, Masshole said: You understand that you just made the argument to ban abortion and allow unwanted pregnancies/children to go full term and then be adopted or put into foster care? That's pretty extreme, I am not sure even I was willing to go that far. But you be you. Into the game of words, you come unarmed. . . Actually in the beginning of this thread I pretty much said I could probably be OK with limiting abortion as long as we could ensure the babies were adopted into good families (definitely not put into foster care), and that the mothers did not need to pay a dime for their health care and were compensated for their time and any lost wages due to being pregnant. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TimHauck 1,790 Posted July 1, 2022 10 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said: I guess if a woman loses her job or opportunities because she had a kid then that’s not a crime either. No, but a felony is which it will be in Texas. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jerryskids 5,165 Posted July 1, 2022 3 minutes ago, TimHauck said: Actually in the beginning of this thread I pretty much said I could probably be OK with limiting abortion as long as we could ensure the babies were adopted into good families, and that the mothers did not need to pay a dime for their health care and were compensated for their time and any lost wages due to being pregnant. I think those things can be explored, but you bring up a larger point. The radical feminist position is that it isn't FAIR that women have to do the childbearing thing, and in doing so not reap all of the awesome benefits of casual, meaningless, unprotected sex that men do. One can argue how "awesome" it really is for women, because they aren't generally programmed to work that way, and that's because... the males and females of our species have different roles in the procreation process. Sorry not sorry, that's just how it is. If we're being fairsy, women live on average 5.4 years longer than men. Quote Life expectancy at birth for males was 75.1 years in the first half of 2020, representing a decline of 1.2 years from 76.3 years in 2019. For females, life expectancy declined to 80.5 years, decreasing 0.9 year from 81.4 years in 2019 (Figure 1). Ignore the decline which is mildly disturbing, maybe Covid? Anyway, 5.4 more years of life is not exactly fair, should men get compensated for their earlier demise? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RaiderHaters Revenge 3,565 Posted July 1, 2022 1 hour ago, Sean Mooney said: Other than how disease experts understand how diseases mutate and spread....sure. I'm sure you have locked in on it. Right those experts that said if I get the vaccine I can’t get Covid Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MDC 5,875 Posted July 1, 2022 Is overturning Roe really giving power back to the people if states enact trigger laws that are unpopular with a large % of the population? Texas is set to ban abortion in nearly all cases even though 45% of Texans think it should be legal in all or some cases. How is letting the state decide what half the population can or can’t do with their own bodies better than letting the people decide? 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sean Mooney 1,184 Posted July 1, 2022 5 hours ago, jerryskids said: I'll take that as a "no, you can't see the flaw." I'll take that as a "no, I don't see how they are safe despite all evidence supporting it." Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nobody 2,031 Posted July 1, 2022 6 hours ago, Hawkeye21 said: So, maybe about 500 more people died from covid than from the vaccine. With those small of numbers I see no reason to take the vaccine at all in that age range. It's not all about death though either. If a person is young and healthy they absolutely don't need the vax and shouldn't get it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TimHauck 1,790 Posted July 1, 2022 6 hours ago, Hawkeye21 said: So, maybe about 500 more people died from covid than from the vaccine. With those small of numbers I see no reason to take the vaccine at all in that age range. Wait you think 315 5-18 year olds died from the Covid vax? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hardcore troubadour 12,576 Posted July 1, 2022 We’ll find out how much damage the covidiots did to kids down the road. At least they were just morons. Teachers just didn’t want to go to work. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
weepaws 2,451 Posted July 1, 2022 1 hour ago, Hardcore troubadour said: We’ll find out how much damage the covidiots did to kids down the road. At least they were just morons. Teachers just didn’t want to go to work. That’s not all true, teachers here wanted to go back to work very badly, even had town hall meetings about it. Them are facts jack. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hardcore troubadour 12,576 Posted July 1, 2022 7 minutes ago, weepaws said: That’s not all true, teachers here wanted to go back to work very badly, even had town hall meetings about it. Them are facts jack. You’re right. I should have said the teachers union. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites