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2 minutes ago, dogcows said:

Actually, people vote based on perception. And the perception is that crime is out of control. I think that perception is somewhat inaccurate, but understandable based on local news, Fox News. and ubiquitous GOP advertising.

Fear is a great motivator, and the GOP uses it to great effect. I’m sure the strategy will have some success this year.

To an extent. The MSM has been hiding the crime for months, only recently have they stopped completely pretending it away.  So the people who view CNN/MSNBC....others....have all had a steady stream of "its not real". Until very recently that is.  And ONLY because polling has indicated it is an election factor, so they have been imploring their Democrat overlords to deal with it.  

And yet, Democrats have assiduously ignored it.  And it pisses people off, they will stop voting Democrat. It makes no sense to tell people their experiences are invalid, the Dems really need to stop doing that. 

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Just now, RLLD said:

To an extent. The MSM has been hiding the crime for months, only recently have they stopped completely pretending it away.  So the people who view CNN/MSNBC....others....have all had a steady stream of "its not real". Until very recently that is.  And ONLY because polling has indicated it is an election factor, so they have been imploring their Democrat overlords to deal with it.  

And yet, Democrats have assiduously ignored it.  And it pisses people off, they will stop voting Democrat. It makes no sense to tell people their experiences are invalid, the Dems really need to stop doing that. 

I have seen this same dance every election for decades. When it gets close to Election Day, the GOP buys TV ads and mails out flyers using stories of crime to try and scare people. It’s their go-to move. Crime went down 1% compared to the final year of Trump’s presidency, but we must vote GOP to stop crime! I guess many voters assume the right-wing has the magic recipe to stop crime. But it never ever works out that way.

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2 minutes ago, dogcows said:

I have seen this same dance every election for decades. When it gets close to Election Day, the GOP buys TV ads and mails out flyers using stories of crime to try and scare people. It’s their go-to move. Crime went down 1% compared to the final year of Trump’s presidency, but we must vote GOP to stop crime! I guess many voters assume the right-wing has the magic recipe to stop crime. But it never ever works out that way.

Except. There is plenty of evidence that they have been reporting on this for the last two years.....constantly. It is not recent. It is only "recent" in that the liberal media see that crime in so prevalent that people are pissed, and are voting based on it as a factor, so they are reporting on it to urge Democrats to at least pretend to be aware of it, and dealing with it. Its not working. 

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Report that the attacker was looking for Nancy:

Quote

The assailant was in search of Speaker Pelosi, according to a person briefed on the attack. Before the assault occurred, the intruder confronted Mr. Pelosi in their home shouting, “Where is Nancy, where is Nancy?”

Still, that doesn’t 100% prove it was politically motivated. Unlike Marco Rubio, I will wait for more facts before jumping to conclusions.

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20 minutes ago, dogcows said:

I have seen this same dance every election for decades. When it gets close to Election Day, the GOP buys TV ads and mails out flyers using stories of crime to try and scare people. It’s their go-to move. Crime went down 1% compared to the final year of Trump’s presidency, but we must vote GOP to stop crime! I guess many voters assume the right-wing has the magic recipe to stop crime. But it never ever works out that way.

I don’t remember too much of that in the 2000’s, especially in NY. Why would the republicans be running a lot of adds about a high crime rate back then? They were running adds bragging that they decreased it massively.  Fail. 

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As a matter of fact, into the 2010’s Bloomberg and other republicans were running adds saying “KEEP our streets safe”. And they couldn’t say enough that NYC was the safest big city in the country. Dog Cows just making things up. Unless he’s a six year old. 

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55 minutes ago, RLLD said:

Yep, I should have expected this, the Democrats are trying this too....and its another reason they are going to lose big this fall,

Stop trying to pretend its not happening, the people out in the communities hate it when Democrats pretend their experiences are invalid. Its killing your political people.....

At the very least though you would have to admit that if numbers show they are going down then it is a perception problem and not a reality one. And the sad reality is- in this instance this is FOX news and the right perpetuating that idea. I'm not saying the left doesn't do it as well but it is okay to admit that media will inflate things at times to create perception blurriness.

 

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Just now, Sean Mooney said:

At the very least though you would have to admit that if numbers show they are going down then it is a perception problem and not a reality one. And the sad reality is- in this instance this is FOX news and the right perpetuating that idea. I'm not saying the left doesn't do it as well but it is okay to admit that media will inflate things at times to create perception blurriness.

 

I think the those stats are flawed, and I think people don't care about those stats.  I think people care about what is going on out on main street, and across metro areas.....criminality has risen, criminals that are arrested are set free and commit more crimes....people are done.

Sit back on those numbers all you want, meanwhile people know what they are seeing and hearing, and trying to tell them that that are not experiencing what they are is a losing strategy. 

 

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2 minutes ago, Sean Mooney said:

At what point do both sides say "Maybe we've gone too far and need to pull this rhetoric back?"

Not sure. 

I think calling out crime as a problem is a good thing. Then dealing with it is a good thing.  I think both sides should be able to come together on this point, if nothing else. 

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1 minute ago, Sean Mooney said:

At what point do both sides say "Maybe we've gone too far and need to pull this rhetoric back?"

If we could only trace the increased violent rhetoric back to its source….

Quote

In the five years after President Donald J. Trump was elected in 2016 following a campaign featuring a remarkable level of violent language, the number of recorded threats against members of Congress increased more than tenfold, to 9,625 in 2021, according to figures from the Capitol Police, the federal law enforcement department that protects Congress.

In the first quarter of 2022, the latest period for which figures were available, the force opened 1,820 cases.

 

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39 minutes ago, RLLD said:

To an extent. The MSM has been hiding the crime for months, only recently have they stopped completely pretending it away.  So the people who view CNN/MSNBC....others....have all had a steady stream of "its not real". Until very recently that is.  And ONLY because polling has indicated it is an election factor, so they have been imploring their Democrat overlords to deal with it.  

And yet, Democrats have assiduously ignored it.  And it pisses people off, they will stop voting Democrat. It makes no sense to tell people their experiences are invalid, the Dems really need to stop doing that. 

What do you consider MSM?

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Just now, Pimpadeaux said:

What do you consider MSM?

CNN/MSNBC/CBS/ABC/NBC; WaPo/NY Times

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Crime going up is a perception, not a reality.  Got it. Does it work the other way around? When crime is going down is that perception or reality? Reality says it’s a reality. And even if the ridiculous notion that it’s just perception is accepted, people not feeling safe as much as they once did is an issue.   I know, just stop watching Fox and you’ll feel safe again. Never mind the reports in the local media. Like people being pushed in front of subway trains. 

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If I had a nickel for every time a man beat himself with a hammer to get away from his wife...which is really, really stupid. You have a focking hammer. Kill the b!tch. :mad:

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3 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

Crime going up is a perception, not a reality.  Got it. 

Well, gas prices were at $5 when Biden came into office, so...that must be a reality since our president says so. Anything goes for the liberals.

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1 minute ago, RLLD said:

Not sure. 

I think calling out crime as a problem is a good thing. Then dealing with it is a good thing.  I think both sides should be able to come together on this point, if nothing else. 

I agree, but to me that starts with honestly looking at the actual numbers. Then look at former anti-crime initiatives and see what works and what doesn’t.

But what we usually see is just giving a bunch more money to the police. That doesn’t always work. We had 376 police officers at the school in Uvalde and they didn’t do 💩 to save little kids who were bleeding to death on the floor just a few feet away from them.

Also, the side that constantly hammers on violent crime being an issue refuses to consider that gun control could help the situation too.

So, both sides should get together, go with the data and research, and maybe put money towards something that would work instead of giving blank checks to the cops over and over and over.

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4 minutes ago, RLLD said:

CNN/MSNBC/CBS/ABC/NBC; WaPo/NY Times

See, you left out Fox, the most mainstream, highest rated cable news network in the land. Newsmax is in the MSM ballpark as well.

Tucker Carlson is the highest-rated cable news host in the land as well, so that makes him kind of all MSM.

 

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Paul Pelosi getting HAMMERED. 

The headlines write themselves. 

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1 hour ago, dogcows said:

From the FBI crime stats for 2021:

 

Leftists are some of the dumbest people in society. Do you do any research at all? Here’s the data from far right NPR -

“Los Angeles and New York City did not report to the FBI. In fact, only 63% of the country's police departments submitted anything, and some of the data that was submitted was incomplete.”

“The gap includes the nation’s two largest cities by population, New York City and Los Angeles, as well as most agencies in five of the six most populous states: California, New York, Illinois, Pennsylvania, and Florida.”

So only 40% submit data excluding  the states where we are seeing the most crime, dogcows says crime has dropped. 

 

 

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3 hours ago, dogcows said:

Her husband was attacked with a hammer by a home invader. Suspect is in custody, but they haven’t released the name.

He gets hammered a lot

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4 minutes ago, Pimpadeaux said:

See, you left out Fox, the most mainstream, highest rated cable news network in the land. Newsmax is in the MSM ballpark as well.

Tucker Carlson is the highest-rated cable news host in the land as well, so that makes him kind of all MSM.

 

This is such a bull crap argument. NYT and WaPo alone have over 10 million digital subscribers not including home deliveries. Tucker Carlson viewership is on par with The View. 

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5 minutes ago, Dizkneelande said:

Leftists are some of the dumbest people in society. Do you do any research at all? Here’s the data from far right NPR -

“Los Angeles and New York City did not report to the FBI. In fact, only 63% of the country's police departments submitted anything, and some of the data that was submitted was incomplete.”

“The gap includes the nation’s two largest cities by population, New York City and Los Angeles, as well as most agencies in five of the six most populous states: California, New York, Illinois, Pennsylvania, and Florida.”

So only 40% submit data excluding  the states where we are seeing the most crime, dogcows says crime has dropped. 

 

 

He doesn’t know about that. Neither does Tim or the other libtards who actually think they have a clue. The left wing media they devour didn’t tell them. 

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6 minutes ago, Pimpadeaux said:

See, you left out Fox, the most mainstream, highest rated cable news network in the land. Newsmax is in the MSM ballpark as well.

Tucker Carlson is the highest-rated cable news host in the land as well, so that makes him kind of all MSM.

 

I did. I still consider them the opposition to power. For years they were mostly a joke, I know I did not watch them.

But then something happened, the Democrats lost their mind when Trump was elected, and the reporting from the MSM (the dominant entities in news at the time) went into a dark place. They shed any assemblance of impartiality and became the mouthpiece of the Democrat party. 

They enthusiastically went after Trump, as they should ANY president, but this was different. You had the Russian collusion hoax, which they have never apologized for.

Over and over they were caught lying, promoting Democrat talking points, being vile racists in some cases. Turning to Fox was organic, they seemed to be the only outlet that was making sense. When the truth came out in the end on topics, they seemed to be correct time after time

So now, the impropriety of MSM has elevated Fox news.  Still not MSM, but once Republicans are back in power, I could see them becoming that. 

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The label of MSM is applied to any media source right-wingers disagree with at any given point in time. 

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25 minutes ago, RLLD said:

I think the those stats are flawed, and I think people don't care about those stats.  I think people care about what is going on out on main street, and across metro areas.....criminality has risen, criminals that are arrested are set free and commit more crimes....people are done.

Sit back on those numbers all you want, meanwhile people know what they are seeing and hearing, and trying to tell them that that are not experiencing what they are is a losing strategy. 

 

Again- it's not that crime is not a problem....of course it is. I'm saying the idea that it is up 2 and 3 times or whatever other arguments are presented are not accurate. But the perception is that those numbers are up. Perception then becomes reality. 

3 minutes ago, RLLD said:

I did. I still consider them the opposition to power. For years they were mostly a joke, I know I did not watch them.

But then something happened, the Democrats lost their mind when Trump was elected, and the reporting from the MSM (the dominant entities in news at the time) went into a dark place. They shed any assemblance of impartiality and became the mouthpiece of the Democrat party. 

They enthusiastically went after Trump, as they should ANY president, but this was different. You had the Russian collusion hoax, which they have never apologized for.

Over and over they were caught lying, promoting Democrat talking points, being vile racists in some cases. Turning to Fox was organic, they seemed to be the only outlet that was making sense. When the truth came out in the end on topics, they seemed to be correct time after time

So now, the impropriety of MSM has elevated Fox news.  Still not MSM, but once Republicans are back in power, I could see them becoming that. 

When Obama was elected President back in 2008 he fistbumped with michelle on stage. Some FOX News programs called it a "terrorist signal."

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A whole bunch of people just got inspired for last second ideas for Halloween costumes for the weekend. :ninja:

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2 minutes ago, RLLD said:

I did. I still consider them the opposition to power. For years they were mostly a joke, I know I did not watch them.

But then something happened, the Democrats lost their mind when Trump was elected, and the reporting from the MSM (the dominant entities in news at the time) went into a dark place. They shed any assemblance of impartiality and became the mouthpiece of the Democrat party. 

They enthusiastically went after Trump, as they should ANY president, but this was different. You had the Russian collusion hoax, which they have never apologized for.

Over and over they were caught lying, promoting Democrat talking points, being vile racists in some cases. Turning to Fox was organic, they seemed to be the only outlet that was making sense. When the truth came out in the end on topics, they seemed to be correct time after time

So now, the impropriety of MSM has elevated Fox news.  Still not MSM, but once Republicans are back in power, I could see them becoming that. 

Fox is mainstream media, whether you like it or not, and is as bad at cranking out right-wing propaganda as MSNBC is at cranking out the lefty perspective. MSM is one of those alt-right buzz words to demonize popular news sources that produce information with which alt righties disagree. Look at all the viewers who fled Fox after it called the Arizona vote in Biden's favor.

Just because news sources have attained a certain level of popularity doesn't automatically make them biased and inaccurate.

Journalism as a whole has always leaned slightly left, but ABC, NBC, CBS, Reuters and Associated Press are as close to unbiased, fact-based and accurate news as it gets. But alt-righties don't like that because they don't want balance. They want it all alt-right.

I don't think this country has ever seen someone brainwash a huge chunk of our population the way Clownzo has.

 

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1 minute ago, Sean Mooney said:

Again- it's not that crime is not a problem....of course it is. I'm saying the idea that it is up 2 and 3 times or whatever other arguments are presented are not accurate. But the perception is that those numbers are up. Perception then becomes reality. 

When Obama was elected President back in 2008 he fistbumped with michelle on stage. Some FOX News programs called it a "terrorist signal."

Perhaps you and I will never see this situation in quite the same way.  I am comfortable with that. Mainly because the voters out there have watched it, know its true because they are living it, and I sense they are about to vote to get rid of those who are aligned with allowing it to happen. This is a good thing.  If we can get rid of Democrats, there is a chance to restore police and the courts system, get criminals off the streets. I have hope. 

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5 minutes ago, Sean Mooney said:

Again- it's not that crime is not a problem....of course it is. I'm saying the idea that it is up 2 and 3 times or whatever other arguments are presented are not accurate. But the perception is that those numbers are up. Perception then becomes reality. 

When Obama was elected President back in 2008 he fistbumped with michelle on stage. Some FOX News programs called it a "terrorist signal."

And more recently every left wing news outlet reported that the Capitol Hill rioters killed a police officer. And that Trump colluded  with Russia to steal the election and Brett Kavanaugh drank beer in high school. As long as we’re looking back. And let’s not forget mostly peaceful riots and looting. 

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7 minutes ago, dogcows said:

The label of MSM is applied to any media source right-wingers disagree with at any given point in time. 

The left could do the same with Fox, Newsmax, OAN, etc.

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1 minute ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

And more recently every left wing news outlet reported that the Capitol Hill rioters killed a police officer. And that Trump colluded  with Russia to steal the election and Brett Kavanaugh drank beer in high school. As long as we’re looking back. 

Adults are talking and we don't need the children coming in yelling "squirrel"

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Just now, Sean Mooney said:

Adults are talking and we don't need the children coming in yelling "squirrel"

Oh, only you get to go back and point out lies from the media. Yeah, you lose. 

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Just now, Pimpadeaux said:

Fox is mainstream media, whether you like it or not, and is as bad at cranking out right-wing propaganda as MSNBC is at cranking out the lefty perspective. MSM is one of those alt-right buzz words to demonize popular news sources that produce information with which alt righties disagree. Look at all the viewers who fled Fox after it called the Arizona vote in Biden's favor.

Just because news sources have attained a certain level of popularity doesn't automatically make them biased and inaccurate.

Journalism as a whole has always leaned slightly left, but ABC, NBC, CBS, Reuters and Associated Press are as close to unbiased, fact-based and accurate news as it gets. But alt-righties don't like that because they don't want balance. They want it all alt-right.

I don't think this country has ever seen someone brainwash a huge chunk of our population the way Clownzo has.

 

We can agree to disagree on whether Fox is MSM, I concede that the flight to Fox and away from the obvious lying of traditional MSM has resulted in Fox getting the best viewership and one can reasonably make the assertion that they are now effectively part of MSM.

I think accurately calling out media outlets when they lie is a good for the public, so in those terms I see Fox as our best defense against power right now.  I do not think that popularity is a indication of bias or inaccuracy, I think lying is the indication, and we have seen it mostly from those liberal outlets. 

Agree on the tilt of journalism, it has always been there, but in the last 10 years most outlets have abandoned even trying to report both sides. It used to be true that only Fax was like that, they were clownish, but now its ever present. At least Fox seems to be correct in what they report, even if it takes months or years for the truth to be allowed. 

 

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2 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

And more recently every left wing news outlet reported that the Capitol Hill rioters killed a police officer. And that Trump colluded  with Russia to steal the election and Brett Kavanaugh drank beer in high school. As long as we’re looking back. 

Not surprising you throw the baby out with bathwater. 

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Just now, RLLD said:

We can agree to disagree on whether Fox is MSM, I concede that the flight to Fox and away from the obvious lying of traditional MSM has resulted in Fox getting the best viewership and one can reasonably make the assertion that they are now effectively part of MSM.

I think accurately calling out media outlets when they lie is a good for the public, so in those terms I see Fox as our best defense against power right now.  I do not think that popularity is a indication of bias or inaccuracy, I think lying is the indication, and we have seen it mostly from those liberal outlets. 

Agree on the tilt of journalism, it has always been there, but in the last 10 years most outlets have abandoned even trying to report both sides. It used to be true that only Fax was like that, they were clownish, but now its ever present. At least Fox seems to be correct in what they report, even if it takes months or years for the truth to be allowed. 

 

You can't change the definition of the word "mainstream," whether you like it or not. Fox is the No. 1 MSM in the land thanks to its popularity. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/News_media_in_the_United_States

And Fox often is wrong.

https://www.politifact.com/personalities/fox-news-channel/

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