TimHauck 1,796 Posted January 20, 2023 One of the most under-rated players ever. The ironic thing IMO is Philly fans would often criticize him for "looking for a walk instead of a hit." But if he had converted 530 of his 1476 walks into hits he would have gotten 3,000 hits and been a lock Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
edjr 5,547 Posted January 20, 2023 Why not, Ozzie Smith, Harold Baines and Bert Blyleven are in and Clemens and Bonds are not. Who gives a fock who they let in? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Twinsdad 44 Posted January 20, 2023 IF he converted 530 of his 1476 walks into HRs he would be the all-time home run leader. BUT...guess what, he didn't. if ifs and buts were candy and nuts.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
edjr 5,547 Posted January 20, 2023 you've never been right before when you post here, why start now? 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TimHauck 1,796 Posted January 20, 2023 46 minutes ago, Twinsdad said: IF he converted 530 of his 1476 walks into HRs he would be the all-time home run leader. BUT...guess what, he didn't. if ifs and buts were candy and nuts.... a single is a lot different than a HR... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TimHauck 1,796 Posted January 20, 2023 Just now, edjr said: you've never been right before when you post here, why start now? I was right (and you were wrong) that the FHA loan qualification requirements didn't change 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hardcore troubadour 12,596 Posted January 20, 2023 Very good player. Sometimes those guys get in, sometimes the don’t. Kirby Puckett and Don Mattingly have very similar numbers. KP first ballot, DM never getting in. And that’s ok. Post season should count when judging a players career. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Twinsdad 44 Posted January 20, 2023 17 minutes ago, TimHauck said: a single is a lot different than a HR... ok then, but for him to convert those walks into singles, he'd have to hit .360 for those at bats.....he's a lifetime .291 hitter. So your reach to 3,000 is just as absurd as my reach to them being homeruns. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RaiderHaters Revenge 3,566 Posted January 20, 2023 no, and neither should half the people in there but I would say if Baines is why not Abreu the HOF is a sham til Bonds, Clemens, Sosa and McGwire are in they have already let in plenty of juicers, so they are total hypocrites Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hardcore troubadour 12,596 Posted January 20, 2023 8 minutes ago, Twinsdad said: ok then, but for him to convert those walks into singles, he'd have to hit .360 for those at bats.....he's a lifetime .291 hitter. So your reach to 3,000 is just as absurd as my reach to them being homeruns. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
zsasz 195 Posted January 20, 2023 Nah man. Minimal black ink. Never above 10th in MVP voting. Never led his league in BA/OBP/OBS/HRs etc. 30HRs in a season once. He was a good player.....but he's not HOF material. ETA: None of his player comps are in the HOF...AND he doesn't even have the support of his hometown(PHI) sports writers. There weren't many who liked him much. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
League Champion 1,593 Posted January 20, 2023 1 hour ago, TimHauck said: One of the most under-rated players ever. The ironic thing IMO is Philly fans would often criticize him for "looking for a walk instead of a hit." I agree but I don't think he's a Hall of Famer, very nice player though. He was very frustrating in the fact that he he'd be looking for a walk with 2 outs and a runner on third. It was more of his timing of looking for a walk. Sometimes you just need a hit. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
posty 2,296 Posted January 20, 2023 1 hour ago, RaiderHaters Revenge said: the HOF is a sham til Bonds, Clemens, Sosa and McGwire are in BINGO!!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
League Champion 1,593 Posted January 20, 2023 And especially Pete Rose Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
iam90sbaby 2,121 Posted January 20, 2023 Did he wear metal helmets too? 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
posty 2,296 Posted January 20, 2023 1 minute ago, League Champion said: And especially Pete Rose Nope... He should only get in after Joe Jackson gets in and after he has been dead for as long as Jackson was before he got in (if he ever does)... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
League Champion 1,593 Posted January 20, 2023 Just now, posty said: Nope... He should only get in after Joe Jackson gets in and after he has been dead for as long as Jackson was before he got in (if he ever does)... Pete got caught as a coach, not a player. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RaiderHaters Revenge 3,566 Posted January 20, 2023 6 minutes ago, League Champion said: And especially Pete Rose Nope rose gambled on his own team and is an absolute doush Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
League Champion 1,593 Posted January 20, 2023 Just now, RaiderHaters Revenge said: Nope rose gambled on his own team and is an absolute Apparently he never bet against his team though. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RaiderHaters Revenge 3,566 Posted January 20, 2023 3 minutes ago, League Champion said: Apparently he never bet against his team though. You don’t have any idea how insider gambling works do you? I’ve been in that industry for 25 years and know people who had players on the take it goes like this pete bets on reds to win. Bookie he bets with loads up cause he knows rose is gonna go all out to win pete doesn’t bet on reds to win what does that tell the bookies to do jose rijo talked a lot about his usage in games Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
League Champion 1,593 Posted January 20, 2023 2 minutes ago, RaiderHaters Revenge said: You don’t have any idea how insider gambling works do you? Jesus, calm down. Sorry I'm not a degenerate. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TimHauck 1,796 Posted January 20, 2023 1 hour ago, RaiderHaters Revenge said: no, and neither should half the people in there but I would say if Baines is why not Abreu the HOF is a sham til Bonds, Clemens, Sosa and McGwire are in they have already let in plenty of juicers, so they are total hypocrites I’m of the opinion that Bonds and Clemens should be in because they would’ve been HoF’ers without the roids. McGwire and Sosa wouldn’t have been, so I’m OK leaving them out. I think that’s kinda part of the argument for Abreu too. If you take out the juicers from his era he looks a lot better. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
posty 2,296 Posted January 20, 2023 10 minutes ago, RaiderHaters Revenge said: Nope rose gambled on his own team and is an absolute doush You got that right, Pete Rose is a huge douche... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
League Champion 1,593 Posted January 20, 2023 Just now, posty said: You got that right, Pete Rose is a huge douche... No doubt, but a hell of a ball player. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RaiderHaters Revenge 3,566 Posted January 20, 2023 5 minutes ago, League Champion said: Jesus, calm down. Sorry I'm not a degenerate. I wasn’t calling you out. I went on to explain bro reread Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
League Champion 1,593 Posted January 20, 2023 Just now, RaiderHaters Revenge said: I wasn’t calling you out. I went on to explain bro reread No worries, I gotcha Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RaiderHaters Revenge 3,566 Posted January 20, 2023 4 minutes ago, TimHauck said: I’m of the opinion that Bonds and Clemens should be in because they would’ve been HoF’ers without the roids. McGwire and Sosa wouldn’t have been, so I’m OK leaving them out. I think that’s kinda part of the argument for Abreu too. If you take out the juicers from his era he looks a lot better. Maybe. This is true. But you got a couple guys in like sosa and McGwire. Bagwell and piazza I don’t know if they are hof without juice Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
League Champion 1,593 Posted January 20, 2023 If Abreu is a Hall of Famer then there's tons of others who are deserving as well. How many people do we need in the Hall? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BufordT 371 Posted January 20, 2023 You got me to look at his career stats. Better than I thought He had 10 seasons with an OBP of .400 or better and 2 more at .390+ with a career OBP of .395. Not too shabby. He had 8 seasons with 100+ runs scored and 3 more seasons with 90+ runs scored. Not too shabby He had 8 seasons with 100+ RBI's. 14 seasons with 20+ SB's He did strike out a lot for someone who didn't hit a lot of HR's Surprised he only has 1 gold glove but he was a plus outfielder defensively with a good arm. All that said. Not quite a HOFer in my book but better than some of the schlubbs already in there. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RaiderHaters Revenge 3,566 Posted January 20, 2023 1 minute ago, League Champion said: If Abreu is a Hall of Famer then there's tons of others who are deserving as well. How many people do we need in the Hall? I think I’d eliminate at least half of the hall of good to decent Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RaiderHaters Revenge 3,566 Posted January 20, 2023 2 minutes ago, BufordT said: You got me to look at his career stats. Better than I thought He had 10 seasons with an OBP of .400 or better and 2 more at .390+ with a career OBP of .395. Not too shabby. He had 8 seasons with 100+ runs scored and 3 more seasons with 90+ runs scored. Not too shabby He had 8 seasons with 100+ RBI's. 14 seasons with 20+ SB's He did strike out a lot for someone who didn't hit a lot of HR's Surprised he only has 1 gold glove but he was a plus outfielder defensively with a good arm. All that said. Not quite a HOFer in my book but better than some of the schlubbs already in there. He’s a lessor tim Raines who I don’t think is deserving Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
League Champion 1,593 Posted January 20, 2023 Just now, RaiderHaters Revenge said: I think I’d eliminate at least half of the hall of good to decent I agree. The Hall was meant to celebrate the best of the best. Now we're talking Abreu?? Seriously? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RaiderHaters Revenge 3,566 Posted January 20, 2023 2 minutes ago, League Champion said: I agree. The Hall was meant to celebrate the best of the best. Now we're talking Abreu?? Seriously? I have the strictest guideline for the hof of anyone. I think you should get one vote after 5 years and require 90% to get in. If you get 75% you get a second shot the following year. however for those who have votes. If a player gets 90% and you voted no. Like these holier than thou reporters do you lose your vote for 5 years since clearly you have no clue anyways Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BufordT 371 Posted January 20, 2023 5 minutes ago, RaiderHaters Revenge said: He’s a lessor tim Raines who I don’t think is deserving Too me, Raines had 2 careers. Before the age of 30 then after the age of 30. Agree. Shouldn't be in. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TimHauck 1,796 Posted January 20, 2023 8 minutes ago, League Champion said: I agree. The Hall was meant to celebrate the best of the best. Now we're talking Abreu?? Seriously? I assume you're a Phillies fan. What do you think of Rolen and Rollins' cases? I'm probably biased as Abreu was my favorite player but I'd take Abreu over both of them. The only advantage they have over Abreu is better defense (and Abreu was an OF'er which where the competition is more stiff), and Rollins had one MVP year. Saw Jayson Stark voted for both Rolen and Rollins, but not Abreu, which was part of my motivation for this thread. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RaiderHaters Revenge 3,566 Posted January 20, 2023 4 minutes ago, TimHauck said: I assume you're a Phillies fan. What do you think of Rolen and Rollins' cases? I'm probably biased as Abreu was my favorite player but I'd take Abreu over both of them. The only advantage they have over Abreu is better defense (and Abreu was an OF'er which where the competition is more stiff), and Rollins had one MVP year. Saw Jayson Stark voted for both Rolen and Rollins, but not Abreu, which was part of my motivation for this thread. Easy no to all 3 i think you need to be at least top 2 at your position for a decade to be considered Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
League Champion 1,593 Posted January 20, 2023 6 minutes ago, TimHauck said: What do you think of Rolen and Rollins' cases? I love Rollins, not a Hall of Famer but a clutch player who I always enjoyed. I hate Scott Rolen (not a Hall of Famer). He was such a d-bag that his teammates, fans and probably his own Wife hated him. Chase Utley, now I'm listening Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TimHauck 1,796 Posted January 20, 2023 9 minutes ago, League Champion said: I love Rollins, not a Hall of Famer but a clutch player who I always enjoyed. I hate Scott Rolen (not a Hall of Famer). He was such a d-bag that his teammates, fans and probably his own Wife hated him. Chase Utley, now I'm listening Fair enough. I did see this on Rollins which was interesting: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites