Patrick Mahomes, Joe Burrow, Jalen Hurts, Josh Allen, Justin Jefferson MVP finalists

[cmh6476 750]

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2023/01/25/patrick-mahomes-joe-burrow-jalen-hurts-josh-allen-justin-jefferson-are-the-ap-mvp-finalists/

 

Chiefs DT Chris Jones, Cowboys LB Parsons, and 49ers LB Bosa 3 finalists for DPOTY

[cmh6476 750]

I voted for the Chiefs but I'll guess Mahomes and Bosa.  

[taco breath 419]

In a place like this you're going to get seven votes why even bother?

[weepaws 2,456]

I vote Geno Smith ff mvp.  

[cmh6476 750]

7 hours ago, taco breath said:

In a place like this you're going to get seven votes why even bother?

Not really worried about this poll, just the actual outcome

[weepaws 2,456]

54 minutes ago, cmh6476 said:

Not really worried about this poll, just the actual outcome

What outcome would you be worried about? 

[cmh6476 750]

18 minutes ago, weepaws said:

What outcome would you be worried about? 

not worried about, just interested in both.

[TBayXXXVII 2,108]

Mahomes & Bosa

[League Champion 1,593]

Hurts easily. The Eagles don't even sniff the playoffs without him. 

 

[TBayXXXVII 2,108]

38 minutes ago, League Champion said:

Hurts easily. The Eagles don't even sniff the playoffs without him. 

 

I don't think that's the case.  Seattle got into the playoffs with a 9-8 record and the Giants with a 9-7-1 record... neither have a team as good as the Eagles and Minshew is just as good as Smith and Jones.  The Eagles, with their schedule should've been able to hit at least 9 wins without Hurts.  Even if I agree with you that the Eagles still miss the playoffs, they're still at worst 7 or 8 win team... with Chad Henne, the Chiefs have 4 wins and are picking in the top 5 of the draft.

If you want to use the "The Eagles don't even sniff the playoffs without him" argument, in regards to Hurts, Tampa is probably 0-17 without Brady.

[weepaws 2,456]

1 hour ago, TBayXXXVII said:

I don't think that's the case.  Seattle got into the playoffs with a 9-8 record and the Giants with a 9-7-1 record... neither have a team as good as the Eagles and Minshew is just as good as Smith and Jones.  The Eagles, with their schedule should've been able to hit at least 9 wins without Hurts.  Even if I agree with you that the Eagles still miss the playoffs, they're still at worst 7 or 8 win team... with Chad Henne, the Chiefs have 4 wins and are picking in the top 5 of the draft.

If you want to use the "The Eagles don't even sniff the playoffs without him" argument, in regards to Hurts, Tampa is probably 0-17 without Brady.

Minshew wasn’t better than Jones or ff mvp G Smith this past season. Minshew 57% completion 3tds 3 ints.  

I don’t that that the eagles don’t sniff the playoff without Hurt, but their not nearly as good with Minshew. And they probably don’t make the playoffs, they would have been in a battle for a wildcard slot.  

Bucs have problems with coaching.  

[League Champion 1,593]

2 hours ago, TBayXXXVII said:

don't think that's the case.  Seattle got into the playoffs with a 9-8 record and the Giants with a 9-7-1 record... neither have a team as good as the Eagles and Minshew 

Minshew went 0-2 and was beyond horrible doing so. 

[TBayXXXVII 2,108]

1 hour ago, weepaws said:

Minshew wasn’t better than Jones or ff mvp G Smith this past season. Minshew 57% completion 3tds 3 ints.  

I don’t that that the eagles don’t sniff the playoff without Hurt, but their not nearly as good with Minshew. And they probably don’t make the playoffs, they would have been in a battle for a wildcard slot.  

Bucs have problems with coaching.  

Come on.  Minshew played 2 games, without their starting LT I believe, and they didn't even put in a full game plan.  They all but had the #1 seed locked up and didn't want to give away anything.  Even their last game against the Giants was the same thing.  Plus, both Jones and Smith both had losing records after their bye weeks.  Teams figured them out and they struggled to win games.

Yes, the Bucs do have a coaching problem, that's why they go 0-17 if they had Gabbert or Trask in there instead of Brady.  That's how valuable Brady was.

[jrokh 568]

3 hours ago, TBayXXXVII said:

Minshew is just as good as Smith and Jones.

LMAO. Is everyone this clueless in Tampa?

[League Champion 1,593]

29 minutes ago, jrokh said:

LMAO. Is everyone this clueless in Tampa?

Yes, they don't know pro sports in Tampa, they're dolts when it comes to pro football. 

[TBayXXXVII 2,108]

54 minutes ago, League Champion said:

Minshew went 0-2 and was beyond horrible doing so. 

Most QB's do when the team doesn't put a game plan in.  Hurts was 20-35 for 229 yards with 1 int and only 13 rushing yards against the Giants.

[League Champion 1,593]

2 minutes ago, TBayXXXVII said:

Most QB's do when the team doesn't put a game plan in.  Hurts was 20-35 for 229 yards with 1 int and only 13 rushing yards against the Giants.

What makes you think there wasn't a game plan? They needed those games, they hadn't clinched yet. I watch every Eagles game. The playbook was wide open with Minshew. They didn't change a thing. 

[TBayXXXVII 2,108]

1 minute ago, League Champion said:

What makes you think there wasn't a game plan? They needed those games, they hadn't clinched yet. I watch every Eagles game. The playbook was wide open with Minshew. They didn't change a thing. 

LOL, come on.  You think those games looked anything like the first 13?  Seriously?  Minshew threw the ball 40 times.  Do you know how many times Hurts threw the ball 40 times this year?  It was less than 1.  The Eagles never trailed that game until there was 2 minutes left in the game.  The Eagles don't throw the ball like that.  They run, a lot.  If your excuse is that Hurts is a big part of that run game, I'm not buying it.  There is NO WAY, that if Minshew was NEEDED to WIN them that game, that he throws the ball 40 times when they were never trailing.

The Saints game... the first 3 plays of the game were pass attempts, Minshew was sacked twice.  They punted.  The next drive started out with 2 runs for 9 yards.  They proceeded to pass on 3rd and 1... Minshew got sacked.  You really think that if the Eagles needed that game, those 2 series fall that way?  Come on.

Didn't change a thing?  They threw the ball 40 times in a game they never trailed until the very end.  That never happened all year!

Didn't change a thing?  They started off with 4 pass attempts on the first 6 plays of the game, gave up 3 sacks.  That never happened all year.

No, they didn't change a thing.  Come off it.

[League Champion 1,593]

2 minutes ago, TBayXXXVII said:

LOL, come on.  You think those games looked anything like the first 13?  Seriously?  Minshew threw the ball 40 times.  Do you know how many times Hurts threw the ball 40 times this year?  It was less than 1. 

You just sealed my point. They didn't have to with Hurts because he's that good. Gotcha! 

[TBayXXXVII 2,108]

2 minutes ago, League Champion said:

You just sealed my point. They didn't have to with Hurts because he's that good. Gotcha! 

Nice try, but no.  You claimed they didn't change a thing.  I proved that they did.  Swing and miss bud.

[weepaws 2,456]

2 hours ago, TBayXXXVII said:

Come on.  Minshew played 2 games, without their starting LT I believe, and they didn't even put in a full game plan.  They all but had the #1 seed locked up and didn't want to give away anything.  Even their last game against the Giants was the same thing.  Plus, both Jones and Smith both had losing records after their bye weeks.  Teams figured them out and they struggled to win games.

Yes, the Bucs do have a coaching problem, that's why they go 0-17 if they had Gabbert or Trask in there instead of Brady.  That's how valuable Brady was.

Not buying Minshew.  

[League Champion 1,593]

38 minutes ago, TBayXXXVII said:

Nice try, but no.  You claimed they didn't change a thing.  I proved that they did.  Swing and miss bud.

Minshew doesn't have anywhere near the skillset that Hurts has. Isn't that the ultimate point and why he should be MVP. Hurts only lost 1 game all season (15-1). Minshew went 0-2, Yes Hurts is the MVP 

[TBayXXXVII 2,108]

30 minutes ago, League Champion said:

Minshew doesn't have anywhere near the skillset that Hurts has. Isn't that the ultimate point and why he should be MVP. Hurts only lost 1 game all season (15-1). Minshew went 0-2, Yes Hurts is the MVP 

Never said Minshew did have the skill set of Hurts, nice try making a straw man argument.  In fact, I compared what Minshew could do with mediocre QB's who only won 9 games.

[TBayXXXVII 2,108]

55 minutes ago, weepaws said:

Not buying Minshew.  

Minshew went 6-6 with a garbage Jacksonville team.  I think he can win 9 with a team who had a great OLine, great defense, excellent WR's, and a solid running game.

[jrokh 568]

40 minutes ago, TBayXXXVII said:

Minshew went 6-6 with a garbage Jacksonville team.  I think he can win 9 with a team who had a great OLine, great defense, excellent WR's, and a solid running game.

This coming from the guy who claimed in the pre-season that both Blaine Gabbert, AND Kyle Trask were better than Trevor Lawrence. What a clown show you are...

[League Champion 1,593]

45 minutes ago, TBayXXXVII said:

Minshew went 6-6 with a garbage Jacksonville team.  I think he can win 9 with a team who had a great OLine, great defense, excellent WR's, and a solid running game.

"This coming from the guy who claimed in the pre-season that both Blaine Gabbert, AND Kyle Trask were better than Trevor Lawrence". 

YOU SERIOUSLY SAID THIS? 

[weepaws 2,456]

1 hour ago, TBayXXXVII said:

Minshew went 6-6 with a garbage Jacksonville team.  I think he can win 9 with a team who had a great OLine, great defense, excellent WR's, and a solid running game.

One would think that Minshew would win at least nine with that lineup.  

After all Smith and Jones both won nine games, and I would say on lesser quality of teams.  So saying that Minshew would win nine games with more talent to work with doesn’t say anything about him being better than Jones who won nine games or Smith who won nine games.  

Thanks 

[TBayXXXVII 2,108]

13 hours ago, weepaws said:

One would think that Minshew would win at least nine with that lineup.  

After all Smith and Jones both won nine games, and I would say on lesser quality of teams.  So saying that Minshew would win nine games with more talent to work with doesn’t say anything about him being better than Jones who won nine games or Smith who won nine games.  

Thanks 

He claimed that the Eagles wouldn't make the playoffs if it weren't for Hurts.  I said that with the talent on the team, he could.  That was my point.  It wasn't about Smith or Jones being better or worse than Minshew, though, I'm not so sure there's all that much separation.   I would say that Jones is better, how much may be nominal.  Geno Smith has been in the league for what, 10 years and he finally had a season where he was competent.  Sorry, I'm not going to give him the benefit of the doubt over anyone.  Let's see what happens next year before we start saying "he's better than...".

As far as the Giants are concerned, I'd contend that Barkley had more to do with the teams success than Jones.  The Giants were running that dude into the ground in the first 10 games.  He averaged over 25 touches a game up to week 10 (9 games), and they were 7-2.  After they backed off a bit, in the last 7 games (not counting the Eagles game that he didn't play in), he averaged 18 touches a game, and they were 2-4-1.  I don't think it's a coincidence that in the first 9 games, Barkley averaged 25+ touches a game and Jones 26+ pass attempts that they went 7-2 and in the last 7 (again, not counting the Eagles game), they went 2-4-1 with Barkley averaging 18 touches a game and Jones 33 passes a game.

 

[TBayXXXVII 2,108]

16 hours ago, League Champion said:

"This coming from the guy who claimed in the pre-season that both Blaine Gabbert, AND Kyle Trask were better than Trevor Lawrence". 

YOU SERIOUSLY SAID THIS? 

 

Honestly, when talking to him, I just say things to egg him on.  He's the straw man and the "Not uh" king of the world.  He exaggerates everything and when anyone makes a comment, he just says you're wrong without giving reasons why.  I read his posts, laugh at him, and move on.

As an example.  At the end of last year, someone asked how we'd rank that years rookie QB seasons.  I had Mac Jones and the Houston kid #1 and #2, I then had guys who never played, like Trask and Book (I think), then Lawrence and White.  My reasoning was that that Jones and the Houston kid did pretty well while White and Lawrence sucked azz.  I said that guys who didn't play had a better year than guys who were garbage.  He went to the extreme to say that I claimed that Trask was a better QB than Lawrence.  Anytime I've talked about Trask, I've never been complimentary of him.  I've always said that since the team drafted him, they should see what they have in him after Brady left... but I never said he was going to be any good.

For the record, I don't think Lawrence is anywhere as good as what he was supposed to be.  I don't think he'll be as bad as his rookie season and I think this past season might be the best he ever has.  I think his ceiling is a mediocre starter.  To note, I never said Trask was ever going to be any good at all.

[jrokh 568]

2 minutes ago, TBayXXXVII said:

As far as the Giants are concerned, I'd contend that Barkley had more to do with the teams success than Jones.  The Giants were running that dude into the ground in the first 10 games.  He averaged over 25 touches a game up to week 10 (9 games), and they were 7-2. 

You have no clue what you are talking about. The Giants schedule was the reason for their tough second half.  They played the Lions, the comanche's twice, the Eagles twice, the Cowboys, and Minny on the road. Their only 'easy' game was against the Colts, which they won 38-10. Daniel Jones finished tied for 6th in the NFL in Total QBR at 60.8 (coincidentally with Geno Smith). Your boy Brady was 18th at 52.5, barely average. If Minshew had been playing all season with his top pass catchers as Ritchie James, Isiah Hodgins, and Daniel Bellinger, the Giants would have been lucky to win 4 games. Every post you make on this topic is idiotic...

[weepaws 2,456]

Seems like one is saying that Minshew would benefit from having a great oline, great WRs, and a great def, but Jones nine wins  don’t count cause he had Barkely on his team.  

[cmh6476 750]

Chris Jones dominated tonight

[League Champion 1,593]

On 1/27/2023 at 8:57 PM, weepaws said:

Seems like one is saying that Minshew would benefit from having a great oline, great WRs, and a great def, but Jones nine wins  don’t count cause he had Barkely on his team.  

Minshew had the best o-line and still went 0-2. 

[weepaws 2,456]

And to very good WRs, and still went 0-2.  

[TBayXXXVII 2,108]

On 1/27/2023 at 8:57 PM, weepaws said:

Seems like one is saying that Minshew would benefit from having a great oline, great WRs, and a great def, but Jones nine wins  don’t count cause he had Barkely on his team.  

If that's what you're reading, go back and read it again.

[TBayXXXVII 2,108]

15 hours ago, League Champion said:

Minshew had the best o-line and still went 0-2. 

...and they were running a bland vanilla offense both games.  Something they wouldn't have done if Minshew was going to be their guy going forward.

[cmh6476 750]

On 1/25/2023 at 9:26 PM, cmh6476 said:

I voted for the Chiefs but I'll guess Mahomes and Bosa.  

Ding ding ding