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4 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

You’re an extremely intelligent and thoughtful guy and it shows in a post like this one. 
 

But I also think you’re very naive when it comes to racism. And precisely because you’re so smart, I have to believe your naïveté is willful. I think you realize that it would upset your world view to accept reality on this matter. 

This is pretty hilarious based on how wrong you’ve been elsewhere in this thread.  It’s typical liberal thinking.  The faux moral superiority oozes from your posts.

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The ongoing issues affecting farmers in the US is tragic. The entire sector remains under pressure from big agri-business, this crosses racial lines and is not just an issue that black farmers deal with. Black farmers are struggling because all farmers are struggling and so by focusing on race, Tim is barking up the wrong tree. 

I have to say though that farming is a special case of "Noun + Verb + Sh*t that happened 60 years ago" because the ongoing struggles for small farmers and political power weilded by large ones has been an ongoing since the New Deal, preceding the Civil Rights movement. I would however assume that the targeting of black farmers for special abuse almost surely ended 60 years ago because that's when race-based abuses ended everywhere else.

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32 minutes ago, Voltaire said:

I would however assume that the targeting of black farmers for special abuse almost surely ended 60 years ago

I literally showed you proof that this isn’t true.  Yet another case of the GC refusing to change their mind despite obvious evidence, it’d be funny if it wasn’t so sad.

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Just now, TimHauck said:

I literally showed you proof that this isn’t true.  Yet another case of the GC refusing to change their mind despite obvious evidence, it’d be funny if it wasn’t so sad.

Yet calling this out only gives you faux moral superiority, according to some. 

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Pigford v. Glickman (1999) was a class actionlawsuit against the United States Department of Agriculture (USDA), alleging that it had racially discriminated against African-American farmers in its allocation of farm loans and assistance between 1981 and 1996. The lawsuit was settled on April 14, 1999, by Judge Paul L. Friedman of the U.S. District Court for the District of Columbia.[1][2] To date, almost $1 billion US dollars have been paid or credited to fewer than 20,000 farmers under the settlement's consent decree, under what is reportedly the largest civil rights settlement to date. Due to delay tactics by the U.S. government, more than 70,000 farmers were treated as filing late and thus did not have their claims heard. The 2008 Farm Bill provided for additional claims to be heard. In December 2010, Congress appropriated $1.2 billion for what is called Pigford II, settlement for the second part of the case.[2]

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1 hour ago, The Real timschochet said:

You’re an extremely intelligent and thoughtful guy and it shows in a post like this one. 
 

But I also think you’re very naive when it comes to racism. And precisely because you’re so smart, I have to believe your naïveté is willful. I think you realize that it would upset your world view to accept reality on this matter. 

White guy who grew up outside of Detroit is willfully naive about racism says California liberal. 

That's awesome!  :lol:

 

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44 minutes ago, TimHauck said:

Why would the banks settle if they did nothing wrong?  That’s nice that you “hope” they weren’t racist though, lol.

And no, it was worse for the black farmers.  Here’s a video on the Pigford v Glickman lawsuit that I had actually already seen previously:

 

Success in the legal system is a poker game. McDonalds had as un-losable a case as could be, yet everyone alive in 1994 remembers the story about how a jury consisting of twelve abject morons decided McDonald's had to cough up $$$ millions to a dingbat who dumped hot coffee on herself. Bajillion dollar mega-corporations often seek to settle out of court, rather than play their hands, no matter how strong it is.

Not saying these banks had a strong or weak hand....not say it at all... I have no idea how accurate the allegations were.

Settlements happen all the time. Facebook settled with Illinois over biotech data, NBC settled with Nick Sandmann. President Trump settled a suit with a bunch of protestors who claim they were roughed up.

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3 minutes ago, 5-Points said:

White guy who grew up outside of Detroit is willfully naive about racism says California liberal. 

That's awesome!  :lol:

 

I don’t care where he was born. He wrote that systemic racism no longer exists in the USA. He’s been offered factual evidence to the contrary and he denies it. Sorry but he’s not being credible. 

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2 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

I don’t care where he was born. He wrote that systemic racism no longer exists in the USA. He’s been offered factual evidence to the contrary and he denies it. Sorry but he’s not being credible. 

:lol:

Liberals are so stupid.

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2 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

I don’t care where he was born. He wrote that systemic racism no longer exists in the USA. He’s been offered factual evidence to the contrary and he denies it. Sorry but he’s not being credible. 

He will readily admit that Affirmative Action is modern day systemic racism. Will you? 

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2 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

No. 

So you deny that there is systemic racism in America. Got it.

Or is it OK with you if it is used against a certain race? Because that would be racist. 

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16 minutes ago, TimHauck said:

I literally showed you proof that this isn’t true.  Yet another case of the GC refusing to change their mind despite obvious evidence, it’d be funny if it wasn’t so sad.

I watched the video and I think what happened to those black farmers was awful and I'm glad they got the settlement. What exactly is in the video is it that you are referring to? They raised an issue about the timeframe for how quickly the loan applications were processed based on race that I felt was worth a good look.

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19 minutes ago, 5-Points said:

So you deny that there is systemic racism in America. Got it.

Or is it OK with you if it is used against a certain race? Because that would be racist. 

He doesn't know what systemic racism nor what it looks like.

Affirmative action IS what systemic racism looks like because we're judging people based on skin color.

Now, he can justify affirmative action with "noun+verb+60 years ago", and although I would disagree, I could at least give him credit for acknowledging reality while spouting the party line, but he won't even do that.

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12 minutes ago, Voltaire said:

I watched the video and I think what happened to those black farmers was awful and I'm glad they got the settlement. 

So you agree that what happened to them was an example of systemic racism then?

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2 minutes ago, TimHauck said:

So you agree that what happened to them was an example of systemic racism then?

I don't know the specifics, and really only know one side because of this video, but the time to process loan applications (60 vs 220 days) seems seriously suspect and I would find it near impossible that there are enough legitimate, unrelated factors to explain such a vast discrepancy. Also the court agreed.

 

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5 minutes ago, Voltaire said:

He doesn't know what systemic racism nor what it looks like.

Affirmative action IS what systemic racism looks like because we're judging people based on skin color.

Now, he can justify affirmative action with "noun+verb+60 years ago", and although I would disagree, I could at least give him credit for acknowledging reality while spouting the party line, but he won't even do that.

Exactly. The state mandates you deny the more qualified applicant in favor of a lesser qualified applicant based solely on skin color. 

Not systemic racism in Tim's book. Tells you all you need to know.

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45 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

Yet calling this out only gives you faux moral superiority, according to some. 

You literally take advantage of brown laborers because they are illegally here and don’t have full employment protections.  Spare us with the savior complex.

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53 minutes ago, 5-Points said:

So you deny that there is systemic racism in America. Got it.

Or is it OK with you if it is used against a certain race? Because that would be racist. 

I’m not really a fan of affirmative action, particularly with regard to universities. I don’t think it’s fair especially to Asian students. I think it creates resentment. And most important, I think it’s a lazy solution to a complicated problem. Black students by and large receive poorer educations than others do in primary and high school. You can’t fix that by giving them help to go to college. You have to fix it by improving the primary and high schools. But that’s a lot of work. 
 

But I also don’t think affirmative action is racism because the intent is not to discriminate to give people in need a helping hand.  Intent is extremely important to me in terms of judging actions. 

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13 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

But I also don’t think affirmative action is racism because the intent is not to discriminate to give people in need a helping hand.  Intent is extremely important to me in terms of judging actions. 

Affirmative Action was/is absolutely racism. It's state sanctioned denial of  better qualified applicants in favor of lesser qualified applicants based solely on skin color.

How can that possibly not be construed as racism?

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6 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

I’m not really a fan of affirmative action, particularly with regard to universities. I don’t think it’s fair especially to Asian students. I think it creates resentment. And most important, I think it’s a lazy solution to a complicated problem. Black students by and large receive poorer educations than others do in primary and high school. You can’t fix that by giving them help to go to college. You have to fix it by improving the primary and high schools. But that’s a lot of work. 
 

But I also don’t think affirmative action is racism because the intent is not to discriminate to give people in need a helping hand.  Intent is extremely important to me in terms of judging actions. 

Totally agree with the first paragraph.  As an example of affirmative action in universities, I present to you the MIT Career Advising and Professional Development statement to recruiting companies regarding diversity.  Basically, they say that companies should devalue the grades of their students because black people get worse grades.  So if you are a white or Asian kid who busted his ass to get a 3.7 at our university, please step aside for the 2.7 GPA black kid:

Quote

Remove GPA requirements from your job or internship postings

High GPAs do not translate to workforce readiness. Consider skills not academic majors. This Handshake blog post reviewed the data and explains how GPA requirements disadvantages black students. If you are using GPA to filter your applicants, you are leaving behind a talented candidate pool at MIT.

https://capd.mit.edu/resources/recruiting-underrepresented-students/

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High school kids in Baltimore can barely read. How come that’s not systemic racism? 

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3 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

High school kids in Baltimore can barely read. How come that’s not systemic racism? 

How come eubonics is not considered for proficiency in a foriegn language?  Lots of kids could use the credits towards graduation and would get high marks and so boost their GPA's.  

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Fake racism is everywhere. This one is new though. They got really creative: apparently the reason the officers who were thrown under the bus promptly is because they are black. 🤦‍♂️ 

Corporate media giant NYTimes: https://archive.is/HdxOK

Every time these dummies inhale, "racism" comes out when they exhale.

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13 hours ago, The Real timschochet said:

I’m not really a fan of affirmative action, particularly with regard to universities. I don’t think it’s fair especially to Asian students. I think it creates resentment. And most important, I think it’s a lazy solution to a complicated problem. Black students by and large receive poorer educations than others do in primary and high school. You can’t fix that by giving them help to go to college. You have to fix it by improving the primary and high schools. But that’s a lot of work. 
 

But I also don’t think affirmative action is racism because the intent is not to discriminate to give people in need a helping hand.  Intent is extremely important to me in terms of judging actions. 

Tim, can't you see in this post you seem to be saying that you don't think it's racism because it's for a good cause, or at least you agree with what they are doing?  

 

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14 hours ago, The Real timschochet said:

 

But I also don’t think affirmative action is racism because the intent is not to discriminate to give people in need a helping hand.  Intent is extremely important to me in terms of judging actions. 

If you actually cared about people in need, you would be for economic-based affirmative action. You're so in the tank on racial issues, that you think "black" and "people in need" are synonyms.

 

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I did some digging, sounds like the Memphis dept needs a criminal investigation in general. The word I get is that the dept is a mess and it’s a mess because of bad leadership, apparently this Sarah Lynn davis? Not sure who that is, but the name was dropped to me….apparently she comes there from Atlanta where she was booted for unethical behavior? I will look into that to see if it’s true….

These guys should have never been cops, and I think the DOJ may need to take over this thing entirely….sounds like a complete mess

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5 minutes ago, Voltaire said:

If you actually cared about people in need, you would be for economic-based affirmative action. You're so in the tank on racial issues, that you think "black" and "people in need" are synonyms.

 

I think you missed the point of that post. It doesn’t matter whether I think black people are in need; it matters that the people who designed affirmative action thought so. That’s why I reject labeling what they did as racism. 

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10 minutes ago, RLLD said:

I did some digging, sounds like the Memphis dept needs a criminal investigation in general. The word I get is that the dept is a mess and it’s a mess because of bad leadership, apparently this Sarah Lynn davis? Not sure who that is, but the name was dropped to me….apparently she comes there from Atlanta where she was booted for unethical behavior? I will look into that to see if it’s true….

These guys should have never been cops, and I think the DOJ may need to take over this thing entirely….sounds like a complete mess

Cherelyn Davis is the Memphis police chief.  I don't know enough about her to comment, but props for acting quickly in firing/arresting the cops involved as it may be what saved her city from getting BLMed.

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19 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

I think you missed the point of that post. It doesn’t matter whether I think black people are in need; it matters that the people who designed affirmative action thought so. That’s why I reject labeling what they did as racism. 

When you favor one group of people over another that's the textbook definition of racism.  Whether it's mild or extreme, it's still racism because you're using a person's skin color to favor them.

The left wants to be racism free by.....wait for it.....implementing more racism. :doh:

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10 minutes ago, EternalShinyAndChrome said:

 

The left wants to be racism free by.....wait for it.....implementing more racism.

 

The first day I heard radical leftoid claim that colorblindness was actually racism really shocked me; I had thought we were on the same team. At the time I didn't know where they were driving that bus. Now we do.

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9 minutes ago, Voltaire said:

The first day I heard radical leftoid claim that colorblindness was actually racism really shocked me; I had thought we were on the same team. At the time I didn't know where they were driving that bus. Now we do.

Yep.

Also, remember when "Segregation" (separate but equal) was racist?  Yeah, apparently the left thinks that it's okay now and not racist anymore.

MLK would be turning over in his grave if he knew how the left has perverted and twisted his message.

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22 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

I think you missed the point of that post. It doesn’t matter whether I think black people are in need; it matters that the people who designed affirmative action thought so. That’s why I reject labeling what they did as racism. 

Back in the day, white people were in need of cheap labor to help work the farms and plantations. The people who designed slavery were simply helping those in need. So slavery wasn't racist. 

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16 minutes ago, EternalShinyAndChrome said:

Yep.

Also, remember when "Segregation" (separate but equal) was racist?  Yeah, apparently the left thinks that it's okay now and not racist anymore.

MLK would be turning over in his grave if he knew how the left has perverted and twisted his message.

 

What's happening is that the angry anti-white black nationalist heirs to Marcus Garvey, Malcom X, and Al Sharpton are still taking the fight to those of us who are the heirs to assimilationists like W.E.B. Dubois, Martin Luther King, and Roy Innis.

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2 minutes ago, Voltaire said:

What's happening is that the angry anti-white black nationalist heirs to Marcus Garvey and Malcom X are still taking the fight to those of us who are the heirs to assimilationists like W.E.B. Dubois and King.

Exactly.  It's almost as if they WANT and are pushing for a race war.

IMO, this all about money and power. That's it. Racism is just the vehicle to get them there.  Make no mistake - these same people are just as racist as the imaginary racists they pretend to fight against.

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6 minutes ago, RaiderHaters Revenge said:

Tim probably thinks segregation is good. Cause the intentions 

The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

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