The SAVE Act has passed

[supermike80]

43 minutes ago, Strike said:

Whatever you say, Hawking.

Reminds me when squissy would come in after someone says "democrats don't eat beans" and he'd post a link to a democrat that actually does eat beans and think he gotcha

[Ron_Artest]

Just now, Fireballer said:

Just stop.  You know that nobody knows the answer, and for you to be using this question as a “gotcha” exposes the shaky ground you’re on.  

It's not a gotcha, it's proving my point.  It's already against the law for illegals to register to vote.  Why do we need another law saying the same thing?

[squistion]

9 minutes ago, Ron_Artest said:

Fearmongering.

There is a provision that allows for a marriage license to be used as a bridge document.

There are enough legit reasons that this bill is dumb, don't need to make any up.

But that is requiring additional documentation and adds another potential hurdle for women that male voters won't have to contend with.

[Fireballer]

5 minutes ago, Ron_Artest said:

It's not a gotcha, it's proving my point.  It's already against the law for illegals to register to vote.  Why do we need another law saying the same thing?

How, specifically, is an illegal stopped from registering today vs if SAVE act is passed?

[avoiding injuries]

27 minutes ago, Ron_Artest said:

Another hurdle, especially for those that don't have easy access to a copy machine.

[Ron_Artest]

3 minutes ago, squistion said:

But that is requiring additional documentation and adds another potential hurdle for women that male voters won't have to contend with.

Correct, it's another hurdle.  That's all this bill is, hurdles to supress votes, for no tangible benefit.

[Hardcore troubadour]

We could get a jab in everyone’s arm but we can’t get a tiny pct of the population an id. Democrats are not concerned with helping those without.  It’s all a charade. 

[Ron_Artest]

3 minutes ago, Fireballer said:

How, specifically, is an illegal stopped from registering today vs if SAVE act is passed?

Currently they are asked if they are a citizen or not and would have to lie.  After this act they will also have to present a forged birth certificate.

[Fireballer]

2 minutes ago, Ron_Artest said:

Currently they are asked if they are a citizen or not and would have to lie.  After this act they will also have to present a forged birth certificate.

Gun thrown…

[Ron_Artest]

Just now, Fireballer said:

Gun thrown…

What does this mean?

[WhiteWonder]

1 hour ago, Ron_Artest said:

No.  Unless you can explain to me or show me evidence of a problem, no.

so you ae suggesting that laws only exist in response to existing problems and have never or should never exist to proactively address potential problems we don't want?

interesting take

 

(also anyone here can explain the problem, I just find it comical that this is the angle you're going with)

[WhiteWonder]

7 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

We could get a jab in everyone’s arm but we can’t get a tiny pct of the population an id. Democrats are not concerned with helping those without.  It’s all a charade. 

 

well said

[squistion]

19 minutes ago, Ron_Artest said:

Correct, it's another hurdle.  That's all this bill is, hurdles to suppress votes, for no tangible benefit.

Exactly. The only tangible benefit would be to Republicans.The purpose is to make it more difficult for certain segments of the population to vote (women, minorities, seniors, etc.) and who are probably more likely to vote Democratic. 

[Gladiators]

11 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

We could get a jab in everyone’s arm but we can’t get a tiny pct of the population an id. Democrats are not concerned with helping those without.  It’s all a charade. 

100%

[WhiteWonder]

52 minutes ago, Sean Mooney said:

Hey dumbass- where did I say anything against the SAVE Act in this thread or say that the passport thing was going to prevent people from getting ID's. I just pointed out a different story that was tangentially related to this and pointed out that it's slightly more complicated than what is being presented. I did not once, once say anything about the SAVE act directly. 

Don't make up your own narrative to argue against. That's why it's impossible to discuss things here. Because people make up their minds on things and just comment without actually understanding what is being said. 

haha this guy is full of 

didn't you actually incorrectly say that places had made it harder to get a real ID? then backtrack when you were wrong and had confused it with passports?  and you just so happened to be quoting someone who was saying everyone can get a real ID, as if to retort "well wait a minute, it's being made harder to do...."

[Ron_Artest]

2 minutes ago, WhiteWonder said:

so you ae suggesting that laws only exist in response to existing problems and have never or should never exist to proactively address potential problems we don't want?

interesting take

 

(also anyone here can explain the problem, I just find it comical that this is the angle you're going with)

Yes exactly.

You want to pass a bunch of laws that address problems we might have in the future?  Do we want a law that says you have to have an ID to levitate?

[Sean Mooney]

52 minutes ago, Strike said:

This thread is about the SAVE act.  Whether someone can get a passport is only relevant if impacts someone's ability to vote.  If not, who cares.  I'm simply pointing out that whether someone can get a passport or not, or how difficult that process might be, is irrelevant to a discussion about the SAVE act.  And I admitted I didn't read the whole thread, because much of it is filled with B.S. and after reading 5 B.S. posts in a row I skipped a bunch of it.  It's not about MY narrative.  It's about the SAVE act and liberals trying to deflect the issues.

Again- please find where I said anything in favor of or against the SAVE act. Someone mentioned about the Real ID. I said ironically they just made it harder to get passports. Apologized and corrected it to that story and mentioned about the Real ID and how they operate that.

Nowhere did I say anything against the SAVE act. But you want to police threads now when people get onto a slightly different topic. Let's see how long that lasts. 

51 minutes ago, Strike said:

All the banned aliases seem to have anger issues.

I have one name I post under. I have no desire to create multiple names if I get banned for a period of time. 

[Sean Mooney]

1 minute ago, WhiteWonder said:

haha this guy is full of 

didn't you actually incorrectly say that places had made it harder to get a real ID? then backtrack when you were wrong and had confused it with passports?  and you just so happened to be quoting someone who was saying everyone can get a real ID, as if to retort "well wait a minute, it's being made harder to do...."

Cool- you can repost things I said and reiterated. 

Also- tell me where the lie is that in some states they've made it so you can only get Real ID's at certain places?

Also- since you want to play too....show me where I said I'm against the SAVE act. 

[WhiteWonder]

3 minutes ago, squistion said:

Exactly. The only tangible benefit would be to Republicans.The purpose is to make it more difficult for certain segments of the population to vote (women, minorities, seniors, etc.) and who are probably more likely to voted Democratic. 

here is a crazy idea... why doesn't your party just do all it can to help women, minorities, seniors, etc obtain IDs? As the party of the marginalized, don't you claim to want to help everyone? So why not help them rather than bitch and moan that they just shouldn't have to?   

The fact that you can show up to your poll and not have to present an ID to vote in a presidential or any election is absolutely bonkers. We should all be in favor of making sure only legal citizens are casting ballots. If you think this creates a problem, somehow, for your preferred voter base... let's address those issues separately, no?

[HellToupee]

The politics here in the GC has reached peak retard level. Does anyone ever get sick of this? This isn’t a controversial issue but here we are

[WhiteWonder]

4 minutes ago, Ron_Artest said:

Yes exactly.

You want to pass a bunch of laws that address problems we might have in the future?  Do we want a law that says you have to have an ID to levitate?

You're flailing, little guy. 

are you actually going to sit there and say that in the history of this country, no law was ever passed or put into place proactively? 

also this is not about problems we might have in the future. the problem is already present.   But for arguments sake, the idea that something "might not be a problem yet" is not a reason to not pass a law. 

[squistion]

2 minutes ago, WhiteWonder said:

here is a crazy idea... why doesn't your party just do all it can to help women, minorities, seniors, etc obtain IDs? As the party of the marginalized, don't you claim to want to help everyone? So why not help them rather than bitch and moan that they just shouldn't have to?   

The fact that you can show up to your poll and not have to present an ID to vote in a presidential or any election is absolutely bonkers. We should all be in favor of making sure only legal citizens are casting ballots. If you think this creates a problem, somehow, for your preferred voter base... let's address those issues separately, no?

Actually the Democratic Party has tried to do that:

AI Overview

Democratic Approaches to ID Access

• Funding and Accessibility: Democrats have proposed or supported measures that would provide free, government-subsidized IDs and cover associated costs, such as obtaining birth certificates or marriage licenses, which can be barriers for elderly and low-income voters.
•  
• Expanding ID Options: They have advocated for allowing a wider range of identification, such as student IDs, tribal IDs, or utility bills, to count for voting purposes, which helps those who may not have a driver's license or state ID.
•  
• "CA IDs for All" (California): In 2022, California Democrats passed, and Gov. Gavin Newsom signed, AB 1766, which expands access to state identification cards to all residents, including undocumented individuals, by 2027. This specifically aims to help seniors and disabled individuals who do not drive and previously struggled to get state-recognized IDs.
•  
• Registration Modernization: Democrats have supported initiatives like the National Voter Registration Act (NVRA) and, more recently, executive orders by the Biden administration to improve voter registration access at federal agencies, which helps eligible citizens get registered and, in turn, often helps them navigate getting required documentation. 
  American Civil Liberties Union +6

[Ron_Artest]

6 minutes ago, WhiteWonder said:

here is a crazy idea... why doesn't your party just do all it can to help women, minorities, seniors, etc obtain IDs? As the party of the marginalized, don't you claim to want to help everyone? So why not help them rather than bitch and moan that they just shouldn't have to?   

The fact that you can show up to your poll and not have to present an ID to vote in a presidential or any election is absolutely bonkers. We should all be in favor of making sure only legal citizens are casting ballots. If you think this creates a problem, somehow, for your preferred voter base... let's address those issues separately, no?

Democrats have tried to include funding and provisions to address these hurdles but Republicans have stopped it.

Again, you're making up a problem where anyone can just show up and vote.  You have to be a registered voter, and only legal residents with proper ID can register to vote.

And no it's dumb to say "Let's pass this bill that makes it harder for certain people to vote, and then you can fix that later"

[WhiteWonder]

14 minutes ago, squistion said:

Actually the Democratic Party has tried to do that:

AI Overview

Democratic Approaches to ID Access

• Funding and Accessibility: Democrats have proposed or supported measures that would provide free, government-subsidized IDs and cover associated costs, such as obtaining birth certificates or marriage licenses, which can be barriers for elderly and low-income voters.
•  
• Expanding ID Options: They have advocated for allowing a wider range of identification, such as student IDs, tribal IDs, or utility bills, to count for voting purposes, which helps those who may not have a driver's license or state ID.
•  
• "CA IDs for All" (California): In 2022, California Democrats passed, and Gov. Gavin Newsom signed, AB 1766, which expands access to state identification cards to all residents, including undocumented individuals, by 2027. This specifically aims to help seniors and disabled individuals who do not drive and previously struggled to get state-recognized IDs.
•  
• Registration Modernization: Democrats have supported initiatives like the National Voter Registration Act (NVRA) and, more recently, executive orders by the Biden administration to improve voter registration access at federal agencies, which helps eligible citizens get registered and, in turn, often helps them navigate getting required documentation. 
  American Civil Liberties Union +6

So reliant on AI... but yeah, thats great. I support all of that, minus the identification cards for undocumented individuals part.  Let's keep at it.  There must also be other ways. I'm sure a lot of liberals are just chomping at the bit to volunteer to help drive those without licenses or cars etc to their appointments.  I know i've heard a lot of people complaining that certain groups don't have the means to get to and from where they need to go to obtain certs and licenses, etc.  We definitely hear about it when it's time to vote, that they just can't make it out to the polls. 

Sounds like a good start.   Also doesn't sound like any reason we can't aim to tackle both issues (the issue of proving who you are before you cast a ballot  and the issue of being able to prove who you are)

[Sean Mooney]

Honest question: Does anyone here go to a voting booth where they are asked to show ID or they are just allowed to vote with no checks whatsoever.

 

My voting station always either asks to see an ID or checks your signature against the register book. In fact, one time I signed and the lady questioned my signature (because it was off from my normal) so I had to show her my driver's license. 

[WhiteWonder]

6 minutes ago, Ron_Artest said:

And no it's dumb to say "Let's pass this bill that makes it harder for certain people to vote, and then you can fix that later"

link to where this is what the bill is saying?    

[WhiteWonder]

7 minutes ago, Sean Mooney said:

Honest question: Does anyone here go to a voting booth where they are asked to show ID or they are just allowed to vote with no checks whatsoever.

 

My voting station always either asks to see an ID or checks your signature against the register book. In fact, one time I signed and the lady questioned my signature (because it was off from my normal) so I had to show her my driver's license. 

 

Yup. in 2024, I walked into the school auditorium where I vote, walked up to the table with my section number on it... the woman working asked me my name. I stated my first name and then began to spell my last name and after giving her the first 2 letters, she finished my name for me as a question. I said Yes, that's me.  I was handed my ballot and got in line for the voting machine.

I did vote by mail drop box in 2020, but I have never had to show my license or any form of ID for any election. 

[HellToupee]

Just now, Sean Mooney said:

Honest question: Does anyone here go to a voting booth where they are asked to show ID or they are just allowed to vote with no checks whatsoever.

 

My voting station always either asks to see an ID or checks your signature against the register book. In fact, one time I signed and the lady questioned my signature (because it was off from my normal) so I had to show her my driver's license. 

Moved from MA to Florida last year. In MA you tell them your name & address, no id and no signature check . In Florida last fall we showed our license. 

[supermike80]

8 minutes ago, Sean Mooney said:

Honest question: Does anyone here go to a voting booth where they are asked to show ID or they are just allowed to vote with no checks whatsoever.

 

My voting station always either asks to see an ID or checks your signature against the register book. In fact, one time I signed and the lady questioned my signature (because it was off from my normal) so I had to show her my driver's license. 

I think that might be state controlled but not sure.  At my polling place in Michigan, I get asked for an ID.  It usually stresses me out cause who carries their ID with them all the time?  Thankfully, I happen to have mine on me when I get asked.    

Maybe that's unusual for some segments of the population.  Not sure

[Ron_Artest]

14 minutes ago, Sean Mooney said:

Honest question: Does anyone here go to a voting booth where they are asked to show ID or they are just allowed to vote with no checks whatsoever.

 

My voting station always either asks to see an ID or checks your signature against the register book. In fact, one time I signed and the lady questioned my signature (because it was off from my normal) so I had to show her my driver's license. 

I am asked my name and address, then signature match.

[Ron_Artest]

14 minutes ago, WhiteWonder said:

link to where this is what the bill is saying?    

It's what you are saying, pass the bill and have democrats fix the hurdles later,

[WhiteWonder]

24 minutes ago, Ron_Artest said:

Democrats have tried to include funding and provisions to address these hurdles but Republicans have stopped it.

Again, you're making up a problem where anyone can just show up and vote.  You have to be a registered voter, and only legal residents with proper ID can register to vote.

And no it's dumb to say "Let's pass this bill that makes it harder for certain people to vote, and then you can fix that later"

So If my neighbor is registered to vote and I walk into my polling place on election day, where they don't ask me to present an ID, and I give his name. I won't be able to vote as him?

[Ron_Artest]

2 minutes ago, WhiteWonder said:

So If my neighbor is registered to vote and I walk into my polling place on election day, where they don't ask me to present an ID, and I give his name. I won't be able to vote as him?

This happens?

[Sean Mooney]

For me it is usually:
 

"Hi what's your last name..." (i give my last name)

then they ask my first name as a question and I reply yes.

"Okay. sign here." (i sign they check my signature and then give a number to the person in the middle of the tables)

"Here is your ballot, follow the arrows to vote."

 

I don't think I've had to show an ID since my first time voting in that polling place which was 12 years ago. 

____________________________________________________________________________________________________

I only asked because I'm not sure what having an ID will do if places aren't necessarily checking ID's. I mean- some illegal immigrant could easily steal my name and forge my signature.

[WhiteWonder]

13 minutes ago, HellToupee said:

Moved from MA to Florida last year. In MA you tell them your name & address, no id and no signature check . In Florida last fall we showed our license. 

in NJ I think I was asked my address in 2016 but for the 2024 election, just like with my last name, I was asked in the form of a question.  The woman said "and you address is ______ _______ lane? and i replied Yes. 

Now I suppose she could say a fake address to see my response but let's be real. A poll worker is not actively trying to catch anyone committing voter fraud. The simple solution is that everyone should need to present their state issued ID when they vote 

[WhiteWonder]

2 minutes ago, Ron_Artest said:

This happens?

you just claimed it can't

[seafoam1]

I've never been asked for ID for voting since I moved to liberal America.

Liberals are stupid, hate-fillled socialists.

[Ron_Artest]

4 minutes ago, WhiteWonder said:

you just claimed it can't

No I never claimed that.  I claimed it isn't a problem.  Reading is Fundamental.

[WhiteWonder]

3 minutes ago, Sean Mooney said:

I only asked because I'm not sure what having an ID will do if places aren't necessarily checking ID's. I mean- some illegal immigrant could easily steal my name and forge my signature.

they should all be checking IDs moving forward if becomes a requirement, no?

Back in September 2024 my friend had 2 guys rummaging through his cardboard recycling. He asked them what they were doing and they did not speak any English. When he took out his phone they ran off (with some broken down cardboard boxes). My friend was complaining that the boxes had him and his wife's names and address on them and at the time I simply said, don't leave the labels on the boxes? and also anyone can look up your name and address.    But then I did start to think about it, especially when I voted... that all you really needed was someone's name and current address. I don't believe they even signature matched me. 

I am not suggesting that is what these guys were doing.  I am just suggesting that voter fraud can happen and I don't see why anyone would be opposed to measures to make sure it doesn't happen.  This is clearly just a "my sides voter base is more adversely impacted by this "  which I know conservatives would be crying about if it was the other way around... but please. 

[WhiteWonder]

43 minutes ago, Ron_Artest said:

Democrats have tried to include funding and provisions to address these hurdles but Republicans have stopped it.

Again, you're making up a problem where anyone can just show up and vote.  You have to be a registered voter, and only legal residents with proper ID can register to vote.

And no it's dumb to say "Let's pass this bill that makes it harder for certain people to vote, and then you can fix that later"

 

5 minutes ago, Ron_Artest said:

No I never claimed that.  I claimed it isn't a problem.  Reading is Fundamental.

 

agreed