Caine Mutiny Posted April 3 Posted April 3 The national Debt now stands at 39 trillion. The annual deficit is 2 trillion. Jerome Powell, along with almost every economist, says this is unsustainable. We are heading towards a crisis which will begin when our interest payments become too large to allow us to continue spending. That could come in 5 years or 10 or sooner but it WILL come. None of the politicians want to address this. They are, IMO, equally guilty. Democrats want to raise taxes but Republicans oppose that. (Besides Democrats want to couple raising taxes with increasing spending which does no good). Republicans want to cut spending but only on items they don’t like which are largely symbolic anyhow. And they rarely if ever carry it out and they almost always cut taxes as well. The truth is we would have to seriously raise taxes AND cut spending at the same time to make any kind of impact on the deficit (there’s almost nothing we can do about the debt). Politically speaking this is almost impossible because any politician who tries this will be voted out of office and they all know it. We are careening headlong into the iceberg. 1 Quote
Caine Mutiny Posted April 3 Author Posted April 3 More details Annual spending: 7 trillion. We take in 5 trillion in taxes, so that’s a shortfall of 2 trillion (I’m rounding up.) Breakdown: Social Security 22% Healthcare, Medicare, Medicaid 23% Defense 13% Current interest 13% Income Security(SNAP, Welfare) 10% Everything else is below 5% Quote
Caine Mutiny Posted April 3 Author Posted April 3 2 minutes ago, WhiteWonder said: You don’t believe they’re equally guilty? Quote
WhiteWonder Posted April 3 Posted April 3 1 minute ago, Caine Mutiny said: You don’t believe they’re equally guilty? where did I say that? Quote
Caine Mutiny Posted April 3 Author Posted April 3 1 minute ago, Hardcore troubadour said: Do away with snap except for invalids. That would likely create economic unrest that would probably be costlier than the money you would save initially. Quote
Hardcore troubadour Posted April 3 Posted April 3 Just now, Caine Mutiny said: That would likely create economic unrest that would probably be costlier than the money you would save initially. Why? You won’t give to those without? Quote
Caine Mutiny Posted April 3 Author Posted April 3 1 minute ago, WhiteWonder said: where did I say that? That was the only part of the OP which was my opinion. The rest was just reporting facts. Quote
WhiteWonder Posted April 3 Posted April 3 Just now, Caine Mutiny said: That was the only part of the OP which was my opinion. The rest was just reporting facts. and I was just that you had an opinion. doesn't matter what the opinion is, since you're not qualified to have one. 1 Quote
Caine Mutiny Posted April 3 Author Posted April 3 1 minute ago, Hardcore troubadour said: Why? You won’t give to those without? If you’re suggesting that private charity would make up for cutting government programs to the needy, history has suggested this doesn’t work. Quote
Caine Mutiny Posted April 3 Author Posted April 3 1 minute ago, WhiteWonder said: and I was just that you had an opinion. doesn't matter what the opinion is, since you're not qualified to have one. Ah OK. Quote
Caine Mutiny Posted April 3 Author Posted April 3 3 minutes ago, HotRod said: get rid of dem fraud and we're in the black Getting rid of corruption would certainly help. It’s estimated to be somewhere between 3-7% of the entire budget. Alas nobody knows quite how to get rid of it. Quote
HotRod Posted April 3 Posted April 3 1 minute ago, Caine Mutiny said: Getting rid of corruption would certainly help. It’s estimated to be somewhere between 3-7% of the entire budget. Alas nobody knows quite how to get rid of it. vote republican Quote
Caine Mutiny Posted April 3 Author Posted April 3 Just now, HotRod said: vote republican Putting aside the large number of reasons I will not do this, the notion that today’s Republican Party is less corrupt in general than today’s Democratic Party is absurd. 1 1 Quote
TheNewGirl Posted April 3 Posted April 3 1 minute ago, Caine Mutiny said: Getting rid of corruption would certainly help. It’s estimated to be somewhere between 3-7% of the entire budget. Alas nobody knows quite how to get rid of it. HA! Yes they do. Quote
RaiderHaters Revenge Posted April 3 Posted April 3 well you guys cry whenever someone tries to raise more money for America but cheer when its sent to other countries 1st step is stop that then profit Quote
Gepetto Posted April 3 Posted April 3 US federal government needs money, yet you're against tariffs on other countries. Quote
Caine Mutiny Posted April 3 Author Posted April 3 4 minutes ago, Gepetto said: US federal government needs money, yet you're against tariffs on other countries. I am because it stifles economic growth more than regular taxation. Quote
Caine Mutiny Posted April 3 Author Posted April 3 54 minutes ago, RaiderHaters Revenge said: well you guys cry whenever someone tries to raise more money for America but cheer when its sent to other countries 1st step is stop that then profit We spend less than 1% of the budget on foreign aid. Quote
WhiteWonder Posted April 3 Posted April 3 1 hour ago, Caine Mutiny said: We spend less than 1% of the budget on foreign aid. it's like the trans in sports argument also curious where you are getting your data. genuinely curious. Because I seem to be seeing that only 6-7B was sent to Ukraine in 2024 as part of a total roughly 82B in foreign aid for FY2024. But we know a ~60B aid package for Ukraine was signed in April 2024 and ~175B has been sent to Ukraine alone since 2022 which would be roughly 1% of the budget during that time, on it's own. I'm not claiming foreign aid is significantly more, i'm just curious. plus, a small % of a big amount is still a big amount. gotta start somewhere. Quote
Caine Mutiny Posted April 3 Author Posted April 3 33 minutes ago, WhiteWonder said: it's like the trans in sports argument also curious where you are getting your data. genuinely curious. Because I seem to be seeing that only 6-7B was sent to Ukraine in 2024 as part of a total roughly 82B in foreign aid for FY2024. But we know a ~60B aid package for Ukraine was signed in April 2024 and ~175B has been sent to Ukraine alone since 2022 which would be roughly 1% of the budget during that time, on it's own. I'm not claiming foreign aid is significantly more, i'm just curious. plus, a small % of a big amount is still a big amount. gotta start somewhere. Got it from Google. Typed in how much we spend on foreign aid. I think foreign aid can be a very good investment, especially when it goes to American companies (as is the case with most of the Ukraine aid from what I understand.) I would look to reduce costs elsewhere. 1. I believe that Social Security and Medicare should be means tested. Basically if your income is above a certain amount you don’t get it. Thats not fair to those who paid in but too bad we gotta do something. 2. I would cut off SNAP payments and all entitlements from anyone who is not a citizen. As you know I am for open immigration but the taxpayer shouldn’t have to pay for it. 3. I think we need to re-evaluate our entire military before we spend another penny on it and find any way we can to streamline it and adapt to the modern era (specifically the drone era) without weakening ourselves. 4. Most important of all, so important that it overwhelms every other concern IMO, I think we should have a Manhattan Project like effort to solve nuclear fusion. Quote
supermike80 Posted April 3 Posted April 3 Oh crap. Timmy has moved on from tariffs destroying everything..to this. Ill never understand how people can live in fear every second of every day. Must be fun i guess? Ugh. Quote
HellToupee Posted April 3 Posted April 3 Not a word during the 4 years of everything free in America under Biden 1 Quote
WhiteWonder Posted April 3 Posted April 3 11 minutes ago, Caine Mutiny said: Got it from Google. Typed in how much we spend on foreign aid. I think foreign aid can be a very good investment, especially when it goes to American companies (as is the case with most of the Ukraine aid from what I understand.) I would look to reduce costs elsewhere. 1. I believe that Social Security and Medicare should be means tested. Basically if your income is above a certain amount you don’t get it. Thats not fair to those who paid in but too bad we gotta do something. 2. I would cut off SNAP payments and all entitlements from anyone who is not a citizen. As you know I am for open immigration but the taxpayer shouldn’t have to pay for it. 3. I think we need to re-evaluate our entire military before we spend another penny on it and find any way we can to streamline it and adapt to the modern era (specifically the drone era) without weakening ourselves. 4. Most important of all, so important that it overwhelms every other concern IMO, I think we should have a Manhattan Project like effort to solve nuclear fusion. thought maybe you had some specific sources as opposed to Squs-I Overview. either way, it's not the first place i'd start... but it's definitely something that needs to be looked at. I'd likely start with all the foreign aid on American soil. Quote
easilyscan Posted April 3 Posted April 3 The US doesn't have a taxation problem, they have a spending problem. If it was ‘only’ 39 trillion, we ‘might’ have a chance to address it, but unfunded liabilities from SS and Medicare have to be added as well. Data from OpenTheBooks, estimates a combined long-term liability of $175.3 trillion Quote None of the politicians want to address this. They are, IMO, equally guilty. Refreshing viewpoint, & anyone who takes off the blinders should feel the same way. Quote
lickin_starfish Posted April 3 Posted April 3 Stop laundering money to Minnesota daycares, Israel, and Ukraine. Quote
Maximum Overkill Posted April 3 Posted April 3 5 minutes ago, lickin_starfish said: Stop laundering money to Minnesota daycares, Israel, and Ukraine. Yup, I blame Dems. See Walz and Newsome @Caine Mutiny Quote
RaiderHaters Revenge Posted April 3 Posted April 3 4 hours ago, Caine Mutiny said: We spend less than 1% of the budget on foreign aid. im not talking about foreign aid Quote
SUXBNME Posted April 3 Posted April 3 25 minutes ago, weepaws said: I like to gargle on white balls Quote
MikeMatt Posted April 3 Posted April 3 6 hours ago, HotRod said: get rid of dem fraud and we're in the black No pun intended. Quote
jerryskids Posted April 3 Posted April 3 The only way to move the needle is to restructure entitlements like SS and Medicare, but that is a 3rd rail that no politicians will touch. 1 Quote
dogcows Posted April 4 Posted April 4 The sad part is: the huge debt actually wasn’t due to Medicare and Social Security. It was all the other stuff. Then add to that the upward migration of wealth over the past 50 years, while taxes on corporations and high earners went down. More money pushed up, but being taxed at a lower rate. To balance the budget, you need to cut spending and increase revenue. But I believe Clinton was the last president who actually balanced the budget. Everybody since has spent more than they earned. And, oddly enough, it’s the party that talks most about debt and fiscal responsibility that ran up the biggest deficits. A lot of folks call this war “short term pain for long term gain.” So we can kill young people for long-term gain? But for some reason we can’t subject the billionaires in this nation to much higher taxes, giving them some short term pain they can easily afford in order to provide long-term gain to the nation. I will support a future Congress that can accomplish that. Quote
dogcows Posted April 4 Posted April 4 Trump’s new military budget will increase the debt by another $7 trillion! https://finance.yahoo.com/economy/policy/articles/trump-wants-add-nearly-7-202737074.html Conservatives voted for the party that blew up the deficit over and over, WAY beyond what Democratic presidents did. Go ahead, check the numbers. It’s not a pretty picture for the GOP. Everything they say about fiscal responsibility is purely lip service. Quote
TimHauck Posted April 4 Posted April 4 18 hours ago, dogcows said: Trump’s new military budget will increase the debt by another $7 trillion! https://finance.yahoo.com/economy/policy/articles/trump-wants-add-nearly-7-202737074.html Conservatives voted for the party that blew up the deficit over and over, WAY beyond what Democratic presidents did. Go ahead, check the numbers. It’s not a pretty picture for the GOP. Everything they say about fiscal responsibility is purely lip service. But DOGE!! (was a failure) Quote
seafoam1 Posted April 4 Posted April 4 3 minutes ago, TimHauck said: But DOGE!! (was a failure) It worked very well. You whined the whole how it was ruining things. Made a big impact on many things. And it completed ahead of schedule. Quote
TimHauck Posted April 4 Posted April 4 27 minutes ago, seafoam1 said: It worked very well. You whined the whole how it was ruining things. Made a big impact on many things. And it completed ahead of schedule. Ahead of schedule but far less savings than they promised. Quote
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