Democratic Socialism is coming

[Caine Mutiny]

Speaking of Ronald Reagan: in the 1960s he described Medicare as evil because it was creeping socialism that would lead to a Communist state like Soviet Russia. But when Reagan became President in 1981 he refused to touch Medicare- too popular. 
 

In 2015 Donald Trump said that Obamacare was creeping socialism that would lead to a Communist state like Soviet Russia. Yet Trump has been President twice now, both times in the first couple years with Republican majorities- and we still have Obamacare. Why is that? 

[SaintsInDome2006]

2 hours ago, TBayXXXVII said:

True or false, Mamadani is further left than Bernie?

I think you might be underestimating Sanders. When he was mayor of Burlington he was more left than he was as a Rep, then he was more left as a Rep than he was as a Senator. Sanders promoted Crazy Tulsi Gabbard & he helped wreck Hillary’s candidacy. Right now he wants the US government to take an ownership position in the AI industry.

New York has had a Dem Socialist as mayor before - David Dinkins. Aside from the loopy public grocery idea Mamdani basically advocates standard stuff from 1970s NYC, subsidized housing, public welfare, that sort of thing.

And NYC is schizophrenic- Dinkins (DSA), Giuliani, Bloomberg (3 terms), DiBlasio, Fox favorite Adams, now Mandami (back to DSA).

[Caine Mutiny]

Also- if you are a Trump supporter please don’t tell us how much you love capitalism. Trump’s economic policies, particularly in his second term, have been more anti-capitalist than any proposed by the Democratic Socialists. 

[Caine Mutiny]

4 minutes ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

I think you might be underestimating Sanders. When he was mayor of Burlington he was more left than he was as a Rep, then he was more left as a Rep than he was as a Senator. Sanders promoted Crazy Tulsi Gabbard & he helped wreck Hillary’s candidacy. Right now he wants the US government to take an ownership position in the AI industry.

New York has had a Dem Socialist as mayor before - David Dinkins. Aside from the loopy public grocery idea Mamdani basically advocates standard stuff from 1970s NYC, subsidized housing, public welfare, that sort of thing.

And NYC is schizophrenic- Dinkins (DSA), Giuliani, Bloomberg (3 terms) DiBlasio, Fox favorite Adams, now Mandami (back to DSA).

Fiorello La Guardia, arguably NYC’s greatest mayor and one whom Mamdami resembles in many ways, was also essentially a Democratic Socialist. 

[SaintsInDome2006]

4 minutes ago, Caine Mutiny said:

Fiorello La Guardia, arguably NYC’s greatest mayor and one whom Mamdami resembles in many ways, was also essentially a Democratic Socialist. 

Thank you. Good point.

[supermike80]

52 minutes ago, Mark Davis said:

I think you hit on what one of our major issues with socialism is.   Younger people don't see it as a failure.  We haven't educated people on all the successes of capitalism, we are almost apologetic of it as a society and America's success.  We often only talk about our issues or warts, not what is right and why it's the best system and we've been so prosperous where countries who have tried socialism have fallen behind and failed.

Kids are raised differently than most of us were.  In some ways it may be for the better but sometimes allowing people to lose, fail, get picked on, learning to overcome bullying, fighting for yourself is a good thing.  When they hit 21-22 years old and have ran up student loan debt, every bank is issuing college kids credit cards to get further in debt, then they see what the real job market and pricing is, I'm sure it's overwhelming.  They are looking for an answer and a lot of times they don't have the tougher exterior a lot of older generations were forced to have through endurance of some issues.  It's not a failing of the younger people so much as it's a failure on us for allowing this creep toward that dangerous ideology in our society at all.

I think social media plays a huge role in this as well.   The younger ones see their peers living their "best lives" on tik tok or instagram, facebook, whatever, and they get jealous. Whether or not it's true, it sure is presented as such on social media.   Greed is probably the biggest motivator for actions by humans, but jealously is way way up there as well.

[SaintsInDome2006]

8 minutes ago, Caine Mutiny said:

Also- if you are a Trump supporter please don’t tell us how much you love capitalism. Trump’s economic policies, particularly in his second term, have been more anti-capitalist than any proposed by the Democratic Socialists. 

Under Trump the US government has taken up ownership positions in something like 25 corporations. That is pure socialism.

[SaintsInDome2006]

57 minutes ago, Mark Davis said:

I think you hit on what one of our major issues with socialism is.   Younger people don't see it as a failure.  We haven't educated people on all the successes of capitalism, we are almost apologetic of it as a society and America's success.  We often only talk about our issues or warts, not what is right and why it's the best system and we've been so prosperous where countries who have tried socialism have fallen behind and failed.

Kids are raised differently than most of us were.  In some ways it may be for the better but sometimes allowing people to lose, fail, get picked on, learning to overcome bullying, fighting for yourself is a good thing.  When they hit 21-22 years old and have ran up student loan debt, every bank is issuing college kids credit cards to get further in debt, then they see what the real job market and pricing is, I'm sure it's overwhelming.  They are looking for an answer and a lot of times they don't have the tougher exterior a lot of older generations were forced to have through endurance of some issues.  It's not a failing of the younger people so much as it's a failure on us for allowing this creep toward that dangerous ideology in our society at all.

Amigo our elders said the same thing about our generation. No civics!

Look at the children of the Greatest Generation - they tore up campuses, committed acts of terrorism (actual, not this antifa bs), supported our enemies, murdered a president… 

This now is actually the most, best educated generation ever. The access to social media means they’re open to damaging influences, yes, but they’re also accessing information, like the insane level of wealth inequality right now. 

And (sorry) Trump has introduced a taste of authoritarianism in this country and they do not like it, & yes they very much know their history imo.

[Engorgeous George]

Interesting arguments.  I read here that past incremental steps thought to potentially lead to socialism and which did not immediately and completely do so prove that incremental steps will not lead thereto.  Yet here we are, getting closer to it, in fact and in declaration of candidates.  Does that not mean that in fact that is what these incremental steps are leading to, stronger and bigger incremental steps down that pathway? 

[Beaker15]

20 minutes ago, Caine Mutiny said:

Also- if you are a Trump supporter please don’t tell us how much you love capitalism. Trump’s economic policies, particularly in his second term, have been more anti-capitalist than any proposed by the Democratic Socialists. 

Holy crap you are retarded

[Engorgeous George]

26 minutes ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

Amigo our elders said the same thing about our generation. No civics!

Look at the children of the Greatest Generation - they tore up campuses, committed acts of terrorism (actual, not this antifa bs), supported our enemies, murdered a president… 

This now is actually the most, best educated generation ever. The access to social media means they’re open to damaging influences, yes, but they’re also accessing information, like the insane level of wealth inequality right now. 

And (sorry) Trump has introduced a taste of authoritarianism in this country and they do not like it, & yes they very much know their history imo.

They are nearly functionally illiterate.  The have access to information, much or most of it wrong and foolish.  The information they access is the echo chamber of their own uneducated, inexperienced adolescence.  We credential them as educated by passing them out of high school and college, but they are greatly misinformed.  Read the letters of revolutionaries and civil war common soldiers.  Those were educated, thoughtful people.  Todays kids are idiots worried whether others will find their shared picture of their last meal was cool and enhances their social standing. 

[SaintsInDome2006]

15 minutes ago, Engorgeous George said:

Interesting arguments.  I read here that past incremental steps thought to potentially lead to socialism and which did not immediately and completely do so prove that incremental steps will not lead thereto.  Yet here we are, getting closer to it, in fact and in declaration of candidates.  Does that not mean that in fact that is what these incremental steps are leading to, stronger and bigger incremental steps down that pathway? 

It is interesting.

Imo your point about incremental socialism (Fabianism) is something Republicans used to get. Give people a taste of some public good. Romney did it in Massachusetts, look at Nixon & Bush Sr. (1000 points of light), Kemp. That tradition stretched back to Teddy Roosevelt & maybe even Lincoln.

But we decided to cut that off, outright decapitate it. No, I think what we are seeing is a very natural, predictable response to that defenestration of republicanism, which cobbled together some putative claim of social good with fiscal conservatism & public ethics.

And there’s going to be hell to pay. 2016 Lindsey Graham (RIP) may prove right after all.

[SaintsInDome2006]

5 minutes ago, Engorgeous George said:

They are nearly functionally illiterate.  The have access to information, much or most of it wrong and foolish.  The information they access is the echo chamber of their own uneducated, inexperienced adolescence.  We credential them as educated by passing them out of high school and college, but they are greatly misinformed.  Read the letters of revolutionaries and civil war common soldiers.  thsoe were educated, thoughtful people.  Todays kids are idiots worried whether others will find theer shared picture of their last meal was cool and enhances their social standing. 

Interesting. I think they by & large can read an income distribution pie chart. I think they can read a debt vs GDP over time graph. I think they can recognize a village flattened like Warsaw 1945. And they know how to find all those things online.

[Mark Davis]

24 minutes ago, supermike80 said:

I think social media plays a huge role in this as well.   The younger ones see their peers living their "best lives" on tik tok or instagram, facebook, whatever, and they get jealous. Whether or not it's true, it sure is presented as such on social media.   Greed is probably the biggest motivator for actions by humans, but jealously is way way up there as well.

I agree social media plays a huge part.  A lot of the silos we get into on there reinforces our own leanings.  When younger people are feeling hopeless, those socialist ideologies have taken root on there.  There's no reality out there of what the end result would be from those policies that have failed everywhere.

[Engorgeous George]

15 minutes ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

Interesting. I think they by & large can read an income distribution pie chart. I think they can read a debt vs GDP over time graph. I think they can recognize a village flattened like Warsaw 1945. And they know how to find all those things online.

And yet all 'objective" metrics of academic achievement show they are increadingly and alarmingly unable to read or do math anywhere near their expected grade levels.  Given that, if they do find a relevant pie chart the odds of them extrapolating the correct conclusions therefrom are minimal.

 

Basically we have a new generation of young candidates with no life experience opining on issues which will have long term effects.  These folks have not shown a history or propensity to look to the future or to defer gtratification, to think beyond tomorrow.  Frankly only an idiot would care what they think or say.  They are little different than us at their age except a bit more vacuous, and here's the thing, I would not have given us the riens of power at that age either.  They presumptively think they have it coming, and that worries me.  In time, fine, after a bit of seasoning, a bit of experience, some life lessons learned sure, but not yet.

[Mark Davis]

19 minutes ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

Amigo our elders said the same thing about our generation. No civics!

Look at the children of the Greatest Generation - they tore up campuses, committed acts of terrorism (actual, not this antifa bs), supported our enemies, murdered a president… 

This now is actually the most, best educated generation ever. The access to social media means they’re open to damaging influences, yes, but they’re also accessing information, like the insane level of wealth inequality right now. 

And (sorry) Trump has introduced a taste of authoritarianism in this country and they do not like it, & yes they very much know their history imo.

Sorry man, this is way beyond a Trump thing.  I can't really respond to you fruitfully on that, we just live in different realities there.

You can sing their praises if you want, but we haven't educated them, not fiscally.  They are also the softest generation as far as their feelings go.  I said things to people in school and had things said to me that would get my kids expelled today.  They aren't allowed to face some adversities at pre teen ages we all went through.  We have softened them up, then when they face these very real economic conditions, for some of them their reaction is to blame the system rather than to work for solutions for themselves.  

[Mark Davis]

4 minutes ago, Engorgeous George said:

And yet all 'objective" metrics of academic achievement show they afre increadingly and alarmingly unable to read or do math anywhere near their expected grde levels.  Given that, if they do find a relevant pie chart the odds of they extrapolating the correct conclusions therefrom are minimal.

 

Basically we have a new generation of young candidates with no life experience opining on issues which will have long term effects.  These folks have not shown a history or propensity to look to the future or to defer gtratification, to think beyond tomorrow.  Frankly only an idiot would care what they think or say.  They are little different than us at their age except a bit more vacuous, and here's the thing, I would not have given us the riens of power at that age either.  They presumptively think they have it coming, and that worries me.  In time, fine, after a bit of seasoning, a bit of experience, some life lessons learned sure, but not yet.

Great post, you explained my feelings on this better than I did.

[supermike80]

23 minutes ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

Amigo our elders said the same thing about our generation. No civics!

Look at the children of the Greatest Generation - they tore up campuses, committed acts of terrorism (actual, not this antifa bs), supported our enemies, murdered a president… 

This now is actually the most, best educated generation ever. The access to social media means they’re open to damaging influences, yes, but they’re also accessing information, like the insane level of wealth inequality right now. 

And (sorry) Trump has introduced a taste of authoritarianism in this country and they do not like it, & yes they very much know their history imo.

Damaging influences is an understatement.  No matter which way you lean, the media and the internet is so biased toward whatever you feel that it's absurd.   So if you feel like you might like socialism, guess what your twitter and instagram algorithm will be full of.  In my opinion, the media as a whole is worse than it ever has been

[Strike]

2 minutes ago, supermike80 said:

Damaging influences is an understatement.  No matter which way you lean, the media and the internet is so biased toward whatever you feel that it's absurd.   So if you feel like you might like socialism, guess what your twitter and instagram algorithm will be full of.  In my opinion, the media as a whole is worse than it ever has been

This is actually a great point.  We're all tracked all over the Interwebs and then our "feeds" tailored to whatever topics we seek out.  And I'm a privacy freak and, as much as I can, try to avoid being tracked.  But it's not possible while keeping the internet usable.  So the Internet is literally reinforcing whatever views one has to a large extent.  

[SaintsInDome2006]

10 minutes ago, Engorgeous George said:

And yet all 'objective" metrics of academic achievement show they afre increadingly and alarmingly unable to read or do math anywhere near their expected grde levels.  Given that, if they do find a relevant pie chart the odds of they extrapolating the correct conclusions therefrom are minimal.

 

Basically we have a new generation of young candidates with non life exprerience opining on issues which will have long term effects.  These folks have not shown a history or propensity to look to the future or to cefer gtratification, to think beyond tomorrow.  Frankly only an idiot would care what they think or say.  They are little different than us at their age except a bit more vacuous, and here's the thing, I would not have given us the riens of power at that age either.  They presumptively think they ahve it coming, and that worries me.  in time, fine, after a bit of seasoning, a bit of experience, some life lessons learned.

Much respect as always, George. I frequently relate to your POV.

I 100% agree with you on the qualifications front. But guess who is the worst transgressor of that? The party that is supposed to stand against it. - You don’t think they see that? It’s not hypocrisy, it’s just a hollowness of values. When a Republican comes forward and wags their finger about qualifications, civic education & values, what do you think is the very first thing they’re going to say???

[SaintsInDome2006]

8 minutes ago, Mark Davis said:

You can sing their praises if you want, but we haven't educated them, not fiscally.  They are also the softest generation as far as their feelings go.  I said things to people in school and had things said to me that would get my kids expelled today.  They aren't allowed to face some adversities at pre teen ages we all went through.  We have softened them up, then when they face these very real economic conditions, for some of them their reaction is to blame the system rather than to work for solutions for themselves.  

Have you looked at our fiscal status? The debt? The income inequality? The self-dealing & lack of accountability? What lesson should they take post-2000?

[supermike80]

5 minutes ago, Strike said:

This is actually a great point.  We're all tracked all over the Interwebs and then our "feeds" tailored to whatever topics we seek out.  And I'm a privacy freak and, as much as I can, try to avoid being tracked.  But it's not possible while keeping the internet usable.  So the Internet is literally reinforcing whatever views one has to a large extent.  

And it is absolutely not a liberal or MAGA thing.  this is both sides.   I hate the media more than I can possibly express here

[SaintsInDome2006]

10 minutes ago, supermike80 said:

Damaging influences is an understatement.  No matter which way you lean, the media and the internet is so biased toward whatever you feel that it's absurd.   So if you feel like you might like socialism, guess what your twitter and instagram algorithm will be full of.  In my opinion, the media as a whole is worse than it ever has been

It’s a good point, but it doesn’t have to be that way. You control who you follow, not the algorithm.

[Strike]

1 minute ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

It’s a good point, but it doesn’t have to be that way. You control who you follow, not the algorithm.

I don't follow anyone.  it's not just about following people.  And I mean that literally.  I don't have an account on X, BluSky, Instagram, or any of those types of sites.  I visit Facebook  a couple times a week and have some friends there but that's it.  

[supermike80]

Just now, SaintsInDome2006 said:

It’s a good point, but it doesn’t have to be that way. You control who you follow, not the algorithm.

That would require a level of media savvy that many many people just don't have, especially young people.   The media is a multi billion, probably trillion dollar economic machine.  They know what they are doing.

[supermike80]

Just now, Strike said:

I don't follow anyone.  it's not just about following people.

Ditto.  I follow absolutely no one on any platform.  

[supermike80]

I remember once, couldn't have been more than once, I let a Taylor Swift video play too long on my feed.  Next thing you know, I was seeing tons of Taylor Swift videos popping up, and I don't like her music at all.   Took a fair amount of time of quick swiping to make that go away

[Engorgeous George]

5 minutes ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

Much respect as always, George. I frequently relate to your POV.

I 100% agree with you on the qualifications front. But guess who is the worst transgressor of that? The party that is supposed to stand against it. - You don’t think they see that? It’s not hypocrisy, it’s just a hollowness of values. When a Republican comes forward and wags their finger about qualifications, civic education & values, what do you think is the very first thing they’re going to say???

I don't disagree that their criticisms need to be heard. Hell, we had them too at their age and they are not all wrong.  I just hold that though they may accurately identify areas which would benefit from change does not mean that they have any idea how to accomplish that change.  I admire their passion and their hubris, and I also have a bit of disdain for their hubris.  Nothing new in all of this, it is the circle of life, our opinions and solutions are influenced by our station.  The only difference is tht this generation moves in a bit of a dangerous lockstep, coordianted by social media.  i think that presents obsticles to gaining life experience. In the end who cares, I am a dinosaur on the way out and they are the ascendent future.  The will eventually be served.  I wonder, when they are will they wonder whether maybe they should have listened just a bit to the lessons their elders tried to impart?

[SaintsInDome2006]

10 minutes ago, Engorgeous George said:

I don't disagree that their criticisms need to be heard. Hell, we had them too at their age and they are not all wrong.  I just hold that though they may accurately identify areas which would benefit from change does not mean that they have any idea how to accomplish that change.  I admire their passion and their hubris, and I also have a bit of disdain for their hubris.  Nothing new in all of this, it is the circle of life, our opinions and solutions are influenced by our station.  The only difference is tht this generation moves in a bit of a dangerous lockstep, coordianted by social media.  i think that presents obsticles to gaining life experience. In the end who cares, I am a dinosaur on the way out and they are the ascendent future.  The will eventually be served.  I wonder, when they are will they wonder whether maybe they should have listened just a bit to the lessons their elders tried to impart?

Dinosaur huh? Why do I have the feeling yours is the winning side in a bar fight.

Well on the last bit of course. We all just did Father’s Day. We all hear our dads on those days. We start to look like them, get them. They’ll go through it too.

I’m not sure you caught my point. Which is fine. I’m sorry to raise the T word, again. But these kids are not blind. If Republicans use words like character, qualifications, duty, honor, conservatism, Constitution, Founding Fathers, experience, accomplishment … they will laugh their asses off. They see what’s been going on. As my Dad used to say, they may be dumb but they’re not stupid.

[supermike80]

Just now, SaintsInDome2006 said:

Dinosaur huh? Why do I have the feeling yours is the winning side in a bar fight.

Well on the last bit of course. We all just did Father’s Day. We all hear our dads on those days. We start to look like them, get them. They’ll go through it too.

I’m not sure you caught my point. Which is fine. I’m sorry to raise the T word, again. But these kids are not blind. If Republicans use words like character, qualifications, duty, honor, conservatism, Constitution, Founding Fathers, experience, accomplishment … they will laugh their asses off. They see what’s been going on.

Is your contention that if all republicans went away the kids would be fine?

[SaintsInDome2006]

1 minute ago, supermike80 said:

Is your contention that if all republicans went away the kids would be fine?

Mike, get serious. No. Although arguably the Republicans *have gone away.

[Hardcore troubadour]

1 hour ago, Caine Mutiny said:

Also- if you are a Trump supporter please don’t tell us how much you love capitalism. Trump’s economic policies, particularly in his second term, have been more anti-capitalist than any proposed by the Democratic Socialists. 

You just say things

[supermike80]

Just now, SaintsInDome2006 said:

Mike, get serious. No. Although arguably the Republicans *have gone away.

I don't know.   Everytime you mention it, you only point to what republicans are doing.  So how do I not take that as you saying it.

[SaintsInDome2006]

Just now, supermike80 said:

I don't know.   Everytime you mention it, you only point to what republicans are doing.  So how do I not take that as you saying it.

Mike, I’m sorry. Yes Dems have serious problems too. Hillary & Harris are just two examples, practically no serious opposition. And the leadership has been feckless.

[Engorgeous George]

8 minutes ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

Dinosaur huh? Why do I have the feeling yours is the winning side in a bar fight.

Well on the last bit of course. We all just did Father’s Day. We all hear our dads on those days. We start to look like them, get them. They’ll go through it too.

I’m not sure you caught my point. Which is fine. I’m sorry to raise the T word, again. But these kids are not blind. If Republicans use words like character, qualifications, duty, honor, conservatism, Constitution, Founding Fathers, experience, accomplishment … they will laugh their asses off. They see what’s been going on.

I understand they have valid reasons to be skeptical of the admonitions of those in power, trying to capture their allegiance so as to keep themselves in power and not to serve the greater good, as if most politicians would know the greater good if it ws gnawing on their genitals.  Their skepticism, their suspicions are well founded. I have them too.  I don't believe those in charge telling me its raining since my leg always seems to smell like piss when they are done explaining. We need the young, the ardent, the true believers to remind ourselves of the very concept of belief.  

 

As for bar fights lets say I retired from such a while ago and hope to never come out of retirement.  I would like to keep my undefeated record unblemished and there would be real doubt about that now. 

[supermike80]

6 minutes ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

Mike, I’m sorry. Yes Dems have serious problems too. Hillary & Harris are just two examples, practically no serious opposition. And the leadership has been feckless.

Ok...Appreciate the clarification.  I think it's important

[TBayXXXVII]

1 hour ago, Fnord said:

OK, mini-Strike.

You asked a question, I answered it. The 80s are widely accepted as having seen a hard turn to the right; sorry it contradicts your previously formed, ignorant opinions. You've obviously never questioned why Reagan is considered the gold standard of American conservatism. Do you think that occurred in a vacuum?

Always appreciate a dikish response, and the GC never disappoints on that front.

I didn't deny you answered the question, I simply stated that it didn't refute the point.  Stopping leftism from continuing isn't moving to the right.

[TBayXXXVII]

1 hour ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

I think you might be underestimating Sanders. When he was mayor of Burlington he was more left than he was as a Rep, then he was more left as a Rep than he was as a Senator. Sanders promoted Crazy Tulsi Gabbard & he helped wreck Hillary’s candidacy. Right now he wants the US government to take an ownership position in the AI industry.

New York has had a Dem Socialist as mayor before - David Dinkins. Aside from the loopy public grocery idea Mamdani basically advocates standard stuff from 1970s NYC, subsidized housing, public welfare, that sort of thing.

And NYC is schizophrenic- Dinkins (DSA), Giuliani, Bloomberg (3 terms), DiBlasio, Fox favorite Adams, now Mandami (back to DSA).

Yeah, it's possible I am underestimating Sanders, I won't deny that.  But, I think Bernie is just a grifter.  I don't think he actually cares, any more, about the things he says.  I think he's all about the money.  He's always about making sure he's not in the bracket he complains about.  Mamdani and friends are actually stepping on the gas pedal that he built.

[Strike]

59 minutes ago, supermike80 said:

I remember once, couldn't have been more than once, I let a Taylor Swift video play too long on my feed.  Next thing you know, I was seeing tons of Taylor Swift videos popping up, and I don't like her music at all.   Took a fair amount of time of quick swiping to make that go away

Case in point.  This JUST happened to me.  I went to IMDB to look up an actor I had seen in a video on YouTube.  Not 5 minutes after hitting IMDB I get an e-mail from them WELCOMING me to IMDB.  I didn't sign up.  I just read an actor's profile.  Not only that, I wasn't even on my own computer.  I was on a work computer.  That's how deep the tracking runs.  Things I do on my work computer are tracked and tied to my personal life.  Disgusting.  

[Mark Davis]

1 hour ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

Have you looked at our fiscal status? The debt? The income inequality? The self-dealing & lack of accountability? What lesson should they take post-2000?

Oh I’m in full agreement on much of that. Our debt is completely out of control and the problem is very real. Our politicians, and really ourselves for allowing it, have caused us great fiscal harm. The lesson I would take is government spending has gotten us here. This isn’t a party thing, we all have gotten used to more government spending especially over the past 30 or so years.

The lesson for me is government spending and intervention is the problem  not the solution.  We do need the government for certain things, but we already spend too much.  I don’t see any tenet of socialism that reduces government spending to fix the ills you mentioned 

When it comes to income inequality we should be debating the best way to not just help the middle class, but to grow it.  It’s impossible to tax or redistribute it into existence.  Capitalism is the best vehicle to make it happen