The Real timschochet

What in the actual Fock are you talking about? What economist has said this? They’ve said the same thing all along: that the price hikes will hit this summer, in June or July, that it’s already too late to prevent it, that the drop in our ports currently happening (long Beach by 60%) is a calamity. https://apnews.com/article/inflation-economy-tariffs-trump-5436b90e8e5a003f228c1bd08186589c Now they could still be wrong. I seriously doubt it but hope they are. We’ll know by July.

Let me offer you a hypothetical. An undocumented immigrant witnesses a child being sexually molested. He goes to the police and turns in the culprit. Now the pedophile is on trial and this undocumented immigrant is the only witness to the crime. But the witness sees this incident (the Hannah Dugan case) in the news. Now he is afraid to testify. Since he was the only witness the case is thrown out and the pedophile freed to commit more crimes. This is exactly what the ACLU was warning about. It’s what Hannah Dugan recognized and why she should not be prosecuted. Now do you get it? If you still don’t there’s really nothing else I can offer. ICE shouldn’t be outside the courtroom or inside. They shouldn’t be anywhere near it, period.

No it wasn’t shown that. While they didn’t enter the courtroom and they didn’t interfere with this specific case, their presence outside affects all judicial proceedings. Why is this so hard to understand?

No that was not my argument, I wrote that ICE interfered with her courtroom. I didn’t change my argument.

https://www.bbc.com/news/videos/cwyn9291yv0o As a Jew and a lifetime supporter of Israel (though not the current government) it has become impossible for me to find justification for this.

Qatar has given a few billion to Hamas as I recall…if Trump was a college student he would be deported for accepting this gift wouldn’t he? Talk about hypocrisy…

Trump’s effusive praise of the leader of Saudi Arabia is yet another disgraceful moment of his Presidency…there are just so many.

You mean running up the prices right? https://www.wpr.org/news/wisconsin-coffee-roaster-warns-of-price-hikes-amid-tariff-uncertainty Coffee is hurting like so many other industries.

Actually the vast majority of my predictions come true. That’s not always a good thing.

Isn’t this vintage Trump logic? The whole theory of the tariffs is based on the same argument.

This is a really dumb analogy. I mean terrible.

I disagree. My prediction sadly failed, but I stand by the arguments and ideas I offered in this thread, and remain proud of them.

Unfortunately for you, me and the entire country, no. But I remain hopeful that the future will bring a return to sanity.

You know, not in every case, but I think as a general rule this is a wise conclusion by you. Certainly they’re far more right now than they’ve been in years, due to the continuing assault on our civil liberties by the Trump Administration. And they’re having a lot of legal success fighting back. I try to give them money every month or so and I have to say I’m quite satisfied with my investment these days.

It doesn’t matter that he came forward. (Though would he have done so if he knew he’d be arrested?) The point is that others won’t. It may not make sense to you but it makes sense to a lot of legal experts.

I didn’t make up any of these arguments. I wish I had. But I‘m no legal expert. I just happen to read the arguments of other people that I find compelling. But part of that is that unlike most of you guys I don’t start with a hard on for deporting undocumented people. Your obsession with that colors your rational judgment IMO.

Well you’re just wrong on this. Here is the ACLU on this exact issue: ICE arrests in courthouses gravely impact the willingness of immigrant communities to come forward as victims or witnesses of crimes and seek out help or due process they have a right to. https://www.aclu.org/press-releases/aclu-of-wisconsin-and-aclu-react-to-fbi-arrest-of-milwaukee-judge Simply put if we allow ICE to go into a courthouse to make an arrest, even if they don’t enter the courtroom, that will cause people fearful of deportation to refuse to testify or go to court. THAT’S the interference.

Anyhow we’ll see. I’m pretty sure she’ll be acquitted (and should be) but juries are unpredictable. It will likely be months before this comes to trial. The important thing is that judges need to continue to be brave and not allow this incident or other threats by the MAGA crowd to intimidate them.

I said they interfered with her courtroom. I never said they entered it. They interfered by waiting outside preparing to arrest him, because that puts a damper on proceedings inside the courtroom. This is why the federalism argument is brought up. This is why so many jurists think it was both illegal and improper, despite your assurance otherwise.

And “egregious” is not the same as illegal. Dugan’s actions were egregious to McCarthy (not to me.) Nonetheless he disapproves of her indictment and predicts she’ll be acquitted. Which is why I linked him. I could just as easily have linked articles by the ACLU, or Andrew Weissman, or dozens of liberal attorneys predicting the same, but if I had done that, most of you here would have ignored it and accused me of bias. I don’t think you can ignore McCarthy.

I read the whole thing. And your imtepretation is off. It’s not “lawyer things”, it’s federalism. But let’s get back to your initial question which is whether or not I support breaking the law in this instance. I do not. In certain instances I do. But in this case I don’t believe she broke the law.

Wrong again, the ACLI is actively trying to get him out of federal custody. Whether they succeed is another matter. But that has no bearing on ICE’s illegal interference in a state courtroom. Do you believe in federalism? That’s the basis of McCarthy’s argument. Like you he is a fan of mass deportation and has no love for liberal judges like Dugan. Even so he’s got a problem with ICE interrupting her court proceedings to make an arrest. Because federalism. Do you have a problem with this?

According to whom? ICE? Not according to what I’m reading, and what I’ve linked.

lol it doesn’t change anything. This was always going to be a sham prosecution from the start, designed for show and intimidation. It won’t fly. Here’s more legal analysis as to why it’s extremely weak: https://www.dynamisllp.com/knowledge/arrest-judge-dugan-strategies-and-defenses I advise you to read this one extremely carefully, particularly how the ICE agent screwed up trying to make the arrest and ignoring due process rules (seems to be a pattern, doesn’t it?) That way when she is easily acquitted you won’t be too disappointed.

Nope. Not at all. Here is Andrew McCarthy of National Review, a strong conservative and NOT a fan of Hannah Dugan, nonetheless offering up a defense of her actions: https://www.nationalreview.com/2025/04/as-a-trump-doj-should-know-judge-dugan-has-a-defense/amp/