The Real timschochet

It’s been settled in terms of payment but I would still appreciate your opinion on the matter. When you’re up to it.

Wow. To say I’m disappointed with this opinion would be an understatement. I strongly strongly disagree with you. But I will abide by the terms I wrote. @Engorgeous George my office is closed for the week so I cannot mail you a check until a week from Monday. However if you have Venmo or PayPal I will send you the money right now.

Nope. I dispute your claim that I lost this bet. Fully dispute it. So I will leave it to others to decide. That’s it.

Let them read both threads. If just one of them agrees with you I will concede. It’s not a teachable moment because no matter how this ends up I know and you know what a weasel and a jerk you’re being. But I will leave it up to them to decide if I have to pay you.

@Voltaire @jerryskids @Jon_mx @Strike A couple of you don’t like me very much, and all four of you disagree with me nearly all of the time. Nonetheless I think all 4 of you are honest and honorable people. So I’m going to leave this in your hands. @Engorgeous George thinks he tricked me into agreeing to end our bet today, which would make him the winner because Joe Biden is not yet the nominee. I think it’s a dumb trap, a way to weasel out of eventually paying me, and I didn’t fall into it anyhow. I ask that you guys please go back and read the last page or so. If ANY of you honestly think I lost this bet, post that here and I will pay the man.

What I thought. You know already no honest person is going to agree with you. Go away.

Tell you what. I trust the integrity of @Voltaire and @jerryskids as much as I do anyone here. I disagree with them most of the time but they strike me as honest. Let them read the last page or so of this thread, including your argument as to why you think I lost, and my response. If either one of them agree with you I will send you the $2000. Agreed?

Except Im not asking for any money until I win the actual bet.

First off you were the punk ass. For telling me to go back to my thread and before that for bragging about about the wager and wanting me to write “I am a dumbass” on a check. Second your semantics and stupid tricks are unimpressive. And frankly stupid. I’m sure some folks here who already don’t like me will no doubt cheer you on but I believe most people reading this will know what a weasel you’re being. I think you know it yourself. But whatever.

I think I won the spirit of the bet, but not the actual bet. The spirit of the bet was the idea that the Democrats were so nervous about Biden that they would find a way to replace him on the ticket. That’s obviously not going to happen now. That’s what I meant. But of course I didnt.win the actual bet. Not until he is the actual nominee. I never asserted otherwise.

What a bunch of losers in here. Seriously.

Jon I already said it was fine I will wait until November. That’s what I said to everyone.

You’ve got to be kidding. This is classless on your part. I will not pay you a cent. Rest assured I would never try to pull such a ridiculous trap on you. I honor my wagers. For the record I didn’t fall inro your stupid trap anyhow since I didn’t agree to settle the bet today. I wrote “up to you.” I even offered to let you send the money to charity in November. And then you pull this crap?? Screw it, I’m done with you. If you want to honor the bet at some point you can send the money to charity. I don’t want a penny of yours. With this post you have shown yourself what sort of person you are.

It was in response to “go back to your own thread”. I’m willing to wait. Up to you.

Of course it’s comparable. First off they weren’t vetted. Second, the population of the USA was much smaller then so the number of immigrants, by percentage was much larger. Third they huddled in the big cities, spoke their own languages, refused to assimilate, and caused much more upheaval and violent crime and poverty than the current group. Finally the exact same anti-immigrant rhetoric was made then, nearly as ugly as it is now.

Nah I’ll keep my word. Also, I don’t really want your money. How about we agree the loser donates to a charity? Something non political that we can both agree on? Like fighting cancer or something along those lines.

As always you are the personification of classiness and good taste.

I’ve worked with some very wealthy people. All of them have managers who have access to their accounts and pay their bills. These managers have access to a lot of money if they want to take advantage of it. I know one woman right now who works for a shopping center owner; she pays all of his bills. If she wanted to she could probably remove up to 20 million from his accounts. She would be very quickly arrested but she could do it, in chunks. (Of course she’s an extremely honest person who has worked for the same guy for 25 years and is well compensated.)

@jerryskids without looking yet at the link there is a problem with what you wrote about 2014. Obama’s term from 2009-2016 saw 50 year lows in undocumented immigration and this pretty much continued throughout most of Trump’s term. It only exploded starting in 2020. Conservatives like to blame this on Biden’s loosening of Trump’s restrictions but if that were the case then it should have been high during the Obama years as well. Which leads me to conclude that the current numbers we’re facing have much more to do with Covid and the economic dislocation it caused in Latin America, (far worse than in this country) than any other issue, whether it be government policy or social media messaging beginning in 2014.

I don’t believe all immigration is good. I believe it’s GENERALLY good and in keeping with our ideals. But there are times when it doesn’t work and times when it needs be controlled. And I don’t think undocumented people should be scapegoated and blamed for our problems the way Trump is doing. I admire Freakanomics and appreciated nuanced arguments. I will take a closer look at this, thank you for posting.

1. Agreed. 2. I agree but both types are necessary. 3. The free market creates wages not me. You can call me and other employers “cheapskates” but any increase of wages gets passed to consumers. 4. I agree. But it’s not up to you to decide or try to force that on people. 5. I don’t agree. But the marketplace decides whether that happens not you nor I nor government regulation. 6. Agreed but my point is most undocumented people aren’t on any kind of dole. The fact is that in most cases they put more into the system than they take out. 7. This goes back to point #1. I agree that we have a right to decide who comes here. But it’s then a question of what kind of nation we want to be. Our Founding Fathers, particularly Thomas Jefferson, envisioned a nation welcoming to immigrants from everywhere. To him the USA was the “New World”. I think that we should try to live up to his vision, and that of Ronald Reagan who reiterated the argument.

1. So you think I’m cherry picking? I would argue that it’s the other way around. The points I made are not true all of the time but I will stand firmly on the theory that they are true MOST of the time. Those that focus on individual acts of violence and crime by undocumented immigrants are the ones cherry-picking because they do not represent the majority. 2. I don’t think conservatives are poor, earthbound or dolts. I think that, on this issue, you’re wrong. You’re not any dumber than me, you’re just wrong. Don’t put words in my mouth please. I don’t regard myself as “wise and learned” on this issue. The facts are available to anyone who wants to look for them. 3. You wrote that I don’t even try to be reasonable. But I was responding to someone who wrote “GTFO”. I don’t think that’s a reasonable argument. There are 15 million undocumented people in this country and more coming every day for reasons that have gone unaddressed both here and in most public discussions of this issue. If you’re going to demand a reasonable discussion of this subject, let’s begin with the recognition that the vast majority of these people aren’t going anywhere. If you’re unwilling to accept that fact, then IMO no reasonable discussion is possible.

You’re one of the reasons I changed my mind. I also enjoy our discussions.

In the case of @Cdub100 I already sent $100 to @edjr to hold. I’m good for it, I honor my wagers, always.

Let’s break this down. 1. Only works if the front door is available for everyone equally. It isn’t and never has been. 2. We need unskilled labor from abroad. Always have and always will. 3. Most of these folks work harder and longer hours than native born Americans so you don’t have to worry about this. 4. What business is it of yours? There is no official language in this country. Why don’t you learn Navajo? 5. Assimilation works both ways. America has assimilated to every group of immigrants that has come here far more than they have assimilated to those already here. 6. Let’s get native born Americans off the dole first. Lots more of them, especially in red states. 7. They have as much right to be here as you do, according to the ideals of our Founding Fathers. Thats what this country is supposed to be about. If you don’t like it then maybe it’s you who should GTFO.