The Real timschochet

No I wrote that I don’t care if she sympathizes with Hamas, she doesn’t deserve to have her family die. A 4 year old doesn’t deserve to die because her mother cheers Hamas. Now if the woman IS Hamas then she deserves to die. Her child and family still do not, And sympathizers who are not members don’t deserve to die.

If you think showing a Palestinian woman who has lost her family equals support for Hamas then you’re part of the problem. And you’re disgusting and vile. But I already knew all three points.

MSNBC just showed a Palestinian woman, returning to a shelter that got hit by a bomb. Her entire family is dead: two daughters (one of them 4 years old), two sisters, her parents, her husband. She was screaming in agony. I can’t justify this. Sorry. Maybe she’s a Hamas lover, I don’t care. Maybe it makes me a weak supporter of Israel. I don’t care. This is wrong. That’s all. It’s wrong.

Yep. Of course Trump has let out the word that it can’t be Emmer. The Maga types want Bryan Donalds. He insisted only last month that Trump won the election. What a total sh!tshow.

I don’t have any hate. Only love in my heart.

Yeah he does that a lot. Brings up crap from years ago. He’s incapable of intelligent argument.

It means no support.

No it’s not widespread. It’s not at all. First off I don’t regard the BBC as part of the MSM. I was referring to the American MSM. But even if the BBC was part of it, the fact that they suspended the journalists involved proves that they aren’t sympathetic to Hamas either. If they were sympathetic the journalists would have been rewarded rather than suspended. You know who was sympathetic to Hamas prior to this incident? The Jerusalem Post, the largest newspaper in Israel. And Netanyahu who gave them aid.

Sorry I forgot: per #5: of course Hamas doesn’t support a 2 state solution, which is yet another reason why Hamas must be crushed. I’m just not sure the current plan is the best way to achieve this.

Per #2: reports that a few BBC guys are sympathetic to Hamas is not evidence of support for Hamas from OUR mainstream media. Criticism of Israel is not support for Hamas either. No proof has been presented, sorry. Per #6. It’s an insult to Muslim Americans to suggest that, because some of them are sympathetic to Hamas, they therefore reject American values. There are many conservatives sympathetic to Putin, a mass murderer, including the former President. The great Muhammad Ali was sympathetic and friendly to Mobuto and Idi Amin, two more mass murderers. Woodrow Wilson was sympathetic to the KKK. Our $20 bill has a man on it responsible for the genocide of the Cheyenne nation. In other words I think you are being far too harshly judgmental.

Let’s break this down, because you continue to misunderstand me: 1. I agree with you that the posters are important, that taking down the posters is abhorrent, and that doing so serves to dehumanize the victims (I’m not quite convinced that dehumanizing the victims is the PURPOSE of those tearing the posters down, mainly because I don’t believe they’ve thought that far ahead, but it is certainly the result.) 2. There is no support within the MSM for Hamas. None. I challenge you to prove otherwise, 3. The purpose of me pointing out that Israel does bad things is not to make a “both sides” argument. Let’s be absolutely clear: there is NOTHING that Israel could ever do that would make them the moral equivalent of Hamas. Hamas is evil. Israel, for most of its existence as a modern nation, have been the good guys. Which is why Israel should not do bad things and why we must point it out when they do. 4. If Israel doesn’t escalate Hamas will not go away. I would never make such an absurd argument. Israel absolutely needs to escalate because Hamas needs to be destroyed. But I am not at all convinced that bombing Gaza or that a ground invasion of Gaza is the correct move here, I fear that it will make Israel less safe in the long run even if the current organization called Hamas is completely destroyed. I also don’t like the loss of innocent life that is necessarily involved. However, due to the nature of war I could get around that if I thought that ultimately such moves would make Israel safer. I don’t. 5. Ultimately Hamas can only be defeated when the Palestinian people are not so unhappy with their existence that they are willing to turn to extremism and evil because they are no other way out. This means we need to have a Palestinian state, prosperous, alongside Israel. Yes, the hated two state solution because it remains the ONLY solution. And we are moving away from it. 6. Finally I have some very close Muslim friends. I have discussed this issue at length with them during the last 3 weeks. They take the opposite view from you and me as well; they believe that Israel is evil and they refuse to consider what Hamas has done. Like you they are ABSOLUTELY sure that they are morally correct. Like you they think I am a well meaning idiot on this issue. I bring this up only to point out that there is way too much moral certainty by people who refuse to consider the empathy of others, and I firmly believe this is a big part of the problem.

My side makes skin color an issue because of 400 years of oppression, slavery, genocide, mistreatment, and racism which continues to this very day. All we do is try to to give these people help to have equal opportunity- which they still don’t even without the help- but you guys can’t handle that.

I don’t like it when innocent children die. Palestinian or Israeli I don’t care. I can’t find justification for it and I can’t ignore it.

Difficult thoughts, lol. She has yet to offer a thought that qualifies as anything but inane or insane.

…is one of the dumbest people in America. Just trying to finish the sentence, HTH.

Why are conservatives always whining about skin color? Is it so tough to be a white man these days that everybody is a snowflake? What a bunch of pu$$ies you guys are. You’re terrified of woke, terrified of blacks and women and trannies having any kind of say in society. Get your fat a$$ back on the couch where it belongs and pipe down.

Man you make a lot of assumptions here. When did I ever say I sided with Hamas? Hamas is evil. There is no moral equivalency between Israel and Hamas. On those points I agree. And, like you I stand with Israel. But that doesn’t mean that Israel hasn’t behaved badly. They have. They have contributed to this situation. And they may make things worse. And just because Hamas is evil, that doesn’t give Israel the right to commit crimes against humanity. They don’t have that right and if they do bad things they should be condemned.

Because it’s not as simple as that. And when you make it as simple as that you make things worse. If there is any aspect of the Trump era of politics I detest most of all, it’s the dumbing down of all ideas to in order to satisfy emotional needs. That’s what populism is all about. We don’t need to act like idiots.

I’m forced to agree unfortunately. And of course a large number of Muslims express sympathy for Hamas, or at least a reluctance to condemn them. There are reasons for this far more complicated, IMO, than a lack of moral clarity. For one thing Hamas is on THEIR SIDE (at least nominally) and as we have seen over the years it is extremely difficult, perhaps impossible, for most people to be willing to criticize their own side, ESPECIALLY in times of conflict. There is, I believe, another reason that is even more complicated but it goes to human nature: most people, given the choice, prefer leaders who fight. Among the Palestinians you have a binary choice: you’ve got Fatah, weak, corrupt, always willing to negotiate, and then you’ve got Hamas: strong, defiant, cruel and ruthless incorruptible in the same way that Martin Luther was cruel and ruthless and incorruptible. And that’s why they’re so popular.

Yes and no, but it’s too lengthy to get into. But I was referring to complaints against the Netanyahu government in particular.

Lots of reasons, among them that Trump is going to be the GOP nominee next year because you guys are such morons, the party of stupid. Nominate somebody else and I’ll stop talking about him. Another reason is that I want aid to Israel and Ukraine to go through and for the government not to shut down. And for that we need a speaker. But you morons are preventing it.

The establishment types are going to need the Democrats help to elect a Speaker, that means they’re going to have to compromise. Or they can cave to MAGA.

From what I’m reading one of the main stumbling blocks for any potential Speaker is the election of 2020. Trump’s allies oppose Emmer because he acknowledges that Biden won in 2020, and there are enough of them to kill his chances. Other Republicans have stated that they will ONLY vote for a candidate who acknowledges that Biden won, and there are enough of them to kill any vote.

First off I’m not a progressive. Never have been. I’m a Democrat, for the moment, because I side more with them than I do Republicans. I am a globalist, a capitalist, and pro-establishment. Next I am not defending corruption. I’m only suggesting that those like @jerryskids who believes that it is worse now than it was 100 or 200 years ago are not paying much attention to history. I don’t think it’s going to destroy the republic.

That’s for the dialogue!