Sean Mooney

So no legitimate source? Got it

Where was it reported the shooter was trans?

Post your link telling you the SS allowed this to happen. I've posted plenty of links breaking down where things went wrong in securing the venue.

You guys and this stuff.... The SS was not told to let Trump get shot. There was malpractice in how they did security but that isn't "You need to let this happen"

If the Democrats lose in 2024 Kamala won't be close to the candidate in 2028...There are far better candidates behind her that won't have the stigma of 2024 or the Biden administration.

Nope...equally dumb.

The SS was not under orders to let this happen. That is a completely dumb conspiracy theory.

My thing with her comment on that is just saying "safety factor" is vague. What was the factor in it? Was it literally just someone being on the roof? Was it they didn't think they could see effectively from up there? Was it solely just passing off that factor to the local officials and washing their hands of it? My guess is most of the investigation will focus on that aspect of it all because clearly something broke down in the handling of the building access and someone fell asleep at the wheel on it. I think Cheatle knows that and is using the "safety factor" excuse thinking it will buy them an out. It won't but I think it is the best attempt they can make.

Regarding the talk of the roof slope. The Washington Post looked into some of that and using videos and photos from the event, satellite imagery and terrain analysis they built a 3D model of the rally site, the shooter's position. With that it seems that the countersniper teams may not have initially seen Crooks as he crawled up the roof and the trees around the area may have played into that as well. https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/interactive/2024/trump-rally-shooting-maps-secret-service-analysis/ Some key notes: - The Post’s assessments were reviewed and corroborated by three former law enforcement officials, including two retired snipers and a former Secret Service agent, as well as a former marine sniper. - Countersniper teams commonly scan for threats with binoculars, which offer a wider field of vision than a rifle optic, said Jason Lawless, a retired officer who worked as a sniper with the Tulsa Police Department’s Special Operations Team. But about two minutes before gunshots were fired, the northernmost team had already moved to their rifle positions, suggesting they were attuned to a potential threat at that point. It’s unclear exactly when Crooks first became visible to Secret Service countersnipers. - The closest countersniper team to the shooter had two trees in their line of vision from where they were to where Crooks was- so they may not have been able to see him which is why it is the team furthest away that fired the shot that took out Crooks. - The southernmost countersniper team, which can be seen in earlier images facing south, appeared to reorient northward before Crooks allegedly fired, suggesting that they were also aware of a threat.

Just to add to some of the things I said earlier and some usual suspects jumped on. The AP has done some phenomenal reporting on this and this article talks about the failures of the various law enforcement (SS on down) from Saturday: https://apnews.com/article/trump-shooting-rally-a1bcbaa4a604e09be8cc22893751895b - There were 6 different agencies along with fire and rescue officials working the event. More manpower is good, but can lead to communication issues. - The Secret Service controls the area inside the perimeter, after people pass through metal detectors. Local law enforcement is supposed to handle outside the perimeter. - Crooks was spotted again when members of a local SWAT team, stationed inside the building complex, noticed him walking around and looking at the roof. One officer took a photo of Crooks and radioed to others to be on the lookout for a suspicious person looking through a rangefinder — a small device resembling binoculars that hunters use to measure distance from a target. Not long after, witnesses reported seeing him scaling the squat building closest to the stage. He then set up his AR-style rifle and lay on the rooftop, a detonator in his pocket to set off crude explosive devices that were stashed in his car parked nearby. Outside, a local officer climbed up to the roof to investigate. The gunman turned and pointed his rifle at him. The officer did not — or could not — fire a single shot. But Crooks did, firing into the crowd toward the former president and sending panicked spectators ducking for cover as Secret Service agents shielded Trump and pulled him from the stage. Two countersniper teams were stationed on buildings behind Trump, and the team further away from Crooks fired once, killing him. - Essentially- Crooks was spotted an hour ahead of time and gave off enough suspicion that they even took a photo of him to circulate. Then they lost sight of him. But he was spotted again 20 minutes later by that local SWAT team. - There were special agents, presidential protective teams, counterassault and countersniper teams all there that day. There were also roughly 50 firefighters and emergency personnel, plus dozens of officers from the Butler Township police, deputies from Beaver County and Butler County and Pennsylvania State Police troopers. Look Cheatle is going to- or should- lose her job over this. This is a catastrophic failure even with the idea that she followed typical protocols in many aspects. But unfortunately that is how these things work. You can follow the same procedure that you've followed numerous times but the result of it changes and you get fired for the result and not the practice. And it doesn't matter if the kid never made it in and thus the local people were more responsible- the plan comes from the SS down so something going wrong is going to fall back on you.

The only quote I saw was from the sheriff there saying he knows his police did a good job but could've done better. Of course too the Butler PA commissioner would try to push back on his local police role. Do you have any mode that isn't being a condescending douchenozzle?

They weren't complete fabrications....detail what is fabricated. Perhaps they are not painting a full picture or are leaving out things but stuff isn't a lie.

That's what I think they have to do

I mean it would make sense that it was shrapnel and not a gun shot that hit him. (I would still think it was a glancing wound- not from an act of God making him turn his head but from bad aim from the shooter) Still though- the bigger issue is that we had a sniper fire at a presidential candidate. And a 20 year old kid at that- our leaders on both sides of the aisle need to set better examples. Even Eric Trump and Jason Miller have basically said it is idiotic to blame the women in the protection camp. But then here you are

They are all bad....couple those tariffs with the plan to potentially devalue the dollar. Can't wait

Whatever you say man....I'm not going over it and over it anymore because I don't think it interests anyone outside of us I'll let your comments going forward and how you choose to approach things speak for itself to me.

Here is the Politico piece I mentioned: https://www.politico.com/newsletters/playbook/2024/07/17/new-polling-bolsters-dump-biden-push-00168943 Additionally-according to this poll from the AP and NORC- 65% of Democrats want Biden to drop out of the race: https://apnorc.org/projects/most-say-biden-should-withdraw-from-the-presidential-race/

No...Maybe 75/25 at best.

Who you choose to defend belies what you say about yourself. If you are a centrist and then do nothing but defend the MAGA system it calls into question your centrist nature (and I know because I've been called on it many times here- by others and by you). There are conversations I don't wade into because I think people are going way off the rails (from both directions). I've called out the BeachGuy weirdo for things he says. Again- I've called out realtim and gutter for going too far on things. I call out the many here on the right when they go too far. (And I can grant that with a plurality of people here on the right it amplifies reactions in one way or another). And yes you keep going to the abortion thing. I told you- I don't dispute what you are saying. I don't take issue with it. I take issue with the fact you always seem to line up right behind every MAGA person here and the conspiracy stuff they throw out. At some point it feels like the abortion thing is becoming your "I have a black friend" defense. Lastly- I'm mostly making fun of you because you did that whole "I'm the most centrist poster here" thing which I find hilarious

Because in so many threads I see you just spouting what the MAGAs on here believe. I don't ever remember seeing you push them on anything- you just repeat what MAGA says and back it. And then you always yell "I believe this thing the left does..." When I see you call out people on both sides then fine. And before you say- I've gone after the "boyo" weirdo and I've pushed back on real time and gutterboy at times. So save that attempt. You really have this weird black or white mentality (kind of like someone on the spectrum). No one is saying it is solely on the local cops. The conversation has pretty much been that the process broke down somewhere and while that is ultimately going to fall on the SS the key thing will be where the breakdown occurred so it can be fixed going forward. Literally no one here said "It's all on the local cops."

We will see what the investigation brings as more of this unfolds. SS does do security but will also work with local officials and there was a breakdown there in this instance.

You also think a rock disengages a lock on a door even when it is removed so you shouldn't be commenting, or perhaps should "stick to what you know" And either way- I said that they made the call to have a police presence inside the building after inspecting and clearing the building based off location and everything. Did they err? Yes obviously because something happened. Was that error on the secret service end, or the local police end, or in the communication between the two organizations- that is to be determined yet. Lastly- there were still people outside the building. Nice try

There was more context to it as far as vantage points from the roof to the podium and what not and that it also tied into the conversation with local cops and what they were asked to cover (again common practice).

Trump is allowed to lie and people shouldn't call him on it. This is what happens when you rip at institutions.

I was out most of the day yesterday so I may have missed this in the thread- so apologies if it has already been mentioned. Morning Joe yesterday had on a former Secret Service member and a reporter who worked with the Secret Service in the White House at one point (like an embedded type series). They were talking about some of the stuff as it related to the shooting on Saturday. 1.) The Secret Service was working with the local police force to help lock down some areas (common practice apparently). 2.) The building the kid was on had local cops inside the building as a means of securing the building. They did include the building in their security plans but because it was 150 yards outside the venue they felt it clear. 3.) Additionally, the building had a sloped roof and it was determined that it would not be safe and/or feasible to have a person stationed on it- both from a standing practice and from a strategic vantage point. So the communication with the local cops led to the building having a police presence inside but not on top. (Again mentioned as not uncommon practice from them) 4.) Joe then did question the training of the Secret Service members as after Trump was shot there was communication that the shooter was down but that there still could have been a second or third shooter stationed somewhere and thus leaving Trump's head exposed for like 10 seconds was highly dangerous, not the mention letting him be exposed en route to the car (when you look at the video and pictures you can see that Trump's head for a lot of the time is above the Secret Service members heads. 5.) The former Secret Service guy discussed that the mission of the SS is to essentially manhandle the person they are protecting to physically make them keep their head down and stay hidden as best they can. He is unsure if the guys were trained on that correctly or if they defer to Trump too much (he did mention as you are around these people constantly you can get chummy with them and sometimes to a detriment). It was a fascinating 10-15 minute segment on the show to hear. Also, I saw on Mediaite a clip from CNN where they put together an interesting video that syncs up the video of the Trump shooting with the footage from social media and outlines the one minute and 57 seconds that occurred from the time the crowd first noticed the gunman to the shooting. https://www.mediaite.com/tv/cnn-shows-stunning-side-by-side-video-of-how-trump-shooting-unfolded-combining-news-footage-with-eyewitness-accounts/