jerryskids

I don't see it as a far divergence, but obviously I'm missing your point. I was trying to differentiate society's expectations from God's expectations. But I feel like I already said as much, so I'm just not seeing the difference.

Sorry, Lager https://sports.yahoo.com/rory-mcilroy-files-for-divorce-from-wife-erica-after-seven-years-of-marriage-165443365.html

Your model is fantasy, it has no basis in reality. It will absolutely never happen, at least in this election cycle. The path to minimizing abortions, in AZ anyway, is to allow the 15 week law (or similar) to stand, diffuse the constitutional amendment on the November ballot, and "boil the frog" over time to reduce the 15 weeks to... As a bonus, your position will rally a bunch of young, single women to come vote for that ballot initiative, and while doing so, vote for Biden to win AZ. Also, putting women in prison is not a good strategy. A better strategy is to push for a positive culture shift which celebrates birth, babies, integral families. We both want to minimize abortions. Your approach is an abject failure, mine works.

You have no positive results. In your model, AZ voters pass a constitutional amendment allowing abortion until birth.

How so? I'm being sarcastic; IMO Jesus would think you are a bumbling idiot for pushing a policy that leads to more baby murders.

It should absolutely be God free IMO; that is foundational to our culture. Worship how you wish, or not. But you cannot practice sharia law, nor can you have polygamy with minor girls like Colorado City, AZ. Regarding your second paragraph: I read somewhere recently, probably in research for this thread, that a society will eventually settle on a moral code, and in the absence of a religious one, it will be determined by the state (a Marxist philosophy). I prefer the teachings of Jesus as the basis, especially given recent support by this administration.

No, I endorse minimizing abortion. You, not so much.

Bless your heart. Do you understand the concept of letting the perfect be the enemy of the good? I'm guessing not. Congrats, your position results in more murders of unborn babies.

Keith Mitchell Chris Kirk @WhiteWonder

No, more, because come November, women would be able to abort the baby as it is coming out of the womb at birth. That is what you are supporting. You can say "woman can't keep murdering their unborn children," but you support a path which increases it. You are making my case of letting the perfect be the enemy of the good.

And in doing so, you enable a lot more murders. Winning! Jesus would be proud!

I am in no way defending politicians. But you are a great example of the perfect being the enemy of the good. You probably supported that Arizona 1864 law that outlawed abortion. Had that stood, you would have been happy. But a proposal on our November ballot would most certainly have passed which would embed in our constitution the right to abort a baby until birth. Instead, the state supreme court just this week pushed back the enforcement of that 1864 law for 90 days, until September. https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/politics-news/arizona-supreme-court-pushes-back-enforcement-1864-abortion-ban-rcna152092 In that time an interim law allowing abortion up to 15 weeks will stand, until a more permanent law can be put in place. If it stays at 15 weeks, I would argue that that is better than until birth. Would you agree? I give the Dems here a hard time (well, I probably make fun of our Republican nutcases more, but...) but I give credit to our governor Katie Hobbs and AG Kris Mayes for seeing the bigger picture and not pushing for enforcement of the 1864 law in hopes of a November bigger win.

I made a case earlier that the Judeo Christian primary teachings remain the best model for the morality of a society, independent of belief in God or Christ. I am amazed that, these 2000 years later, you really can't find fault with the teachings of Jesus. Love thy neighbor. Forgive others their trespasses. Great stuff. Furthermore, as you well know, Christianity went through a reformation, one that Islam never did. I've done a little studying in recent years of Buddhism and Hindu, also not bad. A little too much "life sucks so learn to love it" for my taste, but generally a peaceful approach. Anyway, to your post: while God gave you free will, and he may forgive you (i.e., show you the same grace) should you wander, a society cannot function on a person saying, for instance, "oh well, my will was to rape and kill a bunch of women." I'm not saying you are advocating this; instead, I'm saying that society can structure absolute moral expectations on a code judged by humans, which may not be the same way they are judged by God.

I want to say no, because I was considering him, but yes, he is yours. @WhiteWonder

He's not.

I guess we are the same age. Also agreed.

No Anthony Robles? Phayle.

That list shows my age. Hulk, for all his shmaltz, made wrestling as you young whipper snappers know it today. Dusty Rhodes? Bob Backlund, WWF champ for 5 years? Get off my lawn.

Given your law background: can Cohen testify to Trump's state of mind, other than specific statements made by Trump?

This is typical for the Leftist elite. It is how they justify their machiavellian legal pursuits of Trump. If these numbers continue to mive in Trump's favor, it will be interesting to see what new attacks they can devise. That being said, at least Tim is man enough to admit his feeljngs.

Thanks. Those aren't levels, they are mostly grade bumps. But in the spirit of you actually typing something which reads like an adult typed it, with plurals and everything, I'm moving on.

I am quite aware of hierarchy; I spoke to people up and down them all the times at many companies, including several Fortune 500 companies. I never had to go up 10 levels to get to the assistant report generator for the CFO. Educate me on these 10 levels below you that you quickly ascended? How old are you BTW? You said you were sick "a few years ago," but I thought you had cancer in your young 20s. Could be wrong though. I'm 56, since we are sharing.

Just quoting this for posterity.

Maybe you were too young to enjoy him back in the old skool heyday. He had some great quotes; I still sometimes say "to be the best, you gotta beat the best." WOOOOOOOOOOO$#@!#@!$#@!

Is that this trial? I thought this was the trial they decided to call paying a pron star to stay quiet "election interference." In the interest of justice and all. And by justice, I mean to get the mean orange man bad.