Since today is the "Day w/out Immigrants"...

[davebg 0]

First of all, you make the assumption that legal help = higher costs. I'm not sure I agree with that. My point is that employers will eat the costs, because consumers are only willing to pay a certain amount on some goods they expect to get for cheap - for example produce or fast food.

Let me see if I can put this into terms that you will understand...

 

Let's say your boss sends you out to pick up a fruit plate for the afternoon meeting. The fruit on said fruit plate could have been picked by illegal immigrants who get paid < minimum wage, the employer pays no taxes on those wages, nor does the employer have to pay for benefits or to insure these illegal workers. OR, the fruit could have been picked by a legal worker, making minimum wage, is entitled to moderate benefits, the employer must pay taxes on these wages and also must pay higher insurance premiums b/c he has all of these manual workers on the payroll.

 

Which fruit plate costs more to produce and, therefore, cost more for you to buy?

 

You can talk all you want about how the American people will only pay so much for certain things, but when we are talking about necessities (like food and housing) people will pay what they have to. I mean, look at the current gas prices...they're through the roof and people are not happy about it, but they are still paying at the pump...b/c they don't have a choice.

[MDC 7,152]

Let me see if I can put this into terms that you will understand...

 

Let's say your boss sends you out to pick up a fruit plate for the afternoon meeting. The fruit on said fruit plate could have been picked by illegal immigrants who get paid < minimum wage, the employer pays no taxes on those wages, nor does the employer have to pay for benefits or to insure these illegal workers. OR, the fruit could have been picked by a legal worker, making minimum wage, is entitled to moderate benefits, the employer must pay taxes on these wages and also must pay higher insurance premiums b/c he has all of these manual workers on the payroll.

 

Which fruit plate costs more to produce and, therefore, cost more for you to buy?

 

You can talk all you want about how the American people will only pay so much for certain things, but when we are talking about necessities (like food and housing) people will pay what they have to. I mean, look at the current gas prices...they're through the roof and people are not happy about it, but they are still paying at the pump...b/c they don't have a choice.

 

The problem isn't that I don't understand what you're saying. The problem is that your argument is "If we make employers pay taxes and hire only LEGAL help it will cost consumers more - therefore we should let them hire illegal workers and not pay taxes." So I get what you're saying - I just think it's dumb.

 

As far as costs going up, sure it will cost employers more to hire legal help but 1) so what? and 2) How much more do you really think goods are going to go up by? We're primarily talking about unskilled labor like dishwashers, bus boys, etc. and the big one is agriculture. Employers are going to swallow costs before consumers are going to pay dollars more for produce. I can easily envision a life without lettuce.

[mighty_thor 115]

a sizeable chunk--anywhere from 25-40% of the "illegal immigrants"--got visas just fine.

 

Not sure where you get your numbers but you are probably correct. Most non-mexican illegals would have entered legally and overstayed their visitors visa or temporary work visa. These Visas are also extremely difficult to get. Even if you have a sponser in the us it is no gaurentee. It is extremely hard to get a visa from a poor country. Impossible is the wrong word but virtually impossible for the most poor people.

[davebg 0]

The problem isn't that I don't understand what you're saying. The problem is that your argument is "If we make employers pay taxes and hire only LEGAL help it will cost consumers more - therefore we should let them hire illegal workers and not pay taxes." So I get what you're saying - I just think it's dumb.

 

As far as costs going up, sure it will cost employers more to hire legal help but 1) so what? and 2) How much more do you really think goods are going to go up by? We're primarily talking about unskilled labor like dishwashers, bus boys, etc. and the big one is agriculture. Employers are going to swallow costs before consumers are going to pay dollars more for produce. I can easily envision a life without lettuce.

I am not saying that we should let companies hire illegals...I am merely trying to discuss the issues and points being made by both sides.

 

As far as costs going up...uh...please show me an example where costs for necessary goods went up and those costs were not passed on to the customer (I'm tlaking about necessary goods...like food...not how Sony loses hundreds of dollars on each PS2 that they sell.)

[MDC 7,152]

I am not saying that we should let companies hire illegals...I am merely trying to discuss the issues and points being made by both sides.

 

As far as costs going up...uh...please show me an example where costs for necessary goods went up and those costs were not passed on to the customer (I'm tlaking about necessary goods...like food...not how Sony loses hundreds of dollars on each PS2 that they sell.)

 

Dave I don't understand why you're so hung up on the increased costs, when we're losing federal revenue via taxes and the public services that all of us are covering for the 11 million illegal workers. I'm guessing those expenses far outweigh whatever increased costs we'll have to put up with if we made employers obey the law.

 

I think costs are driven more by consumer demand than business expenses. If for some reason it started costing Burger King twice as much to run its business, consumers wouldn't be willing to pay $6 for a Whopper. There comes a point when businesses have to swallow costs in order to remain competitive.