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2010 NFL Draft Weekend Team Thread: Tennessee Titans

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1.16-

 

3.13-

 

3.33-

 

4.13-

 

5.17-

 

6.16-

 

6.38-

 

7.15-

 

7.34-

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no pick in the 2nd blows. I think this was for Nate Washington last year?

Nope. We traded this 2nd round pick for New England's 3rd round pick last season, which we used to draft TE Jared Cook.

 

At least we picked up an extra, compensatory 3rd rounder for losing Haynesworth.

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Nope. We traded this 2nd round pick for New England's 3rd round pick last season, which we used to draft TE Jared Cook.

 

At least we picked up an extra, compensatory 3rd rounder for losing Haynesworth.

 

 

thanks for the update :thumbsup:

 

3.13

3.33

4.13

 

this will be an exciting stretch!

 

Who do you think we are taking at 1.16? All mocks I've seen have a DE as the pick.

 

 

16 (16) Tennessee Jason Pierre-Paul DE South Florida

Pierre-Paul is raw and relies on his athleticism to pressure the QB. Unless he develops better technique, he never will become a productive NFL pass rusher. Risk: Medium.

 

http://www.sportingnews.com/nfl/draft/mock_draft?season=2010

 

 

 

16. Tennessee Titans - Everson Griffen, DE, USC: This could be a reach at 16th overall, but with that said, if anyone can manage "problem defensive linemen" it would be Jeff Fischer. If Fischer can harness that talent, Kyle Van Den Bosch will be a distant memory

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/381006-...e-rounds#page/2

 

 

16. TENNESSEE. Two years worth of defections on the defensive line lead to the Titans having major needs up front. Filling one will be SERGIO KINDLE, DE-OLB, Texas

http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/ravens/...13.story?page=2

 

 

 

16. Tennessee Titans

Jason Pierre-Paul, DE, South Florida

This is a risky pick because Pierre-Paul is so raw and only has seven college starts, but he has the physical traits of a premier defensive end. The Titans have a tremendous defensive line coach to develop him.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story?id=09000d5d8...mp;confirm=true

 

 

Derrick Morgan - DE - GA TECH

03/16/2010 - According to NFL Network's Mike Mayock, "just about everyone in attendance" at Georgia Tech's Pro Day believed Derrick Morgan will be a 4-3 defensive end in the NFL -- not a 3-4 outside linebacker. Morgan struggled badly when asked to drop and change direction at the Combine. He was a bit better at Monday's Pro Day, but at 6'3/266 Morgan's best fit appears to be as a base, 4-3 right or left defensive end. Mayock expects Morgan to be drafted somewhere in the top 10-20, though it appears we can cross most 3-4 clubs off the list of potential landing spots. - USA TODAY football

 

 

02/23/2010 - Georgia Tech defensive end Derrick Morgan is planning to work out at the Combine in his attempt to secure the title as the top-rated pass rusher of the 2010 draft. I spoke to Derrick a bit ago in preparation for a future article. The defending ACC Defensive Player of the Year is eager to show off what he can do, especially after a not so-splashy final performance in the 24-14 loss to Iowa in the Orange Bowl. Morgan, who posted 55 tackles, 18.5 tackles for loss and a 12.5 sacks on the year,

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players...w;pageContainer

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if joe haden falls to us i see them grabbing him.....if not prob JPP or morgan

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I think the Titans definitely go DE in the 1st round. Lots of intriguing DEs will be available at that point -- Brandon Graham, Everson Griffin, Carlos Dunlap, possibly Jason Pierre-Paul, possibly Derrick Morgan.

 

I'd probably rank them:

1. Derrick Morgan (real strong against the run with pass-rushing potential too)

2. Brandon Graham (high-motor guy who is tough against the run and pass)

3. JPP (athletic freak against the pass but can get beat against the run)

4. Everson Griffin (another athletic freak but doesn't have the ceiling of JPP)

5. Carlos Dunlap (nice size/speed combo but has some major character issues)

 

 

I don't think that we go with CB in the 1st round. We brought in Tye Hill this offseason and re-signed Rod Hood. Plus, we just drafted Ryan Mouton and Jason McCourty last season; and I think the coaching staff plans to give those two every opportunity to develop into starting CBs. My bet is that our opening-day starting CBs are Cortland Finnegan and Ryan Mouton. If we draft a CB in this draft, I'm hoping for Javier Arenas in the 3rd round -- a guy who could develop into a solid nickle-CB but, more importantly, is a dynamite KR/PR (which we desperately need).

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I think the Titans definitely go DE in the 1st round. Lots of intriguing DEs will be available at that point -- Brandon Graham, Everson Griffin, Carlos Dunlap, possibly Jason Pierre-Paul, possibly Derrick Morgan.

 

I'd probably rank them:

1. Derrick Morgan (real strong against the run with pass-rushing potential too)

2. Brandon Graham (high-motor guy who is tough against the run and pass)

3. JPP (athletic freak against the pass but can get beat against the run)

4. Everson Griffin (another athletic freak but doesn't have the ceiling of JPP)

5. Carlos Dunlap (nice size/speed combo but has some major character issues)

I don't think that we go with CB in the 1st round. We brought in Tye Hill this offseason and re-signed Rod Hood. Plus, we just drafted Ryan Mouton and Jason McCourty last season; and I think the coaching staff plans to give those two every opportunity to develop into starting CBs. My bet is that our opening-day starting CBs are Cortland Finnegan and Ryan Mouton. If we draft a CB in this draft, I'm hoping for Javier Arenas in the 3rd round -- a guy who could develop into a solid nickle-CB but, more importantly, is a dynamite KR/PR (which we desperately need).

 

 

Bingo - why can't the Titan's find somebody for this position? I can't recall how many years it's been since the Titan's had a kickoff return td - a long time I think? I wan't a small, speedy, shifty, quick homerun guy PLEASE.

 

As for the DE to take - - jeez - - we need a pass rusher and a rush stopper:) I'm going with Morgan!

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2010 TENNESSEE TITANS SCHEDULE!

 

Sh!t - - I'm hoping for a 4-4 record at the bye.

 

Fantasy Football Outlook - - LOOK AT WEEKS 12-16. Going up against suspect defenses - maybe have a Titan or two on your roster :lol:

 

 

Titans Regular Season Schedule (All times Eastern)

Week 1: Sunday, Sep. 12, Oakland, 1:00 PM

Week 2: Sunday, Sep. 19, Pittsburgh, 1:00 PM

Week 3: Sunday, Sep. 26, at NY Giants, 1:00 PM

Week 4: Sunday, Oct. 3, Denver, 1:00 PM

Week 5: Sunday, Oct. 10, at Dallas, 4:15 PM

Week 6: Monday, Oct. 18, at Jacksonville, 8:30 PM

Week 7: Sunday, Oct. 24, Philadelphia, 1:00 PM

Week 8: Sunday, Oct. 31, at San Diego, 4:05 PM

Week 9: BYE

Week 10: Sunday, Nov. 14, at Miami, 1:00 PM

Week 11: Sunday, Nov. 21, Washington, 1:00 PM

Week 12: Sunday, Nov. 28, at Houston, 1:00 PM

Week 13: Sunday, Dec. 5, Jacksonville, 1:00 PM

Week 14: Thursday, Dec. 9, Indianapolis, 8:20 PM

Week 15: Sunday, Dec. 19, Houston, 1:00 PM

Week 16: Sunday, Dec. 26, at Kansas City, 1:00 PM

Week 17: Sunday, Jan. 2, at Indianapolis, 1:00 PM

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Bingo - why can't the Titan's find somebody for this position? I can't recall how many years it's been since the Titan's had a kickoff return td - a long time I think? I wan't a small, speedy, shifty, quick homerun guy PLEASE.

 

As for the DE to take - - jeez - - we need a pass rusher and a rush stopper:) I'm going with Morgan!

 

 

if pacman wasnt such an azzshoe

 

 

but yeah we def need a return man.....

 

 

DE is our priority, but like i said, it would be hard to pass on Haden if he is there

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if pacman wasnt such an azzshoe

but yeah we def need a return man.....

DE is our priority, but like i said, it would be hard to pass on Haden if he is there

 

 

The Titans gave up the 2nd most points in the NFL last year behind Detroit - - - in the you suck in pass defese category. The defense was clobbered with injuries, but still they sucked. I'm fine with Haden, maybe the staff could develop some trust in a great CB and actually BLITZ every now and then. It was quite obvious last season that the front 4 weren't getting to the qb at all. And the CB's and Safeties couldn't stop the pass at all. Pick your poison - - DE or CB? Who knows? We could use the help everywhere.

 

I'm excited, and can't wait to see who that number 16 pick is.

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2010 TENNESSEE TITANS SCHEDULE!

 

Sh!t - - I'm hoping for a 4-4 record at the bye.

 

Fantasy Football Outlook - - LOOK AT WEEKS 12-16. Going up against suspect defenses - maybe have a Titan or two on your roster :thumbsdown:

 

Titans Regular Season Schedule (All times Eastern)

Week 1: Sunday, Sep. 12, Oakland, 1:00 PM WIN

Week 2: Sunday, Sep. 19, Pittsburgh, 1:00 PM WIN

Week 3: Sunday, Sep. 26, at NY Giants, 1:00 PM LOSS

Week 4: Sunday, Oct. 3, Denver, 1:00 PM WIN

Week 5: Sunday, Oct. 10, at Dallas, 4:15 PM LOSS

Week 6: Monday, Oct. 18, at Jacksonville, 8:30 PM LOSS

Week 7: Sunday, Oct. 24, Philadelphia, 1:00 PM WIN

Week 8: Sunday, Oct. 31, at San Diego, 4:05 PM LOSS AGAIN

Week 9: BYE

Week 10: Sunday, Nov. 14, at Miami, 1:00 PM LOSS

Week 11: Sunday, Nov. 21, Washington, 1:00 PM LOSS

Week 12: Sunday, Nov. 28, at Houston, 1:00 PM LOSS

Week 13: Sunday, Dec. 5, Jacksonville, 1:00 PM WIN

Week 14: Thursday, Dec. 9, Indianapolis, 8:20 PM LOSS

Week 15: Sunday, Dec. 19, Houston, 1:00 PM WIN

Week 16: Sunday, Dec. 26, at Kansas City, 1:00 PM WIN

Week 17: Sunday, Jan. 2, at Indianapolis, 1:00 PM WIN B/C COLTS WILL BE ON THE BENCH

 

 

 

8-8

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The Titans gave up the 2nd most points in the NFL last year behind Detroit - - - in the you suck in pass defese category. The defense was clobbered with injuries, but still they sucked. I'm fine with Haden, maybe the staff could develop some trust in a great CB and actually BLITZ every now and then. It was quite obvious last season that the front 4 weren't getting to the qb at all. And the CB's and Safeties couldn't stop the pass at all. Pick your poison - - DE or CB? Who knows? We could use the help everywhere.

 

I'm excited, and can't wait to see who that number 16 pick is.

 

Of course, the New England 60+ point azzwhooping skewed those numbers a bit.

 

We gotta take a pass rusher at 16. I hope Pierre-Paul is there. He may be a third down specialist at first, but he has the ceiling to be something special, and I think we can coach him up.

 

I'd also like to see Haynesworth brought back this weekend.

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Of course, the New England 60+ point azzwhooping skewed those numbers a bit.

 

We gotta take a pass rusher at 16. I hope Pierre-Paul is there. He may be a third down specialist at first, but he has the ceiling to be something special, and I think we can coach him up.

 

I'd also like to see Haynesworth brought back this weekend.

 

 

now you're talking. Even if it is for his 10-12 healthy games. Give up both 3rd rounders this year. Or is that too high?

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Of course, the New England 60+ point azzwhooping skewed those numbers a bit.

 

We gotta take a pass rusher at 16. I hope Pierre-Paul is there. He may be a third down specialist at first, but he has the ceiling to be something special, and I think we can coach him up.

 

I'd also like to see Haynesworth brought back this weekend.

 

 

i def agree....i like JPP.....i know alot of the titans boards disagree though LOL....i dont know, he reminds me of Jevon Kearse, and look what he did for us when we first got him....was a great pick

 

 

im 50/50 with the big al thing.......yes he would help us again, but he is a big fuckin baby

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i def agree....i like JPP.....i know alot of the titans boards disagree though LOL....i dont know, he reminds me of Jevon Kearse, and look what he did for us when we first got him....was a great pick

im 50/50 with the big al thing.......yes he would help us again, but he is a big fuckin baby

 

 

A great page on Jason Pierre-Paul with an interview mid way down. Pretty good read. I don't think he's going to make it to the #16 pick

 

http://www.squidoo.com/jason_pierre-paul

 

 

same link's DE rankings

1. Derrick Morgan - Georgia Tech

2. Carlos Dunlap - Florida

3. Jason Pierre-Paul - South Florida

4. Brandon Graham - Michigan

5. Everson Griffen - USC

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1.16- Derrick Morgan - DE - 6-4 270 Georgia Tech

 

Prospect Rank: 9

Derrick Morgan was rated as a top 10 player on most teams' draft boards and he was a solid pick by the Titans. The Titans got extremely fortunate with this selection because of the needs of the teams.

 

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/draft/prospec...ospectId=381280

 

 

3.13- DAMIAN WILLIAMS - WR - USC

Williams is a transfer from Arkansas to Southern Cal that enjoyed pretty much instant success since arriving in L.A. He led the Trojans in receptions during his two seasons at USC and showed the kind of speed, agility and athleticism that makes him a threat to take it all the way once the ball gets into his hands. He may lack premier top end speed but he does play the game fast and has a lot of agility and elusiveness in the open field. He also brings the added value of being a quality punt returner to the next level. He has struggled to make it through a full collegiate schedule healthy and his durability could be a concern for the next level.

 

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2010/profiles/dam...liams?id=497336

 

 

 

3.33- RENNIE CURRAN - LB - GEORGIA

 

As a true freshman in 2007, Curran appeared in 11 games making five starts with 53 tackles including 9 for loss and 3 quarterback sacks. He received Freshman First-team All-America honors by Rivals.com, and Honorable Mention by The Sporting News.[5]

In his sophomore season, Curran started all 13 games leading the team in tackles (115), including a team-leading 10 for a loss and a team-high 3 sacks to go along with two forced fumbles. His 115 tackles were the most by a Bulldog since Orantes Grant recorded 120 in 1998.[6] Curran was a finalist for the Butkus Award and earned Sophomore All-American honors by College Football News.[7] He was voted First-team All-SEC by the AP and Coaches in 2009, and was also named First-team All-America by CBSSports.com after leading the SEC in tackles with 116

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rennie_Curran

 

Rennie is a short undersized linebacker that has been productive for the Bulldogs over the past three seasons. He has put up big numbers as a two year starter and is one of Georgia’s most active defenders. Rennie is quicker than fast and is best between the tackles. He plays hard but doesn’t have great range to the sideline. He is inconsistent with leveraging the ball as he doesn’t always take proper angles as the play unfolds. He understands route progressions and coverage schemes but again his lack of pure speed may make him a liability in this phase of the game. Rennie Curran maybe a better college player than NFL prospect in this year’s draft.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2010/profiles/ren...urran?id=496917

 

 

4.13-

 

5.17-

 

6.16-

 

6.38-

 

7.15-

 

7.34-

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Bingo - why can't the Titan's find somebody for this position? I can't recall how many years it's been since the Titan's had a kickoff return td - a long time I think? I wan't a small, speedy, shifty, quick homerun guy PLEASE.

 

As for the DE to take - - jeez - - we need a pass rusher and a rush stopper:) I'm going with Morgan!

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1.16- Derrick Morgan - DE - 6-4 270 Georgia Tech

 

Prospect Rank: 9

Derrick Morgan was rated as a top 10 player on most teams' draft boards and he was a solid pick by the Titans. The Titans got extremely fortunate with this selection because of the needs of the teams.

 

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/draft/prospec...ospectId=381280

 

 

3.13- DAMIAN WILLIAMS - WR - USC

Williams is a transfer from Arkansas to Southern Cal that enjoyed pretty much instant success since arriving in L.A. He led the Trojans in receptions during his two seasons at USC and showed the kind of speed, agility and athleticism that makes him a threat to take it all the way once the ball gets into his hands. He may lack premier top end speed but he does play the game fast and has a lot of agility and elusiveness in the open field. He also brings the added value of being a quality punt returner to the next level. He has struggled to make it through a full collegiate schedule healthy and his durability could be a concern for the next level.

 

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2010/profiles/dam...liams?id=497336

 

3.33-

 

4.13-

 

5.17-

 

6.16-

 

6.38-

 

7.15-

 

7.34-

 

TITAN'S BUMP

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1.16- Derrick Morgan - DE - 6-4 270 Georgia Tech

 

Prospect Rank: 9

Derrick Morgan was rated as a top 10 player on most teams' draft boards and he was a solid pick by the Titans. The Titans got extremely fortunate with this selection because of the needs of the teams.

 

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/draft/prospec...ospectId=381280

 

 

3.13- DAMIAN WILLIAMS - WR - USC

Williams is a transfer from Arkansas to Southern Cal that enjoyed pretty much instant success since arriving in L.A. He led the Trojans in receptions during his two seasons at USC and showed the kind of speed, agility and athleticism that makes him a threat to take it all the way once the ball gets into his hands. He may lack premier top end speed but he does play the game fast and has a lot of agility and elusiveness in the open field. He also brings the added value of being a quality punt returner to the next level. He has struggled to make it through a full collegiate schedule healthy and his durability could be a concern for the next level.

 

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2010/profiles/dam...liams?id=497336

 

 

3.33- RENNIE CURRAN - LB - GEORGIA

 

As a true freshman in 2007, Curran appeared in 11 games making five starts with 53 tackles including 9 for loss and 3 quarterback sacks. He received Freshman First-team All-America honors by Rivals.com, and Honorable Mention by The Sporting News.[5]

In his sophomore season, Curran started all 13 games leading the team in tackles (115), including a team-leading 10 for a loss and a team-high 3 sacks to go along with two forced fumbles. His 115 tackles were the most by a Bulldog since Orantes Grant recorded 120 in 1998.[6] Curran was a finalist for the Butkus Award and earned Sophomore All-American honors by College Football News.[7] He was voted First-team All-SEC by the AP and Coaches in 2009, and was also named First-team All-America by CBSSports.com after leading the SEC in tackles with 116

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rennie_Curran

 

Rennie is a short undersized linebacker that has been productive for the Bulldogs over the past three seasons. He has put up big numbers as a two year starter and is one of Georgia’s most active defenders. Rennie is quicker than fast and is best between the tackles. He plays hard but doesn’t have great range to the sideline. He is inconsistent with leveraging the ball as he doesn’t always take proper angles as the play unfolds. He understands route progressions and coverage schemes but again his lack of pure speed may make him a liability in this phase of the game. Rennie Curran maybe a better college player than NFL prospect in this year’s draft.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2010/profiles/ren...urran?id=496917

 

 

4.13-

 

5.17-

 

6.16-

 

6.38-

 

7.15-

 

7.34-

 

LOOKING PRETTY GOOD! NOT 100% SOLD ON DAMIAN WILLIAMS PICK, BUT OK NON THE LESS.

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we should of traded down on alot of picks....especially the rennie curran pick.....i think we could of traded down and still got Williams too

 

 

Pats are draft gods

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if you could choose between Jevan Snead, Tony Pike, Dan Lefevour and Rusty Smith..................Why Choose Rusty? must be the name

 

 

 

fav line i hear this far aswell

 

" If the NFL decides to scrap games and having spelling bees instead, the Titans will be instant favorites with Howard and Rolle."

 

 

 

love my titans

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What is the gameplan at backup rb? What am I missing? I think Hillis would have been perfect as a replacement for White.

 

White wanted to be traded, no reason to have a crying #2 rb in the locker room. Plus looks at these stats from Javon Ringer

 

2009 - - 8 carries for 48 yards and 0 td's. His longest went for 32 yards :cheers:. This is a 6.0 ypc guy - - who needs Lendale White?

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What is the gameplan at backup rb? What am I missing? I think Hillis would have been perfect as a replacement for White.

 

They also signed Stafon Johnson USC as an undrafted free agent

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Titans also signed RB LaGarrett Blount from Oregon (i.e. the dude that punched that Boise State player in the face after a game last year). I actually really, REALLY like the Blount signing. He was originally suspended for the whole season for his face-punching antics, but showed enough contrition throughout the season to be re-instated. He runs with a lot of power and was one of the more consistent RBs at the Senior Bowl. Assuming he makes the roster, he should be a solid replacement for Lendale.

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Draft Picks:

1.16 - DE Derrick Morgan (Georgia Tech)

Love this pick. Titans lost Kyle Vanden Bosch and Jevon Kearse this offseason; and though both are over-the-hill players, their departures left the team with very, very little depth at DE. Morgan was the best all-around DE in this draft. He's very strong against the run and pretty good (albeit not great) at rushing the passer. Hopefully, the coaching staff lets him start this season, opposite William Hayes -- which would allow Jacob Ford to come in on passing situations (where he's best anyway).

3.77 - WR Damian Williams (USC)

I also like this pick in the middle of the 3rd round. Williams is a bit slower than you'd like, but he runs good routes and knows how to get open. He should be able to push Lavelle Hawkins for the #4 WR position this season. More importantly, he's supposed to be a good KR/PR, which the Titans desperately needed.

3.97 - LB Rennie Curran (Georgia)

Even though some are saying this is a bit of a reach at the end of the 3rd round, I really like this pick too. Curran is undersized; however, he plays very fast and seems to always be around the ball. Smart player too who can predict how the play is developing. We've had some luck with smallish LBs lately (Stephen Tulloch & Gerald McRath), and I think Curran could contribute too.

4.104 - CB Alterraun Verner (UCLA)

Not so crazy about this pick since we traded up to draft him. Verner's a ballhawk, but I'm not sure he has the speed to consistently keep up with NFL receivers. Then again...he can't be any worse than Nick Harper was this past season. He'll probably compete with Rod Hill & Tye Hill for depth this season.

5.148 - S Robert Johnson (Utah)

OK pick. Doubt that he'll ever be a starter, but we need some depth at S because Donnie Nickey has no business being out on the field with the defense.

6.176 - QB Rusty Smith (Florida Atlantic)

Intriguing player to develop. Haven't watched him play but he's supposedly got a strong arm and a lot of what you look for in a good backup QB.

6.207 - S Myron Rolle (Florida State)

Love this pick. Rolle isn't very fast, but he's extremely smart and breakdown a play pretty quickly. Some question his dedication to football, but I'm not sure where that comes from exactly -- because he wanted to take a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to be a Rhodes Scholar in a foreign country? He'll be a good player for us.

7.222 - WR Marc Mariani (Montana)

I'm sure this is a Fisher pick because his son plays at Montana. Not sure what receiving skills that Mariani has, but he's supposedly a pretty good KR/PR, which we need. Doubt that he sticks but you never know.

7.241 - DT David Howard (Brown)

Don't know much about him other than he's another classic Titans DLineman -- smallish and capable of getting after the QB. I put my trust in Washburn to develop talent.

 

UDFA:

RB Stafon Johnson (USC)

RB LaGarrett Blount (Oregon)

RB Dominique Lindsay (ECU)

FB William Rose (Florida Atlantic)

WR Mico McSwain (North Alabama)

WR Bobby Sewall (Brown)

TE Gerald Harris (Ole Miss)

TE Steve Pfahler (Montana)

OL Kevin Matthews (Texas A&M)

OL Nick Howell (USC)

When all is said and done, I think LaGarrett Blount makes this team and ends up pushing Javon Ringer for backup duties. I think we'd like to put Stafon Johnson on the PS because he's still coming back from injury; but I'm not sure that another team won't scoop him up. Not familiar with the other guys, but Kevin Matthews is Bruce Matthews son, I guess. If we didn't draft any OL depth this year, my guess is that Munchak thinks he can develop Matthews or Howell into depth guys.

 

 

Draft Trades:

--SEAHAWKS get--

RB Lendale White

DT Kevin Vickerson

Titans 4th Round Pick

Titans 6th Round Pick

--TITANS get--

Seahawks 4th Round Pick

Seahawks 6th Round Pick

 

I don't like this trade for us at all. Yes...Lendale wanted out of TN, but that doesn't mean that we had to give him away for nothing but a negligible swap-up in the draft. Vickerson didn't really fit our DEF scheme; however, I'm upset that we also gave him away for nothing because he has the size/ability to be a solid rotational DT in this league. Basically...I don't get the logic of this trade aside from us just wanting to get rid of these two guys (for whatever reason).

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