redtodd 7 Posted November 13, 2007 Clay Buckholz, John Lester and Jacoby Ellsbury for Johan Santana. Discuss. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
edjr 7,093 Posted November 13, 2007 Don't be stupid. Theo isn't trading all 3 of those guys for one pitcher. hth Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hoytdwow 202 Posted November 13, 2007 No. Never give up 3 young, good cost-controlled players for one giant albatross free agent. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Scooby 0 Posted November 13, 2007 Clay Buckholz, John Lester and Jacoby Ellsbury for Johan Santana. Discuss. I have no idea who those 3 are to trade for Johan... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mighty_thor 115 Posted November 13, 2007 I have no idea who those 3 are to trade for Johan... You do'nt know who those three are? One guy won the clinching game of the world series. One guy was one of the stars in the World Series. The other guy was called up late and pitched 4 games for the Red Sox. Going 3-1 with a 1.59 ERA. In his second major league start he pitched a no hitter. There is no way in he11 i would trade all three of those guys for Santana. I would'nt even trade the two pitchers straight up for santana. The Yankees already said that their young pitchers will not be traded in any deal for santana. I think the Red Sox should take the same stance. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
edjr 7,093 Posted November 13, 2007 You do'nt know who those three are? One guy won the clinching game of the world series. One guy was one of the stars in the World Series. The other guy was called up late and pitched 4 games for the Red Sox. Going 3-1 with a 1.59 ERA. In his second major league start he pitched a no hitter. There is no way in he11 i would trade all three of those guys for Santana. I would'nt even trade the two pitchers straight up for santana. The Yankees already said that their young pitchers will not be traded in any deal for santana. I think the Red Sox should take the same stance. Major League Baseball is slowly changing. Youth has been getting it done the last few years in MLB for the big market teams. Why would you trade a 2 guys you can pay 300,000 to that are major league ready, for a guy you'll have to pay 20,000,000+? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hoytdwow 202 Posted November 13, 2007 Why would you trade a 2 guys you can pay 300,000 to that are major league ready, for a guy you'll have to pay 20,000,000+? Why do you repeat my posts? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
edjr 7,093 Posted November 13, 2007 Why do you repeat my posts? No. Never give up 3 young, good cost-controlled players for one giant albatross free agent. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VikesFan 1 Posted November 19, 2007 Clay Buckholz, John Lester and Jacoby Ellsbury for Johan Santana. Discuss. Here's my problem. We don't need pitching. Ellsbury would be nice, and the other 2 may be great, but we need position players. Take out one of those pitchers and add a high ceiling 3B, 2B, or DH, and I'd take it in a heart beat... My other problem is leaving Santana in the AL If Santana is traded, my guess is to LA for LaRoche, Kemp, and one of kershaw/billingsly Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cgod 0 Posted November 19, 2007 Sub Coco for Jacoby and I'd be hard pressed to say no. Take Vikes angle and make it Coco, another position prospect and either Lester or Buchholz and absolutely. Of course in either case I would want to know that I could sign Johan to a contract extension. It's hard to turn away one of the best pitchers in the game, especially considering he's a lefty. You know what you're going to get out of him over the course of the season. I know we have seen good things out of the kids but you never know what happens once you give ML hitters a full off-season to study video and make adjustments on new pitchers. Johan's been doing it year in and year out for some time now. Hitters have studied and made adjustments and he still gets it done. Put him on a team with an offense like the Sox and instead of 15-13 you're looking at 20+ wins and single digit losses. Imagine a top 4 of Santana, Beckett, Dice-K and Scilling? Wakefield is back and if the deal were for only 1 of the 2 kids then you have 6 solid starters going into the season. Another deal I heard involved Haren and Chavez. Kinda like the Beckett-Lowell thing a few years ago no? I think, if Chavez can get healthy, that suits you well too. You get a young guy who is a horse and is relatively cheap and a solid defensive 3B with some pop who (again if healthy) sees a bit of a resurgence hitting in the Sox line-up. I think this deal could be had for a bit cheaper than Santana. Of course all of this is big-time dreaming. Would be nice but I bet the chances of either are slim. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
edjr 7,093 Posted November 19, 2007 I'd love Haren and Chavez. Mike Lowell last year was not the rule, it was the exception. He will NOT put up those kinds of #'s the next 3 years, forget about 4 years. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cgod 0 Posted November 19, 2007 I'd love Haren and Chavez. Mike Lowell last year was not the rule, it was the exception. He will NOT put up those kinds of #'s the next 3 years, forget about 4 years. I agree. Any way you cut it you're hoping for Drew and Lugo to perform more in line with their career averages to help offset the same effect you get when the rule applies to Lowell if he resigns. You'll also get some help from Manny if he stays healthy and Ellsbury replacing Crisp (or Crisp performing closer to what is expected of him.) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VikesFan 1 Posted November 24, 2007 Sub Coco for Jacoby and I'd be hard pressed to say no. Take Vikes angle and make it Coco, another position prospect and either Lester or Buchholz and absolutely. Of course in either case I would want to know that I could sign Johan to a contract extension. It's hard to turn away one of the best pitchers in the game, especially considering he's a lefty. You know what you're going to get out of him over the course of the season. I know we have seen good things out of the kids but you never know what happens once you give ML hitters a full off-season to study video and make adjustments on new pitchers. Johan's been doing it year in and year out for some time now. Hitters have studied and made adjustments and he still gets it done. Put him on a team with an offense like the Sox and instead of 15-13 you're looking at 20+ wins and single digit losses. Imagine a top 4 of Santana, Beckett, Dice-K and Scilling? Wakefield is back and if the deal were for only 1 of the 2 kids then you have 6 solid starters going into the season. Another deal I heard involved Haren and Chavez. Kinda like the Beckett-Lowell thing a few years ago no? I think, if Chavez can get healthy, that suits you well too. You get a young guy who is a horse and is relatively cheap and a solid defensive 3B with some pop who (again if healthy) sees a bit of a resurgence hitting in the Sox line-up. I think this deal could be had for a bit cheaper than Santana. Of course all of this is big-time dreaming. Would be nice but I bet the chances of either are slim. The premise of this post was Ellisbury, and that was the correct option and the proper starting place. I could see the Twins trading for Coco, but it won't have much of anything to do with Santana. Coco is currently a throw away player... not a centerpiece in a Santana deal. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cgod 0 Posted November 25, 2007 The premise of this post was Ellisbury, and that was the correct option and the proper starting place. I could see the Twins trading for Coco, but it won't have much of anything to do with Santana. Coco is currently a throw away player... not a centerpiece in a Santana deal. Was just responding, as a Sox fan, how I would prefer to do the trade. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VikesFan 1 Posted November 26, 2007 Was just responding, as a Sox fan, how I would prefer to do the trade. understand, but it won't get done if it's coco.... sorry. The Twins want high ceiling position players that can help them now... in two or three of the positions of need. The sox only have one of those guys (ellisbury) and a couple of nice pitching prospects which the Twins really dont' need. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
