Da Bears 34 - Da Pats 3

[football_scooter 0]

Oh wait, of course - Draft Chambers over DJax; Kevan Barlow is a stud, Frank Gore is a dud

 

Hey asshat, I never said Gore was a dud, nor did I say that Barlow should be taken over him. This is the 3rd time you've posted this nonsense and the 3rd time you've been called on it. I said that 2nd round was a bit too high for my tastes for a guy with Gore's injury history and on a crap-ass team like my Niners. I was wrong about it and I'm thrilled that i was wrong about it - but he is an undersized punishing runner who's had surgery on all 4 appendages. It was alarm raising in the preseason, and I'd say it's a safe assumption that NO ONE expected this good of a season out of him.

 

As for Chambers/DJax, that was in May or June - when DJax was having knee surgery and CPep was the QB in MIA.

 

In any case, these are both straw man tactics at best, and ad hominem at worst in attempt to discredit me because you lack the intelligence or stomach to respond intelligently to my prior assertions which actually were ON TOPIC, unlike the crap you bring to the table in effort to deflect the things that you cannot defend.

 

And no, those assertions were not that Orton was the answer. My assertion was that any intelligent Bears fan can look at the same data I've looked at and would more than likely draw the same conclusion: that with Grossman at the helm in the post season the Bears will be about 50-50 in every game.

 

Do I really need to post my own quote a 3rd time for you to finally comprehend that?

 

ok, since you forced me to:

 

posted for the 3rd focking time...will Sweatiness ignore it yet again?

Once again: negro, please. You sound just as bad as the Vick apologists when you talk about winning %. With a defense like the Bears have are you really going to attribute the majority of Bears wins to Rex Grossman?

Like this game:

14/37 for 144 yds and 0 TDs with 4 Ints - a game the Bears won 24-23 - the winner against AZ that was gift wrapped for them. (if you wanna crown 'em, then crown 'em!)

 

Against the Jets he was 11/22 for 119 with 1 TD in the win. I wouldn't put that one on Rex either.

 

and against MIA, in a game they lost I might add, he was 18/42 for 210 with 1 TD to 3 Ints.

 

For the season, Grossman is 192/346 (55%) with 18 TDs and 14 Ints. That's a QB rating of 77.6

 

Brady is 221/367 (60.2%) with 20 TDs to 11 Ints, a QB rating of 87.1

 

Yeah - Rex sure is better than Brady there.

 

Probably not the best idea to point to one irrelevant statistic and rest your case on it that Grossman isn't very iffy. Especially not W-L %, because he's had several total stinkers that the team won and he has a TD:Int of nearly 1:1.

 

That is essentially the EXACT argument that Skinny Bastard has been making for Vick for 3 years now.

Now to your credit, you're more realistic and you seem to accept his flaws.

 

But my point wasn't that Grossman sucks or doesn't suck or whether he has a future or not. My point was that were I a bears fan, I would be extremely uncomfortable with Grossman leading my team into the big game, because he's not shown much in games against decent defenses. MIA and AZ were the best he's faced before the Pats. The results aren't pretty. 354 yds, 1 TD and 7 Ints in those 2 combined. Add in Minny, who's been soft against the pass and you've got another 278 yds and 2 more picks with just one more TD. Ok, now we're at 2 TDs to 9 Ints in those 3 games. Now add NE and you're looking at 2 TDs to 12 Ints. He had a good game against Seattle, 2 TDs, 0 Ints....but otherwise I don't see another team on thier schedule who's defense was worth spit. Not DET, not GB, BUF, SF (at the time), a depleted NYG, NYJ? None of those teams even vaguely resemble the Cowboys, and I don't think the Bears offense could survive a shootout against the Saints. Then if they do advance, I have a hard time seeing Grossman mustering a good game against the Ravens or Pats.

 

And in the playoffs there will be no Cardinals to throw 4 Ints against and still be able to win the game. In the Superbowl there will be no Jets where you can throw 110 yds with 1 TD and hope to win - there will be teams with excellent defenses and top rated offenses who can put 3 or 4 scores on the board, even against the vaunted Bears defense. Like any great defense, the Bears could be handicapped by Grossman's mistakes. Instead of engineering sustained drives that allow the defense to rest, one pick and they're right back out there. How effective will Urlacher & Co be if they're forced to be on the field for much of the 1st half because Rex threw a pick or fumbled away a ball because he lacks the fundamentals to make his reads or (gasp!) know how to handle a snap? Again - no statement about his future. I think he has potential to be an excellent QB, and you're 100% on target...he's like a rookie considering all the time he'd missed early on. But there seems to be about a 50-50 chance that Grossman will cost your team a win once they start playing games that matter against teams that can harass him in the post season.

 

And 50-50 would make me really nervous were I a bears fan.

 

Just one man's opinion. I agree that Grossman is young and I do cut him some slack when evaluating him...but in this topic I'm evaluating the Bears chances at winning the SB, and I think it's going to be an uphill battle mainly because of Grossman at QB. Not saying anyone on the team is better, but I'm just saying.

 

 

Man, I feel bad for good bears fans like Walter, who has to put up with retards like you spouting off and giving Bears fans a bad name.

 

 

ETA - not to defend the Lions, but I'd say that Harrington has proven without a doubt that he is a talented NFL QB. His performance on TG was all the evidence needed. Now that the Lions are in his rear view, he's got a good shot at a bright NFL future. He was doomed from the getgo there.

[Walter34 3]

Not to continue the tangent, but Alex Smith with his 11-9 TD/INT ratio isnt exactly the game manager you guys are suggesting. He's better than year 1, but isnt anything more than a project still.

 

There is a few elite qbs and a few good ones and then there is a large group of ones with pros and cons ... then there is a few that are lucky to have jobs.

 

Elite:

 

P Manning

Brady

McNabb (if he can return well from another injury)

Palmer

Brees

 

Other than these guys, the next tier is large and full of guys with flaws and good points

 

The last tier:

 

Aaron Brooks

[Sweetness_34 0]

And no, those assertions were not that Orton was the answer. My assertion was that any intelligent Bears fan can look at the same data I've looked at and would more than likely draw the same conclusion: that with Grossman at the helm in the post season the Bears will be about 50-50 in every game.

 

===========

 

And I have never disagreed with this, even once .... in none of my threads. But I rather have Grossman than have Alex freaking Smith and his 5th round Qb talent. (Yup, even Brad Gradkowski looks like a better QB out there than alex freaking smith ever has, despite the strong running game that the niners have). And I definitely would rather have Grossman over Griese and Orton.

 

Last year IN THE PLAYOFFS, Grossman led the Bears to 20+ points against the 4th ranked Car D. And this was DESPITE our D makoing boneheaded mistakes that day and giving up >20 pts. You conveniently forget that, but you are an asshat so nothing new there.

 

Draft Barlow over Gore???? BWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH (and yes you said that.....a thread full of that BS.)

 

Draft Chambers over DJax????????? BWAAAAAAAAAAAAH (and yes, one of the reasons I said that DJax was a safer pick than Chambers was because of the Qb situation. Culpepper has shown he is a horrible qb without Moss even before he was injured last year vs Minny)

 

 

 

Not to continue the tangent, but Alex Smith with his 11-9 TD/INT ratio isnt exactly the game manager you guys are suggesting. He's better than year 1, but isnt anything more than a project still.

 

There is a few elite qbs and a few good ones and then there is a large group of ones with pros and cons ... then there is a few that are lucky to have jobs.

 

Elite:

 

P Manning

Brady

McNabb (if he can return well from another injury)

Palmer

Brees

 

Other than these guys, the next tier is large and full of guys with flaws and good points

 

The last tier:

 

Aaron Brooks

 

swamp poosay assessing QBs? BWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAh. That asshat thinks Matt Millen is a draft guru, enough said

[swamp dog 0]

And no, those assertions were not that Orton was the answer. My assertion was that any intelligent Bears fan can look at the same data I've looked at and would more than likely draw the same conclusion: that with Grossman at the helm in the post season the Bears will be about 50-50 in every game.

 

===========

 

And I have never disagreed with this, even once .... in none of my threads. But I rather have Grossman than have Alex freaking Smith and his 5th round Qb talent. (Yup, even Brad Gradkowski looks like a better QB out there than alex freaking smith ever has, despite the strong running game that the niners have). And I definitely would rather have Grossman over Griese and Orton.

 

Last year IN THE PLAYOFFS, Grossman led the Bears to 20+ points against the 4th ranked Car D. And this was DESPITE our D makoing boneheaded mistakes that day and giving up >20 pts. You conveniently forget that, but you are an asshat so nothing new there.

 

Draft Barlow over Gore???? BWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH (and yes you said that.....a thread full of that BS.)

 

Draft Chambers over DJax????????? BWAAAAAAAAAAAAH (and yes, one of the reasons I said that DJax was a safer pick than Chambers was because of the Qb situation. Culpepper has shown he is a horrible qb without Moss even before he was injured last year vs Minny)

swamp poosay assessing QBs? BWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAh. That asshat thinks Matt Millen is a draft guru, enough said

 

your insecurity is showing. again.

 

take a tip from walter when you feel the urge to respond, though i think you've already done too much harm to your credibility to be salvaged at this board.

 

so by all means continue your stupidity.

[Sweetness_34 0]

your insecurity my (swamp poosay's) stupidity is showing. again.

 

I should take a tip from walter when you I feel the urge to respond, though i think you've I've already done too much harm to your my credibility to be salvaged at this board.

 

so by all means continue your I will continue with my stupidity.

 

Eg 1: Alex Smith is a stud Qb

 

Eg 2: Matt Millen is a draft guru

 

Eg 3: Charles Rogers is a stud

 

Eg 4: Fat Mike Williams is a stud

 

Eg 5: Corey Bradford is a great signing for the Lions

 

Eg 6: An average LB was a MUCH better pick than Leinart since we are so jealous of Urlacher and the Bears

 

fixored.

 

You may return to being bitter and miserable about everything to do with the Bears and Packers since the lions are pathetic.

[swamp dog 0]

fixored.

 

You may return to being bitter and miserable about everything to do with the Bears and Packers since the lions are pathetic.

 

like i said: your insecurity is showing.

[Sweetness_34 0]

like i said: my stupidity is showing. But I will continue to demonstrate it.

 

[football_scooter 0]

Not to continue the tangent, but Alex Smith with his 11-9 TD/INT ratio isnt exactly the game manager you guys are suggesting. He's better than year 1, but isnt anything more than a project still.

 

There is a few elite qbs and a few good ones and then there is a large group of ones with pros and cons ... then there is a few that are lucky to have jobs.

 

Elite:

 

P Manning

Brady

McNabb (if he can return well from another injury)

Palmer

Brees

 

Other than these guys, the next tier is large and full of guys with flaws and good points

 

The last tier:

 

Aaron Brooks

lol

 

I love that Brooks has his own tier. I'd put him slightly below Chriss Simms' spleen.

 

 

Anyway, I wasn't saying the Bears could win it all with Alex Smith either - just comparing young QBs. Alex Smith seems like a young, less mobile Steve Young, and Grossman seems like a young Brett Favre gunslinger type. Vague resemblances of course, but they are both young and inexperienced versions...

 

For that reason I wouldn't want either of them with the game on the line for a championship - but if I did I'd want the guy who isn't as wild and makes better decisions under pressure. That seems to be Alex Smith - not based on TD:Int purely, but looking at drives they had to have and either protected or coughed up the rock. IMO Smith has protected the ball better in close and late situations than has Grossman.

 

It's an observation - maybe I'm off base, I dunno. But I'd be very surprised if Grossman leads the Bears to glory, but 9-2 is damn impressive too. I'd rather have Trent Dilfer, were I a CHI fan. Dilfer+Bears D = championship

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

maybenotthough

[football_scooter 0]

Last year IN THE PLAYOFFS, Grossman led the Bears to 20+ points against the 4th ranked Car D. And this was DESPITE our D makoing boneheaded mistakes that day and giving up >20 pts. You conveniently forget that, but you are an asshat so nothing new there.

 

Please do me a favor: Go back to that game, and post the roster of the CAR defense that you claim was "4th rated" against the Bears - oh, I know what they did during the season to garner that rating, but are you going to try to tell me with a straight face that they were that good by the time the Bears got to them? That defense was a mess. I didn't forget anything. If last year against a decimated CAR D is what you're hanging your hat on, then you're really reaching. I am talking about this year against bottom 10-15 defenses. 2 TDs and 13 Ints. That's significant. At least I think it is. I'm just trying to figure out of you think it isn't, because you have yet to come out and say that you're concerned.

 

As for the personal attack, come on. We're both d0uchebags, we both know it, so why even go there. Just a waste of time and distracts from the debate.

[Sweetness_34 0]

I am talking about this year against bottom 10-15 defenses. 2 TDs and 13 Ints. That's significant. At least I think it is. I'm just trying to figure out of you think it isn't, because you have yet to come out and say that you're concerned.

 

It is a very small sample size to be concerned yet scooter. Too early. Let him play 2 more years and I can get back to you then. This instant gratification crapola is the reason why so many franchises do not even bother drafting high pick Qbs anymore (ask millen who got scared like a biotch when Leinart was on the table this year after the abuse suckington faced in detroit). Qbs take time to develop and you do not learn much staying on the bench. Now you may point to Rivers as an exception, but Rivers is blessed because he is playing on a team with LT. When you play with a RB about to break the single season rush TD record and someone who has reached 100 TDs faster than anyone else, even a Cade Mcnown would look good on that team. And there are very very few Brady's, Carson Palmers and Peyton Manning's out there. And even Manning and Palmer struggled mightily in their first 18 games. Also Grossman has always had a gun slinger attitude so in some cases we will always live by the sword and die by the sword, if you know what I mean. Favre makes some of the most amazing throws but he also has a 6 int playoff game (see Rams a few years back) in his resume. Grossman does have some of that in him too. Time will tell but for now, I am not concerned one bit. I rather lose a playoff game or SB with all guns blazing rather than play some conservtive BS that will ultimately cost us the game anyways. I think, by the time the playoffs come in, Grossman and the coaches will make sure they have a solid plan to be aggressive yet figure out how to hedge the risks.

[football_scooter 0]

It is a very small sample size to be concerned yet scooter. Too early. Let him play 2 more years and I can get back to you then. This instant gratification crapola is the reason why so many franchises do not even bother drafting high pick Qbs anymore (ask millen who got scared like a biotch when Leinart was on the table this year after the abuse suckington faced in detroit). Qbs take time to develop and you do not learn much staying on the bench. Now you may point to Rivers as an exception, but Rivers is blessed because he is playing on a team with LT. When you play with a RB about to break the single season rush TD record and someone who has reached 100 TDs faster than anyone else, even a Cade Mcnown would look good on that team. And there are very very few Brady's, Carson Palmers and Peyton Manning's out there. And even Manning and Palmer struggled mightily in their first 18 games. Also Grossman has always had a gun slinger attitude so in some cases we will always live by the sword and die by the sword, if you know what I mean. Favre makes some of the most amazing throws but he also has a 6 int playoff game (see Rams a few years back) in his resume. Grossman does have some of that in him too. Time will tell but for now, I am not concerned one bit. I rather lose a playoff game or SB with all guns blazing rather than play some conservtive BS that will ultimately cost us the game anyways. I think, by the time the playoffs come in, Grossman and the coaches will make sure they have a solid plan to be aggressive yet figure out how to hedge the risks.

 

fair enough.

 

good luck to them this year - if my Niners ain't in it, then what the hell, go Bears. I can't root for the 'Aints or Cowgirls.