Favre pissed!

[listen2me 23 1,542]

The sad fact is every TT backer thinks he is so great because he is not just drafting for Favre and he is doing it his way, when if he really wanted to rebuild he would have teh balls to tell him to retire, TT is hanging this team out to dry just as much as Favre, Im sure if he told him what he was going to do in teh draft and FA (draft D in 1st round)(pick up no one) then Favre would have retired. But TT for some reason doesn't want he bust of a 1st round QB in the linup for some reason.

 

The Packers have NO direction at all, besides make that D great, in order to make a great D you need a great scheme and coaches. Unless AJ Hawk becomes a GREAT player, we don't have that one (Ray Lewis, Merriman, Urlacher) that is on every great D. We have 2 aging CBs that are really the glue. Our D is turning good but no where near "great"

 

Our D will not carry this team when a new QB takes over.

 

TT is rebuilding, but I see no payoff in teh near future.

[swamp dog 0]

The sad fact is every TT backer thinks he is so great because he is not just drafting for Favre and he is doing it his way, when if he really wanted to rebuild he would have teh balls to tell him to retire, TT is hanging this team out to dry just as much as Favre, Im sure if he told him what he was going to do in teh draft and FA (draft D in 1st round)(pick up no one) then Favre would have retired. But TT for some reason doesn't want he bust of a 1st round QB in the linup for some reason.

 

The Packers have NO direction at all, besides make that D great, in order to make a great D you need a great scheme and coaches. Unless AJ Hawk becomes a GREAT player, we don't have that one (Ray Lewis, Merriman, Urlacher) that is on every great D. We have 2 aging CBs that are really the glue. Our D is turning good but no where near "great"

 

Our D will not carry this team when a new QB takes over.

 

TT is rebuilding, but I see no payoff in teh near future.

 

the tt supporters are few and far between from what i've seen around the net and in talking daily to cheeseheads.

 

but even some of the tt bashers are correctly ripping favre a new one here. how the fock is it that your "leader" and "the guy" and the "institution" and "god" that is favre comes out in the media and mopes and whines and points fingers like that? INEXCUSABLE. did joe montana ever do that? no--even after sf traded his focking ass. brady? nope. i could go on and on.

 

"gee *sniff* i really don't know if i'm wanted anymore around here "

 

"gee, i really have to question whether this front office wants to win...oh, and i really don't know if they want me anymore "

 

 

whether you agree with favre and think tt should have done more and should have made a stronger pitch for moss or not, you should step back and see what favre did here is a completely selfish and inexcusable.

[Belushi 9]

I don't see anything wrong with what Favre said. He wants to win in GB, he wants to bring a SB to the city. But he knows he can't do it with this team, and they did nothing in the off-season to help their chances.

 

Let's face it, he's got a year or two left. What is the organization's plan? If you're just building for the future, why keep Favre around? He won't be on the team when it's rebuilt in TT's image. So if he's not part of the plan, trade him, which is what he requested. If you're builing for the future, let Favre go and start with your QB of the future.

 

If you do want to win now, why the hell aren't thye surrounding him with talent? What exactly is the plan here? You can't win now, and you're not preparing your young QB for the future. I don't think Favre's being selfish at all. Like me, he just can't see what this organization is trying to do, and they obviously haven't shared their plans with him.

[Voice_Of_Reason 0]

I actually think both Favre and TT are right. Is that possible?

 

I think TT should continue to do it his way. All GM's are on the hook these days. Just like coaches, you have X amount of time to prove yourself or your gone. He is building a very good looking D that i think will continue to grow. He needs to get some youth at the CB position, but overall the front 7 are looking very solid and the back 4 should be improved with Rouse in the mix for some playing time.

 

I think Favre is right in that the 4th rounder the Pats gave up to get Moss wasn't too much to ask. It would have just given Favre another weapon to throw to. Why not pay a 4th rounder for a guy like Moss? It's not that expensive and it keeps your QB happy. It's not like it was a 1st rounder and a LB. It's a lousy 4th. DJax or Moss would have put a little more something in the game and Favre could be content with that.

 

ALL THAT SAID....

 

I think GB/TT/Favre gets Keyshawn. I think Favre wants another WR to throw to. I think he wants Keyshawn and this is his way of getting TT to pony up a little to get him. I noticed this morning right after I read about Favre that GB reentered the Keyshawn talk. I bet something gets done soon. That's my prediction.

[listen2me 23 1,542]

I don't see anything wrong with what Favre said. He wants to win in GB, he wants to bring a SB to the city. But he knows he can't do it with this team, and they did nothing in the off-season to help their chances.

 

Let's face it, he's got a year or two left. What is the organization's plan? If you're just building for the future, why keep Favre around? He won't be on the team when it's rebuilt in TT's image. So if he's not part of the plan, trade him, which is what he requested. If you're builing for the future, let Favre go and start with your QB of the future.

 

If you do want to win now, why the hell aren't thye surrounding him with talent? What exactly is the plan here? You can't win now, and you're not preparing your young QB for the future. I don't think Favre's being selfish at all. Like me, he just can't see what this organization is trying to do, and they obviously haven't shared their plans with him.

 

[Sho Nuff 719]

favre claims otherwise in this article. and he's in a better position to know then we are.

 

http://www.packersnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/a...1/70512050/1989

 

Id say Ted Thompson is in a better position to know. Where is Favre getting his info from do you think? (I have already made my opinion known on that...but you seem to disagree).

 

 

 

Point is we have so much money and we did nothing. NOTHING. OK Frank Walker!.....TT is too scared to stand by anything and make a move...he has no balls....He has done a great job giving the Packers a solid core of young talent, But our Off should be much better. I don't know why he didn't give us some help on O...we have bad TEs(bubba never was that good and has gotten worse) Our WRs are a mystery after Driver. and Our RBs include a 2nd reach in some people's mind and Morency. ...and he goes DT in the 1st, I just don't know where we will spend the millions we have in our pocket. MAKE SOME MOVES!!!...you don't have to break the bank on the best FAs but give us some vets somewhere in the linup.

 

Who was out there that was so great to go get? Who? Tell me the big great WRs that would have pushed this team over the top?

 

And they had alot of money and locked up both Harris and Barnett (emphasizing what I have been saying all along in that Ted is building up that defense so that when Rodgers does take over, he does not have to try and shoulder the load that Favre has been trying to do the past several years).

 

And I ask who was out there because I hear alot of whining from people about Ted did not do this and Ted did not do that. But none of them have any actual solutions or even plausible options.

[listen2me 23 1,542]

Fvare has given so much to the Packers...and basically rode the bumpy ship the last 2 years....how long are we going to rebuild?, Favre has hung on for 2 years now, if TT knew it was going to still be a rebuilding pinch your pennies year why didnt he tell Favre.

 

Its TTs fault for not communicating the direction he is taking. Unlike the Lions we want to rebuild in 3 years not 40. We improved by 4 wins last year, why can't we take it even further this year?

 

Bottom line is TT is cheap and if he wants to keep rebuilding and plan for 2011 then why doesnt he come out and say it? Someone please answer that! The QB position will be up in th air by the time the D comes in to place and we will still be a 8-8 team. Why can't everyone here that TTs lack of direction and communication is what is teh problem here. This is teh 3rd year it should start coming together by now.

 

I think TT is just using Favre to hold this thing together, if Rodgers was the QB this year all of the young talent would fall on its face, they would go 3-13 and he would look like he has done a bad job as GM.

 

Why did he pick Rodgers? It will turn out to be a dumber pick than Carroll, because at least we used Carroll and saw what he could do, Rodgers will be gone before he even gets on teh field.

[Sho Nuff 719]

Sho, Id like your opinion...

I don't want TT to draft for Favre. But I would like to give him some help.

 

If TT is doing things his way, then what do you think his views on Favre are? Why would he want Favre to stay around while he is building the D?...by the time the D improves we will have to groom an inexperienced QB, and we are back to square one.

 

IMO his views on Favre are what I said above...he may have a year or two left. He has to prepare for the fact that Favre has waffled about retirement for several years and may do it at anytime. When he took over the team the defense was bad, it was an aging team with little to no depth anywhere.

 

He did draft help for Favre this year as well. I will add a breakdown of WRs, RBs, and TEs from last year that will emphasize my point here about people whining about what they did in the first round this year.

 

Why wouldnt he tell Favre that it is time to hang them up and that Rodgers was to take over? If he isn't trying to somewhat win now then why would he hang on to Favre for a year or so and screw everything up down the road?

 

Rodgers looks like a total waste of pick by TT now. If TT is doing it his way then why wouldnt he give HIS guy a chance, and develop him by the time all of his young talent grows up?

 

Id say he is trying to win enough now while Favre is around to try and keep the peace...but he is not going to abandon what he has as his plan for the future of the team. I don't think he is screwing everything up down the road by letting Favre decide when to go (and I agree with others in this that he is in a no-win situation with Favre right now unless he would just go out and sign offensive player after offensive player...and I don't believe he should do that)

 

I don't think the Rodgers pick is wasted at this point...he is still a young QB without taking any pounding of the NFL yet.

 

It makes no sense to give Favre NO help and build other places, when QB will be a concern next year or the year after...

 

TT isnt taking a direction, rebuilding starts with the QB, TT is doing this all backwards.

 

I want Favre to stay around because I dont want to see a few 4-12 seasons back to back, however Id like teh Packers to improve with in the next 2 years and that wont happen if we are stuck with a QB with no playing time, even if our D is solid by then.

 

To me it makes no sense to try and build the team around an aging QB who could retire at anytime like many seem to be suggesting by doing this and that for Favre. That is not TT's job.

 

Rebuilding starts alot of places...he drafted a QB his first year in...had to replace a ton of aging players. Look at the defense and tell me TT is not trying to build something. Look at how many are his guys, or the key guys that he shelled out big money to keep.

 

WOw total opposite, if TT was building for teh future and wanted to make a stand, he would get Favre out, but he doesnt have the balls. TT isnt doing anything. How do you keep a old QB, while you have a QB who you drafted in the 1st round a few years ago, when you are trying to build for the future? In a couple years TT will look so dumb for the Rodgers pick. If he doesn't already look that dumb now...

 

I disagree that he is not doing anything. He is building up that defense so whoever the QB is...whether its Favre, Rodgers, Martin or someone else...does not have to worry about scoring 40 points a game for the team to win.

 

they were dumb to pass on brady quinn....

 

that being said....favre SHOULD be ticked off...

 

i dont understand this whole build for the future mentality....

 

favre only has 1 more year left..this was said THREE years ago and running..so technically, THIS year is part of that future plan back then...

 

you arent building around brett...you are building around the qb position...

 

brett can make this work..to a degree..but hes brett...

 

if he struggles with it..and he will..what will a bum like rodgers do? die again after half a quarter?...

 

work on that HOF speech...the guy who presents him can say, one of the best of all time despite his team never going out of the way to help him..

they couldve picked up guys like Moss..Mcgahee etc..

 

this is all because of the bears.....the packers see the bears on top...winning with a stellar defense and a qb that belongs in the arena league and they figure..when its time for Rodgers...the offense will be lagging..but the D (that they are building up)...should be able to slow teams down and try to make it bears or ravens-like...

 

but they shouldnt model themselves after the bears...had the packers signed Moss..this wouldve brough other FAs to gb as well...

 

 

So...they could have made trades...because both Moss and McGahee were trades. They made an attempt for Moss and thought they had him.

 

Signing Randy Moss would bring other Free Agents to Green Bay? Please...this is not 1993 where we had to have Reggie White come to show players that Green Bay is a good place to be.

 

 

What I find disturbing is that he now referring to himself in the third person.

 

I was waiting for someone else to notice that. Thats usually a good sign its time to call it quits.

[listen2me 23 1,542]

Id say Ted Thompson is in a better position to know. Where is Favre getting his info from do you think? (I have already made my opinion known on that...but you seem to disagree).

Who was out there that was so great to go get? Who? Tell me the big great WRs that would have pushed this team over the top?

 

And they had alot of money and locked up both Harris and Barnett (emphasizing what I have been saying all along in that Ted is building up that defense so that when Rodgers does take over, he does not have to try and shoulder the load that Favre has been trying to do the past several years).

 

And I ask who was out there because I hear alot of whining from people about Ted did not do this and Ted did not do that. But none of them have any actual solutions or even plausible options.

 

Lets see......Moss for cheap, any TE to compete with Bubba who can actually catch a ball, a RB!!!, Maybe he will pick up Keyshawn....I don't know, anything would be good with the money we have? If he doesnt want to use the money or find weapons for Favre why doesnt he sit down and tell Favre that he wasn't going to, or in your case tell him there was no one to get? Favre wouldnt have hung around if he knew TTs thoughts. And we could see what Rodgers has. You miss the point so bad.

[MDC 5,892]

Favre was one of my alltime favorite players but I've been getting more tired of him every year.

 

I think the moment I started getting sick of Favre was when he gave Michael Strahan the sack record. Favre's offensive line had done a terrific job on Strahan all day and based on their comments after the game it's clear they did not expect Brett to take a dive like that. Favre's OL worked hard all game to not give up their record but Favre thinks he's bigger than his teammates and can do what he wants.

 

I'm also sick of the commentators constantly blowing Favre on air. Another QB throws an ugly pick and it's just a poor decision. With Favre, they always justify his turnovers by calling him a "gunslinger." Maybe the Packers would be a better team is he made smarter decisions? That would never occur to Madden et al, they are completely incapable of seeing Favre for the mediocre quarterback he now is.

 

Favre's decision on whether he'd come back last year was obnoxious. The Packers are not a good team and they need to plan for the future - to keep them twisting in the wind like that all offseason was not right. His comments last week were typical of his attitude of being more important than his teammates or the organization. In Favre's mind he's earned the right to say whatever he wants.

 

Finally, all that stuff aside the guy should really just retire. I haven't seen Rodgers play but they were lucky to get him so late in the draft a few years ago and it's time to figure out what they have. Every game Favre plays is another game of development Rodgers misses out on. The team is simply not good enough to win anything this year and their 8-8 record is a mirage because the NFC North sucks.

 

Favre should do his team a favor and leave.

[Sho Nuff 719]

Favre is a great QB and a good guy, but he has really become an attention hound. After he led his team to victory over the Bears, who had already clinched, he acted like Lou Gehrig saying farewell at Yankee Stadium--except that Favre wasn't really even quitting, let alone dying. I was wondering when he'd try to cop some attention during the lull between the Pro Bowl and the start of training camp.

 

Showboat that he is, Favre is right, though. If Thompson is gearing up for a Super Bowl run in 2010, why keep Favre around? If he wants to contend seriously in 2007 while he still has his gifted QB, why don't his personnel moves reflect that?

 

It looks like we are once again going to be a dull team shooting for a wild card spot in our dull division. Thank God the Vikings and Lions are even more confused about what they're doing; it camouflages our own ineptitude.

 

Umm...his teammates are the ones who lifted him up...his teammates are the ones who wanted the pictures with him...because nobody knew whether that would be his last game or not...even him.

[listen2me 23 1,542]

Favre was one of my alltime favorite players but I've been getting more tired of him every year.

 

I think the moment I started getting sick of Favre was when he gave Michael Strahan the sack record. Favre's offensive line had done a terrific job on Strahan all day and based on their comments after the game it's clear they did not expect Brett to take a dive like that. Favre's OL worked hard all game to not give up their record but Favre thinks he's bigger than his teammates and can do what he wants.

 

I'm also sick of the commentators constantly blowing Favre on air. Another QB throws an ugly pick and it's just a poor decision. With Favre, they always justify his turnovers by calling him a "gunslinger." Maybe the Packers would be a better team is he made smarter decisions? That would never occur to Madden et al, they are completely incapable of seeing Favre for the mediocre quarterback he now is.

 

Favre's decision on whether he'd come back last year was obnoxious. The Packers are not a good team and they need to plan for the future - to keep them twisting in the wind like that all offseason was not right. His comments last week were typical of his attitude of being more important than his teammates or the organization. In Favre's mind he's earned the right to say whatever he wants.

 

Finally, all that stuff aside the guy should really just retire. I haven't seen Rodgers play but they were lucky to get him so late in the draft a few years ago and it's time to figure out what they have. Every game Favre plays is another game of development Rodgers misses out on. The team is simply not good enough to win anything this year and their 8-8 record is a mirage because the NFC North sucks.

 

Favre should do his team a favor and leave.

 

If Favre leaving is a favor, why doesnt TT(who's job it is) tell him to leave, trade him, sit down and have a convo about how the Packers arn't trying to win now. Why doesn't TT do something? Why does favre have to? Favre obviously wants to play football. If he knew by year 3 they would still be young...even younger and still not try to win he would have hung them up. Like you said Favre isnt bigger than the game or the team. Its TTs job to take a stand at the QB position, so far he has a Vet QB and Face of teh Packers for 15 years who doesnt know what teh Packers plans are, so he doesnt know when to leave, and then you have a 1st round pick in Rodgers who hasnt seen action. That doesnt sound like a "plan" to me. The most important position on teh field and we have a old QB, and a 1st round pick who hasnt been used and was drafted 3 years ago. Seems pretty silly. Favre isnt holding anyone hostage. TT is. It is his job to make these moves. Not Favre's.

[Sho Nuff 719]

Ok, Sho, I'll bite. So you are completely satisfied with Green Bay's team, and the offseason they had? You can honestly say with a straight face that their draft was good, that their WRs are fine, they don't need a TE because Franks can block, and that a 2nd round RB who few people had ever heard of, along with Morency, will replace Ahman Green, now or ever?

 

No...I have never said I am completely satisfied. Im just realistic about what the team has...and who was out there.

 

I would have liked them to make a run at a few players. Drew Bennett (but not for what he got), McMichael (but once Linehan and the Rams were involved Green Bay had no shot). I have made it no secret that I would have liked Darrell Jackson in the mix.

 

I can honestly say with a straight face that I am satisfied with the draft. I don't think the WRs are as bad as some want to make him out to be. TEs may need some work, but again, there was not much there on the free agent market for a TE. And as much of a reach as some think Harrell was...there were just as many saying Olsen would be a reach at 16.

If people have never heard of Brandon Jackson they don't pay much attention to college football.

 

The same Ahman Green that before last offseason people were ready to give up on? The same guy who again missed games this year? The same guy who is now 30 years old with a long list of injuries and a ton of carries on his body? The same guy who got overpaid to go to Houston?

 

"I don't know what more the guy has to do."

 

Umm... Put up numbers like that without Favre?

 

So we are going to discount his numbers now because of who his QB has been?

 

Should we ask the same for Marvin Harrison?

[hoffdaddy 1]

#3-4 is probably Martin and Holliday right now. With Robinson being in the mix when he is back from suspension. Add in two rookies to compete there as well in Clowney and Jones.

 

Driver has proven he is a #1 WR. I don't know how anyone can knock the guy right now given his track record. Is it just that he is not big and tall? He puts up #1 numbers year after year. Did not even dropoff during Walker's breakout year.

 

Need a #1 badly? Why? Look at recent SB teams. How many of them had a stud star #1 WR. The Colts and Rams are the only recent winners to do that. Then look at the Pats, Ravens, Steelers (Ward is no different than Driver), Buccaneers.... It looks nice and flashy on stat sheets and in fantasy football...but it does not mean its the only way to win in the NFL.

 

I contend they merely needed someone to compliment Driver. Could have been Moss, could have been a guy like Drew Bennett...could even be a guy like Keyshawn. Driver is the #1 to all of those guys being the complimentary #2.

 

Is Meachem any better than what they already have on the team in Jennings, Martin, Holliday? I don't know that he is.

 

Safety? Of value at 16? There was nothing that was great value there at 16 for safety...same for WR IMO.

 

How is trading down and taking Jackson in the 2nd a mess any way you look at it. He is said to fit the zone blocking scheme. You can believe he would have been there in the 3rd...does not make it true.

 

[Sho Nuff 719]

"For the Packers...Id like that deal.

 

Rodgers has been around, and while Id love to have him stay and see what he can do, he does not appear to be a long term solution or anything spectacular.

 

Getting Moss and a decent TE would be a solid deal."--sho, march 15, 2007.

 

you were not only ready to sign off on booting rodgers out of green bay, you have clearly stated rodgers isn't the "long-term solution" in green bay or "anything special."

 

"how the hell do we know" what moss was offered by green bay? come on, now. this is the second time in this thread you've clung to this idiotic weak argument. so you're calling brett a liar? lol...you're really distancing yourself now. that's cold.

 

if i have to spell it out for you how brett could know what he knows about the situation...well, you're really not worth the bother.

 

as for trading, the true contenders will rightly believe that favre in a good lineup with good weapons can still get it done. hey, i don't know if that's true or not...but someone would bite based on that logic--probably at least a #1 pick and *maybe* more if two or more teams get in on the action. so not only is brett a liar, by your definition, he's old and an int machine. ouch...man, are you mr. fickle or what. maybe brett could be ground up for pet food or something, eh? guess you're starting to come around to my preseason 2005 way of thinking: favre should have retired then to expedite the rebuilding process. instead the packers are not-so-secretly trying to rebuild while the big white elephant in the room (mr. favre) keeps wondering why nobody in the front office is freshening his drink.

 

this is pretty bad (again), even for you, sho.

 

Spin spin spin spin...as usual. Here is a tip swamp...don't take words out of context and parse them to here.

 

I was ready to sign off on the deal for trading Rodgers for Moss and the TE mentioned (given a restructure of the Moss' contract). I would still go back and do the same deal. None of that is really relevant given what I am saying in this thread about Favre or Rodgers...or that I even think Rodgers for sure will be the QB of the future for the team.

 

I have clearly stated that if they are willing to deal him (if the rumors that they were willing to do so were true) that it would not appear he was the long term solution. Seriously...read my comments in their entirety rather than parsing them here...because you really are pushing how much of a moron you can be here.

 

How do we know? Thats kind of the point...we don't. What we know is there are several reports out there about what Moss was willing to and not willing to do. And now you have all of those going against Favre at this point? Is he a liar? I don't know, never been given the reason to believe so. Does he have incorrect information? Very possible...again where do you think he is getting his info from?

 

You don't have to spell it out to me...you simply have to admit to the fact that most likely, he got his information from his agent (like I said all along moron).

 

Actually, I have never called Brett a liar...that again is your weak attempt at spin...nothing new for you...I learned that the first day of swampdog 101.

 

He is old...he is an aging QB that could retire at anytime...nowhere have I denied that. You can bring up the Rodgers talk more...where I clearly state that if they traded him, it may be because they know Favre will stay around longer. That did not appear to be the case now that we know more. INT machine? He has always thrown alot of them...in the past he could get away with it because he was also throwing alot of TDs...its not so much the case now. He is still a solid QB...but not something these contenders would be shelling out a 1st round pick for. Especially the AFC contenders that were specifically mentioned. I noticed you wanted to stay as vague as possible when talking about contenders...why is that? Because you know bringing up specifics would just make you look like an idiot.

 

Ive come around to the idea long ago that if Favre was going to play like he did in 2005 that I thought he should have retired before last year. Last year he played a bit better...a bit more controlled so I was not unhappy to see him come back then, or come back this year. However, I realize that he cannot go on forever and that his play has not been what they will need in the future. Does that mean he is really hindering the team as much as you want to show? Not as much. Especially not in 2005. Rodgers would have gotten killed that year...and probably last year with another rookie Oline learning a new blocking technique.

 

 

 

all i know is....

 

the packers only missed the playoffs by 1 game...

 

it isnt a stretch to think that Moss and/or a FA rb wouldve been enough to get that 1 needed win to get in...

 

im not saying that go far or even win a playoff game..just saying theyd have a good chance to get in....

 

plus 3 factors...(1 thats still in play)...

 

1- 2 games with moss on gb vs minny...must see...

 

2- training camp with moss and the FA rb...a lot of fun to see..if anything, favre would be like a lil kid again with a new toy...

 

3- moss and favre would excite fantasy players...(this one is in play as it excites those who think of drafting brady and moss)...

 

its also like the Cubs syndrome here...when u talk about favre or moss selling tix..games are already sold out..it wouldnt anything to that..except jersey sales..

 

A. What RB...seriously...which RB was available that was all that good and worth any sort of money? No thanks...I will go with the youth there. Though I have actually championed the idea of bringing in Chris Brown to help with the RBBC.

B. Moss might have made a games worth of difference last year. Last year is not this year...different year, different schedule. And would it be so much better to get into the playoffs and lose a game?

C. I do agree that I would have loved the Favre to Moss fantasy play.

 

Favre Jerseys already sell a ton. I don't think Moss jerseys would have sold all that well to Packer fans.

[hoffdaddy 1]

I find it very, very amusing that people think Thompson has done nothing and doesn't spend money.

 

Who were the starting linebackers on this team say...two years ago? He completely rebuilt this unit in two season with young, aggressive, talented players.

 

Same goes for the offensive line. Looking at O line rankings (not an exact science, I know) Green Bay's young, sucky O line finished 16th out of 32 teams. With two or three rookies starting all year. Believe me when I say they'll be better this season.

 

Have people been sleeping the last three seasons? Thompson said from day one they'll be strong up the middle. He's spent the money and draft picks on D line, O line, and Linebackers. Strong up the middle. That's the way it works.

 

Favre can still make decent wide receivers look very good, so tell me again why the strong up the middle approach is dumb?

 

Also, how many of you 'spend the money' guys were ripping Ted apart last year for signing Woodson? Fess up, you know who you are.

 

Of course, this year it's different right? Last year he overpaid Woodson, and this year he's not spending enough.

 

And I'm not sure how some of you consider 4-12 to 8-8 not improving?

[Sho Nuff 719]

The sad fact is every TT backer thinks he is so great because he is not just drafting for Favre and he is doing it his way, when if he really wanted to rebuild he would have teh balls to tell him to retire, TT is hanging this team out to dry just as much as Favre, Im sure if he told him what he was going to do in teh draft and FA (draft D in 1st round)(pick up no one) then Favre would have retired. But TT for some reason doesn't want he bust of a 1st round QB in the linup for some reason.

 

The Packers have NO direction at all, besides make that D great, in order to make a great D you need a great scheme and coaches. Unless AJ Hawk becomes a GREAT player, we don't have that one (Ray Lewis, Merriman, Urlacher) that is on every great D. We have 2 aging CBs that are really the glue. Our D is turning good but no where near "great"

 

Our D will not carry this team when a new QB takes over.

 

TT is rebuilding, but I see no payoff in teh near future.

 

Thinks he is so great? I think he is doing an OK job. Im not happy with all of what he has done...but am happy with most of the moves and non-moves he has made.

 

Im happy he is not just pandering to an older QB because it might be the popular thing to do. Though, he is not dumb enough to just tell Favre to retire.

 

Haning the team out to dry? By trying to build up a defense and make the team better in the long run?

What is wrong with drafting D in the first round?

Doesn't want his bust of a 1st round QB in there...getting a bit of head of yourself huh?

 

I think the direction is quite clear that they are building that defense.

Every great D just had a great LB?

Harris is not that old, though Woodson is getting a bit more up there. I think you will see more moves/draft picks there in the future. Its part of why I thought the Harrell pick was odd. I thought if he was going D in round one it was for a corner (and people thought I was nuts).

 

How do you know the D will not be able to help carry the team for a new QB? Can you tell the future?

He is rebuilding...and while the payoff may not be this year...you have to remember what he started with...what was left on the team, the cap situation, lack of depth, age...and so on. Its not a quick process.

 

I actually think both Favre and TT are right. Is that possible?

 

I think TT should continue to do it his way. All GM's are on the hook these days. Just like coaches, you have X amount of time to prove yourself or your gone. He is building a very good looking D that i think will continue to grow. He needs to get some youth at the CB position, but overall the front 7 are looking very solid and the back 4 should be improved with Rouse in the mix for some playing time.

 

I think Favre is right in that the 4th rounder the Pats gave up to get Moss wasn't too much to ask. It would have just given Favre another weapon to throw to. Why not pay a 4th rounder for a guy like Moss? It's not that expensive and it keeps your QB happy. It's not like it was a 1st rounder and a LB. It's a lousy 4th. DJax or Moss would have put a little more something in the game and Favre could be content with that.

 

ALL THAT SAID....

 

I think GB/TT/Favre gets Keyshawn. I think Favre wants another WR to throw to. I think he wants Keyshawn and this is his way of getting TT to pony up a little to get him. I noticed this morning right after I read about Favre that GB reentered the Keyshawn talk. I bet something gets done soon. That's my prediction.

 

Thing is...TT thought he had a deal for the 5th rounder. Until the Pats jumped in and offered a 4th (which was higher than the Packers 4th round pick anyway) and TT never got the chance to up the offer at that point.

 

I would like them to get Keyshawn...like I have said, Driver is a versatile guy who can be complimented in several ways. A deep threat like Moss to open him up underneath...or a possession guy to open Driver up for the longer routes.

 

Lets see......Moss for cheap, any TE to compete with Bubba who can actually catch a ball, a RB!!!, Maybe he will pick up Keyshawn....I don't know, anything would be good with the money we have? If he doesnt want to use the money or find weapons for Favre why doesnt he sit down and tell Favre that he wasn't going to, or in your case tell him there was no one to get? Favre wouldnt have hung around if he knew TTs thoughts. And we could see what Rodgers has. You miss the point so bad.

 

Moss was not a free agent. TT thought he had a deal for him with the Raiders...NE jumped in and got him. And as of this point...it is unclear what the terms of the Moss deal (contract) would have been. You had several reports saying he wanted to negotiate with NE...you now have Favre saying otherwise.

 

What RB? Care to point any out.

Keyshawn is still out there...and what another poster just mentioned GB is getting back into the mix with that.

 

But I am a firm believe in a GM who does not just go out and spend just because they have the money to do so. Seems like some people whining about Thompson would be better fit as Redskins fans.

[listen2me 23 1,542]

Think of our best players on D, Al Harris, Kampman, Barnett, Jenkins, and Hawk. One of them was a pick of TTs.

 

The only thing that TT has done that I like is the rebuilt OLine.

[Sho Nuff 719]

Just for those who thought Ted should have gone more offense with the first pick....here is a little breakdown.

 

WRs.

Of the top 15 WRs in receptions last year...6 were first round draft picks (1 was undrafted, 2-7th rounders, 1-4th rounder, 3-3rd rounders, 2-2nd rounder) for a total of 9 that were non-1st round picks.

RBs.

Of the top 15 RBs in rushing yards last year...7 were first round picks (1-undrafted, 1-6th round, 1-4th round, 2-3rd round, 3-2nd round) for a total of 8 that were non first round picks.

TEs.

Of the top 15 TEs in receptions last year...5 were 1st round picks...(3-undrafted, 1-6th round, 2-4th round, 2-3rd round, 2-2nd round) for a total of 10 that were non-1st round picks.

[Jeremy 0]

I actually think both Favre and TT are right. Is that possible?

 

I think so. It's easy to see things from both points of view. It is TTs job to plan for the long term success of the Packers, and you can't blame Brett for being annoyed that they haven't surrounded them with more weapons.

 

I agree with those who are saying there's a lack of communication happening here. I really do wonder if Packer management is secretly hoping for Favre to retire, but don't know how to get rid of him. And I think Brett really does feel they're a Randy Moss away from contending for the SuperBowl.

 

Maybe it's better to say they're both wrong.

 

I'd be curious to know what their intentions really were concerning Moss. I keep hearing different things. Favre seems to have some inside of knowledge of what went on, but who really knows. I almost think they tried to get too cheap believing they were the only team interested, only to have New England steal him away. I think they could have had him if they'd made an offer before the draft. Or maybe they were just never that interested to begin with. Would have liked to have been a fly on the wall in those discussions.

[Sho Nuff 719]

Think of our best players on D, Al Harris, Kampman, Barnett, Jenkins, and Hawk. One of them was a pick of TTs.

 

The only thing that TT has done that I like is the rebuilt OLine.

 

And then think of the youth.

Collins, Poppinga, Hodge, Pickett, Harrell now...as you said with Hawk.

 

TT also did what? hired the coach that figured out that hey...Jenkins should be started at DE rather than KGB...bring KGB in for pass rush situations (something many had advocated for a while).

What else did he do...just recently locked up both Harris and Barnett to long term deals. Last year kept Kampman from leaving by signing him to a nice contract as well.

 

As I said, most of that D are either guys he brought in...or guys he shelled out the money to keep. (though some still call him cheap because he does not go out and overpay for the marginal talent that was available this year).

[listen2me 23 1,542]

Thinks he is so great? I think he is doing an OK job. Im not happy with all of what he has done...but am happy with most of the moves and non-moves he has made.

 

Im happy he is not just pandering to an older QB because it might be the popular thing to do. Though, he is not dumb enough to just tell Favre to retire.

 

Haning the team out to dry? By trying to build up a defense and make the team better in the long run?

What is wrong with drafting D in the first round?

Doesn't want his bust of a 1st round QB in there...getting a bit of head of yourself huh?

 

I think the direction is quite clear that they are building that defense.

Every great D just had a great LB?

Harris is not that old, though Woodson is getting a bit more up there. I think you will see more moves/draft picks there in the future. Its part of why I thought the Harrell pick was odd. I thought if he was going D in round one it was for a corner (and people thought I was nuts).

 

How do you know the D will not be able to help carry the team for a new QB? Can you tell the future?

He is rebuilding...and while the payoff may not be this year...you have to remember what he started with...what was left on the team, the cap situation, lack of depth, age...and so on. Its not a quick process.

Thing is...TT thought he had a deal for the 5th rounder. Until the Pats jumped in and offered a 4th (which was higher than the Packers 4th round pick anyway) and TT never got the chance to up the offer at that point.

 

I would like them to get Keyshawn...like I have said, Driver is a versatile guy who can be complimented in several ways. A deep threat like Moss to open him up underneath...or a possession guy to open Driver up for the longer routes.

Moss was not a free agent. TT thought he had a deal for him with the Raiders...NE jumped in and got him. And as of this point...it is unclear what the terms of the Moss deal (contract) would have been. You had several reports saying he wanted to negotiate with NE...you now have Favre saying otherwise.

 

What RB? Care to point any out.

Keyshawn is still out there...and what another poster just mentioned GB is getting back into the mix with that.

 

But I am a firm believe in a GM who does not just go out and spend just because they have the money to do so. Seems like some people whining about Thompson would be better fit as Redskins fans.

 

You are hypocrite. The same thing you say Swamp does you do. Where ever did I say I wanted to throw BIG money around on the biggest named FAs? And to just spend money for teh hell of it? We did not participate in FA this year, when we had much money, I have a problem with that.

[Sho Nuff 719]

You are hypocrite. The same thing you say Swamp does you do. Where ever did I say I wanted to throw BIG money around on the biggest named FAs? And to just spend money for teh hell of it? We did not participate in FA this year, when we had much money, I have a problem with that.

 

You are like swamp in your inability to read.

 

I clearly state "some people"...did I say you? Did I say, "you want to just go spend money for the sake of spending it"?

 

Nope.

 

I have been hypocritical at times...this I know...this, however, was not one of those times. It was a statement of general frustration with some of the whining that has gone on...

[hoffdaddy 1]

And then think of the youth.

Collins, Poppinga, Hodge, Pickett, Harrell now...as you said with Hawk.

 

TT also did what? hired the coach that figured out that hey...Jenkins should be started at DE rather than KGB...bring KGB in for pass rush situations (something many had advocated for a while).

What else did he do...just recently locked up both Harris and Barnett to long term deals. Last year kept Kampman from leaving by signing him to a nice contract as well.

 

As I said, most of that D are either guys he brought in...or guys he shelled out the money to keep. (though some still call him cheap because he does not go out and overpay for the marginal talent that was available this year).

 

Exactly.

 

Oh and by the way, did you notice that Thompson has done a pretty good job in his career of finding NFL receivers after the first round? Darrel Jackson ring a bell? Terrence Murphy (injury ended a promising career)? Greg Jennings?

 

And lest you all forget, Thompson did in fact draft a Tight End. Maybe not the one the fans were yelling for, but one who just two years ago was widely regarded as on of the best prospects in college football.

http://www.thnt.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?.../704230312/1002

[Sho Nuff 719]

And for those that wanted Meachem...word is he showed up for camp out of shape and has already tweaked an ankle.

[santa*69 0]

And for those that wanted Meachem...word is he showed up for camp out of shape and has already tweaked an ankle.

 

I live in New Orleans they played the Paytons press conference on Meachem and Bush from last year almost identical. Tweaked an ankle a little out of shape. You wonder if these guys can these speeches.

[Arsenal 3]

Ok, Sho, I'll bite. So you are completely satisfied with Green Bay's team, and the offseason they had? You can honestly say with a straight face that their draft was good, that their WRs are fine, they don't need a TE because Franks can block, and that a 2nd round RB who few people had ever heard of, along with Morency, will replace Ahman Green, now or ever?

 

 

Moss would not have put the team over the top and bringing in someone like him is a short term double edged sword. If he has a lot of success, he will demand a monster contract which TT will not be willing to pay him this late in his career. If he bombs, then we never should have brought him over in the first place. The Packers are not the Patriots - they have a lot more needs to fill.

 

Replace Ahman Green? Are you kidding me? Those guys will easily surpass what he has done the past few years. Sorry, but life in the NFL is tough and Green is a prime example of a 30 year old RB whose best days are well behind him. FFers hate RBBC of course, but is by far the least risky and cheapest way to improve your running game - not to mention, you never know when a RB is going to come out of nowhere and start to excel. The league is full of later round RBs who no one thought was worth a damn on draft day.

[Sho Nuff 719]

I live in New Orleans they played the Paytons press conference on Meachem and Bush from last year almost identical. Tweaked an ankle a little out of shape. You wonder if these guys can these speeches.

 

Perhaps...just found it funny with Meachem...but he was a guy I did not want the Packers to take (said so before the draft). Ive never been all that impressed with him and he was probably a 2nd round guy before the combine anyway.

 

The crux of some of the bashing of TT is this IMO...

 

TT is building a defense...its not the flashy stat catching type of building. Nobody cares to watch a DT or LB plug the hole and running lane.

Instead they want to see the WR/RB/TE get drafted or signed. They want to see the big reception for a TD...they want to see the highlights of their guy breaking through the line for a long run.

 

Its like baseball, people were not content with good baseball, a good sac fly/bunt, a guy hitting behind the runner, good pitching. They all were awed by one thing...the long ball.

[listen2me 23 1,542]

Perhaps...just found it funny with Meachem...but he was a guy I did not want the Packers to take (said so before the draft). Ive never been all that impressed with him and he was probably a 2nd round guy before the combine anyway.

 

The crux of some of the bashing of TT is this IMO...

 

TT is building a defense...its not the flashy stat catching type of building. Nobody cares to watch a DT or LB plug the hole and running lane.

Instead they want to see the WR/RB/TE get drafted or signed. They want to see the big reception for a TD...they want to see the highlights of their guy breaking through the line for a long run.

 

Its like baseball, people were not content with good baseball, a good sac fly/bunt, a guy hitting behind the runner, good pitching. They all were awed by one thing...the long ball.

 

When are you betting or thinking this rebuilding will payoff or at least come together to where we can compete for the NFC championship? Just a question. Or when SHOULD it come together.

[hoffdaddy 1]

When are you betting or thinking this rebuilding will payoff or at least come together to where we can compete for the NFC championship? Just a question. Or when SHOULD it come together.

 

I know you're not asking me directly, but if I may throw out my opinion.

 

Thanks to Mike Sherman, Thompson essentially had to start from scratch. We're heading into year three with Thompson's players. My honest take is that it's a five year rebuild before we really see the returns. Just my opinion.

[listen2me 23 1,542]

I know you're not asking me directly, but if I may throw out my opinion.

 

Thanks to Mike Sherman, Thompson essentially had to start from scratch. We're heading into year three with Thompson's players. My honest take is that it's a five year rebuild before we really see the returns. Just my opinion.

 

I was basically asking any packer fan.

 

What do you think the QB position will look like by year 5? I don't see us competing for a NFC championship unless a solid vet QB falls to us in FAs...The NFC shouldnt be as wide open as it is now.

[XToday 0]

"So we are going to discount his numbers now because of who his QB has been?

 

Should we ask the same for Marvin Harrison?"

 

Discount, no. But look at it realistically. A great QB makes an average WR good (=Driver) whereas a great QB makes a good WR also great (=Harrison).

 

Case in point: Antonio Freeman. The guy was a slug, but for awhile, he put up solid stats with Favre.

 

Now I love Driver, as I mentioned, he's got a heart of gold. But his heart and Brett's skill (even in decline) make him a better WR than he probably is. On most other teams he'd be a #2 WR.

[listen2me 23 1,542]

"So we are going to discount his numbers now because of who his QB has been?

 

Should we ask the same for Marvin Harrison?"

 

Discount, no. But look at it realistically. A great QB makes an average WR good (=Driver) whereas a great QB makes a good WR also great (=Harrison).

 

Case in point: Antonio Freeman. The guy was a slug, but for awhile, he put up solid stats with Favre.

 

Now I love Driver, as I mentioned, he's got a heart of gold. But his heart and Brett's skill (even in decline) make him a better WR than he probably is. On most other teams he'd be a #2 WR.

 

Driver is a number 1 WR....not a top 5 WR in the league. But a #1 WR. He goes long, he catches over the middle, he rarely drops balls. How would you distinguish who a #1 WR is when they have a good QB? Lee Evans quite possibly is the best WR in teh game by your formula. Losman is really an average at best QB and Evans put up top 5 or so numbers last year.

 

Driver is a #1 You are an idiot to think otherwise.

[PackerAttacker 0]

I know you're not asking me directly, but if I may throw out my opinion.

 

Thanks to Mike Sherman, Thompson essentially had to start from scratch. We're heading into year three with Thompson's players. My honest take is that it's a five year rebuild before we really see the returns. Just my opinion.

 

Couple things. First of all why are we starting from scratch after sherman? People like to forget sherman built a superbowl contending team year in and year out... and his last year went 4-12 because he had 4 injured WR's and 5 injured RB's. The team was still there to contend. Thompson comes in and dismantles that team... not shermans fault.

 

Second thing is even if I give you that he has to 'rebuild'... it doesnt matter. That doesnt excuse bad drafting. Bad free agency moves. It might excuse bad records for mccarthy.... but it doesnt do anything for thompson. Look at thompsons drafts, they are a$$-awful. He reaches for guys way too early and they never pan out. AJ Hawk is his only hit... and it was totally obvious. Most of his very few free agents fail (Adrian Klemm, Matt Odwyer, Boerigter, Gardner, Ben Taylor, Manuel). He hit on pickett and woodson.

 

Please tell me why Ted Thompson is even an average GM. He is terrible! And everyone in GB seems to like him. My point here is... Sherman should be irrelevant to the conversation.

[Sho Nuff 719]

When are you betting or thinking this rebuilding will payoff or at least come together to where we can compete for the NFC championship? Just a question. Or when SHOULD it come together.

 

Lots of possibilities there. I don't think it happens with Favre at the helm. And Im not convinced Rodgers will be the one leading it either.

 

But the fact of the matter is this...last year was the first real year of "rebuilding". Year one was the tearing down and clearing of cap space.

 

So here we are in year 2...still a very young team with new faces in the front 7 on defense and at safety, new faces on the Oline and in the backfield, and young faces at WR.

 

Do some people expect that it is a quick process?

 

"So we are going to discount his numbers now because of who his QB has been?

 

Should we ask the same for Marvin Harrison?"

 

Discount, no. But look at it realistically. A great QB makes an average WR good (=Driver) whereas a great QB makes a good WR also great (=Harrison).

 

Case in point: Antonio Freeman. The guy was a slug, but for awhile, he put up solid stats with Favre.

 

Now I love Driver, as I mentioned, he's got a heart of gold. But his heart and Brett's skill (even in decline) make him a better WR than he probably is. On most other teams he'd be a #2 WR.

 

Problem is Driver is faster and has great leaping ability. He is a better WR than Freeman could ever dream of. Has done it with little threat of a running game recently and little talent around him at the other WR spots. Yet he keeps putting up numbers.

[mozzy84 0]

looks like favre's pr person wrote a note for him... this whole statement just sounds weird to me, like a robot or something.

 

 

Statement: QB Favre wants to remain a Packer

Written by: ¦ 5/14/2007

Source: www.packers.com

I was frustrated a couple weeks back when Randy Moss was traded to New England. I never wanted to be traded and I don't want to be traded. I want to be in Green Bay. I want to finish my career as a Packer. Sometimes when I get frustrated I let my emotions get the better of me.

 

As I said in February when I announced that I was coming back, I am excited about the young talent on our team and the improvements we're going to see from one year to the next. I really enjoy the young guys I'm playing with. I'm working hard down in Mississippi right now, rehabbing, and I plan to be in the best shape of my life.

 

I look forward to playing with this team and seeing what we can do. I think we can be pretty good.

http://www.packers.com

[Sho Nuff 719]

Couple things. First of all why are we starting from scratch after sherman? People like to forget sherman built a superbowl contending team year in and year out... and his last year went 4-12 because he had 4 injured WR's and 5 injured RB's. The team was still there to contend. Thompson comes in and dismantles that team... not shermans fault.

 

Second thing is even if I give you that he has to 'rebuild'... it doesnt matter. That doesnt excuse bad drafting. Bad free agency moves. It might excuse bad records for mccarthy.... but it doesnt do anything for thompson. Look at thompsons drafts, they are a$$-awful. He reaches for guys way too early and they never pan out. AJ Hawk is his only hit... and it was totally obvious. Most of his very few free agents fail (Adrian Klemm, Matt Odwyer, Boerigter, Gardner, Ben Taylor, Manuel). He hit on pickett and woodson.

 

Please tell me why Ted Thompson is even an average GM. He is terrible! And everyone in GB seems to like him. My point here is... Sherman should be irrelevant to the conversation.

 

Because when Thompson took over after Sherman he was given a team in cap hell, with little to no depth at key positions on both lines.

 

Super Bowl contending year in and year out? Not totally...but it was Sherman who got them in a bad situation personnel and cap wise and that is what Thompson tore down 2 years ago, and started rebuilding last year.

Yes...given the age, lack of depth, and cap situation...Thompson tearing it down was due to Sherman's miscues as a GM.

 

Bad drafting? Like Collins, Jennings, Murphy (sorry, not Thompson's fault the guy had a condition found by injury that ended his career), Hawk, Poppinga, Hodge, College, Spitz, Moll.

Trades for Morency, bringing in Woodson, Pickett...

Hawk is the only hit? Hah!!!!!!!

 

Sherman is very much a part of the conversation as to why the team is as young as it is...and why there needed to be a rebuild.

[XToday 0]

"Driver is a #1 You are an idiot to think otherwise."

 

 

Well in that case... My opinion has changed completely.

[listen2me 23 1,542]

Do some people expect that it is a quick process?

 

Yes.

 

In todays NFL I expect 3 years. Maybe not to compete for a SB but be in the playoffs and contend, even more so in today's NFC.

 

All I am trying to prove is that by the time we will expect results, we may have a new raw QB that we will have to go through a 2 years grooming process.

 

We are in the middle of rebuilding, why doesnt TT ask Favre to step down, or do it behind closed doors where Favre can just retire and everyone would have thought he was content with his career.

 

I dont want to be the Lions. I don't want 5 years of 4-12. We saw improvment last year. I hope it continues. Because there will be a BIG bump in the road when Favre chooses to leave.

[Belushi 9]

Maybe TT's planning on winning like Chicago-strong D and a good running game. I don't think the D is at the level of Chicago's, although all the young players could develop in a couple of years into a real force.

 

Unfortunately, we don't have the RB's to field a strong, ball-control type of game (I'm not convinced Jackson's the man). If that's the theory, well, great. It certainly worked for Chicago, and the Packer's offence with Favre should be better overall than Chicago's. I think the problem is that by the time the D comes around, Favre will be gone and we'll be stuck with Rodgers at QB.

 

I don't know. Maybe it's a great plan for long-term success. But if that's the case, trade Favre to a team that needs a QB and let Rodgers get experience. It would also free up a ton of cap space. As a Packer fan I certainly don't want to see him in any other team's colours, but it would make sense. At best this team squeeks into the playoffs, where they'd likely be out in the first round. Then again, maybe it would be best to suck for a few years and get some high draft picks. Although TT would probably just use them to reach for guys that were projected to go a round later.

 

As for the comments from Swamp about a team leader not speaking out against the organization. Well, maybe if someone had spoken out about Millen a few year's back, the Lions wouldn't still be in a rebuilding phase.