Pecos Rattlers 5 Posted June 20, 2009 I've run a fairly traditional league (from roster perspective, we do have 0.3 ppr) for 10 years now & been fairly happy with it. This year, however; a number of the owners have been talking to me about a two qb league. While I have never played in one, I have to admit I am intrigued at the idea of drastically changing draft strategy & the value of players. In particular, I'd like to shake up the way many people view the first few rounds as "rb/rb" or "rb/wr" or "rb/peyton(or whoever the top stud qb is)". However, I don't want it to just change QB to the hot position and have 12-15 qb's go off the board in the first two rounds either. I'd like to have a league system that rewards owners who think about value across positions and are rewarded for good choices. NOT "I must pick the best X available". Currently we start: 1 QB, 2 RB, 3 WR, 1 TE, 1K, 1 Team Def. Special teams yards/tds are awarded to individual offensive players only, not the team defense. The only change would be to add a second starting QB. To paraphrase the core point system, it gives all players the same points per category, regardless of position: all tds are 6 pts1 pt per 10 rushing/receiving yards1 pt per 25 passing yards1 pt per 20 return yards0.3 points per reception Here's a few concerns I have about a 2 QB league. I am curious how other commishes have addressed them. Seems like it would be easy to completely run out of QBs if you have too many teams. I am considering capping it at 10 because of this, instead of 12. Thoughts on the max size of a two qb league? To avoid everyone drafting two qb's immediately, it seems like passing scoring would have to be lowered. What type of scoring have you used in two qb leagues? Is stockpiling of QBs a problem? Do people typically set a cap on the total number of qb's that can be held by a team to avoid this? To avoid stockpiling or running out of QB's, would it be better to have the second QB position be a QB/RB or QB/WR flex? In general I don't like flex positions though, as I feel it devalues lower scoring positions and a RB flex greatly increases scarcity of that position. QB/WR flex might be ok though? Anything else that really made your two qb league suck the first year? Looking to learn from others mistakes Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
washers 0 Posted June 20, 2009 im in a 2 conference, 4 division league. The 2 conferences have separate drafts. each conference has ten teams. we have 2 QB slots, and a max of 3 QBs on the roster. Their scoring is 4 for a TD, one point for 25 yards passing, 6 pts for a rushing td, all that jazz Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pecos Rattlers 5 Posted June 20, 2009 im in a 2 conference, 4 division league. The 2 conferences have separate drafts. each conference has ten teams. we have 2 QB slots, and a max of 3 QBs on the roster. Their scoring is 4 for a TD, one point for 25 yards passing, 6 pts for a rushing td, all that jazz Interesting, I hadn't thought about the two conferences with separate drafts. That won't work with our current league provider, but is something to consider. What site does your league use? The roster limits and scoring sounds reasonable. How soon is the run on QB's in your league draft typically? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Super Cubs 154 Posted June 20, 2009 In our league we have one flex option to start a QB, RB, WR, or TE. We have no problems with it. We have standard scoring, no ppr, but our QBs get 3 points per passing TD. Honestly who cares if QBs go early in the draft. It will all balance out in the long run. The owners that grab 2 QBs early will most likely suffer at another position. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sparkky 0 Posted June 20, 2009 I'm in a 10 team dynasty league that starts 2 qb's and it totally changes the dynamics of how you approach your roster and draft. I mean in case of injury or bye weeks you can always plug in a "back up" rb or #3 wr but no NFL team plays qb by committee. if you lose a qb with no starting back up you're just about screwed. it does seem to promote trading and ww pick ups. we started a new league which was a spin off from an existing league and our start up draft went: 1.7 Brees 1.10 Rivers 2.1 Cutler 2.3 Rogers 2.5 Brady 2.7 Manning 2.8 Romo Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CrazyStanley 0 Posted June 20, 2009 I have done a 2 Q league a couple times now and like the changes in brings. The draft changes totally. We had 3 Qbs go in round 1 and 3 or 4 more go in round 2. In your case, i would do these things if you want the 2nd QB to actually change your league: keep scoring the same cap at 10 teams dont flex a qb spot, it devalues the change you are making stockpiling can be an issue, however, it makes you draft better. there are 32 starting qbs and usually 3 or 4 others that get significant playing time due to injuries or benchings. it is nice if i can leave the draft with 4 of the 36 or so potential QBs. i would change one of the WR spots to a RB flex spot, with the extra starting qb it makes you use an extra spot on your bench for an extra qb so that flexibiliy helps i really like this type of league, just something different and it totally changes the draft and usually forces more trading in season hope it works our for ya Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
washers 0 Posted June 21, 2009 Interesting, I hadn't thought about the two conferences with separate drafts. That won't work with our current league provider, but is something to consider. What site does your league use? The roster limits and scoring sounds reasonable. How soon is the run on QB's in your league draft typically? theres usually 3 to 4 QBs taken in the first round, maybe 2 in the second round, then theres a lull until the end of the fourth/beginning fo the fifth, the elite go early, then the rest drop while top WR/RB are snatched up Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
desertfire 4 Posted June 22, 2009 theres usually 3 to 4 QBs taken in the first round, maybe 2 in the second round, then theres a lull until the end of the fourth/beginning fo the fifth, the elite go early, then the rest drop while top WR/RB are snatched up I've been in a 2 QB league for 7 years now and I would never go back to a one QB league. We have 10 teams in our league and our draft is so unpredictable. It is great. We typically have at least 4 QB's go in round 1. We count 6 points for all tds and it works great for us. I think you cannot have more than 10 in a league to make it work right. QB's go fast in a 2 QB league. This year I think at least 5 qbs will go in the first round. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DankNuggs 305 Posted June 22, 2009 In a 10 teamer, 2QB is IDEAL for the league... If you are in a league >10 teams, you really can't entertain this due to scarcity... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lion Fan 0 Posted June 22, 2009 Been running a 10 team, 2 qb league for 8 years now and it's great. It really helps make the draft more interesting and makes the start/sits decisions a lot harder. However, we have rules that no team can have more than 3 "NFL starting" QB's on their team. This prevents hording and leaves a couple of guys available in case you're in a bind. We usually have 1-2 qb's go in the 1st. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ray_T 753 Posted June 22, 2009 I've run a fairly traditional league (from roster perspective, we do have 0.3 ppr) for 10 years now & been fairly happy with it. This year, however; a number of the owners have been talking to me about a two qb league. While I have never played in one, I have to admit I am intrigued at the idea of drastically changing draft strategy & the value of players. In particular, I'd like to shake up the way many people view the first few rounds as "rb/rb" or "rb/wr" or "rb/peyton(or whoever the top stud qb is)". However, I don't want it to just change QB to the hot position and have 12-15 qb's go off the board in the first two rounds either. I'd like to have a league system that rewards owners who think about value across positions and are rewarded for good choices. NOT "I must pick the best X available". Currently we start: 1 QB, 2 RB, 3 WR, 1 TE, 1K, 1 Team Def. Special teams yards/tds are awarded to individual offensive players only, not the team defense. The only change would be to add a second starting QB. To paraphrase the core point system, it gives all players the same points per category, regardless of position: all tds are 6 pts1 pt per 10 rushing/receiving yards1 pt per 25 passing yards1 pt per 20 return yards0.3 points per reception Here's a few concerns I have about a 2 QB league. I am curious how other commishes have addressed them. Seems like it would be easy to completely run out of QBs if you have too many teams. I am considering capping it at 10 because of this, instead of 12. Thoughts on the max size of a two qb league? To avoid everyone drafting two qb's immediately, it seems like passing scoring would have to be lowered. What type of scoring have you used in two qb leagues? Is stockpiling of QBs a problem? Do people typically set a cap on the total number of qb's that can be held by a team to avoid this? To avoid stockpiling or running out of QB's, would it be better to have the second QB position be a QB/RB or QB/WR flex? In general I don't like flex positions though, as I feel it devalues lower scoring positions and a RB flex greatly increases scarcity of that position. QB/WR flex might be ok though? Anything else that really made your two qb league suck the first year? Looking to learn from others mistakes My league starts 2 QB's and surprisingly didnt have many issues. FYI, we switched from a draft format to an auction format last year. 1) one team unsuccessfully tried to stockpile QB's when we expanded to 12 teams, but we anticipated that this may happen and we limited the number of spare roster spots to 5 or 6. so if someone keeps 5 QB's in their lineup, they may not have a spare RB or spare WR. So if you feel that this will happen, just limit the number of spare players teams can have on the roster. 2) as a 12 team league, there are not enough backup QB's to fill all rosters, and this means that as a manager you make more decisions based on the typical health of your QB. and QB's are typically drafted 2-3 rounds earlier than in leagues with only 1 QB starter. (in your league with Pass TD's worth 6 points, you may expect an even split between RB's and QB's in the top 2 or 3 rounds of your draft) So some teams will pay a premium to have 2 starters who are rarely injured and go without a legit backup as compared to paying good money to get a player that will start 2 games (bye weeks) 3) Prior to switching to the Auction format, there has never been an issue with teams drafting QB's too early. They will go earlier than they would in a league where you only start 1 QB, but this really just puts them on par with RB's in terms of value (Top RB's are still more valuable than top QB's but not by a lot) either way, if your league has only 10 teams, most of the above issues wont be a problem. I'd just look into limiting the number of spare roster spots for backups to prevent stockpiling of QB's. Otherwise, you will be okay I think. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DankNuggs 305 Posted June 22, 2009 QB hoarding should be legal and recommended.... 'Anti-hoarding' rules protect people who shouldn't be protected... Retarded to protect owners who neglect positions then whine about no quality being left... awful Pointing at laughing at the guy who doesn't field a starting lineup is MUCH preferable... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ray_T 753 Posted June 22, 2009 QB hoarding should be legal and recommended.... 'Anti-hoarding' rules protect people who shouldn't be protected... Retarded to protect owners who neglect positions then whine about no quality being left... awful Pointing at laughing at the guy who doesn't field a starting lineup is MUCH preferable... that is why we kept 2 QB's in a 12 team league, and limited the # of roster spots. There is usually someone at the bottom of the standings who decides to pickup 2 or 3 backup QB's for purposes of hurting others, but in the end usually hurt themselves more because those slots reserved for backup RB's and WR's are taken up by backup QB's who wont add to their teams ability to win unless they have injuries at QB. the Quote that usually comes out is 'how many sh!te QB's do you need to improve your team?' Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DankNuggs 305 Posted June 22, 2009 that is why we kept 2 QB's in a 12 team league, and limited the # of roster spots. There is usually someone at the bottom of the standings who decides to pickup 2 or 3 backup QB's for purposes of hurting others, but in the end usually hurt themselves more because those slots reserved for backup RB's and WR's are taken up by backup QB's who wont add to their teams ability to win unless they have injuries at QB. the Quote that usually comes out is 'how many sh!te QB's do you need to improve your team?' The entire dynamic is changed in a 12 teamer... in that case, 2QB leagues are really stretching things... when bye weeks force you not to be able to field a starting roster it is a problem... I don't advocate a 2qb system for >10 teams like i mentioned... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
