Anyone in one of the Healthcare Sharing networks? Zion, Metashare etc.

[Bill E. 703]

More and more people we know use these rather than traditional health insurance and some have had accidents or sicknesses but all seem really happy with it.  My Accountant uses Zion.  So talking to people and looking at reviews we are considering it for next year.  There are a few things it does not cover but we save $1500 per month in premiums so it seems like any additional out of pocket near where we have been would be covered.  Anyone else use these and how do you like it? 

Rant below if you want to read it.  Not material to my question above.

My wife and I paid 1700 per month with a gold plan this year and it is going up to close to $2k.  What really gets me is the way Obamacare works.   Your premium is based on your income.  How is that even close to fair?   You do not order a pizza, car or anything else and get charged based on your income.  If you make $70,000 or less you pay next to nothing compared to what we pay.   We have friends that own a focking yacht in the BVI and write it off as a second home.  The depreciation brings their income down to where they pay like $600 per month for what we get and I can not buy a yacht.  We can afford the premiums it is just such B.S. and we really never even got close to the deductible so we end up paying for everything ourselves anyhow.   It feels like people in the middle are having to subsidize the rich and poor. 

[TimHauck 3,395]

I’ve heard they’re scams

[Bill E. 703]

Just now, TimHauck said:

I’ve heard they’re scams

I have too but usually from people that have not used them.  I see a lot of reviews that are positive unless they are planted by the networks.  We have friends that love them but not a lot.  Most people either get insurance at work or are able to get the Obamacare subsidy so there do not seem to be a lot of people in my situation.

[easilyscan 1,063]

5 minutes ago, Bill E. said:

More and more people we know use these rather than traditional health insurance and some have had accidents or sicknesses but all seem really happy with it.  My Accountant uses Zion.  So talking to people and looking at reviews we are considering it for next year.  There are a few things it does not cover but we save $1500 per month in premiums so it seems like any additional out of pocket near where we have been would be covered.  Anyone else use these and how do you like it? 

Rant below if you want to read it.  Not material to my question above.

My wife and I paid 1700 per month with a gold plan this year and it is going up to close to $2k.  What really gets me is the way Obamacare works.   Your premium is based on your income.  How is that even close to fair?   You do not order a pizza, car or anything else and get charged based on your income.  If you make $70,000 or less you pay next to nothing compared to what we pay.   We have friends that own a focking yacht in the BVI and write it off as a second home.  The depreciation brings their income down to where they pay like $600 per month for what we get and I can not buy a yacht.  We can afford the premiums it is just such B.S. and we really never even got close to the deductible so we end up paying for everything ourselves anyhow.   

I've heard of healthcare sharing networks, but never investigated further. To be perfectly honest, it sounds too good to be true ?

Quote

Your premium is based on your income.

Of course. I don't agree with it either, but that's the way life works. It's no different than Social Security. If you and your wife plan your retirement carefully, so that you won't be a burden to your family, the state, or someone else, by the time you start receiving SS, you'll be punished for being responsible by paying tax on 85% of it. Before Democrats start attacking me, let it be known that I realize 'some' people have financial difficulties in life through no fault of their own. But I know for a fact, there's plenty of people out there that could've saved more, but decided to live above their income, & because of that, others who are more responsible, receive less. The worst part is, when Social Security was started back in the 30s, there was clear language attached to it. It was to be explicitly free from taxation of any kind. Our current president voted in favor of taxation in 1983 and again in 1993.

I'm also familiar with the situation you mentioned regarding friends that own a yacht, yet pay only about 1/3 of what you do. I'll touch on that, along with your statement that if you make $70,000 or less, you pay next to nothing for healthcare insurance tomorrow.  

 

 

 

[Strike 6,032]

It sounds like you're going through the government exchanges.  Have you looked at private insurance outside the exchanges?  I don't believe you have to go through the exchange to get your insurance. 

BTW, this was one of my biggest complaints when they enacted Obamacare.  It destroyed the private market to a large extent and caused premiums in that market to skyrocket.  But hey, we gave access to a few million people at the expense of many millions more. 

[TimHauck 3,395]

1 hour ago, Bill E. said:

I have too but usually from people that have not used them.  I see a lot of reviews that are positive unless they are planted by the networks.  We have friends that love them but not a lot.  Most people either get insurance at work or are able to get the Obamacare subsidy so there do not seem to be a lot of people in my situation.

I assume this is part of what you’re referring to by “planted by the networks,” but I remember watching this earlier 

 

 

 

[Thornton Melon 651]

8 hours ago, Bill E. said:

You do not order a pizza, car or anything else and get charged based on your income. 

Ummm....apparently someone's forgetting about income taxes 

[Bill E. 703]

37 minutes ago, Thornton Melon said:

Ummm....apparently someone's forgetting about income taxes 

No I am talking about buying a product or service from a private company.  Taxes are not fair either but you have no choice.  I guess you don't get that. 

[Thornton Melon 651]

9 minutes ago, Bill E. said:

No I am talking about buying a product or service from a private company.  Taxes are not fair either but you have no choice.  I guess you don't get that. 

Yeah, I get it that you have no choice. I was being lighthearted with the winky emoji there. Relax. I was just pointing out that taxes are a service you pay for based on your income.

[Bill E. 703]

12 hours ago, Thornton Melon said:

Yeah, I get it that you have no choice. I was being lighthearted with the winky emoji there. Relax. I was just pointing out that taxes are a service you pay for based on your income.

Sorry i missed the eye thing.

[easilyscan 1,063]

22 hours ago, Bill E. said:

My wife and I paid 1700 per month with a gold plan this year and it is going up to close to $2k.  What really gets me is the way Obamacare works.   Your premium is based on your income.  How is that even close to fair?   You do not order a pizza, car or anything else and get charged based on your income.  If you make $70,000 or less you pay next to nothing compared to what we pay.   We have friends that own a focking yacht in the BVI and write it off as a second home.  The depreciation brings their income down to where they pay like $600 per month for what we get and I can not buy a yacht.  We can afford the premiums it is just such B.S. and we really never even got close to the deductible so we end up paying for everything ourselves anyhow.   It feels like people in the middle are having to subsidize the rich and poor. 

It's outrageous that you have to pay close to 2K a month. I think it was around 1994 when the late PJ O'Rourke said "if you think healthcare is expensive now, just wait till it's free.  “Translation: Obamacare ‘is’ free for low income people, but they make up for that by charging progressively higher rates as income rises to make up the difference. 

Because I retired early, I had to provide my own healthcare insurance. I went on *Cobra* @ $650 a month for 18 months (the maximum allowed) That sounds expensive, especially for a single person, but @ least it was 'real' insurance. Small co-pays and no deductible. 
For 2017, I went on the ACA exchange. Settled on a bronze plan through Medica, $273 a month, with a $6000 deductible. 
At that time, there was something people refer to as an income cliff related to Obamacare. If you didn't keep your MAGI (modified adjusted gross income under that amount) you were penalized (not eligible for any subs + penalties) 

That year the cliff was 48K. My income was/is very simple to figure. $36,696 per year from a private sector pension, + around $16,000 in dividends/capital gains thrown off by a large taxable brokerage account at Fidelity. That equaled $52,696. After deductions, I knew I'd be real close to the cliff, so I gradually started selling some of my dividend producing investments. Pretty weird huh, having to sell off parts of a dividend portfolio I had been building for 25 years, so I wouldn't be savaged by the healthcare industrial complex. 

It worked well, & I ended up about $3000 under the cliff.

The following year the cliff was upped to around $49,000. I would've been comfortably under that figure except for one thing. Late in the year, ConAgra foods acquired Pinnacle Foods @ a substantial premium + a special dividend.  That resulted in unexpected capital gains of approximately $4000. That pushed my MAGI up to $49,200 ……………… $200 over the cliff. 

It changed my federal return from a refund of $150, to owing $5650, & It wouldn't have mattered if I went over by one penny, or $100,000!
Punished because I made what turned out to be a great investment. Only in America.

The next year premiums jumped to $368 a month with a $6500 deductible. The following year, (2021) $433 a month with a $7000 deductible. 

In October 2021, I went & talk to the guy who got me set up on the exchange. He's a financial planner who is also a Medica representative. 
I asked him if there was anything we could do ? He said something to the effect that we have some new options for 2022 through UCare. 
He said I could get the same coverage for only $207 per month. 

Of course I was skeptical. Here's a guy who is a representative for Medica, pointing out a competing plan for 1/2 the monthly premium. 
Asked him how that was possible ? He just flat out said they're much more efficient & less bloated. So I signed up. Everything's worked smooth so far, and the premium (believe it or not) is going to be around $150 per month for 2023. 

I don't know how old you and your wife are, what state do you live in, what your income is, etc. My suggestion would be to check around. 
Schedule a meeting with someone similar to the guy I'm working with. I don't know if I ever would've found out about this competing plan had I not went in and talked to him.  Another thing you probably already know about is the special HSA that's only available to people that have high deductible health care plans & are under 65.  If this is something you would qualify for, and you aren't aware of it, you should check into it. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Bill E. 703]

2 hours ago, easilyscan said:

It's outrageous that you have to pay close to 2K a month. I think it was around 1994 when the late PJ O'Rourke said "if you think healthcare is expensive now, just wait till it's free.  “Translation: Obamacare ‘is’ free for low income people, but they make up for that by charging progressively higher rates as income rises to make up the difference. 

Because I retired early, I had to provide my own healthcare insurance. I went on *Cobra* @ $650 a month for 18 months (the maximum allowed) That sounds expensive, especially for a single person, but @ least it was 'real' insurance. Small co-pays and no deductible. 
For 2017, I went on the ACA exchange. Settled on a bronze plan through Medica, $273 a month, with a $6000 deductible. 
At that time, there was something people refer to as an income cliff related to Obamacare. If you didn't keep your MAGI (modified adjusted gross income under that amount) you were penalized (not eligible for any subs + penalties) 

That year the cliff was 48K. My income was/is very simple to figure. $36,696 per year from a private sector pension, + around $16,000 in dividends/capital gains thrown off by a large taxable brokerage account at Fidelity. That equaled $52,696. After deductions, I knew I'd be real close to the cliff, so I gradually started selling some of my dividend producing investments. Pretty weird huh, having to sell off parts of a dividend portfolio I had been building for 25 years, so I wouldn't be savaged by the healthcare industrial complex. 

It worked well, & I ended up about $3000 under the cliff.

The following year the cliff was upped to around $49,000. I would've been comfortably under that figure except for one thing. Late in the year, ConAgra foods acquired Pinnacle Foods @ a substantial premium + a special dividend.  That resulted in unexpected capital gains of approximately $4000. That pushed my MAGI up to $49,200 ……………… $200 over the cliff. 

It changed my federal return from a refund of $150, to owing $5650, & It wouldn't have mattered if I went over by one penny, or $100,000!
Punished because I made what turned out to be a great investment. Only in America.

The next year premiums jumped to $368 a month with a $6500 deductible. The following year, (2021) $433 a month with a $7000 deductible. 

In October 2021, I went & talk to the guy who got me set up on the exchange. He's a financial planner who is also a Medica representative. 
I asked him if there was anything we could do ? He said something to the effect that we have some new options for 2022 through UCare. 
He said I could get the same coverage for only $207 per month. 

Of course I was skeptical. Here's a guy who is a representative for Medica, pointing out a competing plan for 1/2 the monthly premium. 
Asked him how that was possible ? He just flat out said they're much more efficient & less bloated. So I signed up. Everything's worked smooth so far, and the premium (believe it or not) is going to be around $150 per month for 2023. 

I don't know how old you and your wife are, what state do you live in, what your income is, etc. My suggestion would be to check around. 
Schedule a meeting with someone similar to the guy I'm working with. I don't know if I ever would've found out about this competing plan had I not went in and talked to him.  Another thing you probably already know about is the special HSA that's only available to people that have high deductible health care plans & are under 65.  If this is something you would qualify for, and you aren't aware of it, you should check into it. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thank you will check it out. Hsa's are good because they let you pay with pre-tax dollars. If I remember right that helps with your deductible but not really your premium. We could have gone with the bronze plan instead of the gold plan but you only save about $400 a month and end up paying more in co-pays and prescription drugs. I will look into that and thank you for the history. Mine was similar when I left my full-time job in 08. I was able to get Cobra for I think 18 months. It was expensive but it was a good plan. Back then I didn't mind paying for my own health insurance but the price is really jumped up under obamacare.Medica sounds interesting.  Thanks for the tip.