Another general joins ranks opposing Rumsfeld

[mighty_thor 115]

Whats the matter with Bush? Doesn't he have the ba11s to fire some of these incompetent fools?

 

http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/04/13/ira...feld/index.html

[Uh-huh 0]

That makes six (6) retired generals who have called for Rumsfeld's ouster:

 

Batiste is one of six former commanders who served under Rumsfeld who now say he should be dismissed. The defense secretary has become a lightning rod for criticism of the way the war in Iraq has been run, reports CBS News senior White House correspondent Bill Plante.

 

Major Generals Charles Swannack and John Riggs, both retired Army, were the latest to call for Rumsfeld's resignation. Retired Marine General Gregory Newbold called in Time magazine for "replacing Rumsfeld and many others unwilling to fundamentally change their approach." And last month, Army Major General Paul Eaton wrote in The New York Times that Rumsfeld is "incompetent strategically, operationally and tactically."

 

Other calls for Rumsfeld's replacement have come from Batiste and retired Marine Gen. Anthony Zinni.

 

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/04/14/...in1498785.shtml

[GridIronAssassin#1 0]

This is small beans compared to Clinton lying in court about getting a blowjob. Now that is where we need to draw the line.

[Uh-huh 0]

W is between a rock and a hard place on this one:

 

Bush’s dilemma, said Michael O’Hanlon, a military analyst with the Brookings Institution, is that Bush “shares a lot of the responsibility for the key decisions on Iraq.”

 

“Bush is implicated. For Bush to fire Rumsfeld is for Bush to declare himself a failure as president. Iraq is the main issue of his presidency,” said O’Hanlon, who supported Bush’s decision to invade Iraq and said he still supports the war.

 

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/12313869/

[Churchill610 0]

I just hope more generals start to speak up against this *ssclown and keep it on the front pages.

[Uh-huh 0]

Rumsfeld won't go quietly into the good night:

 

Five reasons Rumsfeld won't leave easily

 

Friends and foes alike know Defense Secretary Don Rumsfeld does not easily bend. And they suggest at least five reasons why he's unlikely to bow under the current battering he's receiving.

 

1. It is not the Rumsfeld way -- He is tough and approaches his critics head-on. Here's Nixon's view from 30 years ago: "...At least Rummy is tough enough. He's a ruthless little bastard to be sure of that..."

 

2. Impact on the military -- The future of Iraq is uncertain, Osama bin Laden remains free, and Iran is rattling its saber. Some military analysts say Rumsfeld bears some blame, but others say Rumsfeld's removal would send a dangerous signal of weakness to enemies.

 

3. White House wants him to remain -- Through Afghanistan and Iraq, Rumsfeld has led this administration's signature initiative, the battle against global terrorism. The White House stands by him and expects the same in return. Here's Scott McCellan's take: "Secretary Rumsfeld is doing a great job overseeing two fronts on the global war on terrorism."

 

4. Politics -- Critics, such as Democratic Sen. Joe Biden, want Rumsfeld out. "It would energize American forces. It would energize the political environment. Yes, he should step down," Biden said. But this administration, Rumsfeld included, seems unshaken, almost oblivious to its political critics.

 

5. Personal conviction -- Rumsfeld says the war in Iraq is difficult, but he sees progress. And he thinks newsmakers and news reporters, who he says focus on the negative, are mistaken and defeatist. "The steady stream of errors all seem to be of a nature to inflame the situation and give heart to the terrorists," Rumsfeld said.

 

In sum, Rumsfeld has lost bureaucratic and political battles in the past, but it is not his nature to ever go down without a fight.

 

http://www.cnn.com/CNN/Programs/anderson.cooper.360/blog/

[parrot 789]

Impact on the military -- The future of Iraq is uncertain, Osama bin Laden remains free, and Iran is rattling its saber. Some military analysts say Rumsfeld bears some blame, but others say Rumsfeld's removal would send a dangerous signal of weakness to enemies.

That has to be one of the stupidest statements ever written. I can see his supporters trying to sell this line of reason but it's a joke. Rumsfeld's incompetence and arrogance are a big part of the reason Iraq is the mess it is and OBL is still running around. The message that removing him and replacing him with someone competent would send is "We're done focking around."

[What is the deal? 1]

If you supervise 200 people and 3% of those people don't like, I would say you are doing a pretty damn good job. Regardless of the loudspoken minority...

[Rude Rick 0]

If you supervise 200 people and 3% of those people don't like, I would say you are doing a pretty damn good job. Regardless of the loudspoken minority...

 

Tell me you're joking. Tell me you don't really think that hack is doing a good job

[paulinstl 296]

If you supervise 200 people and 3% of those people don't like, I would say you are doing a pretty damn good job. Regardless of the loudspoken minority...

 

When in our history have this many retired generals spoken out about their boss?

 

Thought so.

[What is the deal? 1]

Tell me you're joking. Tell me you don't really think that hack is doing a good job

 

He has the toughest job in the White House outside of Bush. There is no answer for this war. Granted mistakes have been made, but there is no answer or scale to compare what he has done to someone who has done a good job, or someone a bad job.

 

But if you have 200 employees and 3% hate you, I'd say your doing a decent job. Think about it, about 95% of my co-workers don't like my boss. Before him there was a woman who did a hell of a job, but still didn't get along with around 20%...

[GobbleDog 996]

"Retired Generals..."

 

Who the hell cares what a bunch of retired generals think? Wake me up when some ACTIVE generals call for Rumsfeld's job.

[Churchill610 0]

"Retired Generals..."

 

Who the hell cares what a bunch of retired generals think? Wake me up when some ACTIVE generals call for Rumsfeld's job.

 

 

 

Ummm....ACTIVE generals aren't exactly ALLOWED to criticize their higher-ups in the press.

[GobbleDog 996]

Ummm....ACTIVE generals aren't exactly ALLOWED to criticize their higher-ups in the press.

So because of that, we should allow retired ones to decide who should be fired and who shouldn't?

 

That's ridiculous. When I first heard this story, I was concerned. I thought gee, if the Generals who are physically fighting in Iraq right now feel Rumsfeld should be fired, well maybe they're right. But no... it turns out this all comes from a few "retired generals". Well I'm sure there there are a few retired generals who think Rumsfeld should keep his job. Either way, WHO CARES WHAT THEY THINK? They're retired.

[mighty_thor 115]

"Retired Generals..."

 

Who the hell cares what a bunch of retired generals think? Wake me up when some ACTIVE generals call for Rumsfeld's job.

 

This last General was the commander who led the elite 82nd Airborne Division during its mission in Iraq. Its not like we are talking about some old Vietnam Generals playing armchair quarterback. These guys just retired.

[What is the deal? 1]

So because of that, we should allow retired ones to decide who should be fired and who shouldn't?

 

That's ridiculous. When I first heard this story, I was concerned. I thought gee, if the Generals who are physically fighting in Iraq right now feel Rumsfeld should be fired, well maybe they're right. But no... it turns out this all comes from a few "retired generals". Well I'm sure there there are a few retired generals who think Rumsfeld should keep his job. Either way, WHO CARES WHAT THEY THINK? They're retired.

 

[Churchill610 0]

So because of that, we should allow retired ones to decide who should be fired and who shouldn't?

 

That's ridiculous. When I first heard this story, I was concerned. I thought gee, if the Generals who are physically fighting in Iraq right now feel Rumsfeld should be fired, well maybe they're right. But no... it turns out this all comes from a few "retired generals". Well I'm sure there there are a few retired generals who think Rumsfeld should keep his job. Either way, WHO CARES WHAT THEY THINK? They're retired.

 

 

 

 

You're not very insightful are you???

[GobbleDog 996]

This last General was the commander who led the elite 82nd Airborne Division during its mission in Iraq. Its not like we are talking about some old Vietnam Generals playing armchair quarterback. These guys just retired.

 

Fair enough. I still don't think retired generals should dictate who should and shouldn't be Secretary of Defense.

[hoytdwow 202]

itsatip that these generals are retiring because they hate what Rummy is doing.

[FranksTanks 0]

Doesn't matter anyway: Bush: Rumsfeld 'exactly what is needed'

[Uh-huh 0]

Either way, WHO CARES WHAT THEY THINK? They're retired.

 

Head in sand syndrome, eh?

 

Who cares if they're retired or not? They are EXPERTS telling us something is WRONG. And they are doing it despite spending their military careers being conditioned to respect the chain of command. Get it?

 

We should care for the same reason we should care if some fired Enron employees came out stating there was widespread fraud and corruption at the highest executive levels, or if government FBI agents declare the US is not prepared to prevent a terrorist attack.

[FranksTanks 0]

But if you have 200 employees and 3% hate you, I'd say your doing a decent job.

Apples to oranges; the worlds most powerful army is not your everyday business. Rummy is not doing a heck of a job.

 

Head in sand syndrome, eh?

 

Who cares if they're retired or not? They are EXPERTS telling us something is WRONG. And they are doing it despite spending their military careers being conditioned to respect the chain of command. Get it?

 

We should care for the same reason we should care if some fired Enron employees came out stating there was widespread fraud and corruption at the highest executive levels, or if government FBI agents declare the US is not prepared to prevent a terrorist attack.

 

I can't wait till I retire. Obviously you must just forget eveything you've done your whole life. It's going to be like Men in Black!

 

Let the character assassinations begin!

[GobbleDog 996]

Head in sand syndrome, eh?

It just seems a lot less important than people are making it out to be.

[Rude Rick 0]

Let the character assassinations begin!

 

They're fixing for attacks from the RW Attack Machine

[Uh-huh 0]

It just seems a lot less important than people are making it out to be.

Ok, I see your point. Fair enough.

[What is the deal? 1]

Apples to oranges; the worlds most powerful army is not your everyday business. Rummy is not doing a heck of a job.

I can't wait till I retire. Obviously you must just forget eveything you've done your whole life. It's going to be like Men in Black!

 

Let the character assassinations begin!

 

What exactly is Rumsfeld doing that's wrong? I have heard complaints that he is a micro manager and that's about it. The rest of them just say are complaints saying things like "he's not doing a good job" but never providing specifics...

[Uh-huh 0]

What exactly is Rumsfeld doing that's wrong? I have heard complaints that he is a micro manager and that's about it. The rest of them just say are complaints saying things like "he's not doing a good job" but never providing specifics...

 

I believe the results speak for themselves.

 

When you go to war there should be a threat to our national security, we should use overwhelming force, and there should be an exit strategy.

 

All three of these principles were violated in Iraq. The war was mishandled, misrepresented, and mischaracterized.

 

http://news.yahoo.com/s/huffpost/20060414/...wN5bnN1YmNhdA--

[hoytdwow 202]

What exactly is Rumsfeld doing that's wrong? I have heard complaints that he is a micro manager and that's about it. The rest of them just say are complaints saying things like "he's not doing a good job" but never providing specifics...

 

Too few troops in Iraq

Authorize torture in military prisons

Act like a jerkoff so Generals get pissed and resign

No post war plan ("We don't do nation building")

 

Just off the top of my head....

[Rude Rick 0]

Too few troops in Iraq

Authorize torture in military prisons

Act like a jerkoff so Generals get pissed and resign

No post war plan ("We don't do nation building")

 

Just off the top of my head....

[parrot 789]

Too few troops in Iraq

The list could have ended right there.

 

Iraq is the goat-ropin' it is because we've never had enough boots on the ground from day one. Army Chief of Staff Shinseki, working off historical precedent and the recommendations of the best military planning minds in the world suggested we would need in the neighborhood of a half million troops to effectively occupy a country the size and population of Iraq.

 

Rumsfeld called that recommendation "wildly off the mark" and pulled a number out of his ass roughly one third of that number. How's that worked out? Three years later and we don't even control the streets of Baghdad.

[hoytdwow 202]

The list could have ended right there.

 

Army Chief of Staff Shinseki,

 

"wildly off the mark"

Rumsfeld canned Shinseki. I mean, Shinseki resigned

 

Wolfowitz made the "wildly..." remark. But, he's Rummy's crummy little toady, so same diff

[parrot 789]

Rumsfeld canned Shinseki. I mean, Shinseki resigned

 

Wolfowitz made the "wildly..." remark. But, he's Rummy's crummy little toady, so same diff

My bad, Rumsfeld said "far off the mark".

[paulinstl 296]

"Retired Generals..."

 

Who the hell cares what a bunch of retired generals think? Wake me up when some ACTIVE generals call for Rumsfeld's job.

 

 

Some of them turned down promotions choosing retirement over working under Rumsfeld.

[zen 0]

"Retired Generals..."

 

Who the hell cares what a bunch of retired generals think? Wake me up when some ACTIVE generals call for Rumsfeld's job.

 

 

Actually, it seems there's several of them who think Rumsfield is insane. Many are threatening to resign.

 

http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/articles/060417fa_fact

[What is the deal? 1]

I believe the results speak for themselves.

 

Did you seriously just link up an article written by John Murtha? I am not reading that garbage.

[buffalobillsffl2003 0]

We need to have all the Jews step down from the federal government.

 

 

[hoytdwow 202]

What is the Deal=recliner pilot

[What is the deal? 1]

Actually, it seems there's several of them who think Rumsfield is insane. Many are threatening to resign.

 

http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/articles/060417fa_fact

 

all I see is this-

"The attention given to the nuclear option has created serious misgivings inside the offices of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, he added, and some officers have talked about resigning. Late this winter, the Joint Chiefs of Staff sought to remove the nuclear option from the evolving war plans for Iran—without success, the former intelligence official said. “The White House said, ‘Why are you challenging this? The option came from you.’ ”

 

 

 

Is it possible that these generals enjoyed being desk jockey's during the Clinton Administration and now are pissed that they actually had to work?

[Rude Rick 0]

We need to have all the Jews step down from the federal government.

[squidfinger 0]

So because of that, we should allow retired ones to decide who should be fired and who shouldn't?

 

That's ridiculous. When I first heard this story, I was concerned. I thought gee, if the Generals who are physically fighting in Iraq right now feel Rumsfeld should be fired, well maybe they're right. But no... it turns out this all comes from a few "retired generals". Well I'm sure there there are a few retired generals who think Rumsfeld should keep his job. Either way, WHO CARES WHAT THEY THINK? They're retired.

 

Did it ever occur to you that the current generals use the retired generals to speak in public for them (since they're not allowed to comment?). This is EXACTLY what's going on. It's hard to assess how much of the current military leadership wants Rumsfeld out, but it's not a small minority. It's significant.

 

Which is just...completely unsurprising since the guy is incompetent.