Divisions - NFC Norse

[RamslovaMartzhata 3]

There is one good thing that having a division full of seemingly sub-par teams.. and that is it is competitive. Each team had some very big holes, have they been filled? To me this is the hardest division to pick a winner, so let's talk about it since there is nothing going on in the sports world and there doesn't seem to be any news today.

 

The Bears = Living and dying by the old adage of defense wins football games. Can they repeat or improve on last year's showing... hopefully improving on offense with t-Rex at the helm, and possibly Benson showing his first round potential? Their offseason was questionable, seemingly geared towards... stopping Steve Smith? Grossmen has shown flashes, but he hasn't been healthy in... well ever. They did finally get a viable back-up in Griese, and they still have Orton who didn't make mistakes often enough to win.

 

The Vikings were on a roll at the end of last year (once they got their roll OFF) and started to hold on to the ball. A lot of people had high hopes for them, as they brought in a lot of talent on the defensive side of the ball, and it came to fruition once BJ came in and started to manage the games well. They narrowly missed the playoffs after an abysmal start. Matt Birk returning at center should give their line a big boost and that D is rock solid IMO. Questions are if BJ has anything left and if Taylor can be the man on O.

 

The Packers had long been a staple in the playoffs, but last year just fell apart due to losses in free agency then injuries. They made some solid moves on the defensive side of the football, but will they pan out? And can Favre live up to the man-crush espn and Madden have on him... or at least to a tenth of that (which would be the best ever... Saturday Night Live needs to bring back "Da Bears" skit, only replacing Ditka with Brett Favre).

 

The Lions. Bad news first. They are the Lions. But they do represent possibily. Will we all see if Martz was the genius that made the Rams the Greatest Show of Turf or did he just luck his way to an incredibly talented team. The good news is Matt Millen didn't take a WR with their first pick and actually had a fairly solid draft IMO. They have a respectable D. Their excuse is gone in Harrington, but the question is did they just bring two more in? Can their WR stop dropping balls, can KJ bounce back from the sophomore slump, and can Martz/Kitna/McCown put everything together.

 

 

 

In a division that seemed more offensively minded than for a while... it seems that each of the teams seem to want to get back to playing hard nosed D. I can't figure out who is going to win this division, but if I had to take a guess, I would say it isn't going to be the Bears. I think that they improved the least. I think I have to pick the Vikings to win. They simply were the best team at the end of the season and had some very strange circumstances from fake dongs to floating ###### houses last year.

 

I do have dark horse hopes for the Packers. Conspracy theorist in me says the league wants Favre to succeed and have a swan song. Realistically though, I thkn they have a good D. Pickett is solid up front coupled with KGB's pass rush skills. Barnet and Hawk should be a very solid young LB combo. And Woodson and Harris are as solid as it gets. On O they OLine had some success in the 2nd half of the season. They could surprise if Fav-rey takes better care of the ball. They do lack receiving threats though.

[Sho Nuff 719]

I think for many reasons it is the Bears' division to lose.

 

**All three other teams went through coaching changes. New faces...new schemes...makes for big question marks going into a season. To break those down further...

-Green Bay...McCarthy...while peole want to detract from him pointing out what San Fran did last year, they forget he inherited the offense of a team that won 2 games the year before, got rid of their only real experienced QB...and a host of other problems. He had success in New Orleans. We will see how this works out. New DC should not change too many things as he was a long time Bates assistant.

-Lions...Martz is a good OC..we will see how the other coaches can keep up.

-Vikings...hire a HC who was an OC who did not even do much playcalling (by most accounts)...who in turn hired an OC who has never been even close to an OC. Im a UW guy and all, but Bevell was a mediocre QB...was the QB coach in Green Bay for a bit (yeah, like he told Favre anything)...this move would frighten me if I was a Vikings fan.

 

Other breakdowns by how I see them finishing.

 

Bears (between 10 and 12 wins)....great defense, mediocre offense. I do not have faith in Grossman even when healthy...but have even less faith in the guy staying healthy.

 

Vikings (between 6-9 wins)...defense? Their secondary is pretty weak as are there LBs. Sharper's numbers looked good last year, but he was burnt about as many times as he made the right read to intercept. Seems like the entire D takes alot of chances and they pay off at times, but hurt just as often if not more. Front 4 are solid though. Offensively their WRs are forgetable except for the drinking problems...RB has had motivational issues. The line brought in Hutch...but it hinges on the health of Birk. If he goes down again, the Hutch acquisition will not mean much and the line will be weak yet again.

 

Packers (between 5-8 wins) Hinges on a few things. First...up front. Will the new additions and new scheme open up some running room and protect Favre? Will we see Favre2005 addition again (God I hope not)? WRs and RBs staying healthy. The defense should improve with the additions that were made and that is a very good place to start building a team.

 

Lions (between 4-7 wins) I have little faith in a journeyman QB, a weak Oline, and a bunch of so far busts at WR (except for Roy).

[swamp dog 0]

most likely bears, vikings, lions, and packers in that order. there's little hope of the packers exiting the cellar. i have little faith in an old qb coming off a near 30 int season, the second coming of marty moronweg as a coach, awful wrs (except for driver), no kicking game, no interior o-line, and a rookie linebacker corps.

 

at least most of the media experts will call it that way. but let's see where things are at come january.

[Portis26 0]

Da Bears

[donhaas 18]

most likely bears, vikings, lions, and packers in that order. there's little hope of the packers exiting the cellar. i have little faith in an old qb coming off a near 30 int season, the second coming of marty moronweg as a coach, awful wrs (except for driver), no kicking game, no interior o-line, and a rookie linebacker corps.

 

at least most of the media experts will call it that way. but let's see where things are at come january.

 

Let's see where you are come january

[swamp dog 0]

profootball.com's take on the nfcn new coaches (http://www.profootballweekly.com/PFW/Commentary/Columns/2006/arkush071106.htm):

 

" Marinelli — One of the most enjoyable aspects of the NFL Scouting Combine in recent years is the opportunity the league offers to the national media to meet the new head coaches each season. No head coach made a stronger impression this past February than Marinelli, a tough, blue-collar grinder who I believe could work wonders with the Lions’ previously underachieving players that have talent to burn. With a new offensive coordinator in Mike Martz, who is much better-suited in that capacity than he was as a head coach (although I believe Martz got an unfair rap from a lot of my media cohorts), I would be hardly be shocked if the Lions steal a page from their baseball brethren and make their presence felt this coming season in a major way.

 

Childress — The former Eagles offensive coordinator who had been considered a hot commodity for a while now will more than earn his keep if he can remove the stigma carried over from last season’s unfortunate “Love Boat” incident on Lake Minnetonka. Obviously, Childress would like to do much more than that, but with aging Brad Johnson at quarterback and the Bears and Lions toiling in the same division, I envision a .500 record at best.

 

McCarthy — From all accounts, McCarthy has made a decent impression so far in Green Bay. But his work as the Niners’ offensive coordinator before being hired to replace Mike Sherman left a lot to be desired, and, while it pains me a great deal to say this, Brett Favre is definitely on his last legs."

 

of course, no one opinion is worth more than another this time of year.

 

 

 

Let's see where you are come january

 

well, that may be a mystery to you but it shouldn't be a mystery where the packers will be again come january.

[nlgb1 0]

i still cant believe how mcuh bad pub the pack is getting this year, i see them being an 8-8/9-7 team this year!!!

 

i guess noone remembers that their defense was ranked 7TH IN THE NFL in yds allowed last yr!!

picking up charles woodson, aj hawk and abdul hodge (ultimate NFL draft sleeper) will greatly improve upon the likes of na'il diggs, robert thomas, and ahmad carroll..... lineup=DL:KGB, Kampman, cullen jenkins(weak link), Ryan pickett LBs:Aj hawk Nick Barnett Abdul hodge (possibly one of best LB corps in a year or so) DBs:Al harris Nick Collins (possible pro bowler this yr, not many know about him) Charles woodson Marquand Manuel.....there is not much wrong with their defense at all....

 

on offense brett favre is still brett favre and will throw for around 3800/23 w/around 20 ints.... may have one of the best RBBC in the NFL w/ a healthy Green, healthy Davenport (who could be an effective starter on most teams) and Gado. Driver is a great hard nosed receiver who should go for about 1400/12 this year, while robert ferguson still has not reached his potential as a downfield threat while sitting behind walker, now as WR2 he could be in for a big year...also greg jennings was added in rd 3 of the draft and was one of NCAAs leading receivers. look for him to contribute out of the #3 spot.

 

also special teams has been greatly improved with addition of quality return men in 06 draft. took will blackmon, jennings, and corey rodgers, all who have proven themselves to be explosive at the college level.

 

all in all i think the pack has gotten way to much criticism after a down year, this year i expect them to move up in the standings while the bears drop just like a few yrs ago after their 13-3 season..

 

Vikes

Pack

Bears

Lions

[Sho Nuff 719]

most likely bears, vikings, lions, and packers in that order. there's little hope of the packers exiting the cellar. i have little faith in an old qb coming off a near 30 int season, the second coming of marty moronweg as a coach, awful wrs (except for driver), no kicking game, no interior o-line, and a rookie linebacker corps.

 

at least most of the media experts will call it that way. but let's see where things are at come january.

 

So instead you put your faith in a journeyman QB who has not started in how long? A group of WRS just as bad (besides Roy), and oline that is just about as bad, and a worse D?

 

And how are 2 vets and one rookie a rookie LB corps. Hodge is Barnett's backup.

 

 

 

McCarthy — From all accounts, McCarthy has made a decent impression so far in Green Bay. But his work as the Niners’ offensive coordinator before being hired to replace Mike Sherman left a lot to be desired, and, while it pains me a great deal to say this, Brett Favre is definitely on his last legs."

 

Got to love when people judge him basically just on San Fran. Only shows more ignorance.

[nlgb1 0]

actually packers are most likely to put barnett on the outside and plug hodge in to the middle because the like hodge so much

 

however this may take 4 or five weeks to happen after after they find out FA signee Ben Taylor sucks on the edge

[swamp dog 0]

i still cant believe how mcuh bad pub the pack is getting this year, i see them being an 8-8/9-7 team this year!!!

 

i guess noone remembers that their defense was ranked 7TH IN THE NFL in yds allowed last yr!!

picking up charles woodson, aj hawk and abdul hodge (ultimate NFL draft sleeper) will greatly improve upon the likes of na'il diggs, robert thomas, and ahmad carroll..... lineup=DL:KGB, Kampman, cullen jenkins(weak link), Ryan pickett LBs:Aj hawk Nick Barnett Abdul hodge (possibly one of best LB corps in a year or so) DBs:Al harris Nick Collins (possible pro bowler this yr, not many know about him) Charles woodson Marquand Manuel.....there is not much wrong with their defense at all....

 

on offense brett favre is still brett favre and will throw for around 3800/23 w/around 20 ints.... may have one of the best RBBC in the NFL w/ a healthy Green, healthy Davenport (who could be an effective starter on most teams) and Gado. Driver is a great hard nosed receiver who should go for about 1400/12 this year, while robert ferguson still has not reached his potential as a downfield threat while sitting behind walker, now as WR2 he could be in for a big year...also greg jennings was added in rd 3 of the draft and was one of NCAAs leading receivers. look for him to contribute out of the #3 spot.

 

also special teams has been greatly improved with addition of quality return men in 06 draft. took will blackmon, jennings, and corey rodgers, all who have proven themselves to be explosive at the college level.

 

all in all i think the pack has gotten way to much criticism after a down year, this year i expect them to move up in the standings while the bears drop just like a few yrs ago after their 13-3 season..

 

Vikes

Pack

Bears

Lions

 

um, their defense was ranked #7 last year and they won 4 games. and bates is gone.

 

 

So instead you put your faith in a journeyman QB who has not started in how long? A group of WRS just as bad (besides Roy), and oline that is just about as bad, and a worse D?

 

And how are 2 vets and one rookie a rookie LB corps. Hodge is Barnett's backup.

Got to love when people judge him basically just on San Fran. Only shows more ignorance.

 

harrington is gone as his devisive lockerroom presence (deserved and undeserved). that alone is a huge huge upgrade for the lions. kitna isn't going to the hall of fame but the lions can be successful with the qbs they have on their roster. and the packers better hope hodge starts, even given the learning curve a rookie lb has in the nfl. the depth is ugly.

 

i'm not predicting great things for the lions this year, but i'm certainly predicting dire things for the packers. you're in denial, as are most packer fans who want to desperately write off last year as some sort of bad fluke.

[DrJ 0]

[nlgb1 0]

um, their defense was ranked #7 last year and they won 4 games. and bates is gone.

 

yup an i cant even begin to remember how many games they lost by 7 or less, i think they set a record or sumthing....theyll definitely win more close games as their defense is IMPROVED, bates is gone yes which was a huge mistake, but offense will improve (like i said one of best RBBC in NFL) Davenport AND Green were injured for bulk of 05 season... i think it all hinges on Favre in my opinion if he puts up AVERAGE "favre-type" numbers then they can do well (which i think he will do)...but if he has another season like last, they could be drafting early again next year...

[Parja 0]

The Bears won't win it. The only thing they can do consistently is be inconsistent.

[mdubz 0]

you mean somebody has to win this division?

[Jay 0]

The Bears by default as they are the playoff-calibre team at the moment, but any team that steps up and plays well could take it. The Bears are not an elite team.

[swamp dog 0]

yup an i cant even begin to remember how many games they lost by 7 or less, i think they set a record or sumthing....theyll definitely win more close games as their defense is IMPROVED, bates is gone yes which was a huge mistake, but offense will improve (like i said one of best RBBC in NFL) Davenport AND Green were injured for bulk of 05 season... i think it all hinges on Favre in my opinion if he puts up AVERAGE "favre-type" numbers then they can do well (which i think he will do)...but if he has another season like last, they could be drafting early again next year...

 

um, bad teams lose lots of close games. a last-place doesn't lose it's games by double-digit points on a consistent basis. the lions lost, i think, two games in overtime last year, another two by 1 point, a couple more on last second field goals.

 

lol...you only think the poor packers set a record losing close games, when in reality they lost no more or no less that way than any other sucky team in the nfl.

 

for the record, the lions have the record in the past few years losing games by 7 or less points. but i don't bring it up because i know better: bad teams lose. period.

[nlgb1 0]

did a packer murder someone in your family or something?? what do u have against them??

[uubeee 0]

um, bad teams lose lots of close games. a last-place doesn't lose it's games by double-digit points on a consistent basis. the lions lost, i think, two games in overtime last year, another two by 1 point, a couple more on last second field goals.

 

lol...you only think the poor packers set a record losing close games, when in reality they lost no more or no less that way than any other sucky team in the nfl.

 

for the record, the lions have the record in the past few years losing games by 7 or less points. but i don't bring it up because i know better: bad teams lose. period.

 

 

Gotta go with Swamp on this one. Who else here knows more about losers than Swamp?

[swamp dog 0]

did a packer murder someone in your family or something?? what do u have against them??

 

 

i simply refuted your claim that the packers, by losing a handful of close games last year, proved they are close to being a good team. that's a classic logical fallacy that i simply pointed out. it has nothing to do with the packers. as proof, i cited the record of the lions in close games.

 

refuting faulty logic doesn't mean a packer murdered someone in my family. i'm not predicting much better for the lions--and no, no lion player has murdered someone in my family, either

 

Gotta go with Swamp on this one. Who else here knows more about losers than Swamp?

 

thank you

[Sho Nuff 719]

actually packers are most likely to put barnett on the outside and plug hodge in to the middle because the like hodge so much

 

however this may take 4 or five weeks to happen after after they find out FA signee Ben Taylor sucks on the edge

 

They are more likely to do that according to you?

And from what I have seen of Taylor and read about him...I disagree completely.

 

um, their defense was ranked #7 last year and they won 4 games. and bates is gone.

harrington is gone as his devisive lockerroom presence (deserved and undeserved). that alone is a huge huge upgrade for the lions. kitna isn't going to the hall of fame but the lions can be successful with the qbs they have on their roster. and the packers better hope hodge starts, even given the learning curve a rookie lb has in the nfl. the depth is ugly.

 

i'm not predicting great things for the lions this year, but i'm certainly predicting dire things for the packers. you're in denial, as are most packer fans who want to desperately write off last year as some sort of bad fluke.

 

Depth is ugly?

Hawk, Barnett, Taylor, (now yes a few of these are injury come backs) Poppinga, Manning, Hodge,

Looking at another rookie Ahmad Brooks in the supplemental.

 

You can keep talking about how great losing Joey was...does not mean it will amount to that much of a difference in the long run.

 

Im not predicting big things from the Packers either. I think Favre plays better than he did last year and we dod not get hit with the same injury issues. In addition, I hope that McCarthy is not as boneheaded as Sherman was many times.

 

Denial? Not at all. I write off last year for what it was. Fluke? Strong word...but not totally far off. The oline remains to be seen if it has improved. Fluke for Favre's play? Most definately. Fluke rash of injuries at key positions? Even you cannot deny that. Notice I predicted a whopping 2-4 game improvement.

[nlgb1 0]

They are more likely to do that according to you?

And from what I have seen of Taylor and read about him...I disagree completely.

 

According to packers beat writers, espn insider, many other sources... i dont just pull these things out of my ass

[Sho Nuff 719]

According to packers beat writers, espn insider, many other sources... i dont just pull these things out of my ass

 

Show me a few of them...because everything I have read coming out is that Taylor has won the job and Hodge is behind Barnett.

[Jay 0]

Taylor is still slotted on the outside and Hodge behind Barnett, but I've heard the rumors that the team is considering moving Barnett outside and Hodge into the starting lineup as well. Taylor has looked like garbage so far. It would probably put the best 3 players on the field, but I thought Barnett finally turned the corner in the middle and I wouldn't want to mess with that either.

[nlgb1 0]

it might all be hearsay then, doesnt really matter though..

 

the point that when barnett hawk and hodge are starting LBs for the pack in a year or 2, packers could have the best young def players in the NFL

 

hawk,hodge,collins,barnett,kampman

 

didnt know my posts would set you guys off so much.....sheesh

[t.j 35]

Detroit.

[Sho Nuff 719]

it might all be hearsay then, doesnt really matter though..

 

the point that when barnett hawk and hodge are starting LBs for the pack in a year or 2, packers could have the best young def players in the NFL

 

hawk,hodge,collins,barnett,kampman

 

didnt know my posts would set you guys off so much.....sheesh

 

Set me off so much?

 

All I did was ask for a source.

 

Because there has been speculation for some time that they would move Barnett outside...and never has anyone brought a source for this.

 

I see it is true again today...that it is only according to rumors...and nobody has a source.

Because I keep pretty well read up on the Packers and had not seen that.

 

The other reason I ask for the link...is that if this is confirmed by something pretty solid...I would share the info on other boards and such with other Packer fans.

[Jimmy "Superfly" Snuka 0]

Vikings? Detroit? Come on! Its gotta be da Bears! I can't believe you said Detroit.

[Jay 0]

The other reason I ask for the link...is that if this is confirmed by something pretty solid...I would share the info on other boards and such with other Packer fans.

 

I saw it too, but it was about a week or so back. It was either on kffl, rotoworld or ffmastermind. It was speculation, based on Taylor's lack of ability to "lock down" the strong side position in OTAs.

[Let Da Big Dog Eat 37]

It's hard not to pick Da Berz. The D is just too good. After that, I would have to go Vikes, Pack and Det.

 

Berz: Da D. Grossman is better than the rook they had to throw out there last year.

Vikes: Hutch, KRob rebound, Birk return and Johnson was good down the stretch, If Johnson gets hurt, INCOMING, duck.

Pack: Improvements everywhere. Don't give me crap about the WR's and JW. He didn't play last year. RB's can't be worse if Green and Davenpooper return which is expected.

Det: Martz has a gazillion plays. Does anyone truly expect the mess of FU WR's to pick up this O in year !? I want some of what you are smoking! Maybe next year they could be dangerous. New QB's and that WR corps = lot's of picks.

[Walter34 3]

Bears - 10-11 wins

Vikes - 7-9 wins

Pack 5-7 wins

Lions 6-8 wins

 

Say what you will about the Bears O, but they are clearly the only team that is playoff calibre in the division at this point, though the other 3 are moving in the right direction. Whether the Bears become serious contenders this year is on the shoulders of Grossman / Griese and someone emerging into a solid starter from Berrian & Bradley.

 

Defence, special teams, oline and running game are all top shelf.

 

All 3 new coaches will go through a transition period implementing their team & system and the rookies will need some time to get used to the pro game. All 3 defences look in decent shape. The Pack may eek out an 8 or 9 win season before an offensive overhaul when Favre goes to pasture.

[Sho Nuff 719]

I saw it too, but it was about a week or so back. It was either on kffl, rotoworld or ffmastermind. It was speculation, based on Taylor's lack of ability to "lock down" the strong side position in OTAs.

 

 

Well, I take things from kffl, rotoworld, and ffmastermind with a grain of salt.

 

Id much rather see something coming out of the press as in JSonline...or something similar.

[Jay 0]

I don't think the linebacker situation will be settled until camp. I do think that Hawk, Hodge and Barnett are our three best linebackers in the long term. I'm not a fan of shuffling linebackers, though, especially if you've found a successful formula with one of them already. A lot of teams have really messed up the production of their best player by doing that. The Packer coaches must think that Hodge is too short to play the strong side, otherwise I see no reason why he couldn't move outside and take Taylor's spot, if necessary.

 

We'll see, I guess. The good news is that the Packers appear to have had an exceptional draft this year and have upgraded the talent on both sides of the ball. It was a necessity, and it was good to see.

[LT2_3 0]

I think the teams with new coaches are going to struggle early. Historically, the only teams with new HCs that performed at a high level were ones that retained their coordinators and schemes.

 

I think that the Bears are the team to beat in this division. If they can win 10 games with a 4th round rookie starting at QB, you have to think that they can at least repeat that with what their coaches consider to be a better QB when they have all 22 starters returning and have the same offensive and defensive systems as the year prior. Their schedule benefits them in that they have 9 games against rookie HCs this year with their first 3 against their division rivals.

 

GB- It'll be interesting to see what happens with this team. They have a bunch of new players, coaches, and scheme's to implement. It's also been reported that MANY players are skipping the teams OTAs entirely which doesn't bode well for the early part of the season. On top of all that, this is the first time that Farve has EVER had to learn a new offense.

 

Detroit - While most of the world is impressed with the hiring of Martz as OC, I see this as a bad thing for them this year and in the future. It's bad this year because StL/KC offense is so complex that it generally takes a couple of seasons to install the entire offense. They will struggle early at the least. It's bad for them longer term because Martz will probably get a HC gig after this year leaving them starting with a new OC and scheme next year AGAIN.

 

Minn - You have to wonder how this will all work out. They have talent on paper. They will likely start slowly too with all new systems. On offense, they don't really have a recently proven WR and while Wiggins is a good TE, their new offense doesn't really utilize that position much and he will be more of an H-back. At RB, they are pretty weak too. On defense they don't really have the LBs to play the Tampa-2 defense particularly well either.

[Sho Nuff 719]

On top of all that, this is the first time that Farve has EVER had to learn a new offense.

 

Not completely. Similar offense...learning new terminology.

[swamp dog 0]

I think the teams with new coaches are going to struggle early. Historically, the only teams with new HCs that performed at a high level were ones that retained their coordinators and schemes.

 

I think that the Bears are the team to beat in this division. If they can win 10 games with a 4th round rookie starting at QB, you have to think that they can at least repeat that with what their coaches consider to be a better QB when they have all 22 starters returning and have the same offensive and defensive systems as the year prior. Their schedule benefits them in that they have 9 games against rookie HCs this year with their first 3 against their division rivals.

 

GB- It'll be interesting to see what happens with this team. They have a bunch of new players, coaches, and scheme's to implement. It's also been reported that MANY players are skipping the teams OTAs entirely which doesn't bode well for the early part of the season. On top of all that, this is the first time that Farve has EVER had to learn a new offense.

 

Detroit - While most of the world is impressed with the hiring of Martz as OC, I see this as a bad thing for them this year and in the future. It's bad this year because StL/KC offense is so complex that it generally takes a couple of seasons to install the entire offense. They will struggle early at the least. It's bad for them longer term because Martz will probably get a HC gig after this year leaving them starting with a new OC and scheme next year AGAIN.

 

Minn - You have to wonder how this will all work out. They have talent on paper. They will likely start slowly too with all new systems. On offense, they don't really have a recently proven WR and while Wiggins is a good TE, their new offense doesn't really utilize that position much and he will be more of an H-back. At RB, they are pretty weak too. On defense they don't really have the LBs to play the Tampa-2 defense particularly well either.

 

 

while i'm not discounting the possibility of the lions struggling to pick up a new system, the fact is martz had instants results with the system with the rams (argue all you want about what talent he did or didn't have to work with there--they picked it up and were instantaneously successful with it). and you're wrong about most people applauding this hire. almost everyone here is badmouthing it: 1) "martz and marinelli won't get along" 2) "martz is overrated and rode the coattails of his star players with the rams" 3) "martz's offense is too complex for the simpletons the lions have" 4) "even if martz is successful he'll be gone next year so that means the hire is really stupid in the first place." i mean, take your pick--and most of this ridicule is coming from people who root for teams with horrid offenses, like, oh, i don't know, da bearz! i'd hate to see the venom the lions would have gotten had they hired the SECOND BEST offensive mind in football instead of the best!

 

martz has also brought his protege with him from the rams to work as his assistant. if martz leaves, that guy will take over the oc.

 

if martz leaves next year because he has a ton of hc offerings, i'm happy: that means the lions were wildly successful this year. not sure how that is a bad thing, but it is an interesting spin you put on it

[LT2_3 0]

Not completely. Similar offense...learning new terminology.

 

True - Perhaps I should have said "The first time that Farve has ever had to learn new terminology for an offensive system."

 

It's happened before where a QB learning new terminology hasn't heard the play call from the sidelines at the end of a close game and called a play from his previous offense. This also will affect the speed at which the team gets out of the huddle. Look for delay of game penalties in the preseason with GBs first unit on the field.

 

While this may not prove to be a big deal ultimately, it has the possibility of being a concerning issue. If, in the heat of a game, Farve effs up a playcall and even 1 guy misses his blocking assignment, he could get creamed. I know, it isn't usually a big deal for other QBs, but Farve strikes me as a player that is more physical talent oriented as opposed to being a cerebral type of guy. Farve himself said it was the hardest part of learning the new offense after minicamp. If HE thinks it's a big deal, who am I to disagree?

[swamp dog 0]

I don't think the linebacker situation will be settled until camp. I do think that Hawk, Hodge and Barnett are our three best linebackers in the long term. I'm not a fan of shuffling linebackers, though, especially if you've found a successful formula with one of them already. A lot of teams have really messed up the production of their best player by doing that. The Packer coaches must think that Hodge is too short to play the strong side, otherwise I see no reason why he couldn't move outside and take Taylor's spot, if necessary.

 

We'll see, I guess. The good news is that the Packers appear to have had an exceptional draft this year and have upgraded the talent on both sides of the ball. It was a necessity, and it was good to see.

 

the lion have had no shortage of "exceptional drafts" in recent years. until it translates to the field, it means nothing. don't count your chickens before they're hatched.

[LT2_3 0]

while i'm not discounting the possibility of the lions struggling to pick up a new system, the fact is martz had instants results with the system with the rams (argue all you want about what talent he did or didn't have to work with there--they picked it up and were instantaneously successful with it).

 

martz has also brought his protege with him from the rams to work as his assistant. if martz leaves, that guy will take over the oc.

 

if martz leaves next year because he has a ton of hc offerings, i'm happy: that means the lions were wildly successful this year. not sure how that is a bad thing, but it is an interesting spin you put on it

 

While it's true that Martz had instant success in StL, I would propose not only that he had MUCH better talent to work with, but also that Vermeil had been in place for 2 years and I'm pretty sure that it was Vermeil's base offense and players like Warner, Bruce, Prohel, and Hakim had already had 2 years in the system. The drafting of Holt and trading for Faulk is what made the system really work that year and not so much Martz coming in as OC. I think that offense would've been vastly improved between '98 and '99 regardless of whether Martz was the OC or not.

[swamp dog 0]

While it's true that Martz had instant success in StL, I would propose not only that he had MUCH better talent to work with, but also that Vermeil had been in place for 2 years and I'm pretty sure that it was Vermeil's base offense and players like Warner, Bruce, Prohel, and Hakim had already had 2 years in the system. The drafting of Holt and trading for Faulk is what made the system really work that year and not so much Martz coming in as OC. I think that offense would've been vastly improved between '98 and '99 regardless of whether Martz was the OC or not.

 

well, we'll never know that, will we? it's convenient to say that (that the rams would have been really good even without martz) but there's no way to know that. the fact is the rams offense still hummed along after vermeil left and martz was still there.

 

hmm...

 

but i see this quite a bit, martz being marginalized. i'm sure if the any other team other than the lions had hired him people wouldn't be trying so hard to find something wrong with it. but that's life.

 

the question should be turned around the other way: do people think the lions offense will NOT improve this year? let's hear the answer to that question

[twalk214 0]

I would have to go with

THE PACK

The bears offense is just to bad to be a good team.

The Vikings, No culpepper, No Moss, No playoffs

The Lions are still rebuilding and I think they will have a good year, but not enough to make the playoffs

The Packers improved defense, there all healthy (maybe not 100%, but enough to play) and the team chemistry should be in check.