Kevin Kolb

[nikki2200 4]

It's funny how the tune changed with most eagles fans after Kolb sucked the entire preseason and that this was suddenly a rebuilding year. You never once heard that when they were shopping McNabb and ESPECIALLY after they traded him to their hated rival.

 

Yes. THIS.

 

It's BS to say that everyone wasn't screaming that Kolb was gonna be the messiah that would take the Eagles to a SB win.

 

On another note, now they're all screaming for Reid's head. Maybe it wasn't McNabb... maybe it was the coach.

 

Rebuilding my a$$. There was no reason to "rebuild" the QB position. And now all of a sudden 34 is over the hill for a QB? Someone tell that to Peyton Manning and Tom Brady.

[TimHauck 3,431]

Yes. THIS.

 

It's BS to say that everyone wasn't screaming that Kolb was gonna be the messiah that would take the Eagles to a SB win.

 

On another note, now they're all screaming for Reid's head. Maybe it wasn't McNabb... maybe it was the coach.

 

Rebuilding my a$$. There was no reason to "rebuild" the QB position. And now all of a sudden 34 is over the hill for a QB? Someone tell that to Peyton Manning and Tom Brady.

 

LOL. Kolb was never the Messiah. Many thought he had a chance to be better than McNabb, some even thought he could be better in 2010, but it was definitely not a sure thing that Kolb would be leading the Eagles to the SB, and he certainly wouldn't be doing it this year.

 

If you really live in Philly, you'd know that people had already started wanting Reid gone for a couple years now (although the real problem is the ownership, but that's not gonna change anytime soon). He's a good coach from Monday-Saturday, but he might be the worst in-game manager I've seen in awhile. Going into the offseason, there were a lot of people that just wanted at least one of McNabb and/or Reid gone, but really didn't care which one.

 

But before anyone starts with the "Why would you want to get rid of one of the winningest coaches of the decade?" it's basically the same as the McNabb situation. We appreciate what he did in rescuing the Eagless from suckiness, but after 10+ years and no SB, it's just time for a change.

[nikki2200 4]

But before anyone starts with the "Why would you want to get rid of one of the winningest coaches of the decade?" it's basically the same as the McNabb situation. We appreciate what he did in rescuing the Eagless from suckiness, but after 10+ years and no SB, it's just time for a change.

 

Ask someone from like Detroit or Cleveland if they would have been happy with the type of success the Eagles have had for 10+ years. Is that what is required now? You MUST win a SB or else your team just isn't good enough? That means 31 teams suck every year.

 

And yes... people have been saying one of the two needed to go ever since the botched Superbowl. BUT last year..... they were all screaming for McNabb. He was getting booed at the games. Chants of Vick Vick Vick. No wonder his head wasn't exactly in the game last year. But all things considered, he still finished 2009 with a 93 passer rating and ranked #12 in the NFL. I personally don't find that trade-worthy and I'm sure lots and lots of fans from other cities would agree with me, especially considering how difficult it is to find decent QBs these days.

[TimHauck 3,431]

Like I said, most people are happy with the success Reid and McNabb brought the Eagles. But that doesn't mean they both needed to stay here forever.

[surferskin 31]

LOL. Kolb was never the Messiah. Many thought he had a chance to be better than McNabb, some even thought he could be better in 2010, but it was definitely not a sure thing that Kolb would be leading the Eagles to the SB, and he certainly wouldn't be doing it this year.

 

There it is right there. You just admitted that many thought the reason to get rid of McNabb is because of Kolb. Not only was Kolb was gonna be better than McNabb but he was gonna be better right away.

[TimHauck 3,431]

BTW, from a fantasy perspective, despite not looking terribly sharp, Kolb did finish with somewhat respectable stats. Obviously it depends on how long Vick is out since the job seems to be his (unless of course Kolb pulls a Vick and miraculously turns it around), but as I said, Kolb is definitely worth a flier if you need a QB.

[TimHauck 3,431]

There it is right there. You just admitted that many thought the reason to get rid of McNabb is because of Kolb. Not only was Kolb was gonna be better than McNabb but he was gonna be better right away.

 

Huh? How does saying "some people thought Kolb could be better than McNabb in 2010" admitting that the reason they got rid of McNabb was because of Kolb. Yes, some people did think that, but simply having Kolb there was NOT the reason they got rid of McNabb. Yes, they wanted to see what Kolb could do, but it was definitely not a sure thing he'd be better than McNabb. Many seem to forget that Kolb was nearing the end of his own deal, so if McNabb was still here it'd be yet another year of "can Kolb take over after McNabb is gone?" questions. Giving the job to Kolb gave the team time to evaluate whether or not Kolb really is the future or not (of course the Vick situation complicated matters). So obviously if he keeps playing like he has been he probably won't be.

[nikki2200 4]

Huh? How does saying "some people thought Kolb could be better than McNabb in 2010" admitting that the reason they got rid of McNabb was because of Kolb. Yes, some people did think that, but simply having Kolb there was NOT the reason they got rid of McNabb. Yes, they wanted to see what Kolb could do, but it was definitely not a sure thing he'd be better than McNabb. Many seem to forget that Kolb was nearing the end of his own deal, so if McNabb was still here it'd be yet another year of "can Kolb take over after McNabb is gone?" questions. Giving the job to Kolb gave the team time to evaluate whether or not Kolb really is the future or not (of course the Vick situation complicated matters). So obviously if he keeps playing like he has been he probably won't be.

 

So let's say... hypothetically... if Koy Detmer was the back up and was in his early 20s, would the Eagles have still traded McNabb because it was just his time to go?

 

You are definitely from Philly. I'm saying that in an affectionate way. I love these convos.

 

Kolb had two good games last year and most people (I won't say everyone) thought he was the answer and wanted McNabb's head on a platter. And they got what they asked for. It had nothing to do with it was just his time to go. It had to do with the fact that they thought we had a QB that would be better. FACT.

[TimHauck 3,431]

So let's say... hypothetically... if Koy Detmer was the back up and was in his early 20s, would the Eagles have still traded McNabb because it was just his time to go?

 

You are definitely from Philly. I'm saying that in an affectionate way. I love these convos.

 

Kolb had two good games last year and most people (I won't say everyone) thought he was the answer and wanted McNabb's head on a platter. And they got what they asked for. It had nothing to do with it was just his time to go. It had to do with the fact that they thought we had a QB that would be better. FACT.

 

Having Kolb made letting McNabb go easier (so we thought) simply because they wanted to see what they had in Kolb, but most people were not entirely confident in Kolb yet. Because of that, you could probably argue that they shouldn't have traded McNabb, but yeah, there probably are a lot of people in Philly that would've been okay with Koy Detmer as the QB if it meant a change from McNabb.

[nikki2200 4]

I'm not denying that McNabb was pretty much run out of town. But I am denying that the reason he was run out of town was because they had Kevin Kolb.

 

 

Having Kolb made letting McNabb go easier (so we thought) simply because they wanted to see what they had in Kolb

 

Thank you.

 

Because of that, you could probably argue that they shouldn't have traded McNabb

 

And thanks again....

[TimHauck 3,431]

Thank you.

 

 

 

And thanks again....

 

Having Kolb wasn't the reason they traded McNabb. I said it made the decision easier, but it wasn't the reason.

 

And I said "you could argue they shouldn't have traded McNabb," but you could also argue that they should have.

[Lord4GL 4]

McNabb is gone for a variety of reasons. He is 34 and has had injuries. He threw too many balls in the dirt or behind guys; we got to see more of that yesterday. Stop listening to the collection of pinheads on 610’s morning show to gauge who wanted McNabb to leave. I am sick of hearing about the dirty thirty and other assorted morons who are held up to represent the team’s fans.

 

All that being said, I don’t think McNabb, Kolb or Vick would have taken this team to the Super Bowl. I would have preferred they stick it out with Kolb to see what he could do. I think they would have a better record this year with Vick over Kolb though.

 

McNabb’s 8/19/125 performance isn’t what did the Eagles in yesterday. Penalties and Andy Reid did. Sorry, but a delay of game after a timeout is ludicrous. I am pretty sure their only third and short play is designed to run right into the left tackle.

 

The Skins weren’t rushing the passer that hard yesterday. The easiest way to tell is that the Eagles offensive line looked good in pass protection. I don’t recall Vick taking shots down the field either. I think Kolb just took what he saw. It would have been nice to see him play more aggressive, but I don’t think the loss is fault.

[p00h 85]

i'd like to state what I heard about the singletary situation in SF, as it relates to the mcnabb/kolb situation. People in the bay area are frustrated with the string of coaches they've had since marriuchi got fired in a terrible fashion. They say this here. 'Yeah singletary might have to go, but lets make sure we get in someone that is better than him! If not, we just dance the same dance for another 2-3 years before going through the same process again.'

 

I think that same mantra applies very well with the McNabb situation. This guy is likely going to the HoF, and you just dump him for some no name dude that wasn't even highly drafted or anything. That has reeked of 'i'm smarter than you' since day 1, which is AR's MO TBH. And QB is a position where you can't just act like, 'my system will allow me to plug anyone in and still chug along.' ANd in this day and age, for every Tom Brady that turns into a stud unexpectedly, there are a thousand alex smiths and david carrs that don't pan out. You don't just let a mcnabb loose like that, in division no less. That move will haunt them for years to come, regardless of how good Vick can play for them for the near future. Only if Kolb takes them to the promise land will that mistake be overlooked, but even then it will be a mistake that was made...

[WiljenFC 0]

Is it too late for Phily to trade for Leinart? Maybe Trent Edwards? They could complete the "Captain Checkdown" set they started with Kolb.

[JT 137]

i'd like to state what I heard about the singletary situation in SF, as it relates to the mcnabb/kolb situation. People in the bay area are frustrated with the string of coaches they've had since marriuchi got fired in a terrible fashion. They say this here. 'Yeah singletary might have to go, but lets make sure we get in someone that is better than him! If not, we just dance the same dance for another 2-3 years before going through the same process again.'

 

I think that same mantra applies very well with the McNabb situation. This guy is likely going to the HoF, and you just dump him for some no name dude that wasn't even highly drafted or anything. That has reeked of 'i'm smarter than you' since day 1, which is AR's MO TBH. And QB is a position where you can't just act like, 'my system will allow me to plug anyone in and still chug along.' ANd in this day and age, for every Tom Brady that turns into a stud unexpectedly, there are a thousand alex smiths and david carrs that don't pan out. You don't just let a mcnabb loose like that, in division no less. That move will haunt them for years to come, regardless of how good Vick can play for them for the near future. Only if Kolb takes them to the promise land will that mistake be overlooked, but even then it will be a mistake that was made...

 

So if Kolb takes them to a level that McNabb never achieved, the deal was a mistake?

 

I guess that's no less idiotic than most of this thread.

 

McNab is 34, coming into a contract year, along with the uncertainty of the upcoming CBA or potential work stoppage. There's been nothing in his play over the last year to indicate that suddenly he was going to play at a Super Bowl level. They liked Kolb from the start, have what they felt (and appears to be) a solid backup in Vick. There was never a better time to make the McNabb deal.

 

Comparisons to Manning and Brady??? Where were those prior to the trade? All anybody outside of Philly ever had to say about McNabb was that he was a choker who couldn't win the big game. Now, when it suits their purpose to take his side and trash the organization, suddenly he's Johnny Unitas.

 

Do I like that they sent him inside the division? Nope. Stupid move as a result of being to slow to make the decision. Make McNabb available a couple months earleir and you get a lot more in return, outside the division. But as a business move...and the league is a business where, if you're not built to win big, you had better have a plan in place for winning this next game...it was sound.

 

They've made a plan. It didn't look so good at halftime of game one, but looked pretty damn good up until Vick got injured yesterday. Nobody with any sense saw Kolb as a messiah. As a fan of 40 years, I hoped for an 8-8 season with signs of progress. If that's the worst that rebuilding gets, that's pretty good. Ask about 25 other franchises. If Kolb doesn't show progress, his contract is front-loaded to allow them money to work with next off season.

 

To judge Kolb after this limited stint is foolish. To keep him in when Vick had a red hot hand would have been foolish as well. And to watch McNabb yesterday and think he is anything near what he was in his prime, or that he's taking any team to the Super Bowl, is the most foolish of all.

[Turcaso 1]

The eagle,s traded McNabb because the had Kolb in the waiting AND VICK. Vick wasn't the principle reason for letting MCnabb go but he was the security blanket.

 

Philly found out the their #2 was really their #1 and one of the most dynamic players in the league. Vick is a much better option than Donovan right now AND going forward. Resign Vick now for three years and have him run this young offense to wherever they are going to go....if it's not the Superbowl, it will be more exciting and successful than what they would have with McNabb or Kolb.

[Doozer 0]

So if Kolb takes them to a level that McNabb never achieved, the deal was a mistake?

 

I guess that's no less idiotic than most of this thread.

 

McNab is 34, coming into a contract year, along with the uncertainty of the upcoming CBA or potential work stoppage. There's been nothing in his play over the last year to indicate that suddenly he was going to play at a Super Bowl level. They liked Kolb from the start, have what they felt (and appears to be) a solid backup in Vick. There was never a better time to make the McNabb deal.

 

Comparisons to Manning and Brady??? Where were those prior to the trade? All anybody outside of Philly ever had to say about McNabb was that he was a choker who couldn't win the big game. Now, when it suits their purpose to take his side and trash the organization, suddenly he's Johnny Unitas.

 

Do I like that they sent him inside the division? Nope. Stupid move as a result of being to slow to make the decision. Make McNabb available a couple months earleir and you get a lot more in return, outside the division. But as a business move...and the league is a business where, if you're not built to win big, you had better have a plan in place for winning this next game...it was sound.

 

They've made a plan. It didn't look so good at halftime of game one, but looked pretty damn good up until Vick got injured yesterday. Nobody with any sense saw Kolb as a messiah. As a fan of 40 years, I hoped for an 8-8 season with signs of progress. If that's the worst that rebuilding gets, that's pretty good. Ask about 25 other franchises. If Kolb doesn't show progress, his contract is front-loaded to allow them money to work with next off season.

 

To judge Kolb after this limited stint is foolish. To keep him in when Vick had a red hot hand would have been foolish as well. And to watch McNabb yesterday and think he is anything near what he was in his prime, or that he's taking any team to the Super Bowl, is the most foolish of all.

 

15/22 of Kolb's passes were completed to McCoy/Schmitt... he looked terrible and played terrible. Manning was a notorious choker until his SB run, of which he didn't even play that well and was carried by his defense/running game.

 

Who was the best QB the Bills have ever had? The best QB the Dolphins have ever had? Jim Kelly lost how many super bowls yet is still loved in Buffalo. Marino never even got the Dolphins to the SB but is still a much loved figure in Miami. You threw away your best QB to a division rival for a couple of second round picks when your offense has the best talent at skill positions in all of McNabb's tenure... you cannot deny that, and that is retarded IMO.

[Melissa Stark 1]

Would it have been better to keep McNabb and dump Reid.

That would have been an interesting scenerio.

[mambokings 0]

15/22 of Kolb's passes were completed to McCoy/Schmitt... he looked terrible and played terrible. Manning was a notorious choker until his SB run, of which he didn't even play that well and was carried by his defense/running game.

 

Who was the best QB the Bills have ever had? The best QB the Dolphins have ever had? Jim Kelly lost how many super bowls yet is still loved in Buffalo. Marino never even got the Dolphins to the SB but is still a much loved figure in Miami. You threw away your best QB to a division rival for a couple of second round picks when your offense has the best talent at skill positions in all of McNabb's tenure... you cannot deny that, and that is retarded IMO.

 

Agreed, especially about the talent at the skill positions. It seemed like the Eagles finally decided to get McNabb some help, like they were finally about to put together a SB run, but they end up dumping McNabb and put themselves in a semi-rebuilding mode. Unreal. When they gave McNabb a stud WR, Owens, he nearly won 'em a championship. Donovan was plenty talented to complete a Superbowl roster and it wasn't his fault they never got a ring.

 

Also agreed on Manning, how he lucked in to that championship because of his running game and Rex Grossman's complete suckage. Otherwise, he's mostly a choker but no one ever said "hey, let's dump Manning for Sorgi because Peyton can't win the big one". You play the best you have and improve the rest of the team. McNabb was the best they had, but they let him go. Philadelphia deserves a bum like Kolb, this bizarre Vick situation, and continued losing.

[TimHauck 3,431]

Agreed, especially about the talent at the skill positions. It seemed like the Eagles finally decided to get McNabb some help, like they were finally about to put together a SB run, but they end up dumping McNabb and put themselves in a semi-rebuilding mode. Unreal. When they gave McNabb a stud WR, Owens, he nearly won 'em a championship. Donovan was plenty talented to complete a Superbowl roster and it wasn't his fault they never got a ring.

 

Also agreed on Manning, how he lucked in to that championship because of his running game and Rex Grossman's complete suckage. Otherwise, he's mostly a choker but no one ever said "hey, let's dump Manning for Sorgi because Peyton can't win the big one". You play the best you have and improve the rest of the team. McNabb was the best they had, but they let him go. Philadelphia deserves a bum like Kolb, this bizarre Vick situation, and continued losing.

 

I don't get why everyone in here thinks the entire city of Philadelphia hates McNabb. They don't, they recognize that he was the best QB the team has ever had, but he is on the downside of his career, and it was just time for a change at the QB position. This was not a legitimate SB team even with McNabb. Reid loves McNabb more than anyone. If he thought the team could win a SB with McNabb in 2010, he still would've been here. Besides, McNabb only had one year left on his contract and they weren't going to give him the money he wanted for an extension. After 11 years, I wouldn't call trading him when he only has one year left on his deal "throwing him away." Teams in all sports do that to some of their longest-tenured players all the time.

 

I didn't live in Miami in the 90's, but I'm willingly to bet that Marino wasn't "loved" by everyone there during the later stages of his career when he still had no SB ring. 5-10 years from now, McNabb will still be remembered as the best QB in Eagles history, but right now, he's just the guy who couldn't win a SB.

[surferskin 31]

15/22 of Kolb's passes were completed to McCoy/Schmitt... he looked terrible and played terrible. Manning was a notorious choker until his SB run, of which he didn't even play that well and was carried by his defense/running game.

 

Who was the best QB the Bills have ever had? The best QB the Dolphins have ever had? Jim Kelly lost how many super bowls yet is still loved in Buffalo. Marino never even got the Dolphins to the SB but is still a much loved figure in Miami. You threw away your best QB to a division rival for a couple of second round picks when your offense has the best talent at skill positions in all of McNabb's tenure... you cannot deny that, and that is retarded IMO.

 

I agree with everything you said up until the Marino comment. Marino took the Phins to the SB in his second season.

[TimmySmith 2,783]

To sum up....

 

McNabb with no receivers = 4 championship games.

McNabb with 1 receiver = Super Bowl.

McNabb with 3 receivers = traded.

 

Kolb with 3 receivers = rebuilding year.

[p00h 85]

So if Kolb takes them to a level that McNabb never achieved, the deal was a mistake?

 

I guess that's no less idiotic than most of this thread.

 

McNab is 34, coming into a contract year, along with the uncertainty of the upcoming CBA or potential work stoppage. There's been nothing in his play over the last year to indicate that suddenly he was going to play at a Super Bowl level. They liked Kolb from the start, have what they felt (and appears to be) a solid backup in Vick. There was never a better time to make the McNabb deal.

 

Comparisons to Manning and Brady??? Where were those prior to the trade? All anybody outside of Philly ever had to say about McNabb was that he was a choker who couldn't win the big game. Now, when it suits their purpose to take his side and trash the organization, suddenly he's Johnny Unitas.

 

Do I like that they sent him inside the division? Nope. Stupid move as a result of being to slow to make the decision. Make McNabb available a couple months earleir and you get a lot more in return, outside the division. But as a business move...and the league is a business where, if you're not built to win big, you had better have a plan in place for winning this next game...it was sound.

 

They've made a plan. It didn't look so good at halftime of game one, but looked pretty damn good up until Vick got injured yesterday. Nobody with any sense saw Kolb as a messiah. As a fan of 40 years, I hoped for an 8-8 season with signs of progress. If that's the worst that rebuilding gets, that's pretty good. Ask about 25 other franchises. If Kolb doesn't show progress, his contract is front-loaded to allow them money to work with next off season.

 

To judge Kolb after this limited stint is foolish. To keep him in when Vick had a red hot hand would have been foolish as well. And to watch McNabb yesterday and think he is anything near what he was in his prime, or that he's taking any team to the Super Bowl, is the most foolish of all.

 

 

since you want to use insult words, here's my retort..

 

 

The only place Kolb can take them that McNabb hasn't, is a SB win, idiot. Hence my comment: Only if Kolb takes them to the promise land will that mistake be overlooked, but even then it will be a mistake that was made...

 

The latter part of that comment that is will stll be a mistake that was made is in reference to this: They could have kept McNabb another year or two, and properly groomed Kolb to take the job. But AR in his infinite wisdom believed that RIGHT NOW, Kolb was the better option. THat is clearly not the case. And to throw McNabb's 34 years out there is idiotic, and you know it is idiotic. He's not run down, getting hurt every other week or anything. THis is 2010 my man, soon to be 2011. QBs that play at a high level are more than capable of playing into their late 30s. I won't use Favre as an example because he is well outside the norm, but a bunch of the top qbs in the league right now are well into their 30s...

 

I don't have any horse in this race tbh. Jets fan here, am pretty much not a fan of anything philly. Don't care much for vick cuz I'm a huge animal lover, and find his actions despicable. And I could care less if Kolb turns out to be the next Joe Montana. I'm just making a simple statement that AR's move of getting rid of McNabb was an extremely stupid one because he didn't have a viable replacement to step up and move forward. The team they have has TOO much talent to try and play it like its a rebuilding year as well. Reid thought kolb could step in and get them winning games ASAP, and that is not the case, and will now be proven clearly since Vick is out for an indefinite time...

[TimHauck 3,431]

To sum up....

 

McNabb with no receivers = 4 championship games.

McNabb with 1 receiver = Super Bowl.

McNabb with 3 receivers = traded.

 

Kolb with 3 receivers = rebuilding year.

 

It's about more than just receivers. Specifically, the defense isn't as good as it's been in the past.

 

since you want to use insult words, here's my retort..

 

 

The only place Kolb can take them that McNabb hasn't, is a SB win, idiot. Hence my comment: Only if Kolb takes them to the promise land will that mistake be overlooked, but even then it will be a mistake that was made...

 

The latter part of that comment that is will stll be a mistake that was made is in reference to this: They could have kept McNabb another year or two, and properly groomed Kolb to take the job. But AR in his infinite wisdom believed that RIGHT NOW, Kolb was the better option. THat is clearly not the case. And to throw McNabb's 34 years out there is idiotic, and you know it is idiotic. He's not run down, getting hurt every other week or anything. THis is 2010 my man, soon to be 2011. QBs that play at a high level are more than capable of playing into their late 30s. I won't use Favre as an example because he is well outside the norm, but a bunch of the top qbs in the league right now are well into their 30s...

 

I don't have any horse in this race tbh. Jets fan here, am pretty much not a fan of anything philly. Don't care much for vick cuz I'm a huge animal lover, and find his actions despicable. And I could care less if Kolb turns out to be the next Joe Montana. I'm just making a simple statement that AR's move of getting rid of McNabb was an extremely stupid one because he didn't have a viable replacement to step up and move forward. The team they have has TOO much talent to try and play it like its a rebuilding year as well. Reid thought kolb could step in and get them winning games ASAP, and that is not the case, and will now be proven clearly since Vick is out for an indefinite time...

 

If Kolb wins a SB (not saying he will), there is absolutely no way you could call trading McNabb a mistake. Properly groom Kolb? He sat on the bench for 3 years! If he's not ready now, he probably isn't going to be (which is a possibility).

 

Yes, QB's do play into their late 30's, and I'm not saying McNabb won't, but he did take a pretty good beating during the early part of his career when he ran more, and he hasn't exactly been the picture of health during his career. In 11 years, he has started all 16 regular season games just 4 times. In contrast, to whoever brought up Manning and Brady, Peyton Manning has done it every season he's been the starter (12).

 

But again, everyone is writing off Kolb after not even 2 games as the starter. Even after Vick came in and did well, many people were still saying it was Kolb's job and it should at least take a couple games to lose it. Now with Vick hurt, you might as well give Kolb more than 1.5 games to decide if he sucks or not.

[JT 137]

15/22 of Kolb's passes were completed to McCoy/Schmitt... he looked terrible and played terrible. Manning was a notorious choker until his SB run, of which he didn't even play that well and was carried by his defense/running game.

 

Who was the best QB the Bills have ever had? The best QB the Dolphins have ever had? Jim Kelly lost how many super bowls yet is still loved in Buffalo. Marino never even got the Dolphins to the SB but is still a much loved figure in Miami. You threw away your best QB to a division rival for a couple of second round picks when your offense has the best talent at skill positions in all of McNabb's tenure... you cannot deny that, and that is retarded IMO.

 

A couple questions:

 

How have the Bills fared post-Kelly? The Dolphins post-Marino?

 

It's almost impossible to have a QB ready when you decide that the spot belongs to someone until they're done with it. Green Bay had to force Favre out when Rodgers was ready, and he didn't look like a Pro Bo0wler his first 6 quarters.

 

With McNabb, are the Eagles a Super Bowl caliber team?

 

You and I both know they're not. Not even close. The defense needs more playmakers, the O-line is the weakest it's been in over a decade.

 

Today, would McNabb be the best QB on the Eagles roster?

 

Better than Vick? Tough to tell. He looked pretty good. Better than Kolb? Sure, today he had better be. He's an experienced veteran vs a kid with two starts and a thrid game chopped up into halves. From what we've seen, Kolb doesn't look very good. Of course, we've not seen nearly as much as the guys who made the decision.

 

"Beloved loser" isn't really what a franchise is looking for from it's highest paid, highest profile player. Coming close but failing isn't either. As an Eagles fan, I've heard that mocking from folks all through McNabb's tenure. And yes, I'm a big McNabb fan. Defended him for years. But it was time for a very successful franchise to decide whether they wanted to tread water with McNabb due to age, injury, finances, etc, or try and continue to perform at a high level. They opted to try and move forward, and the time to make a judgement on whether they did the right thing is after a year or so, not 4 weeks.

 

And I pray to god that the Manning you're discussing is Eli. That would make it appear that you at least know a little about what you're talking about.

[Gepetto 1,478]

A couple questions:

 

How have the Bills fared post-Kelly? The Dolphins post-Marino?

 

It's almost impossible to have a QB ready when you decide that the spot belongs to someone until they're done with it. Green Bay had to force Favre out when Rodgers was ready, and he didn't look like a Pro Bo0wler his first 6 quarters.

 

With McNabb, are the Eagles a Super Bowl caliber team?

 

You and I both know they're not. Not even close. The defense needs more playmakers, the O-line is the weakest it's been in over a decade.

 

Today, would McNabb be the best QB on the Eagles roster?

 

Better than Vick? Tough to tell. He looked pretty good. Better than Kolb? Sure, today he had better be. He's an experienced veteran vs a kid with two starts and a thrid game chopped up into halves. From what we've seen, Kolb doesn't look very good. Of course, we've not seen nearly as much as the guys who made the decision.

 

"Beloved loser" isn't really what a franchise is looking for from it's highest paid, highest profile player. Coming close but failing isn't either. As an Eagles fan, I've heard that mocking from folks all through McNabb's tenure. And yes, I'm a big McNabb fan. Defended him for years. But it was time for a very successful franchise to decide whether they wanted to tread water with McNabb due to age, injury, finances, etc, or try and continue to perform at a high level. They opted to try and move forward, and the time to make a judgement on whether they did the right thing is after a year or so, not 4 weeks.

 

And I pray to god that the Manning you're discussing is Eli. That would make it appear that you at least know a little about what you're talking about.

 

You could have said the same thing about John Elway at age 34 and we all know how that turned out. Eagles loss here. Dumb move.

[mambokings 0]

everyone is writing off Kolb after not even 2 games as the starter. Even after Vick came in and did well, many people were still saying it was Kolb's job and it should at least take a couple games to lose it. Now with Vick hurt, you might as well give Kolb more than 1.5 games to decide if he sucks or not.

 

The problem is Kolb hasn't just looked a little green like someone who could use some experience. He has looked awful. Like Brady Quinn bad. He has demonstrated a lack of vision, no pocket presence, no leadership potential, no arm strength...but hey, at least he's been inaccurate! There's been absolutely nothing to suggest more time will help. Captain Checkdown needs to show the fans SOMEthing...ANYthing. Hell, scramble, take a big hit, get injured, and at least go down as a tough SoB. But nothing...nada...zilch. Did someone really ask if Matt Leinart was available?! That's how bad Kolb has looked.

[JT 137]

since you want to use insult words, here's my retort..

 

 

The only place Kolb can take them that McNabb hasn't, is a SB win, idiot. Hence my comment: Only if Kolb takes them to the promise land will that mistake be overlooked, but even then it will be a mistake that was made...

 

The latter part of that comment that is will stll be a mistake that was made is in reference to this: They could have kept McNabb another year or two, and properly groomed Kolb to take the job. But AR in his infinite wisdom believed that RIGHT NOW, Kolb was the better option. THat is clearly not the case. And to throw McNabb's 34 years out there is idiotic, and you know it is idiotic. He's not run down, getting hurt every other week or anything. THis is 2010 my man, soon to be 2011. QBs that play at a high level are more than capable of playing into their late 30s. I won't use Favre as an example because he is well outside the norm, but a bunch of the top qbs in the league right now are well into their 30s...

 

I don't have any horse in this race tbh. Jets fan here, am pretty much not a fan of anything philly. Don't care much for vick cuz I'm a huge animal lover, and find his actions despicable. And I could care less if Kolb turns out to be the next Joe Montana. I'm just making a simple statement that AR's move of getting rid of McNabb was an extremely stupid one because he didn't have a viable replacement to step up and move forward. The team they have has TOO much talent to try and play it like its a rebuilding year as well. Reid thought kolb could step in and get them winning games ASAP, and that is not the case, and will now be proven clearly since Vick is out for an indefinite time...

 

I'm amazed at how much you know about what Andy Reid thinks.

 

Vick looked pretty viable. And nobody that has any sense thought Kolb was going to step in at a Super Bowl caliber level. It rarely happens. Rodgers may be the best in the game, and he didn't, even after being groomed for years.

 

Please explain how you pay Kolb...who you've told is your guy of the future...and McNabb...who is a future HOF...through another contract cycle.

 

Too much talent for a rebuilding year? The defense is the weakest it's been in years, as is the O-line. You're a Jets fan. How would they look with a bad D and O-line? They'd look just about like they have for every year in recent memory except the last two.

 

As a fan, I'd much rather look at my team moving forward, than waiting for the day the last wheels fall off our beloved QB. The chance to pursue a ring...what every team is after...is infinitely more important than prepping people for their teary retirement speech.

[JT 137]

You could have said the same thing about John Elway at age 34 and we all know how that turned out. Eagles loss here. Dumb move.

 

Based on one example of a guy that had an all world RB dropped in his lap out of nowhere?

 

Not much of a sample size when there are dozens that reflect the other side of the story.

 

And when, before the discussion of this topic, was McNabb mentioned in the same breath as these guys, even by his staunchest supporters?

[TimmySmith 2,783]

It's about more than just receivers. Specifically, the defense isn't as good as it's been in the past.

This thought appears to be a theme throughout your posts. That is, that the Eagles had a confidence problem going into the season. Westbrook gone and a poorer defense led them to think that McNabb was expendable because they had no realistic shot. The rebuttal from the rest of us is that was ridiculous, wrong thinking by Reid. We can debate what might have been in his head, but there is no debate that he made a huge mistake.

[Gepetto 1,478]

Based on one example of a guy that had an all world RB dropped in his lap out of nowhere?

 

Not much of a sample size when there are dozens that reflect the other side of the story.

 

And when, before the discussion of this topic, was McNabb mentioned in the same breath as these guys, even by his staunchest supporters?

 

You're really going to use "not much of a sample size" as an argument when the keeping Kolb decision and shipping off McNabb is based on a very small sample of Kolb's play? Really?

 

It shouldn't even take the one example of Elway. All it should take is knowing McNabb was/is a top QB.

 

I'm the one comparing him to Elway. Elway went to multiple Championship games and SuperBowls but never won the SuperBowl for much of his career and his stats were not great either for much of the first part of his career. Yet Elway was a pro bowl QB for many years, just like McNabb.

 

McNabb was/is a top QB and the Eagle traded him away. They should have resigned him and kept the best players on the field. If their plan would have been to start Vick and trade McNabb, I would have agreed with that; but they lucked into Vick.

[p00h 85]

mcnabb is no brady or manning, or even elway, but he's a stud qb. Not an average qb. If he can put a couple of more years of above average production, he's is likely going into the HoF. He is that good. Trust me, you'll feel the 'never know what you've got till its gone' feeling soon, and it will last for a long time. If Kolb doesn't pan out, they will play the musical chair game with qbs in the draft, picking up FAs, etc. Having a stud qb is a greatest luxury in this league. And they threw it away for peanuts, in division to boot...

 

And his winning record is nothing to scoff at. How many qbs can claim they played in the SB. League championship games left and right. Are you kidding me??? He gave them a solid chance to get back into a championship hunt this year, they have very little chance without him. They completely stepped in ###### with the way Vick has performed, so a bit of it is being ignored, but if Kolb came in here with a 1-3 record, people would very quickly realize what they gave up in McNabb.

 

Take it from a yankees fan here. Getting to the playoffs is a huge thing. Even for yankees, who are expected to win every year. You can't always win, because there are a bunch of other teams that are there, and are there because they were good enough to get to the playoffs. What happens in the playoffs is a crap shoot in many regards, and expecially so in a 1 and done sport like football, but getting there is an accomplishment and is great for the fans. Speak to fans of teams that are never there, and ask them what they'd think of a qb that gets them to the playoffs year in and year out. They'd have built a gold statue of him outside 10 different parks in the league...

[Stewburtx8 67]

This thought appears to be a theme throughout your posts. That is, that the Eagles had a confidence problem going into the season. Westbrook gone and a poorer defense led them to think that McNabb was expendable because they had no realistic shot. The rebuttal from the rest of us is that was ridiculous, wrong thinking by Reid. We can debate what might have been in his head, but there is no debate that he made a huge mistake.

 

Trading McNabb wasn't a mistake. You can read anything I've posted in the past and you'll know I am a HUGE Donovan McNabb fan. I have never been a big Kevin Kolb fan. He was a "system QB" in college. A system that hasn't translated well to NFL success. But the mistake the Eagles made was trading back in 2007 and selecting Kevin Kolb in the 2nd round (their first pick of the draft). The pick didn't make sense at the time, and it still doesn't. Most people said the Eagles reached for Kolb, who was a complete project and unknown because of the system he played in college. This was a team 3 years removed from going to the Super Bowl, and a team who went 10-6 the previous season. Yes, McNabb had recent injury problems, but he was 30 years old and still playing at high level. You could of easily drafted a QB in the 4th, 5th, or 6th round as a similar long term project, and not wasted a high pick that could of been used elsewhere. When Andy Reid made the Kevin Kolb selection, everyone knew the Donovan McNabb era wouldn't last too much longer. You don't draft a QB that highly and not expect to give them an opportunity to succeed at some point.

 

2010 unfortunately was that point. Donovan was in the last year of his contract, same with Kolb. You weren't signing both of them. There was a market for Kevin Kolb out there (especially Tom Heckert in Cleveland who coveted him) and he wasn't going to resign for less money as a backup in Philly. So they had to make a choice. Do you hold on with Donovan McNabb, have no possible future replacement for him, and try to scratch out a few more playoff births, etc., or do you see what you have in Kevin Kolb. Unfortunately Kolb hasn't looked very good at all, but you still had to see what he could do in my opinion. This team wasn't a Super Bowl contender THIS year with Donovan McNabb. Yes, they might of been a playoff contender, but after years and years of going to the playoffs, this shouldn't be the goal. I still didn't WANT them to trade Mcnabb, but I knew it was the correct business decision. He is not Peyton Manning or Tom Brady. He is not the guy who is single handedly going to lead you to a Super Bowl. He was 34 years old and this team had too many deficiencies on the offensive line and the defense. Now trading him to a division rival was stupid, but the idea of trading him was not in my opinion. It's not like he is lighting the world on fire in Washington anyways..

 

I also am sick of so many non-Eagles fans who think that Angelo Cataldi, Howard Eskin, and many of their callers on 610 WIP represent ALL Eagles fans. This couldn't be furthur from the truth. Most REAL Eagles fans liked Donovan McNabb or at least appreciated everything he has done for the orginazation. This is why he got a standing ovation on Sunday before the game. It was great to see. But once the game started, he plays for the other team, therefore you should root against them.

 

And for several years I've been saying they need to fire Andy Reid as head coach. This has everything to do with his poor in game management (play calling, time management, in game decisions). Trading Donovan McNabb didn't change my opinion about him one bit. It's his coaching that is lacking, his personnel decisions have at least been average or above average most of the time.

[surferskin 31]

Hey, guys, the eagles totally know what they're doing here. They had to get rid of McNabb now that he's the wrong side of 30 and his injury history. That's why they're going to resign Michael Vick to replace him.

[The Next Generation 11]

LMAO at anyone suggesting the FANS ran McNabb out of town. That's just priceless. I do think the players had something to do with it, though. You know, the same ones you are saying are worthless with Kolb in there are the same ones that wanted Kolb in there and not McNabb. So, upper management, coach, and players are why McNabb got traded. But, don't let facts get in the way of bashing the fans for him getting traded.

[Stewburtx8 67]

LMAO at anyone suggesting the FANS ran McNabb out of town. That's just priceless. I do think the players had something to do with it, though. You know, the same ones you are saying are worthless with Kolb in there are the same ones that wanted Kolb in there and not McNabb. So, upper management, coach, and players are why McNabb got traded. But, don't let facts get in the way of bashing the fans for him getting traded.

 

 

Its like I said..Everyone thinks that 610 WIP represents ALL Eagles fans, which couldn't be furthur from the truth.

 

And yeah, when McNabb was on the Eagles roster, all you heard from non-Eagles fans was how he was inaccurate, had an injury history, and was overrated. Now that they traded him, he is a top QB and it was a stupid move.

[surferskin 31]

LMAO at anyone suggesting the FANS ran McNabb out of town. That's just priceless. I do think the players had something to do with it, though. You know, the same ones you are saying are worthless with Kolb in there are the same ones that wanted Kolb in there and not McNabb. So, upper management, coach, and players are why McNabb got traded. But, don't let facts get in the way of bashing the fans for him getting traded.

 

Yeah, it's a good idea to let Desean Jackson make your personnel decisions.

[surferskin 31]

Its like I said..Everyone thinks that 610 WIP represents ALL Eagles fans, which couldn't be furthur from the truth.

 

And yeah, when McNabb was on the Eagles roster, all you heard from non-Eagles fans was how he was inaccurate, had an injury history, and was overrated. Now that they traded him, he is a top QB and it was a stupid move.

 

Our plan worked perfectly. We talked him down for so many years that we tricked you into trading him to us at a discount and now you're left holding a bag of sh1t named Kevin Kolb.

 

[The Next Generation 11]

Yeah, it's a good idea to let Desean Jackson make your personnel decisions.

 

Yes, that's EXACTLY what I said. DJax decided McNabb had to go, so he's gone. Nice...

[TimHauck 3,431]

This thought appears to be a theme throughout your posts. That is, that the Eagles had a confidence problem going into the season. Westbrook gone and a poorer defense led them to think that McNabb was expendable because they had no realistic shot. The rebuttal from the rest of us is that was ridiculous, wrong thinking by Reid. We can debate what might have been in his head, but there is no debate that he made a huge mistake.

 

Confidence problem? You basically said it in your post, it was more like realism. As stewburt just said, yes they would've been a playoff contender with McNabb, but in reality they would not have been a legitimate SB contender.

 

mcnabb is no brady or manning, or even elway, but he's a stud qb. Not an average qb. If he can put a couple of more years of above average production, he's is likely going into the HoF. He is that good. Trust me, you'll feel the 'never know what you've got till its gone' feeling soon, and it will last for a long time. If Kolb doesn't pan out, they will play the musical chair game with qbs in the draft, picking up FAs, etc. Having a stud qb is a greatest luxury in this league. And they threw it away for peanuts, in division to boot...

 

Take it from a yankees fan here. Getting to the playoffs is a huge thing. Even for yankees, who are expected to win every year. You can't always win, because there are a bunch of other teams that are there, and are there because they were good enough to get to the playoffs. What happens in the playoffs is a crap shoot in many regards, and expecially so in a 1 and done sport like football, but getting there is an accomplishment and is great for the fans. Speak to fans of teams that are never there, and ask them what they'd think of a qb that gets them to the playoffs year in and year out. They'd have built a gold statue of him outside 10 different parks in the league...

 

Even if McNabb still is a stud QB (which is debatable), how many years does he realistically have left of being one? Not many IMO, so it wasn't worth it to give him an extension when you'd have to sign Kolb as well, who they thought was the future of the team. Which is why I don't know why everyone keeps using terms like the Eagles "threw him away," when all they did was trade him in the last year of his contract, in a year where even with McNabb, it wasn't very likely that they'd be able to win the SB. If McNabb is still so great, why didn't he all the sudden make the Redskins into a SB contender? They have some decent receivers and a team fairly similar to the Eagles.

 

Are you seriously trying to say that as a Yankee fan, you're happy just to get into the playoffs? Come on now. As a Phillies fan, I was ecstatic when they made the playoffs in 2007. But after back-to-back WS trips and 4 straight division titles, just making it to the playoffs doesn't sound as great as it did less than 5 years ago. Same for the Eagles. Before McNabb, they were awful. So when he started leading them to the playoffs and NFC Championship games, it was great. But after consistently getting there, and not much farther, you want them to be able to take the next step. But McNabb couldn't do it.