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Official Super Bowl Thread: Eagles v Chiefs

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1 minute ago, AxeElf said:

He averaged 10 yards per catch (caught 13 of 14 targets)

Dude, that's the point exactly. You yourself can put up numbers in that offense, anyone can. 

They always plug JAGS in 

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2 hours ago, AxeElf said:

First of all, saying "he's just a just a guy" is stupid.

Secondly. saying he's "just a guy" is stupid.

He averaged 10 yards per catch (caught 13 of 14 targets) and 5.0 yards per carry on 207 totes, which tied him for 11th in the NFL with Rhamondre Stevenson and Nick Chubb, and which was more than other JAGs like Josh Jacobs, Christian McCaffrey, Saquon Barkley and Derrick Henry.

Pacheco will continue to be the feature back on into the future.

I didnt look at the stats.   the eye test did enough for me.  I liked the way he ran, broke tackles.  his vision was pretty good too.

with a good line and good OC this guy can play and be productive in the NFL.   I've no doubt of that.

what I dont know about is whether he can play behind a crappy line.   I suspect hed be okay due to his ability to break tackles but I dont know if the overall skillset is consistently good enough to overcome a bad line.

luckily, that is not the scenario here.  hes running behind a line that is at least average and probably above average.   in KC I think the kid is fine.

 

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3 hours ago, League Champion said:

Dude, that's the point exactly. You yourself can put up numbers in that offense, anyone can. 

They always plug JAGS in 

I appreciate the vote of confidence, but I'm not sure I could have caught 13 of 14 passes from Mahomes this season--and I'm pretty sure I wouldn't have averaged 5 yards per carry had they handed me the ball over 200 times.

You'll excuse me if I don't take you seriously after that bit of analysis.

 

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1 hour ago, AxeElf said:

I appreciate the vote of confidence, but I'm not sure I could have caught 13 of 14 passes from Mahomes this season--and I'm pretty sure I wouldn't have averaged 5 yards per carry had they handed me the ball over 200 times.

You'll excuse me if I don't take you seriously after that bit of analysis.

 

the line in KC is decent.  but not so good that a shmo could own it.

The titans line  up until last year and the cowboys line when Zeke was young were the kind of lines where you and I could have put up stats running behind.  Quite often the hole the line opened was the size of a Mac Truck.

KC's line wasnt THAT dominant in terms of run blocking.   Not surprising.  the line is built to protect their all star QB more than it is to run the ball.   (as it should be) 

Bottom line: you still need some skill at RB to make the run game work here.

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7 hours ago, Ray_T said:

Bottom line: you still need some skill at RB

Absolutely, which every player in the NFL has skill, including JAGS. That's why they're there. 

But it's a lot easier to do when your behind Mahomes who can keep a defense honest. 

Let's put Pacheco behind a crappy QB/O-Line and see how that goes. It won't go well. He's nothing special. 

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3 hours ago, League Champion said:

Absolutely, which every player in the NFL has skill, including JAGS. That's why they're there. 

But it's a lot easier to do when your behind Mahomes who can keep a defense honest. 

Let's put Pacheco behind a crappy QB/O-Line and see how that goes. It won't go well. He's nothing special. 

Like I said, we dont know how he would do because we have not seen him in that situation.

as mentioned earlier, I like his tackle breaking ability.  that part of his game is pretty good.   his vision seems to be above average too so there is a chance hed be ok behind a poor line.   but I cannot say for sure.

keep in mind he will continue to develop as a player over the next while.  So I do think there is some upside.

That said,  for KC's purposes I think he is now the starter.   whether he hangs onto the job long term is largely up to him.   Now that KC has won another superbowl, there will be salary pressure as everyone will want to sign their free agents.   so the team will lose some talent come free agency time.

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Mahomes is of course the key to KC success, I don’t think they need a true rb1, I think they will continue with rotating their Rbs based on situations during the flow of games.   

I don’t believe they have currently a true rb1 on the roster they have very good situational Rbs that works.  

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Pacheco reminds me of Demarco Murray.  Runs upright, so he'll take a beating.  Kind of straight line runner, but has a lot of power.  A little tightness in the hips so his cuts aren't as explosive as a guy like Tony Pollard, so he looks slower than he is.

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11 minutes ago, nobody said:

Pacheco reminds me of Demarco Murray.  Runs upright, so he'll take a beating.  Kind of straight line runner, but has a lot of power.  A little tightness in the hips so his cuts aren't as explosive as a guy like Tony Pollard, so he looks slower than he is.

That's a pretty good comparison. He's perfectly fine, he's just not special. Some in here are labeling him a stud, that's just silly. 

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Pacheco will be #1 heading into next year. Mckinnon is a free agent, and it sounds like they have seen enough of CEH (although he's still under contract and would need to find a suitor and cut their losses), so I imagine RB will be a position the Chiefs must address in either re-signing their own, through free agency or via the draft.  Lots of options on the free agent front so this isn't a position I'd be worried about.  Receiver is a much bigger question for the Chiefs.

https://www.fftoday.com/nfl/freeagents.php?o=1&PosID=20

With JuJu and Hardman free agents, you're basically looking at a WR room of:

1. Toney

2. Valdez-Scantling

3. Moore

4. John Ross (signed this year on a futres contract

And the free agent receiver pool is crap:

https://www.fftoday.com/nfl/freeagents.php?o=1&PosID=30

 

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1 minute ago, cmh6476 said:

With JuJu and Hardman free agents, you're basically looking at a WR room of:

1. Toney

2. Valdez-Scantling

3. Moore

4. John Ross (signed this year on a futres contract

I ultimately think that Moore will be the WR to own there 

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Just now, League Champion said:

I ultimately think that Moore will be the WR to own there 

It's just extremely risky relying on a oft-injured wideout, a second year guy, MVS who disappears in games and a guy who was drafted before Mahomes but never panned out.

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Just now, cmh6476 said:

It's just extremely risky relying on a oft-injured wideout, a second year guy, MVS who disappears in games and a guy who was drafted before Mahomes but never panned out.

Moore was really underutilized but you know how Andy feels about rookie WRs. 

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20 minutes ago, League Champion said:

That's a pretty good comparison. He's perfectly fine, he's just not special. Some in here are labeling him a stud, that's just silly. 

Exactly.  

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IF, and I know its a huge IF, Toney could stay relatively healthy he would be the WR1 in KC.  Andy showed a lot of faith in game planning him into the offense when he was healthy.  He has the juice to be a big contributor in that offense.  Lot's of young guys have started out labeled injury prone and proven the opposite as they became veteran WR.    

Wouldn't surprise me if they resigned Mecole either, both sides giving each other a break on a team friendly deal.    

One thing to look out for is KC drafting a TE like Musgrave or Kincaid (my favorite).  KC ran 12 & 13 personnel nearly 40% (combined) of the time this season.....Kelce isn't getting younger....Noah is solid TE2 but doesn't have the ceiling of a guy like Dalton.  

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1 hour ago, League Champion said:

That's a pretty good comparison. He's perfectly fine, he's just not special. Some in here are labeling him a stud, that's just silly. 

I was not labelling him a stud.   I just said he was more than a JAG.    Stud implies top 3 to top 5 numbers.    I dont know that he will be that. 

but I am saying hes at least a legit starter in this league.

I dont see the Chiefs trying to find a better RB because at this point it does not seem to be a problem.   likely they really just need to fill holes vacated by free agents.  I could see them letting go of CEH and bringing in someone to develop or someone cheaper to backup Pacheco.  I suspect what they are paying CEH may be steep if hes not gonna start.  I think hes slated to make around 5.5 Mil if they keep him.

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