Does hell exist?

[Frozenbeernuts 2,251]

4 minutes ago, Maximum Overkill said:

I agree to an extent. God is the vacuum that created this whole mess. But at the same time our energy has to go somewhere when we die as quantum physics suggests, but where? Certainly not a heaven or hell, that's for the uneducated to debate. 

Reality Transurfing talks about pendulums that absorb our energy. It's a gigantic cycle really. We absorb energy from earth, food, and atmosphere. It then gets spent physically and mentally. Eventually that gets cycled back

[seafoam1 3,015]

20 hours ago, jerryskids said:

I don't understand what you are saying here.  Can you explain? 

Here on Earth we are broken into multiple viewpoints. One's of physical science, medicine, religion, philosophy, math, language, biology, psychology, parapsychology, astrology, etc...

All in all, this is our collective brain as people of Earth. We can pick a topic or two and formulate opinions. Even some facts. But only as we know it. And that's all. Only as we know it. Which is fine for justifying our lives and to make things less burdensome. That's a self protection from the fear of the unknown. But we also don't want to fear the unknown simply because we really don't know the truth. That would be destructive. 

So we find confidence in something, some belief that fits our level of mental health. 

People who believe in Hell are no different than people who don't believe in Hell, or Heaven, or God. It's ALL based on not knowing. 

But our minds and life experiences tell us differently. Because we need our minds to make some sense of things that fit who we are so we can self preserve our sanity. 

Anyway, my point was you are seeing things the way you do because that is how you built your life. It works for you. And I would say that IS truth for you. But it's not the truth for everyone necessarily. And the biggest point to be made, is that it's only one subsection of one tiny planet in one tiny solar system that is in no way necessarily even remotely close to what could be understood in other realms of life out there. 

But if it works, why not? 

[jerryskids 6,790]

1 hour ago, seafoam1 said:

Here on Earth we are broken into multiple viewpoints. One's of physical science, medicine, religion, philosophy, math, language, biology, psychology, parapsychology, astrology, etc...

All in all, this is our collective brain as people of Earth. We can pick a topic or two and formulate opinions. Even some facts. But only as we know it. And that's all. Only as we know it. Which is fine for justifying our lives and to make things less burdensome. That's a self protection from the fear of the unknown. But we also don't want to fear the unknown simply because we really don't know the truth. That would be destructive. 

So we find confidence in something, some belief that fits our level of mental health. 

People who believe in Hell are no different than people who don't believe in Hell, or Heaven, or God. It's ALL based on not knowing. 

But our minds and life experiences tell us differently. Because we need our minds to make some sense of things that fit who we are so we can self preserve our sanity. 

Anyway, my point was you are seeing things the way you do because that is how you built your life. It works for you. And I would say that IS truth for you. But it's not the truth for everyone necessarily. And the biggest point to be made, is that it's only one subsection of one tiny planet in one tiny solar system that is in no way necessarily even remotely close to what could be understood in other realms of life out there. 

But if it works, why not? 

I would ask you to go back and re-read the post you originally quoted, because I cannot see how you drew this conclusion from what I said.  If anything, I told Horseman that he is (to summarize what you just said) viewing things through his world view, not some irrefutable facts.

[jerryskids 6,790]

I'm currently listening to a Freakonomics podcast about Richard Feynman, who most would agree was a pretty smart guy.  Mostly, I've learned, he was very inquisitive.  From the transcript of the show:

Quote

There’s something going on with Feynman and the edge of the continent. I mean, he grew up on Far Rockaway, and he’s got two beaches there — he’s got the ocean side, and he’s got the lagoon side. And then you get to California, you’re staring into infinity. You know, you’re at the edge. So I think Feynman liked being at the edge, boundaries between land and water, the boundary between consciousness and unconsciousness, the boundary between understanding something and not quite understanding something. And I think he knew that you find out the most interesting things when you’re poking around the edges.

All that poking had proved fruitful for Richard Feynman. In 1965, he won a Nobel Prize for his work in quantum electrodynamics, which helped deepen our foundational understanding of how light and matter interact. Earlier in his career, he’d helped create the first nuclear weapons, as part of the Manhattan Project; he’d even made contributions to biology. His work intersected with the widespread embrace and application of scientific thinking over the course of the 20th century. But this also included a variety of practices that Feynman thought of as junk science. Things like faith healing and mind-reading, even some practices within psychology and psychiatry. But Feynman also believed in challenging assumptions, even his own — with data if possible, or at least intense observation. “First, I started out by investigating various ideas of mysticism and mystic experiences,” he wrote. “I went into isolation tanks and got many hours of hallucinations … Then I went to Esalen, which is a hotbed of this kind of thought.” So Feynman began going to Esalen as something of a skeptic — but he had always been interested in just how flexible and versatile the human mind can be, if you just let it.

I'm not putting myself anywhere near the level of Feynman, but this is how I feel about investigating this topic.  

Others, perhaps smarter than Feynman, know better than him it seems.   

This is the episode, which is #3 in the series. 

https://freakonomics.com/podcast/the-vanishing-mr-feynman/

You can back out and go to #1 if you want to listen to the whole thing (which doesn't talk about these topics).  

[seafoam1 3,015]

6 minutes ago, jerryskids said:

I would ask you to go back and re-read the post you originally quoted, because I cannot see how you drew this conclusion from what I said.  If anything, I told Horseman that he is (to summarize what you just said) viewing things through his world view, not some irrefutable facts.

I don't know his stance on things when it comes to God. And maybe I misunderstood yours. Not sure.  I haven't read all the posts so that's my bad. I'm just stating how I see it. I believe in God/Heaven/Hell and the possibility of just about anything underneath God. But one thing I am pretty sure of is those who don't believe in Heaven or Hell, well, all I can say is there is a Heaven and Hell in everyone's makeup, no matter what they want to label them as. Afterlife will come for all and we will know then I'm guessing. 

[Fnord 2,259]

I've gotta say bravo to those posting in this thread. We've got 4 pages of really interesting discussions going on, where most of us are not being judgmental or demeaning while sharing their thoughts and beliefs. I'm really enjoying reading Horseman's thoughts, and even seafoam is making positive contributions. I really appreciate that, especially among posters normally at each other's throats. Thanks everyone!

[jerryskids 6,790]

21 minutes ago, Fnord said:

I've gotta say bravo to those posting in this thread. We've got 4 pages of really interesting discussions going on, where most of us are not being judgmental or demeaning while sharing their thoughts and beliefs. I'm really enjoying reading Horseman's thoughts, and even seafoam is making positive contributions. I really appreciate that, especially among posters normally at each other's throats. Thanks everyone!

Fock off, doosh. 

[jerryskids 6,790]

20 hours ago, Horseman said:

Using data collected by Kepler Space Observatory 22% of the solar stars in our galaxy have an earth sized plant in the habitable zone. (That's 22% times at least 200 billion just in our galaxy) There are somewhere around one trillion galaxies is the observable universe.  

The moon doesnt have a necessary role for life to have developed on our planet. 

How fast, relatively, life developed on earth has most scientists agreeing it's highly likely we arent the only ones. We're still trying to prove/disprove life possibly happening on Mars for fok sake.  

Every single animal dont create the ecosystem for themselves.  Natural selection and evolution more than adequately explain what you are trying to say.  

Oceans arent perfectly performing.  

There are a ton of intelligent species on our planet. Good grief.   

 

May I suggest some Carl Segan or Neal Degrasse videos?  

I believe there is lots of life on other planets, but I'm a little more skeptical about how advanced it is.  The moon for instance, while not critical for the creation of life, keeps us at a 23 degree angle wrt the sun, which along with other things like our atmosphere, keeps our temperature remarkably constant.  Also our planet is thought to be relatively old, and billions of years were spent with basically lichen as life on land.  So we may be at the forefront of such developments throughout the universe.

Speaking of lichen, I took a class yesterday on ground biota in the desert.  Lichen is fascinating (a symbiotic/parasitic relationship between basically algae (photobiont) and fungus (mycobiont)) but not relevant for this.  What is relevant is "rock varnish," this weird stuff that is very prevalent but we don't quite understand.  It seems to come from very slow growing microbes which "eat" manganese and iron.  Anyway, there are some photos of rocks on Mars which look a lot like rock varnish.  The hope is eventually to get a sample back to earth.  Scientists are not 100% sure that the microbes are required to generate it, but if they can reach that conclusion... that would prove life on Mars.

This link calls it "earth varnish".

https://earthsky.org/space/purple-rocks-mars-perseverance-rover-desert-varnish/

[Fnord 2,259]

33 minutes ago, jerryskids said:

Fock off, doosh. 

Perfect response. Well done.

[IGotWorms 4,058]

On 2/19/2024 at 6:29 PM, Frozenbeernuts said:

Exactly

The odds of the

Sun being perfect for a planet with life

The Earth being the perfect distance from the sun

The moon being perfect size and distance for the earth

Life forming on the planet at all

Every single animal creating a perfectly balanced ecosystem

The ocean currents perfectly forming

Then on top of life actually forming, one of the species turns out to be intelligent

All by accident?

Theres eleventy billion stars in the universe.

Yes, this was bound to happen by accident.

Probably on many other planets too!  

[seafoam1 3,015]

38 minutes ago, IGotWorms said:

Theres eleventy billion stars in the universe.

Yes, this was bound to happen by accident.

Probably on many other planets too!  

We all get it. You were an accident. A true mistake. Everyone knows. 

[Maximum Overkill 1,985]

1 hour ago, IGotWorms said:

Theres eleventy billion stars in the universe.

Yes, this was bound to happen by accident.

Probably on many other planets too!  

Agree, we'd be fools to believe it could only happen once. 

[Voltaire 5,315]

15 hours ago, jerryskids said:

I'm currently listening to a Freakonomics podcast about Richard Feynman, who most would agree was a pretty smart guy.  Mostly, I've learned, he was very inquisitive.  From the transcript of the show:

I'm not putting myself anywhere near the level of Feynman, but this is how I feel about investigating this topic.  

Others, perhaps smarter than Feynman, know better than him it seems.   

This is the episode, which is #3 in the series. 

https://freakonomics.com/podcast/the-vanishing-mr-feynman/

You can back out and go to #1 if you want to listen to the whole thing (which doesn't talk about these topics).  

I love Feynman. Anything he did was educational and entertaining.  I seldom have time for things anymore but I'll find it for this... if I remember.

[TBayXXXVII 2,544]

On 2/18/2024 at 8:14 PM, cyclone24 said:

Give me one piece of ACTUAL evidence of a heaven or hell without using the bible. 

Evidence of heaven... Florida/Texas

Evidence of hell... California/NY