Buying a House vs Renting

[IGotWorms 4,058]

1 minute ago, mmmmm...beer said:

Just put it in a growth account and don't sell it.

Gotta sell it someday, no?

[seafoam1 3,023]

13 minutes ago, IGotWorms said:

I do all of that and I own my home. Nobody can tell me what to do in it, either. Jesus I couldn’t imagine having a landlord at my station in life.

And I don’t know where you’re coming up with your $400k number. It’s sort of irrelevant though. Let’s say it was only $400k. When I’m done paying my mortgage that’s $400k more that I have than you, dumbass

You said it's worth 400k. 

And just because you say "I do all that", it doesn't mean you are worth more. You are so stupid. 

[mmmmm...beer 807]

2 minutes ago, IGotWorms said:

Where you living in the meanwhile?

You’re paying for housing costs either way.

And when you rent, you’re paying more because all the costs of ownership and usage have to be accounted for plus profit to the landlord.

Now you can rent a sh1tty place and save money there. Of course you could also buy a sh1tty house

Not nessicerily bro... you really have to crunch ALL the numbers.  Many times it's a break even...

With 7-8% interest rates not so much.

[BeachGuy23 642]

5 minutes ago, mmmmm...beer said:

I think his point is... after you've paid $550k for your $400k mortgage.

Justt throwing excess money from renting into a S& P500 account averaging over 11% for the last 75 years it would be a ton more than the 400k house in the 30 year mortgage lifespan.

Your aware houses appreciate right?  So that $400k house he paid $550k for he sells for $1M.

Peafoam paid the same $550k (likely more since you have to build in landlord profit) and  has nothing to show for it at the end.

Home ownership trumps renting for a term longer than a year or two.

[mmmmm...beer 807]

5 minutes ago, IGotWorms said:

Where you living in the meanwhile?

On base in a free house!!! Muahahahaah!!!!

[seafoam1 3,023]

wormy is locked into single-path thinking. That is a poor way to go along in life. 

[Maximum Overkill 1,988]

Just now, BeachGuy23 said:

Home ownership trumps renting for a term longer than a year or two.

You are correct Sir, however there are some bad investments out there as well. You gotta know what you're doing. 

[Maximum Overkill 1,988]

Just now, mmmmm...beer said:

On base in a free house!!! Muahahahaah!!!!

Been there Brother. I'll fill you in on the secret if interested 

[seafoam1 3,023]

1 minute ago, BeachGuy23 said:

Your aware houses appreciate right?  So that $400k house he paid $550k for he sells for $1M.

Peafoam paid the same $550k (likely more since you have to build in landlord profit) and  has nothing to show for it at the end.

Home ownership trumps renting for a term longer than a year or two.

Another golden showers angry liberal nutjob... 

It's so fun to dominate their minds. 

[seafoam1 3,023]

3 minutes ago, Maximum Overkill said:

You are correct Sir, however there are some bad investments out there as well. You gotta know what you're doing. 

Do you all think a person can't make more in investments than buying a home? That's naive. 

And think of living life. Being mobile when desired. 

[mmmmm...beer 807]

6 minutes ago, IGotWorms said:

Gotta sell it someday, no?

If you sell within a year it's short term cap gains... which is like 40%.  If you hold it over a year it's long term... which is really about your current tax bracket.

That being said... use it as a retirement account.  Let that thing grow... when you need... start drawing... $1k...$2k a month.

In the meantime.. VOOG or SCHG are over +15% average return since inception with low low fees.

[Maximum Overkill 1,988]

Just now, seafoam1 said:

Do you all think a person can't make more in investments than buying a home? 

 

All depends on the investment. You can make money anywhere when you're right. 

[mmmmm...beer 807]

9 minutes ago, BeachGuy23 said:

Your aware houses appreciate right?  So that $400k house he paid $550k for he sells for $1M.

Peafoam paid the same $550k (likely more since you have to build in landlord profit) and  has nothing to show for it at the end.

Home ownership trumps renting for a term longer than a year or two.

Oh for sure... also... depending on how old you are... 2008... several of my buddies were absolutely upside down in their house... hundreds of thousands.  Took a decade to make it up. 

[Maximum Overkill 1,988]

1 minute ago, mmmmm...beer said:

2008... several of my buddies were absolutely upside down in their house... hundreds of thousands.  Took a decade to make it up

That's when you double up and make a fortune. I was buying in 2008 

[seafoam1 3,023]

2 minutes ago, Maximum Overkill said:

All depends on the investment. You can make money anywhere when you're right. 

You can be wrong in the housing market too. Plus it's not a diverse approach and you are anchored to that location. 

If you need a morgage instead of paying cash, that's a long term buy in that you can't maximise if your life advances in other directions. 

[mmmmm...beer 807]

Listen I'm not saying buying a house is horrible, all I'm saying is I'm seeing more and more people with a lot of money say they'll never own a home.

I came from nothing... riding on the coat tails  of smarter people.  I'm still learning.

There are many avenues I've seen.  There is no perfect way for everyone.

I've bought and sold 4 houses, and maybe haven't seen my last. All I'm saying is I'm doing research.

[mmmmm...beer 807]

13 minutes ago, Maximum Overkill said:

Been there Brother. I'll fill you in on the secret if interested 

I like secrets:

[IGotWorms 4,058]

21 minutes ago, seafoam1 said:

You said it's worth 400k. 

And just because you say "I do all that", it doesn't mean you are worth more. You are so stupid. 

I’m sure I didn’t, because that’s false.

I do have about $400k in equity right now so maybe that’s what I said and what you mean? But that’s a different matter

[Maximum Overkill 1,988]

Just now, mmmmm...beer said:

I like secrets:

A wise Man guided me early. 

He told me to live on base, take ever penny I have and buy my first rental property outside the gates. Then rent that out to incoming GIs.

Use that income and do it again when you get transferred, then again and again. I did. 

I had houses in numerous States and 2 different Countries. Mailbox money  

I retired off those properties and re-invested a ton. 

Good luck!! 

[IGotWorms 4,058]

22 minutes ago, mmmmm...beer said:

Not nessicerily bro... you really have to crunch ALL the numbers.  Many times it's a break even...

With 7-8% interest rates not so much.

It’s really very unlikely that renting is better long term.

Like I said before, if you’re not sticking around that’s different.

But if we’re talking 30 years on a mortgage or 30 years renting it would have to be a very bizarre market situation where renting came out ahead.

The simple reason is that the landlord has to recover all their costs from you and get some profit on top. They’re not renting it to you at a loss if they can help it, obviously. And even if they’ve got it fully paid off, that doesn’t mean they drop the rents, it just means even more profit.

So unless you’re getting a sweetheart deal from your mom or something, all else being equal, you’re almost definitely going to be better off having a fully paid-for asset at the end of your mortgage term than pissing away rent money for nothing in the end.

[IGotWorms 4,058]

33 minutes ago, seafoam1 said:

Do you all think a person can't make more in investments than buying a home? That's naive. 

And think of living life. Being mobile when desired. 

You always say this and it ignores that you can do both.

Let me make it real simple for you.

Let’s say you’ve got $2,000 budgeted for housing and $1,000 budgeted for other investments each month.

You:

- $2,000 on rent over 30 years = $0 at end 

- $1,000 on investments (let’s say 10% rate of return using s&p 500) = $2 million

Me:

- $2,000 on a mortgage over 30 years = $1.2 million (assuming $400k house at national average of 3.8% appreciation per year)

- $1,000 on investments (let’s say 10% rate of return using s&p 500) = $2 million

 

Total for you = $2 million

Total for me = $3.2 million

 
Hey $2 million isn’t horrible, but I win.

[wiffleball 4,790]

Given the plethora of things that can go wrong, coupled with relatively inexpensive stock, I think you're far better off renting a horse instead of buying one.

[seafoam1 3,023]

5 minutes ago, IGotWorms said:

You always say this and it ignores that you can do both.

Let me make it real simple for you.

Let’s say you’ve got $2,000 budgeted for housing and $1,000 budgeted for other investments each month.

You:

- $2,000 on rent over 30 years = $0 at end 

- $1,000 on investments (let’s say 10% rate of return using s&p 500) = $2 million

Me:

- $2,000 on a mortgage over 30 years = $1.2 million (assuming $400k house at national average of 3.8% appreciation per year)

- $1,000 on investments (let’s say 10% rate of return using s&p 500) = $2 million

 

Total for you = $2 million

Total for me = $3.2 million

 
Hey $2 million isn’t horrible, but I win.

False. You factor investments in stocks like you factor your home costs. Meaning you don't. Plus. I don't want a home. We have moved all over rhe country and into Canada because our jobs allow it and because we wan't to. If we kept buying and selling homes, it's a net loss. I've noted this many times before. And you suck at numbers.

[edjr 6,584]

15 hours ago, LaChup said:

ummmm......prices

 

I bought in 2015, was a great time to buy. you lie or your family is poor.

[edjr 6,584]

renting will never, nor ever be a better long term option.

[TimHauck 2,870]

3 hours ago, iam90sbaby said:

$4,500 a month if we keep letting in third world scum

Why, will the third world scum be scooping up all the $3,500 a month rentals, dumbazz?

[Maximum Overkill 1,988]

2 minutes ago, TimHauck said:

Why, will the third world scum be scooping up all the $3,500 a month rentals, dumbazz?

No, but they will drive up the market. Do you believe that millions of more people thrown into the real estate market will lower prices? 

[mmmmm...beer 807]

The market is all being falsely driven up by Blackrock, Vanguard, and the like right now.

[TimHauck 2,870]

2 minutes ago, Maximum Overkill said:

No, but they will drive up the market. Do you believe that millions of more people thrown into the real estate market will lower prices? 

Considering they’re likely also providing low cost labor to build more housing, maybe (SUPPLY and demand, right?).  And many of them aren’t even “in the market” anyway.

More people that want to live in a $700 a month 2 bedroom apartment isn’t going to make @mmmmm...beer’s rent $3,500, stop

[IGotWorms 4,058]

35 minutes ago, seafoam1 said:

False. You factor investments in stocks like you factor your home costs. Meaning you don't. Plus. I don't want a home. We have moved all over rhe country and into Canada because our jobs allow it and because we wan't to. If we kept buying and selling homes, it's a net loss. I've noted this many times before. And you suck at numbers.

Ok well the home costs probably aren’t going to be $1.2 million, yes?

Your point on moving is the only good one you’ve made. That’s a different situation if you aren’t sticking around.

Go ahead and attack my math if you’d like. Admittedly it’s not my strong suit but I think you’ll flail around anyways 

[IGotWorms 4,058]

27 minutes ago, TimHauck said:

Why, will the third world scum be scooping up all the $3,500 a month rentals, dumbazz?

Scum that can drop $42k per year on rent. More than my housing costs, even!

Guess I’m super poor  

[Maximum Overkill 1,988]

1 hour ago, mmmmm...beer said:

I like secrets:

How long have you been living on base?? You should have money stockpiled. 

A few deployments is enough for a huge down payment on something. 

[seafoam1 3,023]

46 minutes ago, IGotWorms said:

Scum that can drop $42k per year on rent. More than my housing costs, even!

Guess I’m super poor  

42k a year on rent. 

Go ahead and dream you are doing better in life than those who know what they are doing. 

[BeachGuy23 642]

1 minute ago, seafoam1 said:

42k a year on rent. 

Go ahead and dream you are doing better in life than those who know what they are doing. 

How much is your rent Peafoam?  You’ve mentioned multiple times it’s less than taxes.  Give us a general monthly number.

[Maximum Overkill 1,988]

1 hour ago, TimHauck said:

want to live in a $700 a month 2 bedroom

No such thing anymore. Unless they're on Welfare. And they probably are.

Hell, my HOA fees are almost 700 a month. 

[Jose M 125]

1 hour ago, IGotWorms said:

You always say this and it ignores that you can do both.

Let me make it real simple for you.

Let’s say you’ve got $2,000 budgeted for housing and $1,000 budgeted for other investments each month.

You:

- $2,000 on rent over 30 years = $0 at end 

- $1,000 on investments (let’s say 10% rate of return using s&p 500) = $2 million

Me:

- $2,000 on a mortgage over 30 years = $1.2 million (assuming $400k house at national average of 3.8% appreciation per year)

- $1,000 on investments (let’s say 10% rate of return using s&p 500) = $2 million

 

Total for you = $2 million

Total for me = $3.2 million

 
Hey $2 million isn’t horrible, but I win.

If you have to move every couple of years like Seafoam does your closing costs just ate up every bit of the appreciation.

And you forgot the $270,000 in property taxes, plus $60,000 in insurance, plus $60,000 in maintenance and $550,000 in interest (7%) you paid over those 30 years. If you say that's all included in your $2000 then you're not comparing apples to apples.  Does Seafoam's rent include utilities and landscaping, if so tack on some more. 

Look, I am a homeowner.  I own two homes right now.   But this is a very "depends on your situation" math problem.   For me it makes sense because I have the luxury of not paying any interest and can move long term to where the property tax is very low.  Seafoam probably doesn't have those advantages.  

I look at my properties as part of my investment portfolio.  But I suggest most people like you don't and not just because you don't understand the math, but also because when you cash in your home for 1.2 million - guess what - you need to find a place to live.  It's not as simple as saying you're ahead the value of your property.

[BeachGuy23 642]

2 minutes ago, seafoam1 said:

Another pee boyo. Happy golden showers to you beachgay. Tell generalpimpledoosh and mdcack "hi" as you all swim in it.

So you’re just lying once again Peafoam.

Its not a very hard question to answer, so there’s a reason you won’t answer it.

[BeachGuy23 642]

2 minutes ago, Jose M said:

If you have to move every couple of years like Seafoam does your closing costs just ate up every bit of the appreciation.

And you forgot the $270,000 in property taxes, plus $60,000 in insurance, plus $60,000 in maintenance and $550,000 in interest (7%) you paid over those 30 years. If you say that's all included in your $2000 then you're not comparing apples to apples.  Does Seafoam's rent include utilities and landscaping, if so tack on some more. 

Look, I am a homeowner.  I own two homes right now.   But this is a very "depends on your situation" math problem.   For me it makes sense because I have the luxury of not paying any interest and can move long term to where the property tax is very low.  Seafoam probably doesn't have those advantages.  

I look at my properties as part of my investment portfolio.  But I suggest most people like you don't and not just because you don't understand the math, but also because when you cash in your home for 1.2 million - guess what - you need to find a place to live.  It's not as simple as saying you're ahead the value of your property.

Taxes and upkeep are all included in rent.

And everyone has said if you move a lot renting is better.   But please, how often did Peafoam physically move from 25-50?

And then you forget that when the mortgage is paid off you have a very cheap place to live and a way to massively increase your investments.  Poor Peafoam is dropping thousands month after month till he dies.

Terrible money management. 

[TimHauck 2,870]

1 hour ago, IGotWorms said:

Scum that can drop $42k per year on rent. More than my housing costs, even!

Guess I’m super poor  

I assume their argument is that higher demand for low-rent housing is driving up rents at all levels, but it doesn’t work like that.

[seafoam1 3,023]

3 minutes ago, BeachGuy23 said:

Taxes and upkeep are all included in rent.

And everyone has said if you move a lot renting is better.   But please, how often did Peafoam physically move from 25-50?

And then you forget that when the mortgage is paid off you have a very cheap place to live and a way to massively increase your investments.  Poor Peafoam is dropping thousands month after month till he dies.

Terrible money management. 

It's already been shared with wormsy a while back peebeachdoosh. Now go take your medication.