Mass Deportation

[Fnord 2,494]

2 minutes ago, edjr said:

What about before they surrender? 

That's when you shoot them. Voila! No asylum claim!

[edjr 6,880]

Just now, Fnord said:

That's when you shoot them. Voila! No asylum claim!

I am anti-gun. I'm not shooting anyone.  (Big time MAGA that people here claim I am)

[The Real timschochet 7,381]

13 minutes ago, edjr said:

Is it illegal to enter the U.S. without documentation?

 

 

Yes, it is illegal to enter the U.S. without documentation

Jaywalking is illegal too. Shall we round up all jaywalkers and throw them in detention camps? Deport them? 

[edjr 6,880]

Just now, The Real timschochet said:

Jaywalking is illegal too. Shall we round up all jaywalkers and throw them in detention camps? Deport them? 

If jaywalkers got free healthcare and welfare. I would say yes. 

 

1.5 Million Noncitizens Receive Food Stamps

https://epicforamerica.org/federal-budget/1-5-million-noncitizens-receive-food-stamps/

[Strike 5,980]

2 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

Jaywalking is illegal too. Shall we round up all jaywalkers and throw them in detention camps? Deport them? 

What is the legal penalty for jaywalking?  We should enforce whatever that penalty is.  You're making sh*t up again.

[Fnord 2,494]

1 minute ago, edjr said:

I am anti-gun. I'm not shooting anyone.  (Big time MAGA that people here claim I am)

Well obviously YOU don't have to shoot them. That's your friendly neighborhood CBP agent's job.

[edjr 6,880]

1 minute ago, Fnord said:

Well obviously YOU don't have to shoot them. That's your friendly neighborhood CBP agent's job.

I would prefer no one get shot. Not even peefoam. 

Enough fighting and shooting and war.

[The Real timschochet 7,381]

2 minutes ago, edjr said:

If jaywalkers got free healthcare and welfare. I would say yes. 

 

1.5 Million Noncitizens Receive Food Stamps

https://epicforamerica.org/federal-budget/1-5-million-noncitizens-receive-food-stamps/

Non-citizens are not the same as undocumented immigrants. That’s the flaw in your link, which is highly deceptive. You shouldn’t fall for it. 

[SaintsInDome2006 611]

4 minutes ago, edjr said:

What about before they surrender? 

It’s redundant. This is is the classic ‘tree in forest falls with no one around’ question. They have no status until arrested & processed. The INA provides that people who had no intent to seek asylum are to be removed, which is why removal numbers were at times quite high in the Bush, Obama, Trump1, & Biden administrations.

[The Real timschochet 7,381]

5 minutes ago, Strike said:

What is the legal penalty for jaywalking?  We should enforce whatever that penalty is.  You're making sh*t up again.

Except that there is no standard penalty for entering the country illegally. It ranges from a $50 fine to 2 years imprisonment, depending. 
 

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/8/1325

It’s certainly not always rounding up and deportation. That’s what YOU want but it’s not the law. 

[Strike 5,980]

2 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

Except that there is no standard penalty for entering the country illegally. It ranges from a $50 fine to 2 years imprisonment, depending. 
 

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/8/1325

It’s certainly not always rounding up and deportation. That’s what YOU want but it’s not the law. 

What circumstance do we fine someone $50 and give them legal status to stay?  You're high if you believe that.  And my question was about jaywalking.  Why did you avoid that?

[The Real timschochet 7,381]

Just now, Strike said:

What circumstance do we fine someone $50 and give them legal status to stay?  You're high if you believe that.

You just implied that deportation is the standard punishment for someone coming here without proper documents. I just demonstrated to you that it wasn’t. If I wanted to behave the way you always do to me, I would now call you a liar. But I won’t because I’m not an a$$hole. I’ll just say you were proven wrong. Of course you’ll never admit it because you behave like a petulant child- another difference between you and I. 

[edjr 6,880]

15 minutes ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

It’s redundant. 

Assuming they will surrender is silly.

[SaintsInDome2006 611]

3 minutes ago, edjr said:

Assuming they will surrender is silly.

Happens all the time, frequently actually. Well, used to. Now in Trump2 CBP just breaks the law & removes people. Which… just encourages people to not surrender.

[Strike 5,980]

21 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

You just implied that deportation is the standard punishment for someone coming here without proper documents. I just demonstrated to you that it wasn’t. If I wanted to behave the way you always do to me, I would now call you a liar. But I won’t because I’m not an a$$hole. I’ll just say you were proven wrong. Of course you’ll never admit it because you behave like a petulant child- another difference between you and I. 

No, you didn't demonstrate sh*t.  Again, under what circumstance do we fine someone $50 and give them legal status to stay here?  

[Strike 5,980]

26 minutes ago, Strike said:

 And my question was about jaywalking.  Why did you avoid that?

Why do you keep avoiding my question about your idiotic analogy to jaywalking?  

[Strike 5,980]

25 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

You just implied that deportation is the standard punishment for someone coming here without proper documents. I just demonstrated to you that it wasn’t. If I wanted to behave the way you always do to me, I would now call you a liar. But I won’t because I’m not an a$$hole. I’ll just say you were proven wrong. Of course you’ll never admit it because you behave like a petulant child- another difference between you and I. 

And to be clear, this is from the statute you cited:

Quote

Civil penalties under this subsection are in addition to, and not in lieu of, any criminal or other civil penalties that may be imposed.

What do you suppose a criminal penalty beyond what is listed in that statute might entail?  Perhaps removal from our country?

[SaintsInDome2006 611]

An American Veteran discusses his experience of being illegal seized & jailed.

[The Real timschochet 7,381]

Just now, Strike said:

And to be clear, this is from the statute you cited:

What do you suppose a criminal penalty beyond what is listed in that statute might entail?  Perhaps removal from our country?

Perhaps, perhaps not. It all depends. 

[Strike 5,980]

Just now, SaintsInDome2006 said:

An American Veteran discusses his experience of being illegal seized & jailed.

What's your point?

[Strike 5,980]

Just now, The Real timschochet said:

Perhaps, perhaps not. It all depends. 

No, it doesn't.  Now you're just making sh*t up again.  Just like you did comparing jaywalkers to illegals.  

[SaintsInDome2006 611]

2 minutes ago, Strike said:

What's your point?

My point is the Trump2 administration is seizing Americans without cause & using techniques best compared to the KGB, FSB or security forces in 3rd world dictatorships.

[Strike 5,980]

1 minute ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

My point is the Trump2 administration is seizing Americans without cause & using techniques best compared to the KGB, FSB or security forces in 3rd world dictatorships.

AN American.  And yeah, that's what happens in a lawful society on occasion.  Happens with the cops too.  How long was he held?  It's certainly undesirable and he should pursue any legal recourse he has.  So, my questions to you are:

1)  Do you have evidence of widespread detainment of American citizens by ICE/BP?

2)  Do you agree that in a lawful society there may be mistakes made on occasion?  How frequent and the severity of the mistake is worthy of discussion but mistakes WILL happen in any society with rules.

If the Dems hadn't abdicated their responsibility of securing our country Trump wouldn't have to be so aggressive in his enforcement actions.  So, to the extent that these things are happening, I blame your side. 

 

[SaintsInDome2006 611]

Just now, Strike said:

AN American.  And yeah, that's what happens in a lawful society on occasion.  Happens with the cops too.  How long was he held?  It's certainly undesirable and he should pursue any legal recourse he has.  So, my questions to you are:

1)  Do you have evidence of widespread detainment of American citizens by ICE/BP?

2)  Do you agree that in a lawful society there may be mistakes made on occasion?  How frequent and the severity of the mistake is worthy of discussion but mistakes WILL happen in any society with rules.

If the Dems hadn't abdicated their responsibility of securing our country Trump wouldn't have to be so aggressive in his enforcement actions.  So, to the extent that these things are happening, I blame your side. 

No it doesn’t. This conversation where I’m supposed to accept an American being thrown into a terrorist style cell is not ok. That’s a values discussion. 

[The Real timschochet 7,381]

8 minutes ago, Strike said:

No, it doesn't.  Now you're just making sh*t up again.  Just like you did comparing jaywalkers to illegals.  

No Im not. The point is that just because it’s illegal to come here and attempt to stay without proper papers doesn’t mean we have to deport them. We don’t. We can decide not to. We can fine them and it won’t be ignoring the law. That’s why I compared them to jaywalkers. We’re only deporting nonviolent people right now because it’s what YOU want. But we’re not forced to do it, and I don’t think we should.  

[The Real timschochet 7,381]

3 minutes ago, Strike said:

AN American.  And yeah, that's what happens in a lawful society on occasion.  Happens with the cops too.  How long was he held?  It's certainly undesirable and he should pursue any legal recourse he has.  So, my questions to you are:

1)  Do you have evidence of widespread detainment of American citizens by ICE/BP?

2)  Do you agree that in a lawful society there may be mistakes made on occasion?  How frequent and the severity of the mistake is worthy of discussion but mistakes WILL happen in any society with rules.

If the Dems hadn't abdicated their responsibility of securing our country Trump wouldn't have to be so aggressive in his enforcement actions.  So, to the extent that these things are happening, I blame your side. 

 

No the fault is yours and your asinine insistence on trying to mass deport millions of people, We tried to warn you that this wouldn’t work and that even the attempt would lead to unacceptable, unAmerican consequences. YOU are responsible. 

[edjr 6,880]

 

[Strike 5,980]

17 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

No Im not. The point is that just because it’s illegal to come here and attempt to stay without proper papers doesn’t mean we have to deport them. We don’t. We can decide not to. We can fine them and it won’t be ignoring the law. That’s why I compared them to jaywalkers. We’re only deporting nonviolent people right now because it’s what YOU want. But we’re not forced to do it, and I don’t think we should.  

Yes, we CAN decide not to deport them.  But we HAVEN'T.  That would require changing the law.  Which is what I've told you the solution is.  Your solution is that they should just ignore any law you don't agree with.  And that's why you're not a serious poster.  One of us wants to deal with the issue the right way and one of us wants to hold his breath until he's blue in the face to get his way.

[Strike 5,980]

16 minutes ago, The Real timschochet said:

No the fault is yours and your asinine insistence on trying to mass deport millions of people, We tried to warn you that this wouldn’t work and that even the attempt would lead to unacceptable, unAmerican consequences. YOU are responsible. 

It's working fine.  We're not even a year in and are down a couple million illegals.  I expect that to continue to accelerate.  Hopefully Trump will undo most of Biden's damage by the  time J.D. takes over.

[The Real timschochet 7,381]

2 minutes ago, Strike said:

Yes, we CAN decide not to deport them.  But we HAVEN'T.  That would require changing the law.  Which is what I've told you the solution is.  Your solution is that they should just ignore any law you don't agree with.  And that's why you're not a serious poster.  One of us wants to deal with the issue the right way and one of us wants to hold his breath until he's blue in the face to get his way.

It would not require changing the law. Please present the law that says that all undocumented people must be deported. TIA

[The Real timschochet 7,381]

3 minutes ago, Strike said:

It's working fine.  We're not even a year in and are down a couple million illegals.  I expect that to continue to accelerate.  Hopefully Trump will undo most of Biden's damage by the  time J.D. takes over.

Lol you just accept the Trump numbers as gospel. OK. 

I’ve written several times that at the end of Trump’s term when Newsom takes over there will be more undocumented immigrants here than at the start. I may be wrong about that (we’ll see) but it won’t be by much. 

[Strike 5,980]

Just now, The Real timschochet said:

Lol you just accept the Trump numbers as gospel. OK. 

I’ve written several times that at the end of Trump’s term when Newsom takes over there will be more undocumented immigrants here than at the start. I may be wrong about that (we’ll see) but it won’t be by much. 

So much wrong in this post.  Quoting it for posterity.   More of your wrong "predictions."    But hey, 80% right?  

[The Real timschochet 7,381]

5 minutes ago, Strike said:

So much wrong in this post.  Quoting it for posterity.   More of your wrong "predictions."    But hey, 80% right?  

80% might be low. I’m being conservative here. 

[Fnord 2,494]

1 hour ago, Strike said:

AN American.  And yeah, that's what happens in a lawful society on occasion.  Happens with the cops too.  How long was he held?  It's certainly undesirable and he should pursue any legal recourse he has.  So, my questions to you are:

1)  Do you have evidence of widespread detainment of American citizens by ICE/BP?

2)  Do you agree that in a lawful society there may be mistakes made on occasion?  How frequent and the severity of the mistake is worthy of discussion but mistakes WILL happen in any society with rules.

If the Dems hadn't abdicated their responsibility of securing our country Trump wouldn't have to be so aggressive in his enforcement actions.  So, to the extent that these things are happening, I blame your side. 

 

Wow. How about applying some of these standards yourself? 

Maybe you can supply evidence of widespread:

voter fraud, immigrants eating pets, immigrants abusing SNAP, liberal violence?

Oooh, please tell us more about how J6 protestors got railroaded and entrapped, or how our lawful society needs to ignore the actions of our grossly unlawful CIC?  

Please enlighten us on how mistakes will be made when POTUS recruits thugs to act like a personal police force and tells his DOJ to ignore court orders and lie to judges? Or how unlawfully dispatching NG soldiers WON'T create problems in liberal cities? Then please favor us with your views of the ORIGINAL mistake of electing an authoritarian?

Wait, that wasn't a mistake in your eyes?

Now we have the answers. You're a hollow partisan shell of a person that has ceded his own ability to think for himself, lacks the ability for self reflection, and cannot see the forest for the trees. Perfect MAGA.

 

 

[SaintsInDome2006 611]

“You’re Dead, Liberal”: Federal Agent Threatens to Shoot Veteran

>>

A federal agent blatantly violated a court order against using excessive force against journalists and protesters last Thursday by pointing a gun in a veteran’s face, saying “Bang, bang” and “You’re dead, liberal.”

The Chicago Headline Club, a nonprofit representing journalists in the Chicago area, filed a complaint in federal court after the incident, which took place in the city’s Little Village neighborhood. Local residents had gathered to observe and protest a large presence of federal agents in the area, and Border Patrol chief Gregory Bovino did not respond well or care to take the earlier court order into consideration.

According to the complaint, combat veteran Chris Gentry was “lawfully standing on the side of the road voicing his opposition as agents were driving by in their vehicles.” That’s when an agent pointed a gun at him and threatened to kill him.

That was just one of many shocking incidents that day. Bovino also allegedly threw a tear gas canister into a crowd of protesters, who, according to the complaint, were not violent or committing any crimes. Some of the protesters attempted to talk to Bovino and other federal agents there and were rebuffed. Bovino and his colleagues instead shoved several people and threw more tear gas canisters at them, according to the complaint. …<<

[Maximum Overkill 2,400]

10 minutes ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

“Bang, bang” and “You’re dead, liberal.”

That's not even a little funny 

[Maximum Overkill 2,400]

British commentator Sami Hamdi was detained on Sunday by federal immigration officers during a speaking tour in the United States, in what a Muslim advocacy group said was retaliation for his criticism of Israel.

The Trump administration said its decision to detain Hamdi and revoke his visa underscores that the US has no obligation to host foreigners “who support terrorism and actively undermine the safety of Americans.”

[TimHauck 3,285]

8 hours ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

>>

The White House has signed off on a list of at least a dozen directors of ICE field officers who are set to be reassigned in coming days, the two DHS officials, the former DHS official and the federal law enforcement official said. They said that at least half of them would be replaced with Border Patrol officials. ICE has 25 field offices around the country, so the move could replace nearly half of the agency’s leaders.

The list was compiled by Corey Lewandowski, a special government employee at DHS who advises Homeland Security Secretary Kristi Noem, and Greg Bovino, the Border Patrol sector chief overseeing the agency’s operations in Chicago and previously in Los Angeles, the law enforcement official said. <<

NBC

Few things going on here:

- Kristy Noem’s paramour is making key decisions at DHS.

- ICE leadership removed from their positions include the ICE Field Office Directors in: Los Angeles, Phoenix, Philadelphia, Denver, El Paso, San Diego, Seattle/Portland, New Orleans

- Either deportations aren’t going as promised (claimed) or there are some things even the Trumpiest ICE officers can’t stomach doing, or both.

- Usually purges have one result aside from the intended suppression of speech, elimination of suspected (real or not) rivals & ideological strays, & ramping up of fear in the ranks: incompetence. You get rid of experienced leadership who know how to do things.

Interesting post from Fox News’ Bill Melugin here:

 

 

I think this was the most notable part:

Border Patrol, under Trump 2.0, while sometimes doing their own targeted operations, has been extremely aggressive and has been at the forefront of some of the most controversial immigration enforcement operations we've seen so far, carrying out roving patrols in Los Angeles, Chicago, etc, often at Home Depot, car washes, flea markets etc, leading to a handful of federal judges around the country issuing injunctions against them. A majority of the viral videos you see online are Border Patrol agents, including the use of a Trojan horse style Penske moving truck at a Los Angeles Home Depot, an operation organized by Bovino. ICE often gets blamed for what Border Patrol does, as the media and activists often cannot tell the difference between federal agents, and everyone is called "ICE". I'm told there are growing concerns about the political and PR fallout associated with some of the roving patrols Border Patrol is conducting as lawsuits continue to stack up and mid-terms approach next year. I'm told there is significant friction within different wings of DHS and the administration, with Border Czar Tom Homan & ICE Director Todd Lyons preferring to prioritize targeting criminal aliens & the "worst of the worst" or those with deportation orders, while DHS Secretary Kristi Noem, Corey Lewandowski, and BP Commander Bovino prefer to use aggressive tactics to arrest anyone in the US illegally, including but not limited to criminals, to ramp up deportation numbers and achieve President Trump's promises of mass deportations.

[SaintsInDome2006 611]

7 minutes ago, TimHauck said:

Border Czar Tom Homan & ICE Director Todd Lyons preferring to prioritize targeting criminal aliens & the "worst of the worst" or those with deportation orders,

Sounds like a mini-coup against Homan.

[TimHauck 3,285]

6 minutes ago, SaintsInDome2006 said:

Sounds like a mini-coup against Homan.

Maybe he’ll get charged with taking a bribe after all!