How can you not root for Tim Tebow?

[The Elevator Killer 540]

5 minutes ago, The Observer said:

I thought he was an NFL starter for a while.  Which team do you feel the commissioner should have forced to give him another "real shot"? And the better question is, why do you think any team wouldn't have if they thought he could have helped them win?  He's one of the nicest guys you'll ever meet, so he certainly wouldn't be a locker room problem. 

Not a locker room problem. It was the circus that followed him. He had no control over that. He would attract more fans to the stadium than Shamus Winston. 

[edjr 6,580]

Just now, The Observer said:

What's your conspiracy theory?  Why wasn't he?

It's not a conspiracy, it's a fact. 

He had a winning record for christ sakes.

There have been some god awful qbs with losing records given much more of a shot

[Hardcore troubadour 15,377]

Rex Grossman has a winning record. 

[The Observer 641]

1 minute ago, edjr said:

It's not a conspiracy, it's a fact. 

He had a winning record for christ sakes.

There have been some god awful qbs with losing records given much more of a shot

But there has to be some sort of conspiracy theory if you think he has that 32 teams are not giving this guy a chance when he could help them win. 

Do you think that none of the teams have talent evaluators as sharp as you?  Or are they trying to keep the man down for some reason?  An anti-Christian agenda? 

You're making very general accusations but there's no meat on the bone.  Spill it.  What are they doing to Tim Tebow and why?

[edjr 6,580]

1 minute ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

Rex Grossman has a winning record. 

Eli Manning did not

[TimmySmith 2,782]

3 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

Rex Grossman has a winning record. 

He also led a team to a SB.   What's your point?

[Strike 5,515]

6 minutes ago, edjr said:

It's not a conspiracy, it's a fact. 

He had a winning record for christ sakes.

There have been some god awful qbs with losing records given much more of a shot

So?  He sucked as a QB.  The Broncos tailored their entire offense to his "strengths".  Yeah, they could have won some games.  But you aren't going to win a SB that way.  Here's a good example of a typical Tebow game:

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d82413096/article/broncos-tebow-completes-only-two-passes-but-its-enough-to-beat-chiefs

[TimmySmith 2,782]

1 minute ago, Strike said:

So?  He sucked as a QB.  The Broncos tailored their entire offense to his "strengths".  Yeah, they could have won some games.  But you aren't going to win a SB that way.  Here's a good example of a typical Tebow game:

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d82413096/article/broncos-tebow-completes-only-two-passes-but-its-enough-to-beat-chiefs

A "typical" game? Really?  That's as bad as selfie. 

[edjr 6,580]

Tewbow had a career 75.3 passer rating.  

Steve Bono    75.3
Scott Mitchell    75.3
Ken Stabler+    75.3
Tim Couch    75.1
Norm Van Brocklin+    75.1
Sid Luckman+    75
Vinny Testaverde    75
David Carr    74.9
Chris Miller    74.9
Don Meredith    74.8
Brian Sipe    74.8
Jake Plummer    74.6
Roman Gabriel    74.3
Y.A. Tittle+    74.3
Steve DeBerg    74.2
Gus Frerotte    74.2
Earl Morrall    74.1
Kerry Collins    73.8
Frankie Albert    73.5
Craig Morton    73.5
Rodney Peete    73.3
Mark Sanchez    73.2
Daryle Lamonica    72.9
Greg Landry    72.9
Don Majkowski    72.9
Ron Jaworski    72.8
Tommy Kramer    72.8
Tony Banks    72.4
Bubby Brister    72.3
John Brodie    72.3
Sammy Baugh+    72.2
Milt Plum    72.2
Billy Wade    72.2
Jay Schroeder    71.7
Billy Kilmer    71.6
Bill Munson    71.5
Rex Grossman    71.4
Terry Bradshaw+    70.9
Lynn Dickey    70.9
Kordell Stewart    70.7

[Hardcore troubadour 15,377]

25 minutes ago, TimmySmith said:

He also led a team to a SB.   What's your point?

What’s newbieedjrs point? 

[TBayXXXVII 2,543]

1 hour ago, TimmySmith said:

Still better than 5 starters and 20 backups in the NFL.   The haters of Tebow, didn't hate him for football.  

Chalk me up as a person who couldn't care less about him as a person... he can do whatever he wanted, but for football, he really sucked - at the NFL level.  His game didn't translate because he was a terrible passer.  Maybe he was ahead of his time though.  It's possible he may have been able to play in today's game.

[The Elevator Killer 540]

6 minutes ago, edjr said:

Tewbow had a career 75.3 passer rating.  

Steve Bono    75.3
Scott Mitchell    75.3
Ken Stabler+    75.3
Tim Couch    75.1
Norm Van Brocklin+    75.1
Sid Luckman+    75
Vinny Testaverde    75
David Carr    74.9
Chris Miller    74.9
Don Meredith    74.8
Brian Sipe    74.8
Jake Plummer    74.6
Roman Gabriel    74.3
Y.A. Tittle+    74.3
Steve DeBerg    74.2
Gus Frerotte    74.2
Earl Morrall    74.1
Kerry Collins    73.8
Frankie Albert    73.5
Craig Morton    73.5
Rodney Peete    73.3
Mark Sanchez    73.2
Daryle Lamonica    72.9
Greg Landry    72.9
Don Majkowski    72.9
Ron Jaworski    72.8
Tommy Kramer    72.8
Tony Banks    72.4
Bubby Brister    72.3
John Brodie    72.3
Sammy Baugh+    72.2
Milt Plum    72.2
Billy Wade    72.2
Jay Schroeder    71.7
Billy Kilmer    71.6
Bill Munson    71.5
Rex Grossman    71.4
Terry Bradshaw+    70.9
Lynn Dickey    70.9
Kordell Stewart    70.7

[edjr 6,580]

5 minutes ago, TBayXXXVII said:

Chalk me up as a person who couldn't care less about him as a person... he can do whatever he wanted, but for football, he really sucked - at the NFL level.  His game didn't translate because he was a terrible passer.  Maybe he was ahead of his time though.  It's possible he may have been able to play in today's game.

What happened to Lamar Jackson when he was forced to throw?  Yowza. Not good

[TBayXXXVII 2,543]

1 minute ago, edjr said:

What happened to Lamar Jackson when he was forced to throw?  Yowza. Not good

Jackson wasn't bad.  Don't know if Tebow was even as good as him to begin with though.

[edjr 6,580]

Just now, TBayXXXVII said:

Jackson wasn't bad.  Don't know if Tebow was even as good as him to begin with though.

I guess you didn't watch the playoffs   last 2 years?

[TBayXXXVII 2,543]

Just now, edjr said:

I guess you didn't watch the playoffs   last 2 years?

It was his first 2 years.  I'm sure I can make a list of QB's that had 2 crappy games in their first 2 playoff appearances.  Heck, both Manning brothers come to mind right off the bat.  Jim Kelly had 3 if I remember correctly.  Ben had a couple of dumpers too.

[edjr 6,580]

3 minutes ago, TBayXXXVII said:

It was his first 2 years.  I'm sure I can make a list of QB's that had 2 crappy games in their first 2 playoff appearances.  Heck, both Manning brothers come to mind right off the bat.  Jim Kelly had 3 if I remember correctly.  Ben had a couple of dumpers too.

Difference being, without the threat of the run, Lamar is just another guy.  he was so godly this year, because of the run, it had never really been used the way Baltimore used it. Once it wasn't there, he was terrible.  Lets please remember as well, Baltimore lost to Tennessee,  (scored 12 points, all FGs)

[TBayXXXVII 2,543]

2 minutes ago, edjr said:

Difference being, without the threat of the run, Lamar is just another guy.  he was so godly this year, because of the run, it had never really been used the way Baltimore used it. Once it wasn't there, he was terrible.  Lets please remember as well, Baltimore lost to Tennessee,  (scored 12 points, all FGs)

I don't know if that's all that fair.  I mean, look at Ben's first 2 games.  He was awful... WITH a great run game.  Heck, look at the Kelly's first 3 playoff games, his running game was completely absent, but he still turned out to do well in later playoff runs.  Geez, you want awful, go look up Flacco's entire playoff career... yet he still had a 10-5 playoff record with a ring.

[edjr 6,580]

1 minute ago, TBayXXXVII said:

I don't know if that's all that fair.  I mean, look at Ben's first 2 games.  He was awful... WITH a great run game.  Heck, look at the Kelly's first 3 playoff games, his running game was completely absent, but he still turned out to do well in later playoff runs.  Geez, you want awful, go look up Flacco's entire playoff career... yet he still had a 10-5 playoff record with a ring.

Yeah, I get that there are nerves and playoff football is a different beast.  The difference between Ben and Flacco and Jackson, Jackson had one of the best statistical regular seasons EVER as a QB this year.

[Hardcore troubadour 15,377]

15 minutes ago, TBayXXXVII said:

It was his first 2 years.  I'm sure I can make a list of QB's that had 2 crappy games in their first 2 playoff appearances.  Heck, both Manning brothers come to mind right off the bat.  Jim Kelly had 3 if I remember correctly.  Ben had a couple of dumpers too.

Eli was fine in his second playoff game. Lost by three on the road. Two Td’s and an 87 rating. Better than when he beat the Patriots the first time. You guys need to get over him. He can’t hurt you anymore. 

[TBayXXXVII 2,543]

1 hour ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

Eli was fine in his second playoff game. Lost by three on the road. Two Td’s and an 87 rating. Better than when he beat the Patriots the first time. You guys need to get over him. He can’t hurt you anymore. 

Fair point... he did set a bar that was pretty low, so, there is that.

[edjr 6,580]

Just now, TBayXXXVII said:

Fair point... he did set a bar that was pretty low, so, there is that.

[TBayXXXVII 2,543]

1 hour ago, edjr said:

Yeah, I get that there are nerves and playoff football is a different beast.  The difference between Ben and Flacco and Jackson, Jackson had one of the best statistical regular seasons EVER as a QB this year.

Sure, and it's a different game today.  Easier for players like Jackson to put up big numbers in.  I'm willing to cut him some slack.  Next year, that's a different story.

[Hardcore troubadour 15,377]

9 minutes ago, TBayXXXVII said:

Fair point... he did set a bar that was pretty low, so, there is that.

Yeah, him and 11 others have multiple rings. Him and 4 others have multiple SB mvp’s.  Low bar indeed. You wish any Tampa QB met that low bar.  Or ever will. Not likely. 

[TimmySmith 2,782]

1 hour ago, TBayXXXVII said:

I don't know if that's all that fair.  I mean, look at Ben's first 2 games.  He was awful... WITH a great run game.  Heck, look at the Kelly's first 3 playoff games, his running game was completely absent, but he still turned out to do well in later playoff runs.  Geez, you want awful, go look up Flacco's entire playoff career... yet he still had a 10-5 playoff record with a ring. 

Flacco is a completely underrated playoff QB. Wins in 6 different playoff seasons. Eli has 2. Peyton 6. Brees 6. Eli again 2.

[TBayXXXVII 2,543]

2 minutes ago, Hardcore troubadour said:

Yeah, him and 11 others have multiple rings. Him and 4 others have multiple SB mvp’s.  Low bar indeed. You wish any Tampa QB met that low bar.  Or ever will. Not likely. 

I don't know... Brad Johnson's numbers aren't far off from Eli's when you consider the era that the two played in.  Johnson has a ring with the Bucs.  I can't complain.  Like I said, a low bar.  One that both met.

[TBayXXXVII 2,543]

7 minutes ago, TimmySmith said:

Flacco is a completely underrated playoff QB. Wins in 6 different playoff seasons. Eli has 2. Peyton 6. Brees 6. Eli again 2.

Sure... all while compiling a stellar 56.6 comp% and an awesome 88.6 passer rating.  Good job Joe!  His defense won those games... he just didn't screw it up.  No different than Brad Johnson, Eli, and Dilfer.

At least Brees completed 67% and had a 99.6 passer rating.

To note, I think both Manning's are overrated.

[Hardcore troubadour 15,377]

12 minutes ago, TBayXXXVII said:

I don't know... Brad Johnson's numbers aren't far off from Eli's when you consider the era that the two played in.  Johnson has a ring with the Bucs.  I can't complain.  Like I said, a low bar.  One that both met.

When did Brad Johnson meet Eli’s bar? Did I miss a super bowl? 

[TBayXXXVII 2,543]

Just now, Hardcore troubadour said:

When did Brad Johnson meet Eli’s bar? Did I miss a super bowl? 

Won with Tampa in '02 (season... Super Bowl was in '03).

[Hardcore troubadour 15,377]

1 minute ago, TBayXXXVII said:

Won with Tampa in '02 (season... Super Bowl was in '03).

That’s one, and he wasn’t MVP. Some no name CB was. Got anything else? 

[TBayXXXVII 2,543]

Just now, Hardcore troubadour said:

That’s one, and he wasn’t MVP. Some no name CB was. Got anything else? 

Hey, both are/were decent QB's while they were at their best.  I never said Eli stunk.  I don't know what your hang up is on this.  Eli is what he is... a decent QB who had his defense carry him to a Super Bowl, a WR bail him out, and a played in one SB where no one really set themselves apart... so instead of giving a MVP to the whole offensive line that dominated the Pats DLine, they just gave it to Eli.  He had a nice career... good for him.

[Hardcore troubadour 15,377]

4 minutes ago, TBayXXXVII said:

Hey, both are/were decent QB's while they were at their best.  I never said Eli stunk.  I don't know what your hang up is on this.  Eli is what he is... a decent QB who had his defense carry him to a Super Bowl, a WR bail him out, and a played in one SB where no one really set themselves apart... so instead of giving a MVP to the whole offensive line that dominated the Pats DLine, they just gave it to Eli.  He had a nice career... good for him.

Defense bailed him out? It was his defense that gave up the go ahead score twice in the 4th quarter.  His defense didn’t get one turnover. No one on defense was on the field when he drove his team for the winning score , both times 80 plus yards. Did you watch those games? 

[Kanil 520]

The only problem with Tim Tebow as a quarterback was that he couldn't throw a ball to save his life.  He constantly missed wide open guys and got bailed out by a great defense all year long.

[TBayXXXVII 2,543]

9 hours ago, Kanil said:

The only problem with Tim Tebow as a quarterback was that he couldn't throw a ball to save his life.  He constantly missed wide open guys and got bailed out by a great defense all year long.

Yup.  He was a terrible passer.

[TimmySmith 2,782]

16 hours ago, TBayXXXVII said:

Sure... all while compiling a stellar 56.6 comp% and an awesome 88.6 passer rating.  Good job Joe!  His defense won those games... he just didn't screw it up.  No different than Brad Johnson, Eli, and Dilfer.

At least Brees completed 67% and had a 99.6 passer rating.

To note, I think both Manning's are overrated.

Tis true that 90% of playoff wins are the defense balling and the QB not screwing up.  Therefore I can give credit to the QB for simply "not screwing up".  

[The Elevator Killer 540]

10 hours ago, Kanil said:

The only problem with Tim Tebow as a quarterback was that he couldn't throw a ball to save his life.  He constantly missed wide open guys and got bailed out by a great defense all year long.

Did he throw 30 INT? No? I'll take him. 

[edjr 6,580]

11 hours ago, Kanil said:

The only problem with Tim Tebow as a quarterback was that he couldn't throw a ball to save his life.  He constantly missed wide open guys and got bailed out by a great defense all year long.

Is that what you heard on ESPN?  

Tewbow had a career 75.3 passer rating.  

Steve Bono    75.3
Scott Mitchell    75.3
Ken Stabler+    75.3
Tim Couch    75.1
Norm Van Brocklin+    75.1
Sid Luckman+    75
Vinny Testaverde    75
David Carr    74.9
Chris Miller    74.9
Don Meredith    74.8
Brian Sipe    74.8
Jake Plummer    74.6
Roman Gabriel    74.3
Y.A. Tittle+    74.3
Steve DeBerg    74.2
Gus Frerotte    74.2
Earl Morrall    74.1
Kerry Collins    73.8
Frankie Albert    73.5
Craig Morton    73.5
Rodney Peete    73.3
Mark Sanchez    73.2
Daryle Lamonica    72.9
Greg Landry    72.9
Don Majkowski    72.9
Ron Jaworski    72.8
Tommy Kramer    72.8
Tony Banks    72.4
Bubby Brister    72.3
John Brodie    72.3
Sammy Baugh+    72.2
Milt Plum    72.2
Billy Wade    72.2
Jay Schroeder    71.7
Billy Kilmer    71.6
Bill Munson    71.5
Rex Grossman    71.4
Terry Bradshaw+    70.9
Lynn Dickey    70.9
Kordell Stewart    70.7

[TBayXXXVII 2,543]

1 hour ago, TimmySmith said:

Tis true that 90% of playoff wins are the defense balling and the QB not screwing up.  Therefore I can give credit to the QB for simply "not screwing up".  

Certainly... but that doesn't make him any better than what he is.

[TBayXXXVII 2,543]

1 hour ago, The Elevator Killer said:

Did he throw 30 INT? No? I'll take him. 

LOL, that's true too.

[TimmySmith 2,782]

25 minutes ago, TBayXXXVII said:

Certainly... but that doesn't make him any better than what he is.

Certainly...but what then, is the measure of a QB?